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Post by givehimaball on May 1, 2024 10:39:11 GMT
Just looking at the results of the group stages from last year.
The All-Ireland winner topped their group.
The All-Ireland loser topped their group.
3 of the 4 semi-final teams topped their group, with the other quarter-finalist a 3rd placed team who won their quarter-final on penalties.
Of the 8 teams that finished 2nd and 3rd, 4 were out the next weekend, while 3 more were done the weekend after.
The only survivor to the semi-finals were Monaghan and that was only thanks to penalties after extra-time against Armagh. Topping the group/avoiding the preliminary quarter-final stage looks to be vital for any team that has any serious plans of winning Sam.
I think under this format a team's chance of winning Sam drop massively if they end up in the preliminary quarter-finals round. The three games (last group game, preliminary quarter-final, quarter-final) three weekends in a row is a real grind especially when the opposition in the quarter-final is guaranteed to be a team that had the weekend off in between.
Last year Kerry were very fortunate in terms of other results working out for us i.e. Cork beating Mayo. I doubt we'll get that kind of luck again any time soon as regards other teams doing us any favours.
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Post by homerj on May 1, 2024 22:25:28 GMT
Kerry will get no test in that group. Dublin bet Meath by 16pts in Leinster, Meath gave up with 15mins to go. Monaghan lost to Cavan and were very poor. We hockeyed Louth by 28pts 12 months ago. But it is what it is and it’s a chance to use the 4 weeks to get game time into squad players and players returning from injury and also work towards a settled 15 for the bigger tests that lie ahead. Being tested is over rated. It's about being fresh, fully focused and injury free come middle of June. Dublin has sailed through Leinster every year and have won 9 all Irelands in 13 years.. |
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Aodhan
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Post by Aodhan on May 2, 2024 16:29:17 GMT
Kerry will get no test in that group. Dublin bet Meath by 16pts in Leinster, Meath gave up with 15mins to go. Monaghan lost to Cavan and were very poor. We hockeyed Louth by 28pts 12 months ago. But it is what it is and it’s a chance to use the 4 weeks to get game time into squad players and players returning from injury and also work towards a settled 15 for the bigger tests that lie ahead. Being tested is over rated. It's about being fresh, fully focused and injury free come middle of June. Dublin has sailed through Leinster every year and have won 9 all Irelands in 13 years.. I agree with you to a certain extent but a team also need to be somewhat battle hardened. If Clare do happen to win Munster one would give the a fair shot of advancing. Dublin rarely get out of Croke Park, it's worth at least 3 points to them. For instance Bernard Brogan didn't even have to look at the posts, he know every blade of grass on that field. They won some of those All Irelands by a point with a draw also thrown along with what seems a good chunk of luck. If the Kerry Golden Years team played all their games in Killarney we could be looking at a nine in a row |
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Post by touchtight on May 2, 2024 23:47:10 GMT
Being tested is over rated. It's about being fresh, fully focused and injury free come middle of June. Dublin has sailed through Leinster every year and have won 9 all Irelands in 13 years.. I agree with you to a certain extent but a team also need to be somewhat battle hardened. If Clare do happen to win Munster one would give the a fair shot of advancing. Dublin rarely get out of Croke Park, it's worth at least 3 points to them. For instance Bernard Brogan didn't even have to look at the posts, he know every blade of grass on that field. They won some of those All Irelands by a point with a draw also thrown along with what seems a good chunk of luck. If the Kerry Golden Years team played all their games in Killarney we could be looking at a nine in a row Couldn’t agree more and it doesn’t even have to be as serious a claim as Kerry playing all Irelands in Killarney, play it in semple stadium or make Dublin travel to cork the day before a final and stay in a hotel etc. this seriously needs looking at imagine one country getting to play the World Cup at home every year in year out- oh ya teams want a day in croker… if I won an all Ireland I wouldn’t give a divil if it was in Salthill, Thurles or even Roscommon with the wind cutting Hyde park in half |
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Post by legendz on May 6, 2024 10:16:17 GMT
The race for sam became clearer after yesterday. The opening round of the All-Ireland series will see:
Galway v Derry
Mayo v Cavan
Kerry v Monaghan
Clare v Cork.
Galway have the most difficult opening round. Similar to Mayo going to Killarney last year. Counties know the value from last year of winning the group to go direct to the quarter-finals. The opening rounds of the group stage should be more competitive as a result this year.
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Aodhan
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Post by Aodhan on May 6, 2024 17:25:57 GMT
How was that a free in for Galway at the death? it was an ironclad free out. Overcarrying they say, the Mayo player had the ball for less than a second while been fouled by both Galway players. Gough, touted as the best ref in the game by so many is nothing of the sort. Eammon Fitz made two funny comments yesterday one being about the Goughs. "If you give out to one Gough you give out to them all". How true, those Goughs need to be disbanded. They cost us in two crucial games already.
For the first time ever I witnessed a lineman calling a free, sure enough the incompetent Gough immediately obliged. I'm all for linesmen and umpires to take more active rolls especially in correctly monitoring the off the the ball stuff but yesterday's call, an incorrect one at that, is not in the rule book to the best of my knowledge.
I now make it three incorrect calls in finals when last second frees decided the game, all three should have been frees out. Dublin Joe in two AI Finals and Gough yesterday. Granted Mayo got 30 seconds or so to redeem the situation but we all knew the game was up. No way should refs decide the outcome of games. If the foul was a blatant free in fair enough. The opposing teams are given no chance to right those wrongs.
Those frees for overcarrying needs to be addressed. A player is allowed 13 steps as in the case of Murchan's and Bolgers goals for Dublin, X2 in Murchan's case in one possession, while a player being surrounded by two or many more players is called for overcarrying while been belted from all sides.
The second funny Eammon Fitz comment related to the band when he compared them to the Artane Boys Band in there lack of speed around the field. I had spotted it beforehand and they reminded me of Dad's Army. The players were struggling to slow down. Eammon's comment brough an extra smile to my face.
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Post by dc84 on May 12, 2024 14:33:59 GMT
Dublin didn't exactly blow louth away today conceded 2 goals but I doubt they will be panicking about it.
Louth are a decent team and look better now under brennan than they did under harte last year.i doubt it will be a cakewalk for us in a few weeks when we play them
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Post by homerj on May 12, 2024 15:07:53 GMT
Dublin didn't exactly blow louth away today conceded 2 goals but I doubt they will be panicking about it. Louth are a decent team and look better now under brennan than they did under harte last year.i doubt it will be a cakewalk for us in a few weeks when we play them People forget we could have scored 5 goals against Dublin and Derry took them to the cleaners in the final. They will need to sort that though I am sure they will, its a pity it happened today though and not when it mattered |
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Post by onlykerry on May 12, 2024 17:44:01 GMT
Dublin didn't exactly blow louth away today conceded 2 goals but I doubt they will be panicking about it. Louth are a decent team and look better now under brennan than they did under harte last year.i doubt it will be a cakewalk for us in a few weeks when we play them How many of the journeyman journalists will be writing Dublin off after scrambling to beat 14th ranked Louth in todays Leinster final - any who do are idiots filling column inches for their pieces of silver. Winning the All Ireland is about staying alive and timing your run - particularly with the format being played these days. Another terrible attendance at a provincial final. |
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Post by southward on May 12, 2024 18:29:51 GMT
How many of the journeyman journalists will be writing Dublin off after scrambling to beat 14th ranked Louth in todays Leinster final - any who do are idiots filling column inches for their pieces of silver. They've surely fallen out of Joe Kernan's top 10 anyway. Is Donaghy gone from the Armagh setup? Didn't see him there today. |
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Post by Annascaultilidie on May 12, 2024 18:51:22 GMT
How many of the journeyman journalists will be writing Dublin off after scrambling to beat 14th ranked Louth in todays Leinster final - any who do are idiots filling column inches for their pieces of silver. They've surely fallen out of Joe Kernan's top 10 anyway. Is Donaghy gone from the Armagh setup? Didn't see him there today. I thought I saw him. |
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Fado
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Post by Fado on May 12, 2024 19:27:13 GMT
Yes, Kieran Donaghy is still working with Armagh.
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Post by rollingstone on May 12, 2024 19:55:28 GMT
A real entertaining Ulster final.Im watching football along time and I have never seen better long distance scores that were scored today by both teams.There must have been 10 points kicked from big distances.Poor Armagh though.4 big championship games in a row they lose on penalties. The first half was an absolute exhibition of top class point scoring from all angles |
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Post by veteran on May 12, 2024 19:58:31 GMT
A real entertaining Ulster final.Im watching football along time and I have never seen better long distance scores that were scored today by both teams.There must have been 10 points kicked from big distances.Poor Armagh though.4 big championship games in a row they lose on penalties. A wonderful contest. As you say, the long distance point scoring was astonishing, as indeed was the penalty taking. Such a game restores one’s faith in football. There is no doubt the boys up North cherish their provincial championship. And with good reason. They will not easily let go of it. They are right too. I felt sorry for Armagh and Kieran McGeeney.. Rian O’Neill was poor enough by his standards. I wonder would he more effective at CHF. In any case they are still in it. I notice KD is still with them. It is some jaunt to Armagh. |
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Post by royalkerryfan on May 12, 2024 19:59:42 GMT
First time in many years that we had 4 competitive provincial finals as we had this year.
Fair play to Louth while you don't get a medal for moral victories they can be proud of their approach.
Dublin looked disinterested and they are off to Portugal tomorrow so maybe they were more interested in that.
Our all ireland group is a lot better for Louth than last year but I still suspect that come our match they may be out of gas depending how they go against Meath.
Although I expect them to beat Meath.
As for the Ulster Final,
That was a great game with some unbelievable long range scores and the atmosphere looked class.
I've great time for McGeeney but when Óg Burns wins a mark he stops and looks at the management who tell him to go backwards.
Bravery wins the big games and that was the wrong thing to do.
Losing 4 penalty shootouts is unbelievable and you'd have to have a heart of stone not to feel sorry for them.
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Post by southward on May 12, 2024 20:25:18 GMT
I've great time for McGeeney but when Óg Burns wins a mark he stops and looks at the management who tell him to go backwards. Bravery wins the big games and that was the wrong thing to do. The mark thing happened twice in quick succession. Ridiculous marks they were too but both were scoreable chances. It seems to be a feature of McGeeney's Armagh, this reluctance to really go for it. Saw it first hand in Tralee last year - a nervy Kerry were there for the taking but safety-first prevailed with Armagh and they ended up losing by a point. That mentality is down to the manager. McGeeney has been at the helm for 9 years now and nothing to show for it, despite having loads of talent at his disposal. I'm surprised he's still in charge tbh. |
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Post by royalkerryfan on May 12, 2024 20:30:14 GMT
I've great time for McGeeney but when Óg Burns wins a mark he stops and looks at the management who tell him to go backwards. Bravery wins the big games and that was the wrong thing to do. The mark thing happened twice in quick succession. Ridiculous marks they were too but both were scoreable chances. It seems to be a feature of McGeeney's Armagh, this reluctance to really go for it. Saw it first hand in Tralee last year - a nervy Kerry were there for the taking but safety-first prevailed with Armagh and they ended up losing by a point. That mentality is down to the manager. McGeeney has been at the helm for 9 years now and nothing to show for it, despite having loads of talent at his disposal. I'm surprised he's still in charge tbh. Any other county and he'd be gone. Imagine if he was in Kerry... |
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Post by homerj on May 12, 2024 21:32:24 GMT
As expected very little criticism of Dublin compared to Kerry after Cork and Clare.
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Post by ciarraimick on May 12, 2024 23:18:24 GMT
The mark thing happened twice in quick succession. Ridiculous marks they were too but both were scoreable chances. It seems to be a feature of McGeeney's Armagh, this reluctance to really go for it. Saw it first hand in Tralee last year - a nervy Kerry were there for the taking but safety-first prevailed with Armagh and they ended up losing by a point. That mentality is down to the manager. McGeeney has been at the helm for 9 years now and nothing to show for it, despite having loads of talent at his disposal. I'm surprised he's still in charge tbh. Any other county and he'd be gone. Imagine if he was in Kerry... Players love McGeeney.He obviously a players man.Kildare players loved him and Armagh seem to too but he lacking tactic wise.Armagh have serious talent but constantly fall short.I would argue Atmagh have as good if not better talent as Kerry but its not being utilised properly.I backed Armagh to win Ulster but as usual they fall short. |
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Post by veteran on May 13, 2024 9:07:34 GMT
As expected very little criticism of Dublin compared to Kerry after Cork and Clare. Assuming you are referring fully or in part to this forum, it maybe due to the fact that Dublin playing poorly is not our immediate problem. |
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Post by givehimaball on May 13, 2024 9:31:46 GMT
Dublin didn't exactly blow louth away today conceded 2 goals but I doubt they will be panicking about it. Louth are a decent team and look better now under brennan than they did under harte last year.i doubt it will be a cakewalk for us in a few weeks when we play them I would be very surprised if they don't set up pretty much identically against Kerry for long periods and just concede the kickout, given how well it worked for them yesterday. What I was especially impressed with was how well their attack did yesterday, in addition to their defensive workrate. Normally when a side sits and defends so deep and takes a lot of short kickouts, it ends up hampering their attack but Louth managed to turn a very high percentage of their attacks into shooting opportunities and also converted a very high percentage of these shooting chances. While they lost 4 games in Division 2 and finished 6th, the losing margins in their four losses was - one point to Armagh, two points to Meath, one point to Cavan and 5 points (a goal and 2 points) to Donegal. They had wins over Cork, Fermanagh and Kildare. Their record in the championship so far besides the 4 point loss to Dublin yesterday was a 7 point victory over Wexford and a 4 point victory over Kildare. Anyone thinking the game against them is likely to be a stroll in the park needs to realise they are a very solid team with some really decent players. |
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Post by Annascaultilidie on May 13, 2024 9:46:17 GMT
It might even come to pass that Kerry's toughest opponent in this group stage are Louth.
EDIT: wtf am I talking about Monaghan are in very long grass.
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Post by givehimaball on May 13, 2024 11:00:21 GMT
After watching both games yesterday there is such a difference to the way Dublin and Kerry to a lesser degree play compared to Donegal Armagh etc.Dublin maybe Fenton excluded never really shoot outside the scoring zone and if needed will wait for long periods before a gap appears to get into shooting zone.Kerry Clifford aside are similar although shoot from a little further out .Donegal and Armagh kick from 35/40/50metres out and the point scoring from both team was superb yesterday.This years championship is showing there are now a number of teams at the same level and capable if beating each other.Louth were good yesterday but being realistic they are not going to challenge for the All Ireland.Besides Kerry no team in our group will challenge for Sam.In Dublins group there s only Dublin and Mayo I think are challengers(Yes I think Mayo still will cause problems and will beat a big team).Galway if they get their injuries sorted will challenge as will Tyrone Donegal Derry and Armagh.I still have Dublin as favourites with Derry and ourselves next followed by Donegal .If Armagh throw off the shackles they have the talent to beat any team. The thing is that kicking long-distance points just isn't championship winning football. It's a short-term approach that might win you a match or too (and even that is questionable) but over the course of a championship it's never going to prove successful. I would say that there is a bit of a difference between Kerry and Dublin attacks - Dublin are all about manufacturing goal chances, then if/when the goal chance isn't on they have a relatively easy/high-percentage point scoring chance. I would be certain that if you look at video of Dublin's score taking that you would see a fair percentage of their points come from quarter/half-goal chances that they end up tapping over for a handy point. Kerry are trying to play that way somewhat but are less effective in terms of scoring goals (especially of late) |
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Post by Annascaultilidie on May 13, 2024 11:08:20 GMT
After watching both games yesterday there is such a difference to the way Dublin and Kerry to a lesser degree play compared to Donegal Armagh etc.Dublin maybe Fenton excluded never really shoot outside the scoring zone and if needed will wait for long periods before a gap appears to get into shooting zone.Kerry Clifford aside are similar although shoot from a little further out .Donegal and Armagh kick from 35/40/50metres out and the point scoring from both team was superb yesterday.This years championship is showing there are now a number of teams at the same level and capable if beating each other.Louth were good yesterday but being realistic they are not going to challenge for the All Ireland.Besides Kerry no team in our group will challenge for Sam.In Dublins group there s only Dublin and Mayo I think are challengers(Yes I think Mayo still will cause problems and will beat a big team).Galway if they get their injuries sorted will challenge as will Tyrone Donegal Derry and Armagh.I still have Dublin as favourites with Derry and ourselves next followed by Donegal .If Armagh throw off the shackles they have the talent to beat any team. The thing is that kicking long-distance points just isn't championship winning football. It's a short-term approach that might win you a match or too (and even that is questionable) but over the course of a championship it's never going to prove successful. I would say that there is a bit of a difference between Kerry and Dublin attacks - Dublin are all about manufacturing goal chances, then if/when the goal chance isn't on they have a relatively easy/high-percentage point scoring chance. I would be certain that if you look at video of Dublin's score taking that you would see a fair percentage of their points come from quarter/half-goal chances that they end up tapping over for a handy point. Kerry are trying to play that way somewhat but are less effective in terms of scoring goals (especially of late) There is surely an optimal mix. If you never shoot from distance you allow the opposition defense sit deeper. |
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Post by thehermit on May 13, 2024 11:15:10 GMT
One thing on the Louth game yesterday was they lost by 4 points in Croker. We all surely appreciate Dublin being in Croker gives them a 3/4 point advantage from the get-go. If that game had been brought to Portlaoise or Nowlan Park etc Louth could have come very close to the upset of the century. Look how Clare performed this year in their own backyard v last year.
Again it just highlights the insanity, in sporting terms, of allowing Dublin to play everything at home.
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Post by Annascaultilidie on May 13, 2024 12:29:51 GMT
One thing on the Louth game yesterday was they lost by 4 points in Croker. We all surely appreciate Dublin being in Croker gives them a 3/4 point advantage from the get-go. If that game had been brought to Portlaoise or Nowlan Park etc Louth could have come very close to the upset of the century. Look how Clare performed this year in their own backyard v last year. Again it just highlights the insanity, in sporting terms, of allowing Dublin to play everything at home. No, no, no, think of all the revenue from that massive crowd yesterday that will get reinvested in the GAA. Only Croke Park could handle such a massive crowd... |
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Hicser
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Post by Hicser on May 13, 2024 15:36:35 GMT
Is it just me or is it hard to get invested in the championship this year. Seems like nothing is really happening until we get to these group stages,
Just on Dublin alone, GAA must be now concerned that the county with by far the greatest population can only get 23k for a Leinster final.
This should be an 82k sellout every year, nothing to do with GAA Go.
A massive investment is needed in the other big Leinster counties to try and get them to compete with Dublin otherwise the game will die a death even in Dublin.
The warning is there from rugby, a full house for a club Semi final.
Also if Munster meet Leinster at Croker in the URC it will be another 82k sellout, people are following other sports that have more at stake, more entertainment, more jeopardy etc...,
I wonder how many people tuned in to watch the Leinster final, I expect the ratings were low.
So GAA please note well, Dublin fans are also getting disinterested,
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Post by Annascaultilidie on May 13, 2024 16:15:21 GMT
Is it just me or is it hard to get invested in the championship this year. Seems like nothing is really happening until we get to these group stages, Just on Dublin alone, GAA must be now concerned that the county with by far the greatest population can only get 23k for a Leinster final. This should be an 82k sellout every year, nothing to do with GAA Go. A massive investment is needed in the other big Leinster counties to try and get them to compete with Dublin otherwise the game will die a death even in Dublin. The warning is there from rugby, a full house for a club Semi final. Also if Munster meet Leinster at Croker in the URC it will be another 82k sellout, people are following other sports that have more at stake, more entertainment, more jeopardy etc..., I wonder how many people tuned in to watch the Leinster final, I expect the ratings were low. So GAA please note well, Dublin fans are also getting disinterested, Bloody typical. As soon as the Dubs favourite two teams (Liverpool and Man Yanited) look to enter the doldrums they are going rugby loco... |
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Post by thehermit on May 13, 2024 17:04:06 GMT
One thing on the Louth game yesterday was they lost by 4 points in Croker. We all surely appreciate Dublin being in Croker gives them a 3/4 point advantage from the get-go. If that game had been brought to Portlaoise or Nowlan Park etc Louth could have come very close to the upset of the century. Look how Clare performed this year in their own backyard v last year. Again it just highlights the insanity, in sporting terms, of allowing Dublin to play everything at home. No, no, no, think of all the revenue from that massive crowd yesterday that will get reinvested in the GAA. Only Croke Park could handle such a massive crowd... Fair to say that argument gone down faster than the Belgrano  |
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Post by pipsqueak01 on May 13, 2024 19:20:28 GMT
Any other county and he'd be gone. Imagine if he was in Kerry... Players love McGeeney.He obviously a players man.Kildare players loved him and Armagh seem to too but he lacking tactic wise.Armagh have serious talent but constantly fall short.I would argue Atmagh have as good if not better talent as Kerry but its not being utilised properly.I backed Armagh to win Ulster but as usual they fall short. Surely we can’t let this craziness go unchecked?! You need to call a plumber mate, every barometer you have is broken |
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