|
Post by buck02 on Aug 24, 2016 6:57:44 GMT
Mayo are playing their Senior club championship this weekend. That is surprising to say the least. I don't believe in the club scene going completely dormant during the inter-county season, but the 4 weeks between their semi and the final seems like a risky time to have inter-county players togging out. Games called off now.
|
|
|
Post by Dermot on Aug 24, 2016 12:59:41 GMT
I thought the black card was the correct decision. I thought it was very harsh but it's too open to various interpretations anyway. Jim McGuinness summed it up much better than I could: "The other big talking point was Robbie Kiely’s black card, which was a disastrous call from Tipperary’s point of view. I was really looking forward to seeing Kiely play in this game because of the way he put himself about against Galway. He is tenacious, he’s a seriously good tackler both in his timing and in his physical hardness in contact. Against Mayo with all their physical attributes, I felt he was going to be a key player.
For me, the black card call was totally wrong. I felt he had his hand on Jason Doherty’s back, an awkward tackle, at worst a pull on his jersey – which isn’t a black card offence. As he fell, he and Doherty got tangled up – again, not a black card offence. I didn’t see a deliberate drag down and I didn’t see a deliberate trip. It was never a black card.
The black card, if you back to its origins, was brought in to prevent a player wrapping his arms around an opponent and dragging him to the ground. You know a cynical foul when you see it. A cynical foul is not a player having his hand on another fella’s back as he’s falling.
It’s a free, yes. Punish him with a free that will be a certain point. Punish him with a yellow card that he will have in the back of his mind for the rest of the game. But to remove him from the pitch on the basis of a rule that is so difficult to define is totally wrong.
This was the biggest game of this young fella’s life. The biggest game Tipperary were involved in for the guts of 90-odd years. I don’t think people really and truly understand the lengths that players go to get themselves to this level, the sacrifices they make in their personal life.
To miss basically the whole of an All-Ireland semi-final because of a split-second decision like that is deeply unfair. Is it possible for a referee to differentiate between a free-kick, a yellow card, a black card and a red card in the blink of an eye? I’m not so sure.
It ruined the game for him, obviously. But as well as that, I think it took a huge chunk out of the Tipperary game plan. Robbie Kiely has that bit of strength and punch to him and he would have made plenty of incisions running off the midfielders. And clearly, his absence left a big hole in the centre of the Tipp defence which Mayo exploited for their first goal. Mayo’s dominance of the period before half-time showed them in their best light."Yep, hard to argue with any of that ... A horrible decision especially when you consider Lee Keegan staying on for the whole game .. I'd say he'd need to pull the horns in a bit for the final...
|
|
peanuts
Fanatical Member
Posts: 1,857
|
Post by peanuts on Aug 24, 2016 21:38:10 GMT
TBH, I thought it was a black card in real time as it looked like he cynically took the Mayo player out just as the pass was coming to him.
|
|
|
Post by kerrygold on Aug 25, 2016 10:37:44 GMT
TBH, I thought it was a black card in real time as it looked like he cynically took the Mayo player out just as the pass was coming to him. I don't know. I thought it was more clumsy than anything and needed a bit of sensible refereeing, My reaction in real time was one of fury with the ref.
|
|
|
Post by southward on Aug 25, 2016 18:40:50 GMT
Whatever your view, you'd have to feel for Robbie Kiely there. An AI semi might never happen for him again and he gets just six minutes. Looked like he was fighting back the tears.
|
|
|
Post by wayupnorth on Aug 25, 2016 20:33:34 GMT
Whatever your view, you'd have to feel for Robbie Kiely there. An AI semi might never happen for him again and he gets just six minutes. Looked like he was fighting back the tears. Borderline black all right and heartbreaking for the man but that's the risk of the game and the personal circumstances of the occasion should have no bearing on the referee's decision.
|
|
|
Post by natrachtalai on Aug 25, 2016 21:28:48 GMT
As the week rolls on and analysis is almost complete it strikes me as amazing and wonderful that we can talk of how Tipperary senior footballers could have won an All ireland semi final. Mayo once they got going were indeed the better side but for 40 minutes of this game (the 1st 20 of each half) Tipperary caused the Westerners real problems. We can argue about black cards, a penalty claim on Quinlivan and other events all we like but at this stage that is futile. In Armagh last year Coldrick robbed Tipperary blind and I have no qualms in saying that. Peter Creedon spent two games in the stand after he voiced his views on that display by the Meath official. On Sunday we saw how underdogs need a rub of the green we got none. Thats sport. What a wnderful summer following these guys. What we got was huge honesty of effort. Huge pride and huge entertainment. It was magnificent. Now Tipp must carry this on and not become a Fermanagh or Wexford. Promotion from div 3 must be a priority. To do that we need to get at least six players of quality into the panel. Believe it or not these players are here in the county and not all are hurlers. This run may ignite the flame in these guys. In the next three years Tipperary will also need to see silverware and that realistically means a Munster title.
As for Sunday Dublin obviously have a perceived kink in their defence. Kerry will need to come up with a way of exploiting this I am not sure they can but I look forward to seeing what they come up with. Although the brief dream of a Tipperary team in the final is over for now I look forward to taking my place in Croke Park for the 2016 final and who knows maybe It will be a Kerry/Mayo final that will unfold. Best of luck.
|
|
|
Post by kerrygold on Aug 25, 2016 22:18:59 GMT
Whatever your view, you'd have to feel for Robbie Kiely there. An AI semi might never happen for him again and he gets just six minutes. Looked like he was fighting back the tears. Borderline black all right and heartbreaking for the man but that's the risk of the game and the personal circumstances of the occasion should have no bearing on the referee's decision. I've watched it several times and still don't think it was an intentional foul by the Tipp player to take out the player.
|
|
|
Post by brucewayne on Aug 25, 2016 22:32:46 GMT
Josh Keane is a super player and Halloran is as sweet a kicker as any team could want. Would Stephen O Brien come back do you think?
|
|
|
Post by wayupnorth on Aug 25, 2016 23:07:30 GMT
As the week rolls on and analysis is almost complete it strikes me as amazing and wonderful that we can talk of how Tipperary senior footballers could have won an All ireland semi final. Mayo once they got going were indeed the better side but for 40 minutes of this game (the 1st 20 of each half) Tipperary caused the Westerners real problems. We can argue about black cards, a penalty claim on Quinlivan and other events all we like but at this stage that is futile. In Armagh last year Coldrick robbed Tipperary blind and I have no qualms in saying that. Peter Creedon spent two games in the stand after he voiced his views on that display by the Meath official. On Sunday we saw how underdogs need a rub of the green we got none. Thats sport. What a wnderful summer following these guys. What we got was huge honesty of effort. Huge pride and huge entertainment. It was magnificent. Now Tipp must carry this on and not become a Fermanagh or Wexford. Promotion from div 3 must be a priority. To do that we need to get at least six players of quality into the panel. Believe it or not these players are here in the county and not all are hurlers. This run may ignite the flame in these guys. In the next three years Tipperary will also need to see silverware and that realistically means a Munster title. As for Sunday Dublin obviously have a perceived kink in their defence. Kerry will need to come up with a way of exploiting this I am not sure they can but I look forward to seeing what they come up with. Although the brief dream of a Tipperary team in the final is over for now I look forward to taking my place in Croke Park for the 2016 final and who knows maybe It will be a Kerry/Mayo final that will unfold. Best of luck. That's the spirit! No looking back and focus on Div 2 next year. We'll be on opposite sides of the draw and perhaps a Munster Final in Semple Who knows what might happen but we won't make it easy for you!
|
|
|
Post by natrachtalai on Aug 26, 2016 13:12:56 GMT
Josh Keane is a super player and Halloran is as sweet a kicker as any team could want. Would Stephen O Brien come back do you think? I would be surprised if Stephen O'Brien didn't return. O'Halloran needs to work on his general play. In fairness to him his club plays just junior football in the county's weakest division. Josh Keane is just 20 but is a decent hurler and this could cost us. I think the likes of John Meagher (Full back on the 2011 minor team) and captain of that side Liam McGrath may throw their lot in with the footballers in 2017. Kevin Fahey should have the USA out of his system and he is a serious operator. Jason Lonergan too would be an option off the bench where we were very limited this year. Eventhough easily beaten twice by an excellent Kerry side in last year's minor campaign there are 2 or 3 off that who will join the senior panel. They will take time to come through ok but it's positive. We are not going to beat the world but to have a sustained run at this level would be fantastic. Maybe next year in Thurles we will close the 10 point gap on Kerry some bit.!!!
|
|
|
Post by brucewayne on Aug 27, 2016 16:33:50 GMT
Josh Keane is a super player and Halloran is as sweet a kicker as any team could want. Would Stephen O Brien come back do you think? I would be surprised if Stephen O'Brien didn't return. O'Halloran needs to work on his general play. In fairness to him his club plays just junior football in the county's weakest division. Josh Keane is just 20 but is a decent hurler and this could cost us. I think the likes of John Meagher (Full back on the 2011 minor team) and captain of that side Liam McGrath may throw their lot in with the footballers in 2017. Kevin Fahey should have the USA out of his system and he is a serious operator. Jason Lonergan too would be an option off the bench where we were very limited this year. Eventhough easily beaten twice by an excellent Kerry side in last year's minor campaign there are 2 or 3 off that who will join the senior panel. They will take time to come through ok but it's positive. We are not going to beat the world but to have a sustained run at this level would be fantastic. Maybe next year in Thurles we will close the 10 point gap on Kerry some bit.!! I look forward to seeing how things shape up for ye next year and wish ye the very best of luck. It's great to see the sheer guts with which ye played this year and it's a wake up call for the big fish and the minnows alike!
|
|
|
Post by wayupnorth on Aug 27, 2016 16:37:39 GMT
I hope this thread becomes redundant tomorrow!
|
|
dano
Senior Member
Posts: 530
|
Post by dano on Aug 27, 2016 21:09:23 GMT
Amen to that Wayupnorth, Safe travels tomorrow
|
|
|
Post by onlykerry on Aug 29, 2016 10:30:03 GMT
So this thread remains alive and well - met a Dublin man before the game and his parting comment was that if Kerry win he will be able to give his backing to Mayo as he feels they deserve a win to reflect their tremendous and sustained efforts over recent years. I guess Kerry folk can now do the same and re-adopt our "emmigrant sons" - the O Se brothers as our focal point for the third Sunday pilgramidge to Croker.
|
|
|
Post by mayofan1 on Aug 29, 2016 10:48:33 GMT
So this thread remains alive and well - met a Dublin man before the game and his parting comment was that if Kerry win he will be able to give his backing to Mayo as he feels they deserve a win to reflect their tremendous and sustained efforts over recent years. I guess Kerry folk can now do the same and re-adopt our "emmigrant sons" - the O Se brothers as our focal point for the third Sunday pilgramidge to Croker. Aidan and Seamus were actually born in Co. Westmeath. Conor was born in Mayo. Anyway do ye Kerry folk think we have any chance against the Dublin machine?
|
|
|
Post by jackiel on Aug 29, 2016 13:48:09 GMT
Mayo could take some pointers from yesterday's match. When we hassled Cluxton, he made mistakes.Giving away handy frees in Dean Rock's comfort zone is suicide,he very rarely misses. Dublin are beatable, it's just about having the self belief to push on and go the whole way, in last year's semi that was all that was missing for Mayo.
|
|
|
Post by onlykerry on Aug 29, 2016 14:04:59 GMT
My big take away from yesterday is that Dublin are beatable - they are on a roll and have a winning habit and that is getting over the line in the many tight games they get through. When they play the big teams they are coming out the right side of tight games, not steamrolling all and sundry.
|
|
|
Post by natrachtalai on Aug 29, 2016 14:08:14 GMT
I have no doubt that Mayo will fancy themselves for an upset but I would question their metal strength. When Tipp went three up after only 20 mins they * themseleves. They made several wrong options , shot wildly, and fumbled. Then in fairness hey goaled , settled and took over. But If a team like Dublin put them under the cosh early in the game I can see The Dubs smothering them. I hope I am wrong.
|
|
|
Post by wayupnorth on Aug 29, 2016 14:26:21 GMT
I said even before the Tyrone game that we haven't seen Mayo's big game yet. Yesterday proved that you can still have your big performance of the season and still lose. I have no doubt that Mayo will pull out all the stops for the final and probably produce their best game yet, but will it be good enough? In their favour they are going in as rank outsiders but as we found out, hope, hunger and being ranked low are not enough to cross the line. Given their past performances, I just can't see Mayo winning but I hope I'm wrong..
|
|
|
Post by mayo4sam on Aug 29, 2016 20:30:15 GMT
wayupnorth, Mayo were the only team to draw with the dubs in the championship last year. Dubs are missing roc and mc caffrey. Mayo have a more tactically astute management this year. At the start of the year Rochford said Mayo will be playing a different brand of football come croker. As all the previous teams have found out, he has changed every team and I have the upmost confidence in him. Roll on the 18th of September. Im sure Gavin's remarks about Mayo not been on the dubs radar will be nailed on the door of the changing room, no motivation needed.
|
|
|
Post by wayupnorth on Aug 30, 2016 17:26:06 GMT
If Mayo want to satisfy their undoubted hunger they will need to stop looking back to the past both recent and distant and treat this game as a one-off. Feelings of entitlement or of being hard done by should be put aside. They will not lack for motivation but let them not kid themselves that Gavin's remarks mean that Dublin are unprepared. Mayo are in a very good place: written off by most; underperforming in terms of their talent and 31 counties wishing them well. But all that will count for nothing unless all from 1 to 15 play to and beyond their ability for 80 minutes.
|
|
|
Post by farneysarmy on Aug 30, 2016 18:10:58 GMT
wayupnorth, Mayo were the only team to draw with the dubs in the championship last year. Dubs are missing roc and mc caffrey. Mayo have a more tactically astute management this year. At the start of the year Rochford said Mayo will be playing a different brand of football come croker. As all the previous teams have found out, he has changed every team and I have the upmost confidence in him. Roll on the 18th of September. Im sure Gavin's remarks about Mayo not been on the dubs radar will be nailed on the door of the changing room, no motivation needed. Why would Mayo be on Gavins radar when we had a semi to play? First thing Monday morning you can rest assured you are.
|
|
|
Post by skybluezone on Aug 30, 2016 18:13:09 GMT
Gavins comments being deliberately taken totally out of context. What he meant was they have focused on the opposition for the next game as they came along. Eg Kerry were the focus before last Sunday and now that focus turns to Mayo. One game at a time. Simples. But don't let the truth get in the way of an old fashioned motivational tool! Although Mayo are in trouble already if thats the type of motivation required.
|
|
|
Post by Dermot on Aug 30, 2016 18:17:04 GMT
Mayo will have to do a complete 180 in terms of form if they are to win this ... I hope they can do it (No disrespect to the Dubs) for their own sanity but I honestly cant see it happening ... Another kick in the teeth for Mayo me thinks
|
|
|
Post by farneysarmy on Aug 30, 2016 18:51:13 GMT
Gavins comments being deliberately taken totally out of context. What he meant was they have focused on the opposition for the next game as they came along. Eg Kerry were the focus before last Sunday and now that focus turns to Mayo. One game at a time. Simples. But don't let the truth get in the way of an old fashioned motivational tool! Although Mayo are in trouble already if thats the type off motivation required. Exactly what I was trying to say!😊
|
|
|
Post by seaniebo on Aug 30, 2016 19:37:27 GMT
Gavins comments being deliberately taken totally out of context. What he meant was they have focused on the opposition for the next game as they came along. Eg Kerry were the focus before last Sunday and now that focus turns to Mayo. One game at a time. Simples. But don't let the truth get in the way of an old fashioned motivational tool! Although Mayo are in trouble already if thats the type off motivation required. Exactly what I was trying to say!😊 Jim Gavin is a cool, calm and collected man. His presence and demeanour clearly rubs off on his personnel on the field of play as was evident in the composure Dublin had in creating and taking their winning chances on Sunday. I agree with yer interpretation in terms of the context of his words re Mayo. I took from it that his focus was solely on the opposition that Dublin faced so far. To have looked beyond the semi final would have been totally unprofessional. I found my admiration growing for him after his comments. Dublin will have learned so much more from this titanic battle v Kerry. I'm also hoping Mayo have as well. The last thing we want is a dull All Ireland final now. I don't for one second believe that within the Dublin panel they think it's a done deal. Mayo will say they are written off and use that as motivation but they will also fully believe they can rise to the occasion. It's high time they did. I'm not sure where they go if they retain their bridesmaid status.
|
|
|
Post by mayo4sam on Aug 30, 2016 21:09:11 GMT
seaniebo, obnoxious statement from Gavin saying Mayo weren't on his radar, suppose Tipp were on his radar for the 1/4 final and Tyrone for the semi. Pure balder dash. Reminds me of the time when parkinson kept on asking hi m about the punchup with the armagh team last year, and he kept to his rehearsed line and kept on repeating it. must be his military training. Roll on the final.
|
|
|
Post by seaniebo on Aug 30, 2016 21:23:21 GMT
seaniebo, obnoxious statement from Gavin saying Mayo weren't on his radar, suppose Tipp were on his radar for the 1/4 final and Tyrone for the semi. Pure balder dash. Reminds me of the time when parkinson kept on asking hi m about the punchup with the armagh team last year, and he kept to his rehearsed line and kept on repeating it. must be his military training. Roll on the final. Granted I can see how his comment may have come across that way. I still think, reading between the lines during that interview, that he meant it as a way of saying he wasn't looking beyond Kerry or any other team they have faced. I think he was stating the fact that he had the utmost respect of Kerry that he wasn't taking his eye off us. Regardless, this Mayo team won't need any extra motivation given previous heart ache. There will be a lot said over the next 3 weeks so I doubt they will take much heed to any silly stuff. The motivation Mayo have should surpass any words. On another note, I was at that Tipp match. I don't think I've ever seen Aidan O'Shea play with as much control. He dictated the tempo.I was seriously impressed. I know it's been said he should score more. In his defence he spent large parts of that match as a playmaker - for want of a better expression. I felt he was carrying one or two players who will need to really up their performance. I'll be flabbergasted if they don't. Aidan won't be able to do it all by himself. That said, if he is aided and abetted by his comrades he will be some thorn in the Dublin side.
|
|
|
Post by mayo4sam on Aug 30, 2016 21:36:51 GMT
Im sure rochford has formulated a plan, roll on the final. Will be a great match
|
|