kerryexile
Fanatical Member
Whether you believe that you can, or that you can't, you are right anyway.
Posts: 1,123
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Post by kerryexile on Aug 10, 2015 12:41:11 GMT
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Post by buck02 on Aug 13, 2015 7:51:25 GMT
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Aodhan
Senior Member
Posts: 795
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Post by Aodhan on Aug 13, 2015 8:44:05 GMT
All this with no Ray McMenamin and Conor Gormley in sight, wonder will they wheel out Gormley for the semi? My abiding memory from the game is the constant mouthing of Justin McMahon, then again Dermot may inform us that he was just singing opera.
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Post by buck02 on Aug 14, 2015 10:07:57 GMT
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Post by MrRasherstoyou on Aug 14, 2015 10:16:07 GMT
Is it just me or are the voices of Luke Dempsey and yer man "Woolly" incredibly annoying on the radio? I feel like I'm listening to an episode of the Smurfs
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Post by Mickmack on Aug 16, 2015 19:23:51 GMT
Colm O'Rourke
Published 16/08/2015 | 17:00 When Tyrone beat Meath in Omagh earlier in the summer in the qualifiers, I was very impressed with a player I had never heard of before. His name was Tiernan McCann. He caused plenty of trouble with his hard running and unselfish play.
When I saw him next, against Sligo in Croke Park, he had improved again. And last week against Monaghan he did a lot of work to make others look good. Then he went and ruined it all with a theatrical dive which will follow him around for a long time. The response from the GAA authorities was pretty immediate, a proposed eight-week suspension.
This does look unduly harsh, to seek to put a player out of an All-Ireland semi-final (and a final if Tyrone get there), especially when someone who strikes and injures a player would not get as much.
At this stage the bad publicity gained by McCann is punishment enough but it does mark a line in the sand. This young man, who made a mistake, has forced the GAA into action and sends a message out to all other players: namely that the long arm of the law may come to get you.
Yet if a rule is to be fair it must be applied consistently and Michael Shields in the Munster final behaved disgracefully, while Rory Beggan from Monaghan went down far too easily in last week's game and there were no proposed punishments.
Naturally, this controversy has overshadowed what was a very thorough football display from Tyrone, who were a lot better than Monaghan. They have welded together a new bunch of players who can run hard, tackle like the old days and have added a few deadly scorers like Darren McCurry and Mark Bradley.
Peter Harte and Mattie Donnelly are excellent players who do not get involved in any messing while the Cavanagh brothers are outstanding. In particular, Seán Cavanagh has been one of the top three players of the last decade so why does he become involved in so many incidents?
The elephant in the room with all this cynical Tyrone behaviour is Mickey Harte. Very few have ever criticised him but he is the manager of a team whose rap sheet includes diving, feigning injury, sledging, trying to get opponents sent off and some of his management team getting involved with opposition players. His defence is generally on the lines that there is a Sunday Game agenda and a bias in the southern media.
Last week I was on the Sunday Game and I looked extensively at footage of incidents which highlighted some of the worst behaviour in the game. Monaghan were guilty of serious indiscipline and these were pointed out clearly. The Sunday Game agenda was to highlight the poisonous nature of the game and the sickening, unmanly conduct of some of those involved, the majority of it from Tyrone. And there were plenty of other incidents which did not get shown because of time constraints.
I have worked on the Sunday Game for 25 years and never once has anyone involved in the production of the programme asked me to do anything which gave either advantage or disadvantage to any individual player or county. I am absolutely sure the same applies to everyone else working on the programme. Some with small minds may think that because Mickey Harte or his players do not give interviews to RTé that there is some animosity towards him.
I could not care less if he never again talks to the station. That has nothing to do with it. The truth flows from the pictures no matter how uncomfortable that is for Mickey Harte.
Read more: Ciaran Whelan: Tiernan McCann's failure to own up to dive was a mistake
Since I started for the Sunday Independent nobody at any level of the paper's editorial staff has ever asked me to write anything either favourable or unfavourable to any individual or county. If anyone goes to the press box in Croke Park you meet fans of the game who would much prefer to write about good play than the sickening spectacle which Tyrone were a part of last Saturday.
Indeed earlier in the year, when Tyrone were beaten by Donegal, I wrote that the criticism of Joe McMahon's marking of Michael Murphy was no worse than what Seán Cavanagh had to endure on the same day and that the sledging was from both sides. As it turned out, a pattern of despicable behaviour began to emerge involving Tyrone. So the most successful manager in the game at present needs to address this situation rather than blaming it all on others. His team practise some of the most unmanly acts on a pitch without any apparent censure from within.
One word from Mickey Harte to his players would solve these problems. If he told his players that they would be dropped if it continued then they would clean up their act pretty quickly. Could anyone ever even contemplate Brian Cody tolerating such behaviour? If a Kilkenny player went down like Tiernan McCann or feigned injury like Connor McAliskey, only to jump up when the ball came his way, they would probably be sent to mine salt in Siberia for a few years to learn the error of their ways. Honesty and manliness are at the core of their game; sometimes there is the odd dirty stroke by a Kilkenny player but it is in full view.
Naturally, when highlighting this there is the normal blizzard of paranoia. Generally it centres around the Meath teams that I played on and what a group of thugs we were. And this means I should never comment on any dirty or unsporting conduct.
Some of the players I played with were no angels, they hit hard openly, and sometimes it went beyond that. Yet if one of our players got an opponent sent off by diving or pretending to have been injured it would just be totally unacceptable to the group.
In the past I played against tough Tyrone opponents like Damian O'Hagan, Eugene McKenna, Plunkett Donaghy, Noel McGinn, Audie Hamilton, Kevin McCabe and many more. They were hard but understood the ethos of the game. That seems lost now in the present team
Into the picture comes the Tyrone County Board who now have to defend their man, Tiernan McCann. That is fair enough but is there anyone within the board with standing who will say, when all this dies down, 'We have a problem here which must be tackled'? Is it purely coincidental that so many of their teams through club, county minor, under 21 and senior have been involved in behaviour which the board would be disgusted at if it happened in a club match in Tyrone?
The board should not take the path of least resistance and must confront this poison in the next few months. What standards Tyrone football are built on for the future depends on this because the achievements through the back door so far, and the quality of football played, is being lost in the stench. Maybe they don't just care so long as they are winning.
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Post by glengael on Aug 18, 2015 10:34:22 GMT
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Post by glengael on Aug 20, 2015 11:35:33 GMT
The irony of the tv ads for Sunday's match.
Joe saying the nice things about Kerry and Colm O'R's clip being about Tyrone.
Glad someone left in Montrose has a sense of humour.
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Post by Mickmack on Aug 24, 2015 19:55:22 GMT
THE MAYO TEENAGER killed in a car crash on Sunday evening has been named as minor GAA star Darragh Doherty.
The 19-year-old died after his car hit a wall near Ballinrobe at around 10.30pm.
He starred on the Mayo team which ended the county’s long wait for the All-Ireland minor title in 2013, scoring 1-2 in the final against Tyrone.
His club Kilmaine led the tributes to a young man described as “a winner (and) a leader.”
“It is with profound sadness and shock that Kilmaine GAA announce the untimely passing of club player of Darragh Doherty, Ballyhenry, Kilmaine, Co.Mayo,” the club wrote on Facebook.
“Darragh was an outstanding footballer who bought honour and glory to club and county.”
Darragh was a winner, a leader, expecting the high standards of all those around him, that he delivered himself.
“Kilmaine GAA wishes to extend its sympathies to his parents Margaret and Tom, his brothers, Cathal, Adrian, David and Gerard and all of his extended family and friends.”
A passenger in the car, a man in his late teens, was also injured in the incident. He was taken by ambulance to Mayo General Hospital, Gardaí said, and his injuries are not thought to be life threatening.
“Darragh had great potential,” club chairman Donal Walsh told The42 on Monday afternoon.
“He had scored 2-5 in his last U21 game for us and he was preparing to go on with the Mayo U21s.
He was a very talented young man and he will be massive loss to the club.
“Our thoughts now go out to his family and we’ll do our best to help them through this time.”
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Post by MrRasherstoyou on Aug 24, 2015 22:06:45 GMT
Sincerest sympathy to that chap's family and nearest, and to Mayo GAA people.
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Post by kerrygold on Aug 25, 2015 7:31:44 GMT
Refs chief slams Joe Brolly over 'unacceptable' jibe Colm Keys
PUBLISHED 25/08/2015
The GAA's head of referees development Sean Walsh has said the nature of the criticism of referee Maurice Deegan by analyst Joe Brolly on RTE's 'The Sunday Game' is "unacceptable."
Walsh said the former Derry footballer should withdraw his comments relating to Deegan's failure to award a penalty to Tyrone's Padraig McNulty following a challenge from Aidan O'Mahony. Brolly said Deegan "did something to Tyrone today which normally happens between consenting adults" before adding: "It was an obvious penalty and there's no point in trying to gloss over that." Brolly has already provoked the ire of the referees' committee for his remarks about Padraig Hughes for his decision to give a penalty to Kerry in the drawn Munster final against Cork. They wrote to RTE on that occasion seeking a withdrawal of those remarks in addition to challenging former Cork hurler Donal Og Cusack's analysis of a Limerick goal from Paul Browne in their qualifier game against Westmeath which he claimed was wide. Cusack apologised on the show to referee Paud O'Dwyer on the following weekend after new video evidence proved it was the right call. It is understood that the referees' committee are still awaiting clarity from the station relating to the remarks made about Hughes. But the latest outburst is sure to prompt further dialogue over the levels that commentary on referees is reaching. Walsh said it was clear on 'The Sunday Game' later on Sunday evening that Deegan had been correct in his decision not to award a penalty. "He had that decision in real time and he made a correct decision as far as we are concerned, just as David Coldrick did in the Kerry-Kildare game," said Walsh. "But with the benefit of so many different camera angles after the game, it was still being claimed that it was a penalty." The referees' body are becoming increasingly concerned at the personalised nature of the criticism being aimed at their officials. GAA president Aogan O Fearghail also had harsh words yesterday for 'The Sunday Game', describing some of the commentary on the programme as "tiresome." Irish Independent
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Post by kerrygold on Aug 25, 2015 7:34:23 GMT
Sunday Game 'consistent in its negativity', blasts O Fearghail Donnchadh Boyle
PUBLISHED 25/08/2015
GAA president Aogan O Fearghail has hit out at 'The Sunday Game' analysis, branding it "consistent in its negativity".
And the Cavan official also revealed he understands why some Tyrone supporters might feel "a little aggrieved" over the criticism they have shipped in recent times. In a wide-ranging interview to mark the launch of a new GAA initiative aimed at tackling youth sport drop out, O Fearghail took aim at the show, calling its coverage "tiresome", making particular reference to the commentary that surrounded Tyrone's win over Monaghan in the All-Ireland quarter-final. "I think some of the Sunday Game commentary is unfair but at this stage it's predictable and, in fairness, it's consistent in its negativity. So it's fairly predictable," O Fearghail said. "It's tiresome, I find, when people talk about smells or nastiness or anything like that. I just find that unhelpful in our sport. "I like analysis where people say something (is) wrong and where they point out that something could be improved - there's nothing wrong with that but using that type of language is not something I like, no." And O Fearghail hinted that the relationship between RTE and the GAA has been damaged enough that they could raise their complaint when the TV rights deals come up for discussion next year. "It might be. It could be an issue, yeah, I don't know," said the Cavan man. "I think that a lot of our members are saying to me that they are unhappy with certain comments that are made and, look, some of it is fine and you have to have accept that. . . administrators, players, they do things wrong and we get things wrong and if it's commented upon we have to accept that. "But when you use language like. . . I don't like adjectives that are hurtful to people." Tyrone were under the spotlight last week with Tiernan McCann's 'diving' case going before the Central Hearings Committee. Mickey Harte voiced his unhappiness with how Tyrone were portrayed in his post-match interview on Sunday, and O Fearghail believes Ulster counties get too much bad press. "As an Ulsterman, I can understand why Tyrone feel, in general, a little aggrieved because I would share that. "Tyrone do feel that they get a particularly negative criticism so I would share that but, at the same time, every county has to accept that if their members do something that isn't correct." Criticism "I don't know whether it's. . . a southern media (the criticism comes from). I think one of the greatest critics Tyrone have is very much part of a northern jurisdiction. "I wouldn't be into where the criticism emanates from. Look, new kids on the block do sometimes get criticism. "Tyrone were like many Ulster counties that I certainly remember. I've been coming to All-Irelands since 1973 and Ulster counties generally in my memory, just came down and got well beaten. "I was in dressing-rooms where people would say, 'Well done lads, youse are doing a great job up there, we know how hard it is and keep it up'. "That was unfortunate but now that they've started to do well, then there's a little bit of an edge to some commentary." O Fearghail also revealed that while a review of the football championship structures were ongoing, the provincials will remain in place, with any major change likely to come about in the back door. "We have a lot of proposals in and they are quite varied," he said. "It's getting a sort of a pattern on it but we have quite a few received. "The big thing is there is no appetite for dismantling or changing the provincial structure. "That's very clear from all the proposals coming in but there would appear to be a certain view that the qualifiers needs to be looked at." Irish Independent
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Post by letitin on Aug 31, 2015 15:22:00 GMT
The football wrapped up in Boston yesterday with Donegal beating Wolfetones to take the Senior Championship. Mike O’ Brien from Annascaul was the only Kerry player involved in the senior final, with his brother Shane been the Wolfetones Club Chairman. Earlier in the day Cathal Moriarty (St Pats) and Ger Molloy (Kerins O’ Rahillys) had played on the Wolfetones team that won the junior A Championship.
It was a competitive Championship overall. The Kerry club had a disappointing year. They played a lot of close games however ended up coming bottom in the group stage of 8 teams. They did manage to score the most out of all 8 teams in the group stage mainly due to Shane O Callaghan from Austin Stacks.
Shannon Blues had a number of Kerry players again this summer. Darragh O Brien, Conor Jordan, Wayne Guthrie, Denis McElligott, Greg Horan and David Clifford all of Austin Stacks. Paidi O Se and Sean Michael O Connochuir from Galetacht. Trevor Wallace and Darren Wallace from Ardfert and Barry Dwyer, Waterfille, Kieran Hurley St Pats and Dara Roche Glenflesk back boned the panel. As a team they put in some very impressive performances. They beat both of yesterday’s finalists comprehensively in the group stages. Wayne Guthrie and Dara Roche were probably the stand out players. They fell to a Donegal team by a last minute point in the semi-final having played the majority of the game with a man less.
Connemara Gaels, had a number of Kilcummin players and were also assisted by Tony Brosnan from Dr Crokes. Tony looks like a great player and in a lot of tight games he worked hard for the ball and seemed the best player in an attack that contained Martin Farragher of Corofin and Galway, and Frank Burns of Tyrone. Kieran Murphy from Kilcummin seemed to get better with every game. He had to leave earlier than expected and was a big loss for the Connemara team.
Other Kerry players involved, were Jamie Kelly from stacks who played in goals for the Galway team, whilst Eoin O Neill Renard captained a Christopher’s team that also had Eanna O Connor from the Gaeltacht who looked like a lively player.
As said, it was a very competitive championship. There was a number of high profile players over, with Rory Kavanagh, Mikey Boyle, and Emilyn Mulligan, on the Dongeal team. Tomas O Connor, Sean George, Conor Moynagh, Pashcal Connell were on the yesterday’s Tones team who had also lost Michael Argue and Dara Mc Veety from Cavan. I really take it as a sign of how good Kerry club football is when you see guys like Wayne Guthrie, Dara Roche, Shane O Callaghan and Tony Brosnan, to mention a few, who would not get mentioned when you discuss the Kerry senior team, and out in Boston they stand out in teams and in matches that are littered with high profile players from other counties. With the topic of the summer seeming to be diving, feigning injury, verbals, etc, it was disappointing to see a lot of this carry in Boston this summer particularly at the closing stages. Some of the antics, by the higher profile players in the semifinal and yesterday’s final were a disgrace.
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Sept 1, 2015 17:31:07 GMT
Since that "game that dare not speak its name" in 2001, only once in 13 years have Kerry been knocked out of the championship by a team that didn't go on to win the Sam Maguire.
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Post by kerrygold on Sept 2, 2015 8:21:46 GMT
Mickey Harte's future uncertain after Tyrone delay ratification move Independent.ie Newsdesk Twitter EMAIL PUBLISHED 02/09/2015
Mickey Harte's future as Tyrone manager remains unclear after a County Board meeting didn't ratify him as expected last night.
Instead delegates were informed that there would be briefing with all inter-county managers ahead of the next Board meeting, including Fergal Logan's successful U-21 management who look set to continue on in that role. Harte said last week that it would be "nice" to hear from the Board about the future after he made it clear he wanted to continue. But despite submissions from some clubs to press ahead with extending the three-time All-Ireland-winning manager's time in charge, that will not now take place for another month.
Irish Independent
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Post by kerrygold on Sept 2, 2015 8:22:47 GMT
Is this the beginning of the end for Harte?
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Sept 2, 2015 8:35:21 GMT
Is this the beginning of the end for Harte? From a purely selfish point of view I hope it is. Tyrone are coming again if their performances this year are anything to go by.
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fitz
Fanatical Member
Red sky at night get off my land
Posts: 1,719
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Post by fitz on Sept 2, 2015 9:53:14 GMT
Sunday Game 'consistent in its negativity', blasts O Fearghail Donnchadh Boyle PUBLISHED 25/08/2015 GAA president Aogan O Fearghail has hit out at 'The Sunday Game' analysis, branding it "consistent in its negativity". And the Cavan official also revealed he understands why some Tyrone supporters might feel "a little aggrieved" over the criticism they have shipped in recent times. In a wide-ranging interview to mark the launch of a new GAA initiative aimed at tackling youth sport drop out, O Fearghail took aim at the show, calling its coverage "tiresome", making particular reference to the commentary that surrounded Tyrone's win over Monaghan in the All-Ireland quarter-final. "I think some of the Sunday Game commentary is unfair but at this stage it's predictable and, in fairness, it's consistent in its negativity. So it's fairly predictable," O Fearghail said. "It's tiresome, I find, when people talk about smells or nastiness or anything like that. I just find that unhelpful in our sport. "I like analysis where people say something (is) wrong and where they point out that something could be improved - there's nothing wrong with that but using that type of language is not something I like, no." And O Fearghail hinted that the relationship between RTE and the GAA has been damaged enough that they could raise their complaint when the TV rights deals come up for discussion next year. "It might be. It could be an issue, yeah, I don't know," said the Cavan man. "I think that a lot of our members are saying to me that they are unhappy with certain comments that are made and, look, some of it is fine and you have to have accept that. . . administrators, players, they do things wrong and we get things wrong and if it's commented upon we have to accept that. "But when you use language like. . . I don't like adjectives that are hurtful to people." Tyrone were under the spotlight last week with Tiernan McCann's 'diving' case going before the Central Hearings Committee. Mickey Harte voiced his unhappiness with how Tyrone were portrayed in his post-match interview on Sunday, and O Fearghail believes Ulster counties get too much bad press. "As an Ulsterman, I can understand why Tyrone feel, in general, a little aggrieved because I would share that. "Tyrone do feel that they get a particularly negative criticism so I would share that but, at the same time, every county has to accept that if their members do something that isn't correct." Criticism "I don't know whether it's. . . a southern media (the criticism comes from). I think one of the greatest critics Tyrone have is very much part of a northern jurisdiction. "I wouldn't be into where the criticism emanates from. Look, new kids on the block do sometimes get criticism. "Tyrone were like many Ulster counties that I certainly remember. I've been coming to All-Irelands since 1973 and Ulster counties generally in my memory, just came down and got well beaten. "I was in dressing-rooms where people would say, 'Well done lads, youse are doing a great job up there, we know how hard it is and keep it up'. "That was unfortunate but now that they've started to do well, then there's a little bit of an edge to some commentary." O Fearghail also revealed that while a review of the football championship structures were ongoing, the provincials will remain in place, with any major change likely to come about in the back door. "We have a lot of proposals in and they are quite varied," he said. "It's getting a sort of a pattern on it but we have quite a few received. "The big thing is there is no appetite for dismantling or changing the provincial structure. "That's very clear from all the proposals coming in but there would appear to be a certain view that the qualifiers needs to be looked at." Irish Independent Is this lad deranged? What has Ulster teams' success which is a great thing got to do with open questions about cynical play based on factual incidents, largely focusing on Tyrone?. Now the exact details comprising the incidents has and is being argued upon everywhere including heavily on this forum. The fact is the number of intercounty incidents involving Tyrone teams are more high profile than other county and I don't see that the questions should just go away based on the argument that other counties have plenty cynicism in their play, which they most certainly do as we saw last Sunday. For Tyrone it is the fact their teams are the continued common denominator in many of the intercounty and national club competition incidents over the last 2-3 years that is the primary reason they are now being singled out and not for one incident alone imo. I'll use a typical response template answer to address O'Farrell "Southern" media dig. It was "unfortunate". Talk about encouraging divisive attitudes between Ulster and the other provinces. He's clearly holding onto some personal grudges.
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Post by donegalman on Sept 2, 2015 11:00:33 GMT
I think it is the beginning of the end for Harte, there is nothing that he hasnt achieved and there is an u21 winning team who are coming through. I suppose that the feeling in tyrone is they should stick with the same manager.
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Post by Ballyfireside on Sept 2, 2015 11:57:00 GMT
Tyrone tactics, my info is Mickey is God and unless they are fools they know that, and so does the whole bloody world! Wise managers will be gearing up to out smart him next year and they will be formidable.
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Post by onlykerry on Sept 2, 2015 12:45:17 GMT
There were a lot of murmurings of discontent with Harte in Tyrone back in the Spring - getting to the SF will no doubt appease some but others are more set in their ways and old hurts are being remembered. Will be interesting to see how Harte reacts to the indecision and lack of support from the county board.
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Post by onlykerry on Sept 2, 2015 12:51:49 GMT
Looking at records and all that recently it struck me about all the talk about a perceived need to re-structure the championship to get more teams to the top table etc.... Why pick on football - this code has seen 25 of the 32 counties play in an AI senior final and 25 play in the minor decider compared to hurling where only 13 counties have ever even played in the AI final (curiously 13 at minor grade also - Kerry and Meath swapping places and the other 12 remaining the same). The last three newcomers to the hurling top table were Offaly (1981), Antrim in the 40's and Waterford in the 30's. During this time 9 footballing counties made it to the top table. Curiously the 1990's (before the back door was introduced) 11 different counties contested the AI football final and we had 8 different winners - the greatest spread of titles in any decade since the GAA began.
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Post by Dermot on Sept 2, 2015 13:49:45 GMT
Sunday Game 'consistent in its negativity', blasts O Fearghail Donnchadh Boyle PUBLISHED 25/08/2015 GAA president Aogan O Fearghail has hit out at 'The Sunday Game' analysis, branding it "consistent in its negativity". And the Cavan official also revealed he understands why some Tyrone supporters might feel "a little aggrieved" over the criticism they have shipped in recent times. In a wide-ranging interview to mark the launch of a new GAA initiative aimed at tackling youth sport drop out, O Fearghail took aim at the show, calling its coverage "tiresome", making particular reference to the commentary that surrounded Tyrone's win over Monaghan in the All-Ireland quarter-final. "I think some of the Sunday Game commentary is unfair but at this stage it's predictable and, in fairness, it's consistent in its negativity. So it's fairly predictable," O Fearghail said. "It's tiresome, I find, when people talk about smells or nastiness or anything like that. I just find that unhelpful in our sport. "I like analysis where people say something (is) wrong and where they point out that something could be improved - there's nothing wrong with that but using that type of language is not something I like, no." And O Fearghail hinted that the relationship between RTE and the GAA has been damaged enough that they could raise their complaint when the TV rights deals come up for discussion next year. "It might be. It could be an issue, yeah, I don't know," said the Cavan man. "I think that a lot of our members are saying to me that they are unhappy with certain comments that are made and, look, some of it is fine and you have to have accept that. . . administrators, players, they do things wrong and we get things wrong and if it's commented upon we have to accept that. "But when you use language like. . . I don't like adjectives that are hurtful to people." Tyrone were under the spotlight last week with Tiernan McCann's 'diving' case going before the Central Hearings Committee. Mickey Harte voiced his unhappiness with how Tyrone were portrayed in his post-match interview on Sunday, and O Fearghail believes Ulster counties get too much bad press. "As an Ulsterman, I can understand why Tyrone feel, in general, a little aggrieved because I would share that. "Tyrone do feel that they get a particularly negative criticism so I would share that but, at the same time, every county has to accept that if their members do something that isn't correct." Criticism "I don't know whether it's. . . a southern media (the criticism comes from). I think one of the greatest critics Tyrone have is very much part of a northern jurisdiction. "I wouldn't be into where the criticism emanates from. Look, new kids on the block do sometimes get criticism. "Tyrone were like many Ulster counties that I certainly remember. I've been coming to All-Irelands since 1973 and Ulster counties generally in my memory, just came down and got well beaten. "I was in dressing-rooms where people would say, 'Well done lads, youse are doing a great job up there, we know how hard it is and keep it up'. "That was unfortunate but now that they've started to do well, then there's a little bit of an edge to some commentary." O Fearghail also revealed that while a review of the football championship structures were ongoing, the provincials will remain in place, with any major change likely to come about in the back door. "We have a lot of proposals in and they are quite varied," he said. "It's getting a sort of a pattern on it but we have quite a few received. "The big thing is there is no appetite for dismantling or changing the provincial structure. "That's very clear from all the proposals coming in but there would appear to be a certain view that the qualifiers needs to be looked at." Irish Independent Is this lad deranged? What has Ulster teams' success which is a great thing got to do with open questions about cynical play based on factual incidents, largely focusing on Tyrone?. Now the exact details comprising the incidents has and is being argued upon everywhere including heavily on this forum. The fact is the number of intercounty incidents involving Tyrone teams are more high profile than other county and I don't see that the questions should just go away based on the argument that other counties have plenty cynicism in their play, which they most certainly do as we saw last Sunday. For Tyrone it is the fact their teams are the continued common denominator in many of the intercounty and national club competition incidents over the last 2-3 years that is the primary reason they are now being singled out and not for one incident alone imo. I'll use a typical response template answer to address O'Farrell "Southern" media dig. It was "unfortunate". Talk about encouraging divisive attitudes between Ulster and the other provinces. He's clearly holding onto some personal grudges. Here's a thought !! Ulster is the most competitive province and I think everyone would agree with that .. Because of this we have a lot of Derby type games with no quarter given and due to Tyrones relative success over the last 13 years we have been involved in quite a few of these games.. Personally I dont think we're any worse than any of the top teams but because we are in a province which is so competitive we come up against teams with a similar makeup... . Kerry and Dublin just dont have the same amount of truly competitive games so their games are often walkovers with very little edge. Dublin v Mayo at the weekend showed how things "can" get when two ultra competitive teams meet ... its just in Ulster we get that nearly every game.. I do genuinely think that TSG & certain sections of the media do dwell on us to say the least .. Some of the nonsense over the past couple of years have been a disgrace, especially Brolly's disgraceful remarks about Sean Cavanagh. Even after Sunday, TSG live totally skipped all the negativity, heat butting, diving and feigning injury apart from Brolly having a quick smirk about it ... . TSG at 9pm mentioned it but with nowhere near the same verbosity as they did at every opportunity with Tyrone, (even citing events where it was obvious they were wrong) I cant think of any sensible reason for this to be honest. As for any other reasons, real or perceived, I'll leave that to others to define..
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mandad
Senior Member
Posts: 448
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Post by mandad on Sept 4, 2015 11:46:34 GMT
In light of the frequency of penalties awarded in the Championship this year (not over yet) and the debates that they have rightly generated, one would have to question what degree or certainty a referee has to have before he makes that big call. I can understand that it is impossible for a ref to be right up with the play all the time and the rules do not require proof that overcomes every possible doubt but more than once this year big decisions were made by refs from positions that defied the laws of physics and a few more laws as well. Surely there must be some degree of certainty above and beyond what appears now to be akin to a guessing game. Erroneously awarding a penalty is in my opinion a graver mistake than not awarding a clear penalty. The consequences of these awards are huge and it can only be a matter of time before something similar to the TMO is introduced, at least in Croke Park, to minimize unfair or mistaken calls.
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Sept 5, 2015 8:56:38 GMT
When is the last time you saw a free given for charging??
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Post by glengael on Sept 5, 2015 12:41:54 GMT
Much discussion on here a while back about counties supporting neighbours within their province as they advance in the All Ireland Championship.
For what it's worth, I happened to be in a neighbouring county, yesterday, you know the place where it never rains. I was having my lunch and 2 gentlemen sat at a nearby table to have theirs. I was reading my paper but couldn't help overhearing their discussion, which naturally included GAA action this weekend. Galway were favoured by both to win the hurling.
I hope Dublin win the replay said the younger 40 something man. Why said his slightly older companion. Well, they have the best chance of beating Kerry and I'll cheer for anyone playing Kerry, especially if they've a good chance of beating them.
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Sept 5, 2015 14:29:28 GMT
Much discussion on here a while back about counties supporting neighbours within their province as they advance in the All Ireland Championship. For what it's worth, I happened to be in a neighbouring county, yesterday, you know the place where it never rains. I was having my lunch and 2 gentlemen sat at a nearby table to have theirs. I was reading my paper but couldn't help overhearing their discussion, which naturally included GAA action this weekend. Galway were favoured by both to win the hurling. I hope Dublin win the replay said the younger 40 something man. Why said his slightly older companion. Well, they have the best chance of beating Kerry and I'll cheer for anyone playing Kerry, especially if they've a good chance of beating them. You'd hear it alright if you don't identify yourself! I don't see anything wrong with their attitude. Nothing at all.
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Post by glengael on Sept 5, 2015 21:08:07 GMT
Well mannered young ladies like myself don't go around identifying themselves or their allegiences in potentially hostile environments! First rule of Kingdom Club.
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seamus
Fanatical Member
Posts: 2,741
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Post by seamus on Sept 8, 2015 10:17:58 GMT
Good read from mcGuinness Undercurrent of 'If ye give me the Mayo gig lads, I'll get ye over the line'
Jim McGuinness: Mayo’s game plan came up short at crucial moment Dublin took advantage as Connacht champions failed to do right things to protect lead
Dublin had a detailed game plan to cope with Aidan O’Shea, with Mayo setting up how Jim Gavin expected. Photograph: Lorraine O’Sullivan/Inpho Dublin had a detailed game plan to cope with Aidan O’Shea, with Mayo setting up how Jim Gavin expected. Photograph: Lorraine O’Sullivan/Inpho Jim McGuinness
Topics: Sport Gaelic Games Aidan O Shea Alan Brogan Barry Moran Bernard Brogan Brian Fenton Ciaran Kilkenny Tue, Sep 8, 2015, 08:30 First published: Tue, Sep 8, 2015, 08:30 2 Whenever this Mayo team lose a big championship game now, it is impossible not to feel sympathy for them. For a second consecutive summer, they have come out on the wrong side of titanic All-Ireland semi-final draws and replays which enthralled the entire country. They bring so much to the All-Ireland season. But Mayo do not want sympathy or admiration. They want an All-Ireland title. On balance, the two best teams have made it to this year’s final. But it is no coincidence that they are also highly pragmatic and adaptable. Kerry and Dublin have learned to play it as they see it. Mayo still play the way they play and that has cost them. I believe that this Mayo team can win their All-Ireland because they have shown us repeatedly over the past four summers that they are almost there. But will they? This is a more delicate question. It should be acknowledged that Saturday’s match was a marvellous game of football. The referee, Eddie Kinsella, officiated really well, except for the black card he issued to Seamus O’Shea. I felt that it was a wrong interpretation of the rule and that it ought to have been a yellow card. In my opinion, he didn’t cynically take the Dublin player to the ground. He threw him aside after an off-the ball altercation. It robbed Mayo of a critically important midfield figure and it is a shame that the black card, which has been prone to consistently problematic interpretations, can have such major bearing on a match of this magnitude. Second Captains
Jim Gavin: the Dublin manager does not believe that Diarmuid Connolly’s appeal process was in any way distracting. Photograph: DublinJim Gavin concedes Kerry already have headstart on homework front Mayo goalkeeper Robert Hennelly is unable to prevent Dublin’s Philly McMahon scoring his side’s second goal in Saturday’s All-Ireland football semi-final replay in Croke Park. Photograph: James Crombie/InphoMayo’s lack of killer punch lets reeling Dubs back into game Mayo’s Séamus O’Shea is shown a black card, an incident that came back to haunt Mayo as Michael Darragh Macauley joined Brian Fenton and began to dominate. Photograph: INPHO/Lorraine O’SullivanJohn O’Keeffe: there is no doubt now Dublin still have the hunger However, it wasn’t the factor that swung the game either way. I didn’t think that this match hinged upon a Mayo collapse. Nor did I feel that it was a story of a brilliant Dublin revival. My sense was that overall, the system with which Mayo tried to win the All-Ireland this year was not viable over 70 minutes against the very top teams. For me, there were two glaring issues about Mayo’s performance the last day. The first concerned the way in which they used Barry Moran. Playing Barry as sweeper worked a treat against Donegal and it would have been suitable, too, if they were playing Kerry in the final given the type of threat which Kieran Donaghy presents. But Dublin’s attack is so fast paced and dynamic. They stretch the play inside by placing their two full forwards 30 plus metres apart. So they create a lot of space for themselves and it seems to me that Barry is not built for that role; he doesn’t cover the ground at pace and is a very big man to ask to shuffle back and forth across the park for 70 minutes. So how using him in that role translated to shutting down Dublin’s attack is something I’m not sure about. In the drawn game, Dublin squeezed the middle third of the pitch very successfully. But on Saturday they went with a very high press with a view to forcing turnovers closer to the Mayo goal. But Mayo have such good ball carriers that when they eventually worked the ball through that Dublin cover, they found the space to kick some wonderful points over the opening half, which was just a really enjoyable shootout. Mayo looked assured. That relentless spirit was at full tilt because they had a bit more space. Again, they seemed caught in two minds about the Stephen Cluxton factor. At times they pushed up on the Dublin kick-out but they didn’t fully commit to it either. They didn’t try a tight man-to-man press or even push a few extra bodies in to force the long kick out and make it a war of attrition around the midfield sector. And Cluxton is just too good to be beaten by a conservative press. It has to be all out. And I felt that was significant. I thought as well that Mayo could have got the best of both worlds out of Barry Moran. What I mean by that is that in open play, Barry plays full forward and someone like Kevin McLoughlin or Diarmuid O’Connor plays sweeper - agile guys who have the aerobic capacity of Kenyan middle distance runners. So now you have Aidan O’Shea and Moran inside. I feel that pairing had the potential to cause consternation in the Dublin full back line. Then you have Cillian O’Connor at the top of the D where he can thrive because the Dublin full backs would have been forced to break the ball anywhere they could. Cillian is a fantastic player and a great placed-ball kicker but Aidan O’Shea was being asked to lead the Mayo attack by himself. He was their primary ball winner. Dublin had a detailed game plan to cope with Aidan O’Shea. They knew how Mayo were going to set up and it was all too comfortable for the Dublin defence. They had practiced this over and over at training and they weren’t asked to adapt. Having Moran alongside O’Shea would have changed that. And for Mayo’s kick-out, they could have brought Barry out to midfield. Dublin were pushing up on Rob Hennelly’s kick-out with one hundred per cent intent to try and force turnovers. By taking Barry Moran to the middle of the park, Mayo would have had a third option along with O’Shea and Tom Parsons. Why didn’t they do this? The short answer is I don’t know. Barry Moran scored a point from play which illustrated his role: he was going from midfield, trying to get forward and then dropping back to sweep on his own 21 and then back to the middle. It was a very demanding role and one more suited to Keith Higgins or McLoughlin - those guys who just travel over ground at speed and with ease. I thought that maybe Mayo were holding the option of Moran-as-full-forward until they really needed it. But when they did need to abruptly change things - after Philly McMahon scored Dublin’s second goal and Mayo’s season was going up in smoke - Barry Moran had been substituted. For all that, Mayo got to the point where they had Dublin on the ropes. They came desperately close here. They were 15 minutes from home. I think if Lee Keegan’s shot which fell short had been a point, Dublin could have gone away. Just prior to that, they hand passed the ball to feet on four or five occasions and the ball was turned over by Mayo. Dublin were beginning to run out of ideas. Brian Fenton’s run which created Bernard Brogan’s goal was a defining moment and illustrated what I see as the weakness in Mayo’s overall approach. Cillian O’Connor was marking Fenton and didn’t track his run. I felt that was symptomatic of the Mayo system in general. They play a great brand of football and are very exciting to watch. And I’m not suggesting they are not conscious or diligent when it comes to defence; far from it. It’s just that they don’t appear have a clear idea of what they wanted to do once they built their lead. When you are four points up with 15 to go against a team like Dublin, what is to stop you saying: let’s defend this with our lives? They had worked themselves into a wonderful position. The general view is that All-Ireland teams contain marquee forwards. Dublin and Kerry clearly have those in abundance. If you are playing those teams and your team has a very good forward unit but not quite the same calibre as the opposition, then you have to compensate in other areas or else you will be caught. Rather than going toe-to-toe with a team of high calibre attackers, Mayo could have been cute and clinical and resolved to see the game out. Look at what Dublin did to control the match once they got the few goals: they played keep ball with 25 passes - lateral, backwards, forwards, they didn’t care. They wanted to kill the game. They wanted to suck the Mayo team out and create the space. As it happened, that led to Kevin McManamon’s goal which completed the reversal in momentum. But Mayo did facilitate it in allowing Dublin to attack as they did. If you come with the mentality that nothing goes through the middle, Fenton’s run doesn’t happen. I would suggest that is not being preached night after night at training. Mayo might have got away with it against any team other than Dublin. Once again we saw that the attacking instinct of the Dubs is phenomenal. The game changed because Dublin were able to manipulate its direction with their substitutions. You have to acknowledge the decisiveness of the Dublin management here. Yet again, the resolve of their team was seriously tested by Mayo. But they responded Dublin looked more defensive than offensive at times in the drawn match but on Sunday they were back to what they were doing in 2013. There was a stage when I felt the high press wasn’t working for them in that the turnovers weren’t coming for them. It was an ambitious shift in approach and it looked like they had moved too much in a week. But their response to O’Connor’s goal was decisive and brave. Paul Flynn, a four-time All-Star, was pulled just when the alarm bells were ringing. Johnny Cooper likewise. McManamon brought a totally different dynamic to the game. Michael Darragh Macauley did the same at midfield and Alan Brogan brought all that experience and class that he has to the full forward line. These changes brought about the dramatic shift in approach and possession and to Dublin’s cutting edge, which enabled them to turn the match on its head in five minutes. People talk about the options that Jim Gavin has at his disposal and this was a perfect example. But he still had to make the switches. The ironic thing is that the players taken off will be absolutely ravenous to prove themselves over the next fortnight while the guys who went in will be pushing to start. So it leaves them in a very healthy position. Add to that the five points from play by Paddy Andrews and another good display from Ciaran Kilkenny and it means that Dublin are beginning to bloom at the right time. Where are Mayo at? It is three years since we played them in the All-Ireland final and I don’t think anything major has changed in their overall approach in that period of time. In Donegal, we created a game plan because we knew where we were at in relation to the big teams in the country. We had to do things and be creative - on and off the field. Mayo are going toe-to-toe with Dublin and Kerry and Cork year after year and they are trying to man up and take these teams on in out-and-out football contests. It is a noble aspiration. But the reality is: they don’t have the range of forwards to do that. I believe this Mayo team can win an All-Ireland because they are so close to doing it with the approach that they have. They came close in 2012, 2013, 2014 and on Sunday, I believe they were just one more point away from returning to the All-Ireland final. But they need to start squeezing percentages in these games in their favour and to know when to try and kill the game and develop the kind of pragmatism that both of this year’s All-Ireland finalists have. It is a game of fine margins. If you look at what Kerry have done in the last few years: they have changed significantly to adapt to the prevailing environment. Dublin have changed since last summer. I feel that if Mayo could have just held steady for the six or seven minutes after Dublin sent in their substitutes, they would have made it. Just protect that lead; slow the game down and all of a sudden time is against Dublin. But that question was never asked. Will Mayo win one? I don’t know. The age profile, the football ability, their unbelievable honesty, their midfield, their athleticism: they have so much going for them. But it is not quite enough. They need to box clever. If Mayo can introduce that tactical flexibility to their approach to next season, then they can still win the All-Ireland medals that this team deserves.
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Post by kerrygold on Sept 8, 2015 12:13:51 GMT
Good piece from JMG. He is spot on about the black/yellow card for Seamus O'Shea, a call I feel the ref and linesman got wrong in real time and still do having looked at it again.
Mayo had Dublin on the ropes, whether Lee Keegan's dropped shot would have been enough to win the game we cant say for definite only that the Dubs looked out of ideas at that point.
In a game of inches in terms of this Mayo team winning one, there is a suspicion that Mayo don't have the spread of forwards to do so, either in a shoot out or to execute a tactical game plan that involves the blanket.
So what we learned about Dublin?, lots, can they be beaten? Yes, but it could become a Hail Mary of a game if Kerry don't tactically dominate. And that is a tall order. Dublin will go into the tie expecting to win. This could be their strong point or just as easily be their weak point. It should be fascinating. It remains to be seem if Kerry have the collective spread of players to firstly boil the pot and secondly stir it from 10 minutes out.
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