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Post by hurlingman on Sept 7, 2024 8:10:04 GMT
I was one of the lucky people to get a ticket for the Kerry v Cork championship game in Killarney in 21.Restricted crowd due to covid. Cian O Neill was with Cork and I was watching before game as Cork were doing a warm up in the training pitch behind the terrace dressing room end.O Neill was roaring at the Cork players saying "Kerry are nothing.No Kerry man is better than a Cork man etc and being very uncomplimentary to Kerry.Cork were very riled up and I recall thinking this will be interesting.Cork got an eary goal i think but Kerry destroyed them.Now tbf I suppose most coaches would do the same but I thought he had a bit of a bond with Kerry so I did nt like it. I was also told by an ex Kerry player that Marc O Se will play no part in the 2015 final (2days before game) as Cian O Neill said he had nt enough work done.Marc played no part at all.Im not sure about Cian but Im excites anout Aodhan and he might stand up to Jack.(Jack was the man that finished his intercounty career.Hope James Costello and Aodhan bring an attacking ethos. Aodhan came back into the panel with Jack in 06 so not really true he finished his career to be fair. |
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Post by Lolly Valance on Sept 7, 2024 8:45:07 GMT
Cian O'Neill was our forwards coach in 2015. I remember him saying he took responsibility for the forwards in an examiner interview.
I wouldn't say he was exactly a big success that year
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Post by royalkerryfan on Sept 7, 2024 9:25:10 GMT
Cian O'Neill was our forwards coach in 2015. I remember him saying he took responsibility for the forwards in an examiner interview. I wouldn't say he was exactly a big success that year Homer reckons he's one of the best coaches in Ireland without saying why he believes that. |
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kerryexile
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Post by kerryexile on Sept 7, 2024 9:28:24 GMT
Considering everything the final solution doesn't look too bad. Of course we won't know until the rubber hits the tar.
Aodan is effectively the assistant manager and will have a very important role as Jack is not a people person. It would appear that Jack had to accept such an eclectic bunch to hold on to power. The current Kerry squad just needs a change of focus and as has been said already, based on Aodan's commentaries and the fact that he was a full forward, it is likely he will want a more attacking style.
It is a pity that Cian O'Neill doesn't have a reference to fitness in his title (even if that is an old fashioned word) because he is a person who could walk into the gym and ask questions and give instructions. As we all know that needs to be done.
I'm counting the weeks already.
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Post by homerj on Sept 7, 2024 10:22:49 GMT
Cian O'Neill was our forwards coach in 2015. I remember him saying he took responsibility for the forwards in an examiner interview. I wouldn't say he was exactly a big success that year Homer reckons he's one of the best coaches in Ireland without saying why he believes that. I've given the answer already, generally when he coaches, teams get to all ireland finals. Its very easy to understand no? Calling him out because we lost to Dublin in 2015 is a bit poor to be honest. |
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Post by onlykerry on Sept 7, 2024 10:44:51 GMT
Far too much focus on personalities in the support team. And yes its a support team where the different team needs are addressed and covered.
Clearly from this year fitness, scoring rate and the middle third were the areas that left us down. There is a suggestion that mental resilience may be a factor in recent years with several tight losses.
Fitness, scoring rate and resilience are things that the manager and his coaching team can and need to address - the middle third is a resource issue that does not look like going away for 25 and may need some tactical innovation. For me fresh faces and in particular fresh experienced faces is a good start. As manager its Jacks job to get the most out of both the support team and the playing squad.
Best of luck to them and as always the dawn of a new season will bring the hope and excitement of victory.
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Post by hurlingman on Sept 7, 2024 11:43:14 GMT
Aodhan came back into the panel with Jack in 06 so not really true he finished his career to be fair. Ok Fair enough but I know when Jack came in after Paidi,Aodhan never played champuonship football again. The game had change at that point. I highly doubt Aodhan will have a grudge about something that happened over 20 years ago. |
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Post by veteran on Sept 7, 2024 11:58:48 GMT
White smoke at last. Unfortunately , I am not dancing around with excitement and anticipation. Jack should have read the room and moved aside .
So, we have a head coach, an assistant coach and a performance coach. What can go wrong says you.
At the very least, I was hoping to see the back of Paddy Tally. He is still hanging about in some capacity. A less time consuming role somebody said because he cannot logistically commit to a more demanding role. Kerry football is a monumental cause and if you cannot give the required input you should look for fresh pastures Off Broadway.
Cian O’Nsill is much travelled in the football world. I sometimes wonder if people like Cian compares football coaching to working with a test tube in a laboratory. Add a droplet of x here , take out a droplet of y there , hold it up to the light , shake it , let it rest for a couple of hours and see what reaction has taken place. No visceral attachment to the enterprise. A highly admired coach we are told. Down the years , my impression has been that the person who most admires Cian O’Neill is Cian. Observing him, the old comedy line comes to mind “ that is fine in practice but will it work in theory” .
I am happy with Aodhan and James Costello. I expect they will bring a degree of badly needed freshness.
In any case , as all the trendy guys might say, we are where are. The fervent hope is that this management team will prove worthy of the fine players at their disposal.
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Post by blacksheep21 on Sept 7, 2024 12:29:30 GMT
Everyone seems positive about McGearailt at least. What’s his coaching/managerial/selector experience?
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mike70
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Post by mike70 on Sept 7, 2024 13:04:58 GMT
Management team sorted, time to move on, done and dusted, can we focus on 2025, what needs fixing.
I believe the following need to be addressed,
1. S&C, have we forgot how we faded in the last 20 minute of the all ireland series.
2. Make our bench more impacting, more game time thru the year and not 5 minutes when the game is won or lost, the bench must experience pressure and have ability to close out games.
3. Refresh the squad, not easy, as we have most of the best inside, but if guys not doing it, move them on.
4. Balance between defence and attack, kicking the ball into DC won’t solve our problems, we can’t control how other teams set up, but we definitely need to do better, I leave it to the experts.
Bring on 2025.
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Post by Deise Exile on Sept 7, 2024 13:30:52 GMT
Management team sorted, time to move on, done and dusted, can we focus on 2025, what needs fixing. I believe the following need to be addressed, 1. S&C, have we forgot how we faded in the last 20 minute of the all ireland series. 2. Make our bench more impacting, more game time thru the year and not 5 minutes when the game is won or lost, the bench must experience pressure and have ability to close out games. 3. Refresh the squad, not easy, as we have most of the best inside, but if guys not doing it, move them on. 4. Balance between defence and attack, kicking the ball into DC won’t solve our problems, we can’t control how other teams set up, but we definitely need to do better, I leave it to the experts. Bring on 2025. Yes we haven't been at the races fitness and stamina wise in 2021, 2023 and 2024. Fades outs. We had nothing in the tank in extra time in 2021. Nothing in last 10 minutes against Dublin in 2023 and nothing in extra time against Armagh this year. Surely this and our negative style are the elephants in the room. Yes plural, more than one elephant. We have a lot to fix but we have the raw material |
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Post by greengold35 on Sept 7, 2024 15:38:38 GMT
A mix of scepticism & optimism in equal measure.
Sceptical about Jack holding power at all costs & the employment of two former inter county managers - could prove difficult to handle their roles/input.
Sceptical too about the appointment of Pa McCarthy & Aodán - both are good football men but seriously lacking in club experience- both have cut their teeth with development squads but is that enough for the cut & thrust of senior inter county football? Maybe it’s a training ground for U20 next year.
The optimism lies in the roles as they are named:
Cian O’Neill is a positive guy, knows the territory plus has a sports exercise background- has huge inter county experience.
Tally is the conundrum - normally associated with defensive style & defensive tactics, sports psychology is his forte - if he is tasked with just this, then it’s a positive.
James C is a good guy - knows his football, smart, logical.
The buck, as always stops with the main man - if he can gel this management team, he has the material available- it’s the biggest & final test of his career.
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Post by greengold35 on Sept 7, 2024 15:58:12 GMT
Everyone seems positive about McGearailt at least. What’s his coaching/managerial/selector experience? Development squads plus some coaching experience with An Ghaeltacht. |
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Post by hurlingman on Sept 7, 2024 18:08:02 GMT
Everyone seems positive about McGearailt at least. What’s his coaching/managerial/selector experience? He was involved with Cork hurlers at one point as well. |
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Post by shannonsider on Sept 7, 2024 20:08:57 GMT
Everyone seems positive about McGearailt at least. What’s his coaching/managerial/selector experience? He was involved with Cork hurlers at one point as well. I’m not sure that’s something that should be in flashing lights. Was a fairly unedifying time for Cork GAA that in all fairness. |
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dano
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Post by dano on Sept 7, 2024 21:31:03 GMT
Aodhan came back into the panel with Jack in 06 so not really true he finished his career to be fair. Ok Fair enough but I know when Jack came in after Paidi,Aodhan never played champuonship football again. Yerra All coaches act like that. I'll bet Star does the same thing with Armagh. they will use every tactic they have to try to win. Wouldn't read much into it. |
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dano
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Post by dano on Sept 7, 2024 21:33:28 GMT
Sorry, I meant to attach Ciarraimick's post about Cian O Neill's "Kerry are Nothing" post.
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kerryexile
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Post by kerryexile on Sept 7, 2024 21:53:00 GMT
A mix of scepticism & optimism in equal measure. Sceptical about Jack holding power at all costs & the employment of two former inter county managers - could prove difficult to handle their roles/input. Sceptical too about the appointment of Pa McCarthy & Aodán - both are good football men but seriously lacking in club experience- both have cut their teeth with development squads but is that enough for the cut & thrust of senior inter county football? Maybe it’s a training ground for U20 next year. The optimism lies in the roles as they are named: Cian O’Neill is a positive guy, knows the territory plus has a sports exercise background- has huge inter county experience. Tally is the conundrum - normally associated with defensive style & defensive tactics, sports psychology is his forte - if he is tasked with just this, then it’s a positive. James C is a good guy - knows his football, smart, logical. The buck, as always stops with the main man - if he can gel this management team, he has the material available- it’s the biggest & final test of his career. Greengold35 I agree with almost all of what you say but I think Aodán could be the right man in the right place. The way this is cobbled together it needs a knowledgeable facilitator and Aodán could be the man, no ego, good with people, knows football, can make a decision. |
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Post by mainevalley on Sept 7, 2024 22:09:01 GMT
I'd say apart of the cian o neill appointment is trying to keep the players onside with jack, as cian has a good knowledge of tactics in other counties (because he has been at them all!)
I don't think the players are too happy with jack really, feels he's too old school. Now I don't mind old school but if it's not some bit current you will lose the dressing room fairly fast if you look clueless. Players have alot of power these days so he knows he has to be careful.
I'm getting pissed off a bit with the whole setup back in currans, it's like if you do your time with the development squads you will eventually be a selector with the seniors, they seem to be bypassing all the good club coaches who are proven. It's a kick in the gut to the club coaches who might even know about players than the bubble in currans.
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Post by Ballydonoghoor on Sept 8, 2024 0:29:09 GMT
Wise heads here should have spoken up - we are listened to, even by GAA HQ .. trust me I know.
Aodhan is good but at best on face value he'd notionally be average with an intercounty backroom team - even if he delivers 50% above expectation it won't move the needle what with bossy whacko jacko.
Look, I can see the rebels taking us here .. maybe that's why I was vocal, if I didn't think the situation was so bad I'd have pleaded the 5th, as I see it we are asking for trouble.
I'm off the the church to say a prayer, then I'll follow my namesake and sail out of Fenit with a few footballers aboard, land on an island, email Croker with a late entry, and well, ye can all visit us next Aug to drink out of Sam. Btw will the last one out switch off the light. Ireland is full alright, of nonsense!
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tpo
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Post by tpo on Sept 8, 2024 9:27:06 GMT
I'd say apart of the cian o neill appointment is trying to keep the players onside with jack, as cian has a good knowledge of tactics in other counties (because he has been at them all!) I don't think the players are too happy with jack really, feels he's too old school. Now I don't mind old school but if it's not some bit current you will lose the dressing room fairly fast if you look clueless. Players have alot of power these days so he knows he has to be careful. I'm getting pissed off a bit with the whole setup back in currans, it's like if you do your time with the development squads you will eventually be a selector with the seniors, they seem to be bypassing all the good club coaches who are proven. It's a kick in the gut to the club coaches who might even know about players than the bubble in currans. What county manager would not be Old School ? |
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Post by greengold35 on Sept 8, 2024 9:50:18 GMT
Cian O'Neill was our forwards coach in 2015. I remember him saying he took responsibility for the forwards in an examiner interview. I wouldn't say he was exactly a big success that year Yes 2015 was one of our biggest disasters with forwards.Our star man Gooch was turned into a defender and made Philly McMahon a hero.Not Gooch s fault but the tactics were terrible and word was Cian O Neill had huge sway with Fitzmaurice.Our two best forwards that day who were both scoring were substituted (Paul Geaney and James O Donoghue). Two of our forwards that always caused Dublin hassle (Darran and Donaghy) were left on the bench till half time.Tommy Walsh keft unused sub while Paul Galvin brought on to no success. I wonder will O Neill and Jack get on!Jack is known to be stubborn as is O Neill.Im willing to give them a chance and hope Aodhan and Costello bring a more positive playing style to the field.Also hope our fitness levels are addressed.I hope to see more players tried and lads given ample opportunities. Nail on the head! Always believe that we would have won that game had we started Star. He has the X factor - his passion, belief & leadership would have been key - his presence in a team, be it Stacks, Kerry or Warriors gave them all something extra; he was denied the honour of leading Kerry out as captain which would have inspired all those around him. I know he wasn’t exactly setting the world alight up to the final but he was a big game player - a huge error by EF. Finally, Cian O’Sullivan went into that game with a dodgy hamstring- it was widely known, he was touch & go to play - we put Johnny Buckley on him & allowed him sit back all day without testing him - again, Darran running at him would have proven a bigger threat!! |
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Post by greengold35 on Sept 8, 2024 9:54:52 GMT
A mix of scepticism & optimism in equal measure. Sceptical about Jack holding power at all costs & the employment of two former inter county managers - could prove difficult to handle their roles/input. Sceptical too about the appointment of Pa McCarthy & Aodán - both are good football men but seriously lacking in club experience- both have cut their teeth with development squads but is that enough for the cut & thrust of senior inter county football? Maybe it’s a training ground for U20 next year. The optimism lies in the roles as they are named: Cian O’Neill is a positive guy, knows the territory plus has a sports exercise background- has huge inter county experience. Tally is the conundrum - normally associated with defensive style & defensive tactics, sports psychology is his forte - if he is tasked with just this, then it’s a positive. James C is a good guy - knows his football, smart, logical. The buck, as always stops with the main man - if he can gel this management team, he has the material available- it’s the biggest & final test of his career. Greengold35 I agree with almost all of what you say but I think Aodán could be the right man in the right place. The way this is cobbled together it needs a knowledgeable facilitator and Aodán could be the man, no ego, good with people, knows football, can make a decision. I take your point & hope he has a voice - the omens are not good however given the departures of MQ & DM who had all the attributes you mention in Aodán & looking at the long list( Tomás, Declan, Gooch,Star ) who declined to come on board. |
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horsebox77
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Post by horsebox77 on Sept 8, 2024 9:58:54 GMT
I'm in a few minds about the appointments, at the outset I'm delighted that the circus tent has folded and we can draw a line in the sand and drive on. It was disappointing to read that the likes of Seamus, Declan and Cooper declined the offer, but in reality I envisage all three have ambitions for further down the track, therefore, a one year stint may not be the favored or desired road.
On the new additions, Apart from Pat Flanagen, I think Cian O'Neill is an exceptional and learned on the game, since his last stint he has progressed his CV considerably. I know very little in Pa McCarthy bar his colleges and schools CV, James on the other hand is a very passionate coach, who surrounds himself with coaches with the same ethos, neither are yes men and will fight their corner, I can't see them being bullied or walked over.
Aodhán was over the west kerry U15's this, they were limited in capabilities, however, their set up, shape was attack minded. Similarly on TG4 he talks a good game and is knowledgeable,
I can't recall did Aodhán, play under Jack - when did he depart the county set up.
Anyway regardless of the the above, neither of them will be kicking a ball over the bar, it's players we need, in this regard, James may be the jewel as he would have three years knowledge of minors who will now be nearing their twenties and reaching that "step up" age.
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Post by mainevalley on Sept 8, 2024 10:22:38 GMT
I'd say apart of the cian o neill appointment is trying to keep the players onside with jack, as cian has a good knowledge of tactics in other counties (because he has been at them all!) I don't think the players are too happy with jack really, feels he's too old school. Now I don't mind old school but if it's not some bit current you will lose the dressing room fairly fast if you look clueless. Players have alot of power these days so he knows he has to be careful. I'm getting pissed off a bit with the whole setup back in currans, it's like if you do your time with the development squads you will eventually be a selector with the seniors, they seem to be bypassing all the good club coaches who are proven. It's a kick in the gut to the club coaches who might even know about players than the bubble in currans. What county manager would not be Old School ? Kieran mc geeney has always changed his philosophy to the ever the demands, Jim Gavin, dessie Farrell, mark Fitz, Jimmy mc Guinness, conor laverty, Davy Burke. Old school managers have been found out like Mikey harte and colm o Rourke, jack doesn't want to be that old school manager found out |
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Post by greengold35 on Sept 8, 2024 11:23:08 GMT
Nail on the head! Always believe that we would have won that game had we started Star. He has the X factor - his passion, belief & leadership would have been key - his presence in a team, be it Stacks, Kerry or Warriors gave them all something extra; he was denied the honour of leading Kerry out as captain which would have inspired all those around him. I know he wasn’t exactly setting the world alight up to the final but he was a big game player - a huge error by EF. Finally, Cian O’Sullivan went into that game with a dodgy hamstring- it was widely known, he was touch & go to play - we put Johnny Buckley on him & allowed him sit back all day without testing him - again, Darran running at him would have proven a bigger threat!! Spot on Greengold and when Darran did come on at half time he ran Cian O Sullivan ragged while also scoring 2 points.Cian was substituted then. Donaghy also caused mayhem when introduced and made the Dubs very nervous.He set up a great goal chance for Killian Young and was unlucky not to get a penalty.JOD scored 3 points Geaney 2 points and we only scored 9 and both substituted. Yea, and the fiasco was exacerbated by introducing Star when both JO’D & Geaney were gone !! I remember watching Tommy Walsh warming up when we had our FULL quota of subs used - you couldn’t make it up !! |
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Post by Ballydonoghoor on Sept 8, 2024 11:27:40 GMT
Do I notice a change in views here from a few who we'd normally hear more pragmatic stuff?
Or is it that we don't have options, are we like a political party with a looming election and they haven't groomed a candidate nor have they a high profile alternative to parachute in.
I think TCB might need to engage in succession planning for team management though that might be like turkeys voting for xMas as they might unearth a few administrators with liathrodi in the process.
Regardless of one's views about our Whacko Jacko, given our proud pedigree in all things Gaelic football, it is amazing that we haven't half a dozen serious indigenous contenders for each role, laddos who grew up with our culture and who know the lay of the land, bloodlines, etc.
If it was horses we were talking about the Aidan O'Briens would be forensically taking the diocesan birth records apart looking to unearth potential stars. Ah sure I forgot, horses are worth more than humans, a lot more as it happens.
I recall a mother once denying that the physical prowess of her brat suckling had nothing to do with a local postman of repute, and at either side of the sideline I might add. Apparently it was all to do with the extended breast feeding program that sprouted limbs that fetched dirty ball from behind clouds. Still breeding beats feeding so the jury might still be out on that one Mrs whoever you are and keep checking the post in case we'd miss something, it's all about the pipeline. Now what do you think of that Joe Brolly!
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tpo
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Post by tpo on Sept 8, 2024 18:40:02 GMT
What county manager would not be Old School ? Kieran mc geeney has always changed his philosophy to the ever the demands, Jim Gavin, dessie Farrell, mark Fitz, Jimmy mc Guinness, conor laverty, Davy Burke. Old school managers have been found out like Mikey harte and colm o Rourke, jack doesn't want to be that old school manager found out Jim Gavin hasn't managed for 6 years ,Kieran McGeeney & Jim McGuinness play no risk unless behind in last 15 minutes, Conor Laverty only lets players run with ball and only kick when within 20/25 meter of goal, Mark managed at a level that doesn't count, Davy Burke las let his player have a cut, just not enough good player to win more than one match against top teams |
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Post by glengael on Sept 9, 2024 12:57:48 GMT
'Kerry Senior football management for 2025
Manager: Jack O’Connor
Selectors: Aodán MacGearailt, James Costello
Selector/Head Coach: Cian O’Neill
Asst Coach: Pa McCarthy
Performance Coach: Paddy Tally
S&C Coaches: Jason McGahan & Arthur Fitzgerald
GK Coach: Brian Kelly
Names to go before the next County Committee meeting for ratification.'
My cousin's response to the above 'So many coaches, tis like the car park behind at the Red Fox'.
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Post by Ballydonoghoor on Sept 9, 2024 13:14:01 GMT
It's a fine line between defending and parking the bus, and another fine line between winning and doing so at any cost; and there are a few more fine lines - and then where do you draw the line?
It is said that success is often by what you don't do as much as what you do. Playing with fear is our issue and we have struggled with the fine line here of between that and scoring, i.e. who and from where to pull the trigger, and then there is the progression to get to that point, more dos and dont's, fine lines ... .remember what PO'6 used to say about the grain of rice?
Still this is basic enough stuff really and moreover at inter county level - talking to a few 'Stacks laddos lately had me ask if Dwyer adopted Whackos philosophy, Mickey Sheehy wouldn't have even dreamed of attempting what was to become the games most famous goal! IMO those great players wouldn't have reached their summit today and by definition the same applies to the current panel.
And of course those involved can bat away us keyboard warriors as they have more info here but we can only deal with what is out there and that is the results and which aren't right. Have we forgotten how good DC and SO'6 really are? Something is seriously wrong when it is across the team so what is the common denominator? Whacko thinks he can change and we have bet the house on it. If I thought it was a secret we'd stay quiet but it's all out in the open, other teams will be encouraged and will dream that they can go where the '24 AI finalists went.
I hope to God I am proved so so wrong but I cannot see anything else. Still I was wrong re Brexit vote and I couldn't see Trump ever getting elected, so there's hope for Whacko - now Ima classing him with Donaldo and Boris Bo11ix Johnson, latter almost wrecked peace process and all for his own ego - should be locked up, our problems are small!
I'd agree with ciarraimick above re McGuinness and I also think he is better this time around - I've followed Dgal a lot and my snouts up there are cautiously optimistic on the back of '24, I'd know how to read these bucks and they are good crack when you get 'em going, a bit like when they get me going I suppose!
As for the coaches at the red fox and our coaches, now don't get us goin' on parking busses - maybe we'd be as well to book in and put up the feet rather than going on pilgrimages all over the country, someone wanted a Div 2 pilgrimage - wanting to climb a hill as the whole world feasts on the country's highest peak on our doorstep. No pleasin' some!
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