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Post by boherbee on Apr 5, 2022 15:02:37 GMT
I hope the league final will have a positive effect on Kerry. Like '97 against Cork. That day provided some atonement for the loss to Mayo in the '96 semi and it set us up for an Allireland win. It'll be next to impossible for David clifford to have such a field day again and I believe Mayo were not up for this as much as kerry were. They were down a good few guys too. No need for hype and saying our A v B games will suffice as preparation for tough opposition. kerry haven't won anything yet, not the real prize that we all crave. The plus is that they have got into the habit of winning matches, they have unearthed a solid North Kerry full back, a natural #6 and a variety of forwards. Midfield might still be an issue but there are options with David Moran and Joe O Connor. They should win Munster, although I'm expecting (and hoping for) a tough game from Cork in PUR. It'll be better than any A v B game in Currans. A bit like saying Cork want to beat us more than our 2nd 15 want AI players' medals - maybe, maybe not? Ah nothing beats a local derby - but what about backs and forwards of our 1st 15 so, Foley on Clifford - that Foley dash for the goal wouldn't have him left in a cloud of dust like O'Hora anyway, still while David is Kerry strong I'd love to see the Ballydonoghoor having a go, damage limitation it is, he is unmarkable, lots of 'em are unmarkable but he is more unmarkable than anyone, in terms of the complete footballer, I can't se what he is missing. Remember that it is the best defenders he is dealing with and Jason is highly regarded, let's hire out a chopper for the next session in Currans, better than going into space! Big loss for Mayo, it was around the Flynn incident that O´Hora was annoyed with Clifford, not that Clifford had any part in the unfortunate injury.
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Post by mayofan1 on Apr 5, 2022 15:13:43 GMT
Congrats on the win last Sunday. I thought the days of getting hammered out the gate in Croke Park were over but looks like they have returned.
Despite getting well beaten Clifford is a joy to watch. For such a big man to have that pace, vision and both feet is astonishing. One thing that strikes me is wherever he gets the ball the head is up looking for a teammate or space to kick into. If it’s not on or nobody is available he goes himself and the striking action and curl/style of his kick is great to watch.
I think we have it all to do in Connacht this year with a growing injury list. True we have brought through a lot of young players but it’s going to take time. Cillian looked well of the pace and will need time. Jordan Flynn is another hammer blow. I still think we can take Galway on the 24th who are very open at the back.
Anyway hope we meet later in the summer (I think🙈).
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2022 15:18:31 GMT
Not sure if it's been mentioned already, but Jordan Flynn suffered a Broken ankle and is probably gone for the championship. That’s hard luck on Flynn - initially I thought it was his shoulder that was impacted but then saw him clutching his ankle area - big loss for Mayo. Feck how did Jack Barry shoulder flynn in the chest and break his ankle? I just don't get the physics of it?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2022 15:21:52 GMT
I hope the league final will have a positive effect on Kerry. Like '97 against Cork. That day provided some atonement for the loss to Mayo in the '96 semi and it set us up for an Allireland win. It'll be next to impossible for David clifford to have such a field day again and I believe Mayo were not up for this as much as kerry were. They were down a good few guys too. No need for hype and saying our A v B games will suffice as preparation for tough opposition. kerry haven't won anything yet, not the real prize that we all crave. The plus is that they have got into the habit of winning matches, they have unearthed a solid North Kerry full back, a natural #6 and a variety of forwards. Midfield might still be an issue but there are options with David Moran and Joe O Connor. They should win Munster, although I'm expecting (and hoping for) a tough game from Cork in PUR. It'll be better than any A v B game in Currans. A bit like saying Cork want to beat us more than our 2nd 15 want AI players' medals - maybe, maybe not? Ah nothing beats a local derby - but what about backs and forwards of our 1st 15 so, Foley on Clifford - that Foley dash for the goal wouldn't have him left in a cloud of dust like O'Hora anyway, still while David is Kerry strong I'd love to see the Ballydonoghoor having a go, damage limitation it is, he is unmarkable, lots of 'em are unmarkable but he is more unmarkable than anyone, in terms of the complete footballer, I can't se what he is missing. Remember that it is the best defenders he is dealing with and Jason is highly regarded, let's hire out a chopper for the next session in Currans, better than going into space! the ballydonaghoor 😂 that's brilliant word play bally, you're a gas man 😂👍
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Post by kerrybhoy06 on Apr 5, 2022 15:27:51 GMT
That’s hard luck on Flynn - initially I thought it was his shoulder that was impacted but then saw him clutching his ankle area - big loss for Mayo. Feck how did Jack Barry shoulder flynn in the chest and break his ankle? I just don't get the physics of it? He just landed awkwardly, it was unfortunate but nothing really more. Ankle breaks and ankle ligament damage is especially prevalent in rugby when a land is impacted and still tries to sidestep after the impact as his body is knocked of kilter. Just seems to be one of those
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Post by givehimaball on Apr 5, 2022 16:26:29 GMT
Regarding Jo90's post concerning the incident with Mayo's O'Donoghue and Gavin White I could'nt agree more and those on the Forum here excusing O'Donoghue are wrong. I would suggest they take a close look at the tape again and they will clearly see that O'Donoghue made no effort to play the ball - he clearly clouted White . In another life O'Donoghue was an accomplished boxer and he brought that experience to bear on White. It was a cowardly not to mention dangerous incident and the resultant goal was the Referee's reason for keeping his cards in his pocket. I think you are being harsh on Ó Donoghue. A clumsy and dangerous tackle yes indeed but it was not malicious in my mind. I watched the match again and I have to disagree with you. I did a little bit of boxing myself as a teenager and believe me that was not a boxing punch. He tried to stop a goal and as one poster said he is not a natural defender and got his challenge completely wrong. Gavin was very brave in taking the goal.I have no time for dirty play but I would give Ó Donoghue a pass on that one. This is a red card offence. I don't think it's possible to make the case that leading with a closed fist in an attempt to punch the ball and striking the opponent on the side of the head isn't behaving in a way which is dangerous to an opponent. I don't think there was anything malicious in O'Donoghue's action. I think he was making a genuine effort to play the ball. However the way he did it was in a way that was clearly dangerous to his opponent and as such he should have been red carded.
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Post by Mickmack on Apr 5, 2022 17:08:55 GMT
I think you are being harsh on Ó Donoghue. A clumsy and dangerous tackle yes indeed but it was not malicious in my mind. I watched the match again and I have to disagree with you. I did a little bit of boxing myself as a teenager and believe me that was not a boxing punch. He tried to stop a goal and as one poster said he is not a natural defender and got his challenge completely wrong. Gavin was very brave in taking the goal.I have no time for dirty play but I would give Ó Donoghue a pass on that one. This is a red card offence. I don't think it's possible to make the case that leading with a closed fist in an attempt to punch the ball and striking the opponent on the side of the head isn't behaving in a way which is dangerous to an opponent. I don't think there was anything malicious in O'Donoghue's action. I think he was making a genuine effort to play the ball. However the way he did it was in a way that was clearly dangerous to his opponent and as such he should have been red carded. 5.17 is never applied when a keeper or a midfielder goes up to punch the ball with the fist. I think intention has to come into it and surely his intention was to fist the ball...but GWs head arrived where the ball was a nano second earlier.
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horsebox77
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Post by horsebox77 on Apr 5, 2022 17:09:02 GMT
As we are on the topic of injured players, looks like Kerry are on the flip side to Mayo. Stefan Okunbor looks set to get the all clear this week to resume full contact. Let's see him get a good few club games under the belt and judge progress from there.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2022 17:33:36 GMT
Feck how did Jack Barry shoulder flynn in the chest and break his ankle? I just don't get the physics of it? He just landed awkwardly, it was unfortunate but nothing really more. Ankle breaks and ankle ligament damage is especially prevalent in rugby when a land is impacted and still tries to sidestep after the impact as his body is knocked of kilter. Just seems to be one of those oh right, because I didn't think he was in the air when the shoulder came in.
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Post by Ballyfireside on Apr 5, 2022 17:35:16 GMT
Ah an interesting comparison but it's hard to judge players from different eras as maybe defenders were more loose years ago and less mass defending and players fitter now. I only saw Micko Connell in the flesh once as a six year old in 74 munster final when he came on as a sub so it would be unfair for me to compare. Now Maurice and David I can compare. Now I think David has the tools to be Kerry s greatest but Maurice had traits that David has nt. For example Maurice could play midfield and David does nt. Also Maurice was as good on either foot whereas David is mainly left footed. Maurice could take frees from the ground with both legs (I have yet to see another player do this) so Maurice had more in his arsenal. However David has more pace than Maurice so David has him there. However if I needed help midfield I would nt want David there whereas Maurice would be great there. Its a hard call and I would nt like to make a choice. Two wonderful talented icons. Good stuff there, scoped it out well. And yes hard to compare even 'near generations' let alone MickO'C. Still, could one make a case that these are the best 3 all time greatest? Then again it discriminates against defenders, i.e. how do you know if a fella prevented 10 goals, he'd get more praise for scoring 1 - there's no God there! How far away would JackO'Shea be?
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Post by royalkerryfan on Apr 5, 2022 18:27:06 GMT
As we are on the topic of injured players, looks like Kerry are on the flip side to Mayo. Stefan Okunbor looks set to get the all clear this week to resume full contact. Let's see him get a good few club games under the belt and judge progress from there. Great news indeed, Any update on Dan O'Donoghue ?
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Post by thehermit on Apr 5, 2022 18:35:37 GMT
The other thing to remember here is Jack is far too willy to allow any hubris or complacency set in just because of one big performance in a League decider. Let the outside media hype the hell out of Kerry, Kerry supporters (scarred by the events of the past three campaigns and the increasingly unbearable 8 year famine) know themselves its going to be a long tough summer ahead to bring Sam home. I am convinced Dublin will be waiting in a potential semi-final and in a one of game where they are probably now the underdogs, sure its all set up for them. Tyrone will be a serious challenge and doubtless someone else will emerge to give us pause for thought out of Ulster of the West. If I was Jack the first thing I would be doing when they reconvene for the next training session is to point to David, Seanie, Gavin and the rest and basically ask them what have you really won yet in yer career lads? For all the gushing praise about how great ye are, where's yer Celtic crosses. Diarmuid and Mike here beside me have plenty and no one ever gushed about them too much in their playing days (that's unfair on Diarmuid because I thought he was an excellent keeper but you know what I'm getting at). If I was Jack I'd be seriously reminding them about how they threw away the drawn final in 2019, allowed a mediocre Cork team pip them in 20 and totally under performed again last summer. I'd be hammering home the message day and night that they will be nothing without that AI medal in their back pocket, that they will never truly be rated by their own people until they manage to climb up those steps of the Hogan to lift Sam. Kerry are rightly one of the big favorites for the All Ireland, we usually are so nothing new there. And we all know far less talented teams have claimed titles in the past. And just acknowledging that doesn't mean we are getting carried away either. We are not a perfect team, there are still question marks about our ability to win a tight winner take all game when the fat's in the fire. We might only be an injury or two from disaster and the long wait to a Q-final is a worry too. But I actually think the Cork PUR stand will mean they will have backed themselves into such a corner that they will have to produce a serious performance. Likewise all the furore will give Kerry a bit more motivation to beat them. They'll always be question marks about this team until they actually go out and land the big fish. I'm hopeful however that they have become the anglers to do that job this summer
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Post by givehimaball on Apr 5, 2022 18:37:37 GMT
This is a red card offence. I don't think it's possible to make the case that leading with a closed fist in an attempt to punch the ball and striking the opponent on the side of the head isn't behaving in a way which is dangerous to an opponent. I don't think there was anything malicious in O'Donoghue's action. I think he was making a genuine effort to play the ball. However the way he did it was in a way that was clearly dangerous to his opponent and as such he should have been red carded. 5.17 is never applied when a keeper or a midfielder goes up to punch the ball with the fist. I think intention has to come into it and surely his intention was to fist the ball...but GWs head arrived where the ball was a nano second earlier. And as I said that's a GAA cultural issue that isn't like to change until some poor individual ends up paralysed or dead. I think if you mess up and completely accidently punch someone to the head with no malice whatsoever it should be a red card offence given the danger of a blow to the head. If a player punches someone to the head and it looks like there was malice involved the player involved should be looking at a lifetime ban. The GAA need to be doing everything in their power to remove situations like (lads flying through the air, leading with the fist) from the game. The notion that because there was no malice involved the player shouldn't be punished is pure bunkum. If a player is going to act in a way that is dangerous to their opponent, then they shouldn't be on the pitch.
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Post by southward on Apr 5, 2022 19:17:48 GMT
Rugby isn't exactly a softie sport, we'd all agree but they've become very strict on dangerous play, especially when it comes to the head area. In rugby, O'Donoghue could have been carded (red or yellow) on two counts - (1) the head punch and (2) taking out a player in the air.
And, crucially, intent, or a lack thereof, is largely irrelevant. The onus is put on the tackler to exercise care toward an opponent. Saying a fella was going for the ball and it was an accident, even when accepted, just doesn't cut it.
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Post by veteran on Apr 5, 2022 19:29:06 GMT
Ah that’s a shame about Jordan Flynn. That man has really blossomed over the past year and was having a fine game on Sunday prior to his injury.
Did Tom Parsons sustain a similar injury a couple of years , also in Croke Park against Kerry ? There is something in my head about a collision with Sean O’Shea ? Perhaps I am imagining it.
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Post by royalkerryfan on Apr 5, 2022 19:32:37 GMT
Ah that’s a shame about Jordan Flynn. That man has really blossomed over the past year and was having a fine game on Sunday prior to his injury. Did Tom Parsons sustain a similar injury a couple of years , also in Croke Park against Kerry ? There is something in my head about a collision with Sean O’Shea ? Perhaps I am imagining it. No I think Seanie collided with Conroy of Galway during super 8s game and he broke his leg.
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Post by Moderator on Apr 5, 2022 19:37:29 GMT
Ah that’s a shame about Jordan Flynn. That man has really blossomed over the past year and was having a fine game on Sunday prior to his injury. Did Tom Parsons sustain a similar injury a couple of years , also in Croke Park against Kerry ? There is something in my head about a collision with Sean O’Shea ? Perhaps I am imagining it. Veteran, that was Paul Conroy from Galway in 2018 that slid into Sean O'Shea and suffered a double break in his leg. He was in a wheelchair for a while after it, showing how serious the injury was.
Tom Parsons had his injury against Mayo in Castlebar in May of the same year.
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Post by Kerryman Randy Savage on Apr 5, 2022 19:43:16 GMT
Intent is important when O'Donoghue's tackle is called a cowardly attack on this forum. It was late and we should be happy that Gavin survived without serious injury.
If the shoe was on the other foot, would we be happy with a Dara Moynihan red for the same thing? He went for the ball and made a hames of it. If he didn't go for it his teammates would have gotten onto him. He did what I'd expect the Kerry player to do in the same spot.
Even though it was easy, an early red would have been even less of a challenge. Kerry would be better with a closer game than we got.
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Post by Mickmack on Apr 5, 2022 19:49:09 GMT
Rugby isn't exactly a softie sport, we'd all agree but they've become very strict on dangerous play, especially when it comes to the head area. In rugby, O'Donoghue could have been carded (red or yellow) on two counts - (1) the head punch and (2) taking out a player in the air. And, crucially, intent, or a lack thereof, is largely irrelevant. The onus is put on the tackler to exercise care toward an opponent. Saying a fella was going for the ball and it was an accident, even when accepted, just doesn't cut it. The point is that its not rugby. Rugby are light years ahead of the GAA in relation to injuries. One cant say that a GAA player should be suspended by invoking a rugby rule. Its a totally different discussion as whether the GAA should bring in a rule to put the onus on the guy using the shoulder or the fist to ensure he doesnt injure a player. I believe the GAA are well behind the curve on this and i have made this point previously....particular after the john small shoulder on eoin mcclaughlin..... i believe the gaa should copy the bicycle kick rule from soccer....with the bicycle kick if you kick the ball ...fine......if you kick an opponent...red card
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Post by veteran on Apr 5, 2022 20:06:47 GMT
Moderator and RoyalKerryfan, thanks for clearing that up.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2022 20:40:00 GMT
Rugby isn't exactly a softie sport, we'd all agree but they've become very strict on dangerous play, especially when it comes to the head area. In rugby, O'Donoghue could have been carded (red or yellow) on two counts - (1) the head punch and (2) taking out a player in the air. And, crucially, intent, or a lack thereof, is largely irrelevant. The onus is put on the tackler to exercise care toward an opponent. Saying a fella was going for the ball and it was an accident, even when accepted, just doesn't cut it. I know what you mean Southward but I can forgive an accident. I don't forgive dirty tackles done on purpose. Of course dangerous play can be punished but in the case of Ó Donoghue he had to try block White s attempt. Our own David Clifford hit Eoin Murchan a very dirty elbow to the head in the 19 final and it did nt look accidental but the ref did nt notice it as David was running with the ball and let's not forget Tadhg Kennelly v Nicholas Murphy in 09 which was pre planned. They were far worse than Ryan Ó Donoghue challenge. I remember Ciaran wheelan threw a dirty elbow into Aidan O'Mahonys face when we hammered them in 09 Mick.
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Post by Moderator on Apr 5, 2022 21:02:44 GMT
Why would you assume you were followed here or that a certain poster is from Dublin? I've been a member here for a number of years - long before you, in fact.
This forum is for the discussion of Kerry GAA matters.
Stray off that topic and you'll be gone.
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Post by Mickmack on Apr 5, 2022 21:20:56 GMT
Why would you assume you were followed here or that a certain poster is from Dublin? I've been a member here for a number of years - long before you, in fact. Are you dwelling on a hill in Kerry. There are plenty of them in Kerry. Sean McCarthy wrote a great song called My Kerry Hill.
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mike70
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Post by mike70 on Apr 5, 2022 21:27:31 GMT
Intent is important when O'Donoghue's tackle is called a cowardly attack on this forum. It was late and we should be happy that Gavin survived without serious injury. If the shoe was on the other foot, would we be happy with a Dara Moynihan red for the same thing? He went for the ball and made a hames of it. If he didn't go for it his teammates would have gotten onto him. He did what I'd expect the Kerry player to do in the same spot. Even though it was easy, an early red would have been even less of a challenge. Kerry would be better with a closer game than we got. lads I looked at the incident again today, and I think it’s fair to say o donoghue was commuted to the ball, but Gavin was coming at such speed from outside the box, he got to the ball before o donoghue, to be fair o donoghue was already committed, no issue here what so ever in my opinion. And to add, it was not a tackle, it was commitment to get the ball, collision I think is more appropriate.
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exiled
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Post by exiled on Apr 5, 2022 22:03:54 GMT
Not sure if it's been mentioned already, but Jordan Flynn suffered a Broken ankle and is probably gone for the championship. Barry was very lucky not to see red for the lateness of his tackle. Watched it again.
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Post by royalkerryfan on Apr 5, 2022 22:07:26 GMT
I remember Ciaran wheelan threw a dirty elbow into Aidan O'Mahonys face when we hammered them in 09 Mick. Oh for sure Whelan was no saint either. I remember him at start of a Leinster final v Meath clicking Jimmy McGuinness I think. My point though is IMO a deliberate dirty stroke is nastier than an accidental one. Nigel Crawford, Before the ball was thrown in. The ref didn't know what to do as the game hadn't started...
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Post by Ballyfireside on Apr 5, 2022 22:21:38 GMT
Ah that’s a shame about Jordan Flynn. That man has really blossomed over the past year and was having a fine game on Sunday prior to his injury. Did Tom Parsons sustain a similar injury a couple of years , also in Croke Park against Kerry ? There is something in my head about a collision with Sean O’Shea ? Perhaps I am imagining it. Veteran, that was Paul Conroy from Galway in 2018 that slid into Sean O'Shea and suffered a double break in his leg. He was in a wheelchair for a while after it, showing how serious the injury was. Tom Parsons had his injury against Mayo in Castlebar in May of the same year.
Google says 'twas v Galway and it was the worst such injuries ever of anyone in this country, it has been known to be fatal, it can result in a heart attack if pain control wasn't immediately available, now I'm no medic but that was the story at the time. '...dislocated his knee, tore his cruciate ligaments, hamstring and calf. His foot turned black and a doctor in Galway University Hospital told him he might not be able to run again, let alone play games.' Wouldn't say it only it is already in the public domain but someone ran up the field when Tom was down and I think it was Aidan O'6 who told 'em not to look. His GF is a physio and great to see him now getting on with it with the GPA. What a player, such a pity his career was cut short and in such circumstances, he was the typical classy Mayo footballer, a big hoor of a laddo!
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Post by culdesac on Apr 5, 2022 22:21:47 GMT
Very promising times ahead for us. Jack O Connor had a lot of these guys at minors and 20s and they only showed glimpses of their minor selfs under fitzmaurice and keane but by god they’re showing it all now a few to mention
Gavin white Jason foley Graham o sullivan Brian o beaglaoich
The partnership between foley and Morley is the first time in a long time we’ve able to don’t need to think who’s our 6&3
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Post by royalkerryfan on Apr 5, 2022 22:31:24 GMT
Barry was very lucky not to see red for the lateness of his tackle. Watched it again. Agreed Well according to the Mayo forum Flynn is possibly gone for the championship. A monumental blow for Mayo who already have a horrendous injury list. Jack was lucky but there was no intention to injure the lad. We've wanted a bit of an edge and yes it's a fine line but Jack had his best game in a Kerry jersey in my opinion.
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Post by kerrybhoy06 on Apr 6, 2022 0:55:03 GMT
On the punch to Gavin White, people keep talking about intent but you don’t referee intent, you referee outcome.
How many lads get yellows or reds for high tackles when all they have done is leave in a lazy arm.
He might not have meant it, we’ll never know, but he should have been sent off for a clear punch to the head
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