horsebox77
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Post by horsebox77 on Oct 9, 2021 9:03:21 GMT
Just read that article in the examiner, along with others from Jack’s media stint yesterday, he was asked about player progression from minors to seniors, he quotes that from the 2014/15 minors, against Tyrone, Ryan, O’Beagloich, Foley, Tom Sull, Breen and White all played minors those years, so all bar Murphy from our defence came from his minor tenure.
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Post by Mickmack on Oct 9, 2021 9:05:14 GMT
Outsider O’Connor back inside Kingdom and living another ‘dream come true’
Vincent Hogan
October 09 2021 02:30 AM
The self-styled outsider folds his arms and stretches his legs out long under a table in Austin Stack Park, the body language that of a man ready for any fires about to be set.
Faced by microphones, most Kerry managers feel compelled to become curators of platitude and cliché, but he knows this is different. Jack O’Connor has heard the noise.
So his third stint as Kerry manager officially begins with a question and answer session in Tralee that, for a time, is all about awkward backward glances.
In Kildare, his decision not to complete the third year of his term has been broadly depicted as an act of opportunism, predicated on the changed circumstance of his native county. The bigots and fools of social media have been having a field day, so much so that Kerry chairman Tim Murphy felt compelled to describe questioning of their selection process last Monday as “the lowest of the low”.
Given a previous Kildare statement declaring work with the senior footballers being “at an advanced stage of planning for 2022”, O’Connor’s resignation on September 6 became a kind of incendiary.
“There’s a bit of a misconception there,” he says firmly now. “This thing that I left Kildare because I was asked to manage Kerry or that it was a done deal is absolute and total nonsense.
“The situation in Kildare was I more or less had my mind made up when we were beaten in the Leinster final.
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“In fact, I was quite emotional in the dressing-room because I’d a fair idea it was my last time meeting that bunch of players or addressing them.
“I had a great time in Kildare. The people couldn’t have been more welcoming, but I was finding the almost nine-hour round journey was taking a huge toll.
“And even people close to me would have remarked around that time that I’d lost a lot of weight, that I couldn’t afford to lose.
“I’m fairly skinny as it is!”
O’Connor leaves Kildare a Division 1 team, yet drew heat before departing for his depiction in a podcast of Kerry as Gaelic football’s Manchester United.
No matter, for a man who won immediate All-Irelands in his previous two stints as Kerry senior boss and someone who guided the county’s minors to glory in 2014 and ’15 too, his credentials to replace Peter Keane are scarcely up for argument.
He was, too, always likely to be vulnerable to the visceral pull of home.
“In many ways, it’s a dream come true for me to get back working with the lads I worked with in 2014 and 2015,” said O’Connor, confirming that Tyrone’s Paddy Tally will join Diarmuid Murphy and Mike Quirke in his backroom team.
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You get the impression that O’Connor returns a calmer, more weathered soul.
He wrote a book in ’07, the pages of which read stark with the hard edge of perceived isolation, with his sense of exclusion.
Not one member of the 1970s team contacted him on his first appointment in late ’03 as replacement for Páidí Ó Sé, O’Connor interpreting their silence as a hostile clannishness. He wasn’t part of their silken world, had no access to the elegant light of their history.
And, to Jack, that made him unwelcome.
That’s where his sense of being an outsider found traction, in the idea that the gods of the county were almost willing him to fail.
Seventeen years on, he considers himself wiser, less trenchant.
“I would openly admit that when I went in in 2004, I felt under ferocious pressure because of the man I was replacing,” he says now. “I was replacing a legend, who’d won eight All-Irelands on the field and two more on the sideline. And I’d been involved with him for those two All-Irelands in ’97 and 2000.
“For different reasons, I felt under a lot of pressure to win that year.
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“I think that I’m better able keep things in perspective now. I don’t take criticism as personally as I used to that time. I’m not saying that I like criticism, but I can deal better with it. I’d be a bit more thick-skinned than I used to be. And I now know the areas where you need to direct your energy.”
His first stint as Kerry boss drew immediate success at a time when Ulster teams were becoming brazen.
For three years out of four (’02-’05), Kerry’s hopes would be guillotined by steel-boned Northerners infused with what Jack himself perceived at the time as a vaulting self-regard. He spoke of “an arrogance” in the new challengers “which rubs Kerry people up the wrong way”.
The idea of Kerry being spooked by Northern champions, of them wintering in the red glow of a Sacred Heart lamp for fear of a famine looming clearly needled him.
“They build up a mythology about themselves,” he said in ‘Keys to the Kingdom’. “That doesn’t sit well in Kerry, where a man with four All-Ireland medals would quietly defer to another man who has five.”
Now his third stint begins, as the previous two did, with Tyrone as All-Ireland champions.
And if there was a time in Kerry when losing to Ulster teams represented some social embarrassment, the prejudices of the past have been ground to dust now. O’Connor’s previous Kerry teams found the Tyrone template hard to penetrate and he reckons the new champions won’t be abdicating gently now.
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“Tyrone, in my head, could be even better next year,” he says now. “Because if you think about it, they had disruptions this year with Covid and all that. And the confidence it will give them having won the All-Ireland, they could be better again next year.
“But look I wouldn’t be too sure now that Dublin are gone anywhere. They could regroup next year. They still have a core of very good players, the Brian Fentons, the Ciarán Kilkennys, the Con O’Callaghans, these fellas, they’re going nowhere.
“They could regroup and come very strong next year.”
From there, he does what a Kerry manager must, name-checking just about every team with a functioning pulse. And soon he is on his feet, gathering his coat.
“Thanks lads,” he smiles. “I hope we’ll still be as harmonious in our dealings this time next year!”
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Post by Mickmack on Oct 9, 2021 9:11:00 GMT
Oisín McConville: Kerry, with Paddy Tally, will have a more defined way of playing
Tally is a man who teaches a team how to set up well and therefore gives them a better chance to win games
Oisín McConville: Kerry, with Paddy Tally, will have a more defined way of playing
Paddy Tally
SAT, 09 OCT, 2021 - 06:01
OISIN MCCONVILLE
The first thing about new Kerry coach Paddy Tally is that his reputation precedes him.
We hear it trotted out on the television and the radio that he is nothing more than a defensive coach.
I don’t see it like that at all. I’ve seen him at first hand over the years, when he was in with Crossmaglen doing sessions, for example, and first and foremost Tally is a coach that has been used by teams who want to be better defensively. Basically, if you look deeper into it, Tally is a man who teaches a team how to set up well and therefore gives them a better chance to win games.
He has great experience, having won a Sigerson Cup with St Mary’s. Having a nephew on that panel, I know they were coached to within an inch of their lives, but in a good way. DCU, UCC, UCD, Queen’s, and Jordanstown had vastly larger picks because of their massive student populations, funding, and scholarships, yet St Mary’s punched way above their weight.
Everyone on his team knew their job and you can see how some of those players have prospered since, certainly in Tyrone under Feargal Logan and Brian Dooher, and how they won the All-Ireland.
Cathal McShane was converted from a hard- working half-forward into a more fruitful forward inside; Kieran McGeary and Conor Meyler developed into the fine players they are today and their impact on the inter-county scene has been incredible.
When Tally was with Down they were (and are) perhaps in the middle of their biggest slump in years and he didn’t have the machinery to do damage. Working in Galway, under Kevin Walsh, they were a much more solid-looking team, possessing a couple of kick-out alternatives and didn’t ship the kind of losses they have lately.
Tally gets unfair press and is accused of over-coaching. I don’t buy that. If you were to ask me to name the top three guys that Kerry could have brought into Jack O’Connor’s upcoming regime, Tally would be one of them.
It’s a shrewd move and something that many wouldn’t have seen happening — Kerry bringing in an Ulster coach. It’s a massive move and one Kerry will benefit from.
Tyrone, in the All-Ireland semi-final, were offering Kerry their own short kick-outs. Had Tally been on the line he’d have shown a little know-how and perhaps suggested the need to occasionally go long. It’s time Kerry brought in someone like him. They should let the U17 and U20 management teams be privy to some of his coaching, so players who progress through those ranks don’t come into the set-up and find it a bit alien, so they’re already familiar with it in operation.
Kerry, with Tally, will have a more defined way of playing. They’re traditionalists but what he will offer is a springboard to enable the forward players to play better. A bit more solidity. They need to be harder to play against while not stunting themselves from an attacking perspective.
Those facets need not be mutually exclusive.
From my dealings with Tally, he is very attuned to the pressures on young lads and very much about the player before the performance and the correlation between a happy player and consistent level of performance. That puts him ahead of the curve.
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Post by Whosinmidfield on Oct 9, 2021 9:18:41 GMT
You mean Paudie Clifford hasn’t nailed down a forward position? Jack will be looking for players to do what Galvin and Declan did as wing forwards and it remains to be seen if Paudie has that. Maybe Paudie will be CHF with SOS at midfield. I think Paudie has to start even if a different type of player is going to be at wing forward. I think playing 2 inside with Paudie coming out is a likely option. Paudie and SOS holding their position in the half forward line as much as possible would give us a fantastic link to our full forward line. Both of their movement is excellent and they are very good at winning ball on the run. |
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thehermit
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Tell an old man who saw them in days of old, Do they still walk proudly in their green and gold?
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Post by thehermit on Oct 9, 2021 9:22:35 GMT
If Ger Gilroy is not interested in praising Dublin than why is he they're number cheerleader on there? They might be proud Kildare men but as I acknowledged on my post this goes on despite what county they are from. The fact is they know what side their bread is buttered. A Dublin based media station will never survive asking hard questions about Dublin GAA, regardless of how valid they are. If they did, they'd be no Paddy podcast, no Brendan Brogan podcast,no Philly on to talk about his good charity work. No exclusive interview with Jim We probably need to be moving on from this as we are paying far more attention to OTB than is justified. But Gilroy has consistently stuck the knife into Dublin when the opportunity arose. Eg; after this years semi he basically said they were poor losers who engaged in thuggish behaviour. It's a different debate whether he was right or wrong but the fact is if he was pandering to Dublin he would not have said this. Btw on occasions I've heard him praise Dublin but he'd be a proper ostrich if he didn't acknowledge their achievements. Bernard is the most media savvy of the lot. That's his job and no surprise if he is landing the odd gig with OTB. Paddy Andrews & Andy Moran gig is excellent and has taken on a life of it's own now. Good stuff this week from both lads, Andy about importance of Sigerson while Paddy talked about self analysis and why talent alone is not enough. Great listen for aspiring young lads. Yerra you're probably right about giving them too much thought, we'll agree to disagree. Also agree the Mayo love in thing is grating to say the least, hence my incredulity at Gilroy's claim a team that hasn't won any All Ireland could be called the second best in history  |
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horsebox77
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Post by horsebox77 on Oct 9, 2021 9:34:21 GMT
Jack will be looking for players to do what Galvin and Declan did as wing forwards and it remains to be seen if Paudie has that. Maybe Paudie will be CHF with SOS at midfield. I think Paudie has to start even if a different type of player is going to be at wing forward. I think playing 2 inside with Paudie coming out is a likely option. Paudie and SOS holding their position in the half forward line as much as possible would give us a fantastic link to our full forward line. Both of their movement is excellent and they are very good at winning ball on the run. With regard to the inside line, is Tony Brosnan too similar to David Clifford, would they clash inside or compliment each other? Would live to see these two play more inside in the league and see can they develop some form of relationship akin to Clifford and Seanie. |
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Post by Whosinmidfield on Oct 9, 2021 9:41:42 GMT
I'm becoming more convinced that we will end up with a very youthful diamond, definitely within 18 months. I'm predicting Breen, Diarmuid, Seanie and Paul Shea will be our six, eight, nine and eleven respectively. I've seen a good bit of the Kilcummin man and will be eagerly watching his performances in this year's championship to gauge progression. Jack has no issue with throwing a lad into the mix and seeing how it works, PK was very conservative with Paudie When he was burning up local games last two years. From what I see with Paul O’Shea, I think he is a midfielder only and not a forward. I don’t think he has the movement in the forwards to impact the game enough. He is very talented though and I’d like to see him tried at midfield in the league. Also I think Seanie would be totally wasted at midfield. He’s one of the best forwards in the country. He’s the perfect 11 in my book. A fantastic link man and well able to score a few points from play. Putting him at midfield would only be putting more responsibility on him to work and stop other players which would be a total waste. I think a Joe O’Connor and Diarmuid O’Connor partnership could be very effective. Centre back is a position that we haven’t nailed down in years, hopefully Jack can manage to. A good number of possibilities there, Breen as you say and Morley from the current panel and Dan O’Donoghue, Daniel O’Brien and Okunbor from players who could come in from outside the panel. |
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Post by Whosinmidfield on Oct 9, 2021 9:46:20 GMT
I think Paudie has to start even if a different type of player is going to be at wing forward. I think playing 2 inside with Paudie coming out is a likely option. Paudie and SOS holding their position in the half forward line as much as possible would give us a fantastic link to our full forward line. Both of their movement is excellent and they are very good at winning ball on the run. With regard to the inside line, is Tony Brosnan too similar to David Clifford, would they clash inside or compliment each other? Would live to see these two play more inside in the league and see can they develop some form of relationship akin to Clifford and Seanie. They are similar but I think they could work. Tony Brosnan has to be given a bigger role next year, every time he has played for Kerry I think he has done well. In saying that a more direct inside forward with a bit of pace could compliment Clifford better. Killian Spillane has that and Donal O’Sullivan is another one who has all that in abundance. |
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thehermit
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Tell an old man who saw them in days of old, Do they still walk proudly in their green and gold?
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Post by thehermit on Oct 9, 2021 9:47:28 GMT
I've been impressed by Jack's press conference last night. Didn't dodge any of the hard questions and gave some interesting insights. Full transcript is here: www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/arid-40716938.htmlAnd I think Radio Kerry said they'd carry the full interview at the start of Weekend Sport today at 2. |
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Post by Mickmack on Oct 9, 2021 10:24:49 GMT
I always liked the look of Dan McCarthy from Kenmare
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Post by Whosinmidfield on Oct 9, 2021 10:41:53 GMT
I think these 3 quotes are the most interesting from the press conference.
“Am I looking for a particular type of player? I made the point that the way the game is gone these days, the middle eight is really critical to the way it’s played. Those players have to be savage athletes, Roy Keane-type players. You have to earmark certain types of players for those roles.”
What does Paddy Tally being involved say about your philosophy?
“The only thing I’d say to you, you’re watching teams that I’ve been involved in for many’s a long day, are you? How far back?
You’d want to go back a bit further. I was involved in the Kerry techs in ‘92 and ‘93. So look, look, what kind of football do you think those teams played starting then and all the way up? So I’m hardly going to change at this hour of my life and go all defensive.
Listen, sure of course that narrative will be out there. I’m managing the team. My old friend Johnny Culloty said to me one time, he said, ‘Jack, it’s not enough just to win in Kerry, you’ve to win with a bit of style’. That’ll be our intention.”
Talk about your management team
“Look, I was involved with Diarmuid (Murphy) before. Very, very solid guy. Great head for the game. He was involved with the Dingle club so he’s at the coalface. Very calm character. Very bright guy. Mike (Quirke) has a lot of experience. He’s a coach with the Kerry county board, a GDA. He’s had experience of managing his club team down here and managing an inter-county team and he will bring a lot to the table as well and it only occurred to me the other day that there will be three current inter-county managers in my set-up — I was managing myself, Mike was managing and Paddy was managing. We’re bound to have learned something unless we’re very dim.”
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2021 11:38:15 GMT
I think these 3 quotes are the most interesting from the press conference. “Am I looking for a particular type of player? I made the point that the way the game is gone these days, the middle eight is really critical to the way it’s played. Those players have to be savage athletes, Roy Keane-type players. You have to earmark certain types of players for those roles.” What does Paddy Tally being involved say about your philosophy? “The only thing I’d say to you, you’re watching teams that I’ve been involved in for many’s a long day, are you? How far back? You’d want to go back a bit further. I was involved in the Kerry techs in ‘92 and ‘93. So look, look, what kind of football do you think those teams played starting then and all the way up? So I’m hardly going to change at this hour of my life and go all defensive. Listen, sure of course that narrative will be out there. I’m managing the team. My old friend Johnny Culloty said to me one time, he said, ‘Jack, it’s not enough just to win in Kerry, you’ve to win with a bit of style’. That’ll be our intention.” Talk about your management team “Look, I was involved with Diarmuid (Murphy) before. Very, very solid guy. Great head for the game. He was involved with the Dingle club so he’s at the coalface. Very calm character. Very bright guy. Mike (Quirke) has a lot of experience. He’s a coach with the Kerry county board, a GDA. He’s had experience of managing his club team down here and managing an inter-county team and he will bring a lot to the table as well and it only occurred to me the other day that there will be three current inter-county managers in my set-up — I was managing myself, Mike was managing and Paddy was managing. We’re bound to have learned something unless we’re very dim.” ya Jack is no fool and he's got a great backroom team in my opiniom they all have their fingers on the football pulse so I'm 100% behind them and I'm excited for what next year could bring, it's just a pity Jack couldn't work his magic and get Mark O'Connor to come home. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2021 11:39:33 GMT
I always liked the look of Dan McCarthy from Kenmare was it Dan who did the cruciate last year? |
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thehermit
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Post by thehermit on Oct 9, 2021 13:02:24 GMT
ya Jack is no fool and he's got a great backroom team in my opiniom they all have their fingers on the football pulse so I'm 100% behind them and I'm excited for what next year could bring, it's just a pity Jack couldn't work his magic and get Mark O'Connor to come home. No he's not, and whoever is in charge I'll be 100% behind too. Still the last 3 years have taken their toll on my old optimism. Not sure are we that close or are we just deluding ourselves.
Jack mentioned it himself about the competition. Dublin had a blip, they'll be back next year as strong as ever and nothing is going to happen anytime soon to stop the deck being stacked in their favour. Tyrone will be around for a good few years with their age profile. Mayo can beat anyone on their day. Galway will need to be respected, dido Donegal and Armagh look to be building something serious.
Its not going to get any easier to end this famine.
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Post by givehimaball on Oct 9, 2021 14:30:57 GMT
ya Jack is no fool and he's got a great backroom team in my opiniom they all have their fingers on the football pulse so I'm 100% behind them and I'm excited for what next year could bring, it's just a pity Jack couldn't work his magic and get Mark O'Connor to come home. Getting Mark O'Connor to come home now is a complete non-runner given the way his career is going. He's in a far different place to where Okunbor was with his career/club. Mark's current contract is up next year and by far the likeliest scenario is that he will sign a fairly lucrative contract for at least 3 years possibly even longer given the age profile of Geelong's squad. There is some possibility that Deividas Uosis might be back in a year or two - he has one year left on his rookie deal so he will surely see that one out I'd imagine. Probably a high chance that he gets at least another year - due to COVID, the AFL clubs are allowed keep international rookies on the Category B international rookie contracts for 3 years. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2021 15:13:14 GMT
ya Jack is no fool and he's got a great backroom team in my opiniom they all have their fingers on the football pulse so I'm 100% behind them and I'm excited for what next year could bring, it's just a pity Jack couldn't work his magic and get Mark O'Connor to come home. Getting Mark O'Connor to come home now is a complete non-runner given the way his career is going. He's in a far different place to where Okunbor was with his career/club. Mark's current contract is up next year and by far the likeliest scenario is that he will sign a fairly lucrative contract for at least 3 years possibly even longer given the age profile of Geelong's squad. There is some possibility that Deividas Uosis might be back in a year or two - he has one year left on his rookie deal so he will surely see that one I'd imagine. Probably a high chance that he gets at least another year - due to COVID, the AFL clubs are allowed keep international rookies on the Category B international rookie contracts for 3 years. if money is the problem then why don't kerry gaa buy him a house and get him a job like it's said that Tyrone county board did for mcshane? I'm always told we have loads of brass why not splash a bit on a once in a generation player? |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2021 15:16:03 GMT
No he's not, and whoever is in charge I'll be 100% behind too. Still the last 3 years have taken their toll on my old optimism. Not sure are we that close or are we just deluding ourselves.
Jack mentioned it himself about the competition. Dublin had a blip, they'll be back next year as strong as ever and nothing is going to happen anytime soon to stop the deck being stacked in their favour. Tyrone will be around for a good few years with their age profile. Mayo can beat anyone on their day. Galway will need to be respected, dido Donegal and Armagh look to be building something serious.
Its not going to get any easier to end this famine.
no I'm deffo feeling more optimistic at the moment, but you're right the dubs will be back next year Mayo Tyrone Donegal Galway Armagh all look good so it'll be tough. |
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Post by kerryeastcoastusa on Oct 9, 2021 15:31:49 GMT
Getting Mark O'Connor to come home now is a complete non-runner given the way his career is going. He's in a far different place to where Okunbor was with his career/club. Mark's current contract is up next year and by far the likeliest scenario is that he will sign a fairly lucrative contract for at least 3 years possibly even longer given the age profile of Geelong's squad. There is some possibility that Deividas Uosis might be back in a year or two - he has one year left on his rookie deal so he will surely see that one I'd imagine. Probably a high chance that he gets at least another year - due to COVID, the AFL clubs are allowed keep international rookies on the Category B international rookie contracts for 3 years. if money is the problem then why don't kerry gaa buy him a house and get him a job like it's said that Tyrone county board did for mcshane? I'm always told we have loads of brass why not splash a bit on a once in a generation player? That’s an interesting road to go down … what happens with David Clifford decides we would like a nice house also … and then Paudie Clifford decides he should not be left out … then Seanie O’Shea then …so on and so on. Gaa is amateur … he don’t need to start pay for play |
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Post by ciarraimick on Oct 9, 2021 16:45:17 GMT
I really hope Jack brings back Sam to the Kingdom but I'm not counting my chickens yet. Jack talks a good fight but it's not always the truth. Before Leinster final he told rté that Kildare were coming to win and not make up numbers. Turned out he was talking out two sides of his mouth. Kildare played to try keep score down as Daniel Flynn kind of hinted at afterwards and Jack was telling rté afterwards about how Kildare gave Dublin a great game and not many teams get as close. This was after being destroyed by 8 points in a very one sided final. I for one will only believe if Sam is brought home. Jack did deliver 3 Sam's but as many critics will say they only beat 2 weak Mayo teams and Cork.I don't forget Tyrone Dublin but mainly Down and Donegal not to mention the 09 saga. Hope I'm wrong but let's not get carried away thinking Sam is in the bag.
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horsebox77
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Our trees & mountains are silent ghosts, they hold wisdom and knowledge mankind has long forgotten.
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Post by horsebox77 on Oct 9, 2021 16:47:33 GMT
I think any talk of tempting or persuading Mark back to his native soil is fruitless at the juncture, the key for me is prevention as opposed to coaxing young lads home.
I would be more for keeping current and promising players here as opposed to coaxing those who have left, by all accounts Paul O’Shea is very much on the radar of a certain ex North Kerry facilitator. - keeping our own players by aiding their development both on and off the field is imperative It was one of the key factors is setting up certain Dublin players with jobs and life leg up.
At least now the bastardized hybrid Compromise Ruies has been disbanded… that was like a free view to our shop window…
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Post by givehimaball on Oct 9, 2021 17:33:40 GMT
if money is the problem then why don't kerry gaa buy him a house and get him a job like it's said that Tyrone county board did for mcshane? I'm always told we have loads of brass why not splash a bit on a once in a generation player? That’s an interesting road to go down … what happens with David Clifford decides we would like a nice house also … and then Paudie Clifford decides he should not be left out … then Seanie O’Shea then …so on and so on. Gaa is amateur … he don’t need to start pay for play Also besides the horrible moral implications of such a deal, O'Connor is likely to earn a good bit more than the cost of a house from his Aussie Rules career given what he has achieved already. There's no way in hell Kerry GAA have the amount of cash necessary to even come close to matching what O'Connor is likely to earn in his career. That's beside the practical and moral considerations. |
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Post by givehimaball on Oct 9, 2021 17:51:50 GMT
All he had to do to get Kildare promoted, was beat Cork,Laois and Meath.
Jack was fairly fortunate in the way the league worked out - Cork, Clare and Kildare all finished on the same amount of points so it was score difference that meant they were playing Kildare in the final as opposed to Mayo.
Kildare's final score difference was +14 - they beat Laois by 13 points in Portlaoise in the last round of league games when the wheels had completely come off for Laois. The fact that the Laois manager is now one of his selectors is one for the conspiracy theorists.
To get to the Leinster final all he had to do was beat Offaly and Westmeath.
Over all, his time in Kildare was distinctly unimpressive.
As for the minor wins, given the strength of the panels available to him, no-one can legitimately claim these wins as managerially significant - both years the Kerry squads were clearly the strongest in the country by a long way.
In terms of what Jack has done in the past decade, his stint in charge of the U21s/U20s looks to me to be the most relevant by far given the results and how the teams set up. Over the 4 years he was in charge, one of my key impressions was that each year the team looked less than the sum of its parts which I think is a damming indictment of a manager. He obviously wasn't helped by the absence of Clifford and O'Shea [worth remembering that O'Shea was there for one year] but I think he badly mishandled the situation given he seemed to spend so much time in the media moaning about this/using it as an excuse as opposed to actually dealing with the situation. Over the four years he was in charge, two Munster titles (and then losing both All-Ireland semi-finals) was a fairly paltry return given the players available.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2021 18:50:34 GMT
if money is the problem then why don't kerry gaa buy him a house and get him a job like it's said that Tyrone county board did for mcshane? I'm always told we have loads of brass why not splash a bit on a once in a generation player? That’s an interesting road to go down … what happens with David Clifford decides we would like a nice house also … and then Paudie Clifford decides he should not be left out … then Seanie O’Shea then …so on and so on. Gaa is amateur … he don’t need to start pay for play Tyrone didn't have that problem when they supposedly did what they did for mcshane, if it meant that the Cliffords and Seánie Shea could win allirelands then I'm sure they'd get over it, plus the Aussies aren't after those lads. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2021 18:56:11 GMT
I think any talk of tempting or persuading Mark back to his native soil is fruitless at the juncture, the key for me is prevention as opposed to coaxing young lads home. I would be more for keeping current and promising players here as opposed to coaxing those who have left, by all accounts Paul O’Shea is very much on the radar of a certain ex North Kerry facilitator. - keeping our own players by aiding their development both on and off the field is imperative It was one of the key factors is setting up certain Dublin players with jobs and life leg up. At least now the bastardized hybrid Compromise Ruies has been disbanded… that was like a free view to our shop window… horse if we had Mark O'Connor instead of Jack Barry, who would have won the Tyrone game? I would wager that O'connor would have swung it our way, he definitely wouldn't have kicked the ball back to the Tyroneman in the big square. |
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Post by veteran on Oct 9, 2021 19:04:17 GMT
During the press conference , Jack quoted Johnny Culloty who once told him that in Kerry it is not enough to win , you must win with style. Jack went on to say that is his intention. I maybe able to do business with Jack after all !
In any case Jack this is my message to you. You are not being bequeathed a poisoned chalice. You are being handed a silver spoon. Get on with it and deliver. Not perhaps in 2023 or thereafter . Next year, or else.
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horsebox77
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Post by horsebox77 on Oct 9, 2021 19:09:04 GMT
Ah K'boy, you know my score, I'm not going to single out any one such individual error, Jack didn't go for goal on four occasions when keeping the score board ticking over.
From his minor and school days, it's obvious Mark would make a difference in Mid field... but we could be quoting 18, 19, 20 and last year as he would have made the difference in all this key matches.
I think we have to address our middle diamond, centre back, midfield and our half forward line ... point is Jack has five rounds of county championship to address, let's hope players put the head above the trenches.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2021 19:10:25 GMT
That’s an interesting road to go down … what happens with David Clifford decides we would like a nice house also … and then Paudie Clifford decides he should not be left out … then Seanie O’Shea then …so on and so on. Gaa is amateur … he don’t need to start pay for play Also besides the horrible moral implications of such a deal, O'Connor is likely to earn a good bit more than the cost of a house from his Aussie Rules career given what he has achieved already. There's no way in hell Kerry GAA have the amount of cash necessary to even come close to matching what O'Connor is likely to earn in his career. That's beside the practical and moral considerations. I don't know, is it moral what the gaa have given dublin financially over the last 20 years? Is it moral what Tyrone gaa have supposedly given mcshane to stay put? What about club and intercounty managers getting paid? I think when it comes to gaa it's leave your morals at the door and it's time we woke up in kerry and do what ever is necessary to win the allireland as you can bet all our competitors will. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2021 19:25:11 GMT
Ah K'boy, you know my score, I'm not going to single out any one such individual error, Jack didn't go for goal on four occasions when keeping the score board ticking over. From his minor and school days, it's obvious Mark would make a difference in Mid field... but we could be quoting 18, 19, 20 and last year as he would have made the difference in all this key matches. I think we have to address our middle diamond, centre back, midfield and our half forward line ... point is Jack has five rounds of county championship to address, let's hope players put the head above the trenches. I nó what you're saying horse, and I'm sorry for singling out Jack like that, but as Páidí used to say, a grain of rice can tip the scales I a match, we drew with dublin in 19, lost to Cork by 1 points after extra time, and lost to Tyrone by 1 point after extra time, a grain of rice eh, how many grains of rice would Mark O'connor be worth? You speak of our 6, 8, 9, and 11, well Mark could easily play 6,8,or 9. You could have the 2 O'connors at midfield O'Shea at 11 and all we're looking for is a 6. |
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horsebox77
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Our trees & mountains are silent ghosts, they hold wisdom and knowledge mankind has long forgotten.
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Post by horsebox77 on Oct 9, 2021 19:53:37 GMT
Ya, we need versatile players. I still think Beaufort's Breen can do a job for us at 6, we need to bed in two midfielders and let them settle.
I'm looking forward to East Kerry vs Stacks for that reason, OK we've side shows like Donaghy and Sherwood but what I want to see is if Paul O'Shea is pitted against Joe O'Conner, these are the kind of clashes that will tell us a lot of what we need to get and blood.
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Post by Mickmack on Oct 9, 2021 21:57:00 GMT
After reading all the negative posts about Jack O'Connor i am reminded of a comment made by Mick O'Dwyer back in the 1980 as Kerry were going for 5 in a row.
He was asked how it felt to have 31 counties hoping Kerry would lose.
"Thirty one and a half" says Micko!
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