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Post by wideball on Aug 14, 2019 8:06:56 GMT
Ok, I think you personally have been 100% consistent in your take on Gough, and refs living in Dublin. I dont entirely agree but i see your point. I also have plenty of time for your views on players/managers/supporters blaming referees for bad results etc. But I think in general, most Kerry supporters could not give a *e about perception. They are concerned that in their view Gough did a number on them and dont want it to happen again. That is the main reason why this issue has blown up. Inter county managers wouldnt care if Gough never reffed a game again, so long as they come out the right side of the result. So this holier than thou attitude to perception rings a bit hollow to me. McEnaney made the point that Mike Dean lives 19 minutes from Anfield and/or Goodison, yet he's trusted to ref big games at both stadia. And btw its ironic that O'Mahony of all players has added his tuppence worth in this, given that Gough missed his sending off 'tackle'. Given that you referenced Mike Dean, I might as well include this This is comical stuff |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 14, 2019 8:40:01 GMT
Surely Tom picks up Mannion and Tadgh picks up Con based on strengths, eye. Barry and Spillane take Fenton and a curve ball but Sherwood on McCaffery. Yah, they are all likely matchups, just not sure I can see them working. White would seem a good match for McCaffrey. I think Sherwood is better suited to central positions but he could be an option. Wouldn’t agree with putting White on McCaffrey. Could be a disaster Similar to what happened when he was matched up against Ryan McHugh of Donegal (Granted, he did take a few early knocks!). As Paddy Durcan proved last weekend he is nullified if put on the back foot. White has outrageous pace but does not have the same attacking prowess of someone like Durcan. It is going to be a fascinating game and we can argue match ups all we like but at the end of the day what do we know huh? I’m sure PK and his team already have plans in place… |
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Post by dc84 on Aug 14, 2019 8:41:51 GMT
While I agree with the principal of not having a ref that lives in a competing county 8n charge this is getting put of hand really. The real story here is our young warriors making the final not who refs it.
On gough he seems to be getting built up because he reversed a decision that was laughable where con o Callaghan fell over his first instinct was to give it. Pity lane can't get it streets ahead of everyone else in my book don't remember any controversy with him.
This talk doesn't do us any favours in my opinion.
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Post by buck02 on Aug 14, 2019 8:49:14 GMT
I listened back to the piece on Off the Ball with Pat Mc and Mike Quirke.
Joe Molloy and Pat praised Hough for his decision to over turn the penalty HE awarded against Cork after consultation with the umpire.
Sorry but that is a load of bull.
If he wasn't 100% sure that O Callaghan was fouled, instead of falling, he should not have awarded the penalty in the first place.
If he does the same thing in a few weeks I wonder would the umpire be as likely to tell Gough he was wrong with 15000 Dubs screaming at them from the Hill for the rest of the game.
And wasn't it a pity he didn't listen to his umpire over the phantom 45 he awarded in the 16 semi final.
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Post by kerrygold on Aug 14, 2019 9:03:05 GMT
I listened back to the piece on Off the Ball with Pat Mc and Mike Quirke. Joe Molloy and Pat praised Hough for his decision to over turn the penalty HE awarded against Cork after consultation with the umpire. Sorry but that is a load of bull. If he wasn't 100% sure that O Callaghan was fouled, instead of falling, he should not have awarded the penalty in the first place. If he does the same thing in a few weeks I wonder would the umpire be as likely to tell Gough he was wrong with 15000 Dubs screaming at them from the Hill for the rest of the game. And wasn't it a pity he didn't listen to his umpire over the phantom 45 he awarded in the 16 semi final. Absolutely spot on post. Giving the penalty was a disgrace when he didn't know what he was doing. It was no more than an uninformed stab in the dark then. Dublin have a 100% record of getting every marginal game deciding call going their way in big Croke Park games this decade. |
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Aug 14, 2019 9:12:49 GMT
I really don't think it helps to mention decisions Gough may or may not have got wrong.
The argument, imo, shouldn't be on that basis, or that Gough is biased.
The argument should simply be that refs living and working in Dublin should not be reffing Dublin games.
It is a simple argument, based on a premise that requires no embellishment.
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Post by Mickmack on Aug 14, 2019 9:22:58 GMT
I really don't think it helps to mention decisions Gough may or may not have got wrong. The argument, imo, shouldn't be on that basis, or that Gough is biased. The argument should simply be that refs living and working in Dublin should not be reffing Dublin games. It is a simple argument, based on a premise that requires no embellishment. I agree with this. What is not taken into account is the possible effect on mental preparation of players going in to play Dublin with a ref living and working there. I know that prior to the 2015 it took from all the build up and i tuned out. What can this do to players. I would be interested in the view of Himself on this point....I know its hard to quantify but i think its a huge thing. |
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Post by bomberliston on Aug 14, 2019 9:44:12 GMT
Ref from a non-competing province. So, in this case, Ulster or Connaught.
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kot
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Post by kot on Aug 14, 2019 9:51:03 GMT
Its madness that this is becoming such a talking point.
Surely there is enough referees for the GAA to be able to scan through them and say "which one of these guys is best placed to ref the game without drawing an uproar". Are Goldrick, Mcquillan & Gough really all they have?
Ref's should never be a talking point which is my main gripe with the likes of a Gough or McQuillan and Paddy Russel or John Bannon before them. Making themselves as prominent a talking point as the bloody 30+ lads playing the game.
This isn't a paranoid uproar by Kerry people as the Dublin posters of Facebook, the 42 and so on would have you believe. There is proof in the pudding. Last time he officiated between these 2 teams he was heavily influenced and biased.
The 1 Dublin player who had close links to him convinced him to overturn a wide ball decision incorrectly for a 45 and then avoided a blatant red card. Not to mention all the other headscratchers.
He says he couldn't give a free for a poleaxing in 2016 yet he gives a penalty when he wasn't sure a few weeks back for a lad who simply slipped? He shouldn't be getting the game. Its that simple.
Aside from the fact that he is biased, he isn't a very good ref to be quite frank.
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kot
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Post by kot on Aug 14, 2019 9:51:37 GMT
Ref from a non-competing province. So, in this case, Ulster or Connaught. But that would make complete an utter sense, we can't be having that  |
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Post by homerj on Aug 14, 2019 10:06:44 GMT
Gough confirmed for the final. a fuc*ing disgrace
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Aug 14, 2019 10:11:04 GMT
Good luck to Gough. He is in my eyes unbiased and the best ref in the country.
I am not one bit worried about how he will ref the game.
But in my opinion this is a mistake. Many Kerry fans won't feel they are getting fair play and that isn't right.
If anyone at all in the Kerry camp feel aggrieved at this appointment we are proper goosed.
There should be not even a whiff of perception of bias...
But I am happy he is the ref. But I'm weird.
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kot
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Post by kot on Aug 14, 2019 10:13:18 GMT
Ref from a non-competing province. So, in this case, Ulster or Connaught. But that would make complete an utter sense, we can't be having that And there you go point proven. Need to just get on with it now. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 14, 2019 10:14:21 GMT
Decision made, there is nothing more to be said that has not already been said.
Hopefully he has a good game.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 14, 2019 10:18:18 GMT
I don't know why you're saying this to me: I gave that match up to Dublin despite me thinking Crowley is having an outstanding year for Kerry. No not to you, the poster who did the original match ups gave it to Crowley. Apologies for confusion. Ah you might want to go and check original post again, I gave it as a Draw. |
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Post by veteran on Aug 14, 2019 10:30:51 GMT
I agree that a referee working/living in a particular county should be disbarred from refereeing matches involving that county. It is unfair on the other county and it is unfair on the referee himself. Now, it is ok for a non entity like me having that view in the privacy of this forum but it is a different matter when former Kerry players join in . People and referees take note of those comments and will categories them as an irksome moan , trying to influence matters outside their terms of reference etc. In other words I have a feeling this could end in tears for us. For example if David Gough is appointed he might say I have got my final at last and I do not care if I referee another match so I will referee it my way with particular reference to those sods from Kerry. On the other hand if referee X is appointed he might say Kerry have got their way so they are owed nothing more. The major referees are a small cohort and I am sure there is a strong sense of collegiality amongst them. They could legitimately say , today Kerry are objecting to you , tomorrow it could be to me.
God, the more I reflect on this the darker my thoughts become and the more I wish that former Kerry players would be more circumspect with their comments. I suspect Peter Keane might agree with me but I suppose it is pretentious on my part to make that assumption.
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Post by onlykerry on Aug 14, 2019 10:41:32 GMT
Probably being naieve here but surely a motion for congress that referees for AI series games must be from a province not represented in the fixture would be supported by rational (that may be the problem) people.
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Post by yourholiness on Aug 14, 2019 10:50:24 GMT
It’s like the Séamus Aldridge controversy reversed entirely. It was Dublin objecting then but on the basis of his proximity to Dublin and his role as an official on the Kildare County Board.
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Aug 14, 2019 10:54:12 GMT
If I had my way - I won't - there will be no more mention of the ref.
It's like arguing a ref's decision - they aren't going to change their mind, and it might turn them against your team.
The point was made but now time to understand Kerry can only control the controllables.
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Post by jackiel on Aug 14, 2019 11:20:05 GMT
Decision has been made , no going back so lets move on and concentrate on supporting Peter and the lads the best we can.
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Post by john4 on Aug 14, 2019 11:25:38 GMT
If I had my way - I won't - there will be no more mention of the ref. It's like arguing a ref's decision - they aren't going to change their mind, and it might turn them against your team. The point was made but now time to understand Kerry can only control the controllables. personally I don't like discussing referees, but I think a lot of the question marks around David Gough's appointment as final referee are very valid. Us Kerry people take a lot of stuff on the chin in football but there reaches a point where you have to be honourable to yourself. I think the debate has served it's purpose at this point, as if he does get the final he would be foolish not to be acutely aware of the scrutiny of any bias. |
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Aug 14, 2019 11:27:08 GMT
If I had my way - I won't - there will be no more mention of the ref. It's like arguing a ref's decision - they aren't going to change their mind, and it might turn them against your team. The point was made but now time to understand Kerry can only control the controllables. personally I don't like discussing referees, but I think a lot of the question marks around David Gough's appointment as final referee are very valid. Us Kerry people take a lot of stuff on the chin in football but there reaches a point where you have to be honourable to yourself. I think the debate has served it's purpose at this point, as if he does get the final he would be foolish not to be acutely aware of the scrutiny of any bias. What we are going to see now is rampant confirmation bias - that every single free that he gives to Dublin is due to his (imo nonexistent) bias. And THAT is on the GAA. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 14, 2019 11:36:02 GMT
Every single free he gives against Dublin will be seen as overcompensation
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Post by veteran on Aug 14, 2019 11:47:37 GMT
At the time of writing my earlier post I was not aware that David Gough was the appointee. In a perverse way this may be the best outcome for Kerry. So much for the influence of the “Kerry mafia”.
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Post by parishexile on Aug 14, 2019 11:54:12 GMT
Decisions is made so move on.... however it was no harm to raise it by Fitzmaurice, Quirk and O' Mahoney and hopefully might have a positive influence on Gough towards Kerry ...... a grain of rice !!
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yerah
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Post by yerah on Aug 14, 2019 11:59:06 GMT
Pleased to see David Gough get the game and also good to see the authorities weren't put off by comments (uncalled for and unnecessary by Fitzmaurice and O'Mahoney) in the media in the last couple of days. David Gough had nothing to do with those comments as indeed neither did the Kerry management.
David Gough was always likely to be the candidate for the final with the way things were going this year and he deserves it 100%. Best of luck to him in his 1st final.
At the level he is at there will be no bias. Pat Mceaneney made some great points on the matter during his interview on OTB. Dublin and Kerry are way different demographically. This notion that Gough may be concerned about repercussions etc so he could easily make the wrong calls in the spur of the moment sounds off and jumping to conclusions. He is a top class ref and refs at that level are 100% focused on getting their calls right and fair and no doubt he will. He may get some calls wrong but not for the want of trying.
I was kind of embarrassed by the whole thing really and I suspect the Kerry backroom team would be too. Hopefully this whole things dies down now and people focus on the actual game.
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pillar
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Post by pillar on Aug 14, 2019 12:11:36 GMT
Think at this stage if Gough or Dublin Joe or David Coldrick(His partner is one of the chief stewards in Croker) get the game there will be an unfair and huge pressure on them not to be seen or perceived to be biased.
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Aug 14, 2019 12:12:41 GMT
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pillar
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Post by pillar on Aug 14, 2019 12:13:26 GMT
And Gough has got it .
Can we all just calm down and put our energy into supporting the team and enjoying the build up
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Post by Sons of Pitches on Aug 14, 2019 12:40:52 GMT
And Gough has got it . Can we all just calm down and put our energy into supporting the team and enjoying the build up +1 Admin can we have some rule where if a person mentions the ref prior to the game that they are banned for a minimum of a few days. Let's get back to talking about things that we can control. |
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