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Post by Mickmack on Aug 14, 2007 18:21:00 GMT
Plus theres an element that people seem to miss if you don't get a lot of breaks in the middle of the field as we didn't for a good part of the game it follows that your back line will be under pressure and your forward line suffers as well. Well praise the Lord............ someone else agrees with me
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Post by kerrygold on Aug 14, 2007 18:36:27 GMT
Agree with exile. Unlike Kerrygold, I don’t feel there is any undercurrent against Eoin Brosnan. If Eoin was at his best and performed to his capabilities we would all be delighted. But let’s be honest, this is not about personalities, sentiment, or club alliances, this is about winning an All-Ireland – nothing more. Brosnan’s form has been erratic before, his lost his starting place before, and on this season’s form doesn’t deserve to start at the moment. Moreover, any player would be hurt after being dropped to the bench but I would expect a player of Eoin’s calibre to give the right reaction as Declan has done. Has Declan O’Sullivan not improved immeasurably? Kerry has the talent to win an All-Ireland – but the players in form and performing must be picked on merit. i wasnt referrering to eoins form bigbrother,i was referring to suggestions that pat was favouring eoin because they were club mates.
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Post by dickmac on Aug 14, 2007 18:53:29 GMT
Team for the Dubs: D.Murphy M O Se T O Sullivan P. Reidy - whats the alternative ? T O Se A O Mahony K Young D O Se T Griffin - if fit , otherwise B Sheehan D O Sullivan E Brosnan S O Sullivan C Cooper K Donaghy D O Sullivan
Give Brosnan 20 mins - forget club loyalty - and take him off if he is not pulling his weight.The first half rest he got against Mayo last year did him no harm. If he comes off move Griffin to the ' forty ' and bring in B Sheehan to midfield. If Sheehan starts the match in place of Griffin then move him to the ' forty ' and bring on Scanlon to midfield. I'm presuming thar P Galvin won't start but if he is fit he'll be on until replaced by S O Sullivan.
I believe we'll beat the Dubs with this team but they are fast and fit but we have by far the better more skillful and more natural footballers and I can see us pulling away with 20 mins to go.
Ciarrai abu.
D O Se T Griffin - if fit ( otherwise B.Sheehan ) D. O Sullivan E.Brosnan S O Sullivan C Cooper K Donaghy D O Sullivan
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Post by Kingdomson on Aug 14, 2007 18:54:18 GMT
OK, Kerrygold, point taken. Yeah, Pat has taken him off in two Championship games, so I wouldn't be too worried about that. Pat and his selectors now have some difficult choices to make before the Dublin game and I'm sure they will make them for the sake of Kerry football above all other consideratons.
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Post by Deise Exile on Aug 14, 2007 20:47:27 GMT
I reckon some surgery is required on the Kerry Full back line. We need to get Tom Sullivan back in the corner, Aidan O’Mahony in Full back, Tomas in Centre back and Tommy Griffin in Wing back. Reidy was poor the last day, he didn’t attack the ball atall. Was he a bit over awed with his first big day in Croke Park? I heard he was carrying an Injury? Also at this stage Darren O’Sullivan has to start and so too Sean Sullivan. The pace these too bring would really test the Dublin backline. Jesus I’m really looking forward to this game. Clasic stuff, roll on August 26th and let the build up begin here….
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Post by Kingdomson on Aug 14, 2007 21:17:55 GMT
Here is an interesting article form keith Barr: Dublin can learn lessons from Kerry The dust hadn't even settled on Dublin's nervy victory over Derry when Páidí Ó Sé managed to get his prediction for the All-Ireland on to Page One of the Sunday Indo. Dubs for Sam -- yeah right Páidí! Yesterday, despite the obvious problems in Dublin's performance, pundits were queuing up to place the Dubs in pole position to land the All-Ireland. After Kerry scraped past Monaghan, rookie manager Pat O'Shea showed that he has been a good student, deftly impersonating Mick O'Dwyer, or Páidí himself, by announcing that Dublin will be "overwhelming favourites" to win the semi-final. Get a grip Pat! So let's get this thing straight. Kerry have contested five of the last seven All-Ireland finals, winning three. They are going for their fourth final in a row. They played dreadfully on Sunday but had the men to turn a four-point deficit around in a frantic finale. They are now facing a team for which they perennially raise their game and will have learnt an awful lot from the Monaghan battle. Dublin, whose frailties are pored over by almost devious analysts, haven't got beyond a semi-final in 11 years. I feared it as a player and I fear it now; when you get this consensus opinion about Dublin, they are teeing the side up for a great fall. I would hope neither the Dublin management nor the players is listening to this. They are up against the All-Ireland champions; they are up against the Ó Sés. I have avoided buying into the opinion that Dublin are fading out of games because of some collective mental weakness. Dublin are fading out of games -- they did it against Offaly and Laois too -- but I believe the reason is not mental, but tactical. Dublin are a better side than last year, essentially because of the introduction of Bernard Brogan and Mark Vaughan. But they are playing the same way as last year. Their inability to grab a crucial score to ease the pressure when opponents are throwing the kitchen sink at them is stark. The logic seems obvious. If a team is going at Dublin in the closing stages, they are going to leave holes in their own defence. Cuteness can exploit the very bravery that Derry displayed last Saturday. With Vaughan's free-taking so solid, all Dublin needed to do was work a free. Alan Brogan and Jason Sherlock are well capable of this but there seems to be a frenzy of confusion in the Dublin ranks when the squeeze comes on. At this point, the forwards need to be cuter than at any other stage of the game. Taking off Bernard Brogan and even Collie Moran seemed preordained rather than necessary. I saw Alan Brogan hand-passing to Vaughan in the Dublin half during the closing stages, yet Paddy Bradley was allowed win a breaking ball cleanly in front of Paul Griffin. Where was the suffocating cover? I'm saying this now to the Dublin management rather than being a smart-arsed pundit after the event. They need to sort out their tactical plan for the closing stages of matches -- one based on cuteness. Trying too hard is almost as bad as not trying at all. There is no better way to sicken opponents than halting their gallop with a score. And that is one thing Dublin can do, score. Derry and particularly Monaghan deserved more from both games. Kerry were simply awful and I thought Mike Frank Russell and Eoin Brosnan did not seem to have the stomach for what was a tough, physical battle. Contrast that to the bravery of the Gooch. I would imagine there will be a few harsh words exchanged at training tonight. Seamus Scanlon is not the partner for Darragh Ó Sé at midfield and there is no doubt that the defence does not look as solid. However, in Bryan Sheehan and Tommy Griffin, they had two men to throw into the mix who helped turn the game. Pat O'Shea might be a rookie in comparison to Caffrey, who is six years in the Dublin management,but the Kerryman got his substitutions right. I suspect he'll get his starting line-up right the next day too. And any of the experts who are calling Dublin favourites are simply brushing over the influence of three of the game's finest players in the Ó Sé brothers. All of a sudden no one can see past Dublin. That is, no one except Kerry. -
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Post by kerryeye on Aug 14, 2007 21:28:53 GMT
My team for the dubs would be: D.Murphy M O Se T O Sullivan A O mahony T O Se T Griffin K Young D O Se S Scanlon B Sheehan D O Sullivan P Galvin C Cooper K Donaghy MFR
I also think that the management need to bring in a few backs to the subs bench,the management obviously have no intention of using Mossie Lyons either.I would have MArc oick up Alan Brogan,Tom Sull on keaney,Aidan on Vaughan,Killian on Moran,tomas se on B Brogan and tommy G on Sherlock.
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Post by MrRasherstoyou on Aug 14, 2007 22:21:47 GMT
Keith Barr has a very good piece in todays indo. One of his points is that the Kerry management...... in its first big game in Croke Park made shrewd substitutions while Paul Caffrey ....... in his sixth year in managemnet got his substitutions wrong. Give Pat o Shea a break for f........ sake Third year Mick, he was 3 years as part of the coaching team with Lyons. But I take your point, his policy seems always to leave the lads on the field to turn it round
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Post by MrRasherstoyou on Aug 14, 2007 22:30:08 GMT
Here is an interesting article form keith Barr: Dublin can learn lessons from Kerry The dust hadn't even settled on Dublin's nervy victory over Derry when Páidí Ó Sé managed to get his prediction for the All-Ireland on to Page One of the Sunday Indo. Dubs for Sam -- yeah right Páidí! Yesterday, despite the obvious problems in Dublin's performance, pundits were queuing up to place the Dubs in pole position to land the All-Ireland. After Kerry scraped past Monaghan, rookie manager Pat O'Shea showed that he has been a good student, deftly impersonating Mick O'Dwyer, or Páidí himself, by announcing that Dublin will be "overwhelming favourites" to win the semi-final. Get a grip Pat! So let's get this thing straight. Kerry have contested five of the last seven All-Ireland finals, winning three. They are going for their fourth final in a row. They played dreadfully on Sunday but had the men to turn a four-point deficit around in a frantic finale. They are now facing a team for which they perennially raise their game and will have learnt an awful lot from the Monaghan battle. Dublin, whose frailties are pored over by almost devious analysts, haven't got beyond a semi-final in 11 years. I feared it as a player and I fear it now; when you get this consensus opinion about Dublin, they are teeing the side up for a great fall. I would hope neither the Dublin management nor the players is listening to this. They are up against the All-Ireland champions; they are up against the Ó Sés. I have avoided buying into the opinion that Dublin are fading out of games because of some collective mental weakness. Dublin are fading out of games -- they did it against Offaly and Laois too -- but I believe the reason is not mental, but tactical. Dublin are a better side than last year, essentially because of the introduction of Bernard Brogan and Mark Vaughan. But they are playing the same way as last year. Their inability to grab a crucial score to ease the pressure when opponents are throwing the kitchen sink at them is stark. The logic seems obvious. If a team is going at Dublin in the closing stages, they are going to leave holes in their own defence. Cuteness can exploit the very bravery that Derry displayed last Saturday. With Vaughan's free-taking so solid, all Dublin needed to do was work a free. Alan Brogan and Jason Sherlock are well capable of this but there seems to be a frenzy of confusion in the Dublin ranks when the squeeze comes on. At this point, the forwards need to be cuter than at any other stage of the game. Taking off Bernard Brogan and even Collie Moran seemed preordained rather than necessary. I saw Alan Brogan hand-passing to Vaughan in the Dublin half during the closing stages, yet Paddy Bradley was allowed win a breaking ball cleanly in front of Paul Griffin. Where was the suffocating cover? I'm saying this now to the Dublin management rather than being a smart-arsed pundit after the event. They need to sort out their tactical plan for the closing stages of matches -- one based on cuteness. Trying too hard is almost as bad as not trying at all. There is no better way to sicken opponents than halting their gallop with a score. And that is one thing Dublin can do, score. Derry and particularly Monaghan deserved more from both games. Kerry were simply awful and I thought Mike Frank Russell and Eoin Brosnan did not seem to have the stomach for what was a tough, physical battle. Contrast that to the bravery of the Gooch. I would imagine there will be a few harsh words exchanged at training tonight. Seamus Scanlon is not the partner for Darragh Ó Sé at midfield and there is no doubt that the defence does not look as solid. However, in Bryan Sheehan and Tommy Griffin, they had two men to throw into the mix who helped turn the game. Pat O'Shea might be a rookie in comparison to Caffrey, who is six years in the Dublin management,but the Kerryman got his substitutions right. I suspect he'll get his starting line-up right the next day too. And any of the experts who are calling Dublin favourites are simply brushing over the influence of three of the game's finest players in the Ó Sé brothers. All of a sudden no one can see past Dublin. That is, no one except Kerry. - Spot on as usual, his best article yet. Why isnt this man coaching a top team?
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Post by MrRasherstoyou on Aug 14, 2007 22:31:55 GMT
i suppose it has nothing to do with the fact that mike mac,seamus,eamonn,donal,william and dara all central spinal players have retired in the last 2 or 3 years and that kerry have played in 6 all-ireland finals(including replay v galway) since september '00 and have only played 2 championship games in 18 weeks this year. its easy to be critical,whisper and point fingers,give the lads a bit of space and let them get on with it,they might even surprise some and have a stormer the next day,or else they might as a collective group have gone to well too many times. thats the intrige of the semi final clash with dublin,we dont know how they will respond,maybe thats not a bad way to be preparing to face the dubs,theres nothing like a crisis to concentrate the minds.You would feel the pendilum has swung in dublins favour now,they will go in as hot favourite to win,its theirs now to step up to the plate and play themselves to the title of all-ireland champions,roy curtis thinks its a done deal anyway,mean while leave the cute hoors below in the kingdom to get on with it. "hot favourites" Where did you pluck that gem of analysis from? Read Keith Barr's article and come up with a sensible post about favourites KG
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martym
Senior Member
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Post by martym on Aug 14, 2007 22:58:10 GMT
i suppose it has nothing to do with the fact that mike mac,seamus,eamonn,donal,william and dara all central spinal players have retired in the last 2 or 3 years and that kerry have played in 6 all-ireland finals(including replay v galway) since september '00 and have only played 2 championship games in 18 weeks this year. its easy to be critical,whisper and point fingers,give the lads a bit of space and let them get on with it,they might even surprise some and have a stormer the next day,or else they might as a collective group have gone to well too many times. thats the intrige of the semi final clash with dublin,we dont know how they will respond,maybe thats not a bad way to be preparing to face the dubs,theres nothing like a crisis to concentrate the minds.You would feel the pendilum has swung in dublins favour now,they will go in as hot favourite to win,its theirs now to step up to the plate and play themselves to the title of all-ireland champions,roy curtis thinks its a done deal anyway,mean while leave the cute hoors below in the kingdom to get on with it. "hot favourites" Where did you pluck that gem of analysis from? Read Keith Barr's article and come up with a sensible post about favourites KG A good analysis by Mr Barr . I think at this stage Dublin might just shade it as Kerry have only 2 weeks to improve . The Dublin forwards going back into their own half as the game goes on is only asking for trouble as forwards can some time get in the way of their own defenders with every one leaving the ball to the other guy
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Post by MrRasherstoyou on Aug 14, 2007 23:02:34 GMT
A good post, as I said elsewhere, I think Dublin's main weakness will be tactical - they are not fully playing o their strengths, and this overly cautious approach is asking for big trouble. They must be bold in the latter stages, even if winning
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Post by Control on Aug 15, 2007 5:39:04 GMT
KERRY DUBLIN MATCH Well boys Kerry were seriously lucky to have scraped a win against Monaghan, by the end of it my heart really went out to Monaghan. Have you seen which teams Seamus Moynihan is predicting will reach the finals on the plumgaming.com site. I think that he has picked the Kerry Dublin match just right, but has got the Cork Meath match wrong. This time I am going to beat him, and claim my prize. Sean Igoe, Garryowen club, London
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Post by Control on Aug 15, 2007 5:41:42 GMT
Murphy Marc O'Se Tom O'Sullivan Aidan O'M Tom O' Se Tommy Griffin Killian Young Darragh & Seamus Paul Galvin Eoin B Declan Gooch Star MFR I expect the backs to go man to man - Marc against Bernard Brogan (or maybe Alan) Aidan v the other Brogan, Tom to pick up Keaney, Killian v Vaughan, Tomas v Collie Moran, Griffin v Jayo. I expect Paul Galvin to play alot more withdrawn to cover the central channels which Jayo will try and open up. Eoin Brosnan is the player under most pressure with MFR next to go. Whatcha reckon yourselves?
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Post by Control on Aug 15, 2007 5:43:44 GMT
Altough well discussed already, kerrys one dimensional play lead to a clearly disjointed team performance. However questions marks over some players are completely over the top considering before the game the long lay off as well as the adverse weather conditions hindered kerry's performance. Essentially kerry are in another semi final against a far from outstanding dublin side. Of course kerry are favourites. Furthermore it is clear dublins more open style of football will suit Kerry and a far more varied attacking style of play against the Dubs must be expected in hopefully much more ideal weather conditions and against a not so defensive side. The Monaghan game will of course stand to the players, another tight fought game won. Additionally the fact it is of course Dublin, the old enemy Kerry are playing must give them an added incentive and thus marginally a better chance of reaching another final coupled with of course kerrys superior forwards. So i ask, how could certain people suggest dublin are favourites based on one disappointing performance when most importantly the Kingdom still finished strongly when it mattered. Do supporters expect perfection in every performance from amateur sportsmen? And does one performance cause Kerry, the All Ireland champions to be underdogs with questions over a few players. There should not be a lack of uncertainty among any supporters in this very talented and indeed well proven Kerry side.
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Post by Control on Aug 15, 2007 5:48:47 GMT
Good to know the people of Dublin are reading this site anyway!! We haven't fired on all cylinders since last year - the league was patchy and we haven't had one good performance in the championship yet - we cruised against Waterford without doing anything and went to sleep before half time, we stuttered badly inthe second half against Cork and Monaghan had a number of weak elements to it. Dublin have had some marginally better performances and beaten Laois hands down, plus they played and beat Meath, who have proved to be a very tenacid team of late! Dublin will be favourites and rightly so. They have begun to find solutions to problems which had them only a hairs breath away from an All Ireland final last year and have shown themselves to be hungrier, fitter, tougher and with a reliable free taker. Kerry on the other hand have lost a number of influential players, haven't given a comprehensive performance this year and are under an entirely new management still finding their ground.
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Johnnyb
Fanatical Member
Posts: 1,444
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Post by Johnnyb on Aug 15, 2007 8:35:02 GMT
Bannon is confirmed as the referee. I can see it now, injury time, sides are level. Jayo trips over his shadow, not a green and gold jersey in sight and the whistle sounds. Free in, kerry fans are outraged, the dubs on the hill are too pissed to realise whats going on, 30 yards out, vaughan steps up and the rest is history.........
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seamus
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Post by seamus on Aug 15, 2007 8:51:59 GMT
Bannon. Good god.... How the hell did that happen. The man is a disaster and has nailed us on one too many occasions. Pillar is licking his lips at that news.
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Post by Mickmack on Aug 15, 2007 8:52:59 GMT
So my suspicions are confirmed......... the GAA want Dublin to win the all ireland...... Bannon will see to that they get that far anyway
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Post by Mickmack on Aug 15, 2007 8:58:15 GMT
Meath successfully got Jimmy McKee changed as ref when he was appointed as ref for Meath v Galway........
Can Kerry not do the same about Bannon?
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Post by kerrygold on Aug 15, 2007 8:58:32 GMT
can we object like meath did recently,can he be any worse than the fellow last sunday.
you'd start to wonder alright,first provencial winners this year,last quarter final played.
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Post by kerrygold on Aug 15, 2007 9:01:37 GMT
there proberly should'nt be a leinster ref when a leinster team is playing,you'd wonder having watched setanta again last night would the penalty decision and disallowed kerry goal have gone the other way or against dublin in croker,just food for thought.
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Johnnyb
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Post by Johnnyb on Aug 15, 2007 9:23:29 GMT
This means from the outset:
1. The gooch will get lamped up and down the field and the ref will do nothing 2. The Kerry backs wont be able to make one hard tackle or the ref will blow for a free, knowing the capabilities of Vaughan. 3. The time added on at the end of the game will be dependent on the score line. 4. 2/3's of the 50/50 decisions will be in favour of the Dubs.
So we know all this now. We can either petition the GAA and insist a ref from outside either Munster & Leinster officiate (as was with the Dublin v Derry game, munster ref) or we get on with it and pray that, like last Sunday, with everything from 15 men to the ref to the crowd against us, we can pull through. A huge ask.
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Joxer
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Post by Joxer on Aug 15, 2007 9:43:38 GMT
In trying to identify when last Dublin beat Kerry, a dub supporter came up with the following inspired recollection.."we beat them a coulpe of years ago in a challenge match for the opening of Spillane's clubs new pitch" .....above quote from Reservoirdubs....they have us rumbled lads...need to dig out what team we lined out that day and sit any members of the current panel involved down and give them a stern talking to....if it can happen in Spillanes patch.....
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seamus
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Posts: 2,741
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Post by seamus on Aug 15, 2007 9:53:25 GMT
I seriously think that Bannon could mess us up big time. As has been said already, he makes up the time allowed depending on his mood and has never given us any breaks in a game. Having said that, both Coldrick and our own Mangan were poor at the weekend. How Coldrick only gave 3 minutes injury time after all Monaghans play acting i will never know. I would love to see a tape of the game and clock it. Having said that it backfired on them big time in the end.
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Post by buck02 on Aug 15, 2007 10:06:55 GMT
Can I ask where the confirmation that Bannon is reffing the game can from, I checked the news & fixtures on GAA.ie and there was no mention.
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Post by ardfertnarrie on Aug 15, 2007 10:33:00 GMT
If this is true there will be murder. This has to be the greatest injustice since "Light" Guinness.
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Johnnyb
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Post by Johnnyb on Aug 15, 2007 10:42:17 GMT
It's in the Indo sports section. Its confirmed, trust me.
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Post by ardfertnarrie on Aug 15, 2007 10:54:27 GMT
It's in the Indo sports section. Its confirmed, trust me.
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Post by buck02 on Aug 15, 2007 10:58:35 GMT
Say it aint so Johnnybriggs, say it aint so!
Still best not to ponder too much on the referee, I suppose if we got over last years semi final with him in charge it might be a good omen. Ok I'm clutching at straws.
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