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Post by inforthebreaks on Sept 7, 2006 11:56:14 GMT
I think ye are voer playing the Jack and Declan thing lads. Its an All Ireland final. If he plays him it will be because he feels Kerry have a better chance of winning it with him in the team. Simple as that. And lets not forget its not Jack alone making this decision. There are selectors there with him. They couldn't give a damn what club Declan is from.
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Post by inforthebreaks on Sept 7, 2006 11:57:06 GMT
Plus I dont agree with you Seamus that Brosnan is no good midfield. Thats where I would ahve him all along.
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Post by inforthebreaks on Sept 7, 2006 11:58:48 GMT
IJack O'Connor and his management team have gotten Kerry to 3 All-Ireland finals in a row losing only one meaningful game in that time surely Jo you are not suggesting that a Munster Final against Cork is a meaningless game.........
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Jo90
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Post by Jo90 on Sept 7, 2006 12:04:37 GMT
IJack O'Connor and his management team have gotten Kerry to 3 All-Ireland finals in a row losing only one meaningful game in that time surely Jo you are not suggesting that a Munster Final against Cork is a meaningless game......... Well if I had a choice between winning the Munster Final against Cork this year and keeping the status quo for the rest of the championship or losing it and thus causing a change to the team and to the tactics, I know what I'd prefer.
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Post by Owenabue on Sept 7, 2006 12:07:58 GMT
In a way so Cork beating you was the kick in the arse maybe that Kerry required?? What is that they say, you learn more from a defeat then a win. Don't forget to thank us if you beat Mayo!
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Joxer
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Post by Joxer on Sept 7, 2006 12:18:30 GMT
absolutely right inforthebreaks. I don't think there'll be any change from the starting team..to start but options for change during the game depending on how things are going definitely needs to be considered now. As regards Mayo training with McGarrity on Heaney,it only helps to the extent that hes jumping with a big man but if Heaney comes down without the ball then what happens? The approach Armagh took with McGeeney as a sweeper is the most obvious additional protection Heaney could get.How would Mayo employ to do that? McGarrity? could be effective....strong, tall,quick. How do they then address midfield/...well they have several options..Billy Joe drops to the subs and is replaced by Brady for the first half who takes up midfield duties. It reduces their numbers of forwards but with the passing game Mayo employ, how big a difference will that make with wing backs able to move up in support of the forwards. In that event, does Dara go with McGarrity...don't think so. I'd be inclined to let him to McGarrity to his own devices in that event. It would free up a wing back and we exploit the corner forwards more.Anyway, worth thinking about. I can't see Mayo not employing some kind of sweeper but we'll see.
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Post by ArthurG on Sept 7, 2006 12:52:49 GMT
Mayo will come out of the blocks at 100mph. They will try to push Kerry back on their arses. Hoping then when Kerry do get forward that Donaghy will be isolated from his own players.
Mayo won't fear any Kerry player. They may show a bit of respect but I can't see them changing tactics to match Kerry. Heaney is the best full back in the country at the moment, he'll handle Donaghy if thats possible!!
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laddo
On Probation
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Post by laddo on Sept 7, 2006 13:09:17 GMT
Can't see how you think Heaney's the best full back in the country, what about graham canty or barry owens? Admittedly heaney's playing well at the moment but Conal Keaney took him for 1-3 from play in the semi-final without really playing that well.. Can't see him holding Donaghy for 70mins!
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Post by turnovers on Sept 7, 2006 13:15:53 GMT
well lads declan is flying in training. he is letting the ball off alot faster and is linking up well with the full forward line. think the player to loose out will be tommy griffin. Remember 04 bros wiped mayo out at midfield.
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Post by austinstacksabu on Sept 7, 2006 13:21:45 GMT
It's all well and good saying Declan should start or brosnan should start without knowing how they're going in training... Declan is absolutely flying in training - even I know that a few thousand miles away.
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Post by inforthebreaks on Sept 7, 2006 13:31:56 GMT
Its a tough situation for Mayo to be in. Donaghy is the form player of the Kerry full forward line and an obvious danger man. but if they concentrate on him there are two of Irelands potentially most dangerous corner forwards to worry about. If they drop a man back in front they will be allowing the likes of Brosnan, Sean Sullivan, Declan Sullivan etc a bit more freedom out the field.
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Post by inforthebreaks on Sept 7, 2006 13:35:29 GMT
In a way so Cork beating you was the kick in the arse maybe that Kerry required?? What is that they say, you learn more from a defeat then a win. Don't forget to thank us if you beat Mayo! dont worry Owenabue. I am sure there are plenty people who would be happy to give our sincere thanks to Billy Morgan and John Corcoran should we win the all ireland...
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Joxer
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Post by Joxer on Sept 7, 2006 13:42:32 GMT
Ah, I'm sure they don't fear any Kerry player ArthurG but they're not naive either and will have thought of strategies to combat the areas where they see us as being particularly strong/dangerous and exploit areas of perceived weakness....we'll be doing the same ourselves I assume, so it stands to reason that the threat of Donaghy as well as our perceived weakness under high ball in our fullback line will be considered by Mayo.
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Post by lostinmayo on Sept 7, 2006 15:15:45 GMT
I agree Joxer, they know Kerry are a better team than Dublin and they will not beat us playing the game on its merits. This guys Morrison, who was with Tyrone is supposed to be some sort of tactical genius, it was him that decided to go to the hill. They're all saying here that he knows what every Kerry player has for breakfast and what time they go to bed at. You can be guaranteed they will have some tactics lined up for Donaghy and I'm sure the Gooch aswell (they haven't forgotten '04). Having said all that the fact that they left Higgins on Brogan for so long in the semi final was unreal. If they didn't come back from the 7 down, they would have taken huge flak, coz Brogan nearly won that game on his own. So, even with their best made plans beforehand, it's encouraging that they cannot spot stuff like that on the field.
All this talk of Brosnan-O' Sullivan, it shouldn't even be up for debate, start the same team with Brosnan centre forward, the only place for him. It doesn't matter how well Declan is playing in training, the team started playing better when he was dropped, if he's playing well, then that's encouraging for when we might need him in the second half.
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Post by FatTom on Sept 7, 2006 15:18:28 GMT
But remember Crowley in 2004? He was awesome and not many people saw or wanted that change
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Post by noreenos on Sept 7, 2006 15:37:33 GMT
Hey there,
I would agree to leave Brosnan on the 40. He seems to do much better in there and can link up easily with Cooper in that position. But then again we are not in the management seat....... Jack may have a surprise for us all.
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kymad
On Probation
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Post by kymad on Sept 7, 2006 16:06:14 GMT
if the management feel that dec o sull should start in order to win an all ireland then so be it.
the management's record over the three years is phenomenal in the modern game, so lets not leave the captaincy issue cloud the decision (current system should deffo be changed - a petition should be started).
jacko will make a hard and controversial call if needs be, it wont cost him a thought.
the day he starts listening to the fans views on team selection is the day he is sitting in the stands beside us.
i think there will be one change for the game - straight swop, bryan sheehan for tommy griff.
i love the second guessing thats going on in this thread - the more outrageous the better!
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Post by kerrygold on Sept 7, 2006 16:09:59 GMT
it will only be a phenominal record if we beat mayo,other wise its open too debate.
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Aodhan
Senior Member
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Post by Aodhan on Sept 7, 2006 16:26:59 GMT
I would also leave the team as is. Tommy Griffin was poor against Cork in the replay probably due to nerves as it was his first championship start. He was excellent against Armagh and effective enough against Cork in the semi to warrant a start the next day. It is now very much a twenty man game as the subs brought on are just as important as the starters. Declan will almost certainly be the first sub introduced possibly for a tiring Griffin with either Brosnan or Donaghy going to mid field depending how the game is going.
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Post by Dermot on Sept 7, 2006 16:43:15 GMT
This guys Morrison, who was with Tyrone is supposed to be some sort of tactical genius, it was him that decided to go to the hill. They're all saying here that he knows what every Kerry player has for breakfast and what time they go to bed at. LiM & the rest of you folk - Thats a few times now that someone has said that John Morrison was with Tyrone last year - He wasn't, and never was as far as I know.......................... Don't know where you got that from ? (hope the feck I aint wrong, but I'm 99% sure)
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Post by kerrygold on Sept 7, 2006 17:11:19 GMT
would he be thought of as a tactical genius if vaughan had got the last two free v mayo or if leitrim scuppered them in the first round,
Food for thought!
hype is a wonderful thing really.
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Post by Admin on Sept 7, 2006 18:45:15 GMT
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Boris
Full Member
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Post by Boris on Sept 7, 2006 22:15:44 GMT
If Kerry play Brosnan midfield,it will be playing right into Mayo's hands.Midfield is possibly the only place on the field where Mayo are stronger than Kerry and if Brosnan starts there it will make Daras job an awful lot harder.Brosnan will not be able to impose himself on the game,he hasnt done it all year.Stick with Griffen would be my choice.
I would be happy to see Declan Sull start at centre forward but only if there to attack and link up with Donaghy and take the attention off Cooper and MFR.
And whoever said to start Sheehan instead of Griffen,get a grip!
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Post by topcat on Sept 7, 2006 22:45:35 GMT
Brosnan would be seriously unlucky not to start the final. I personally would be very annoyed over it. I started a thread about the captaincy issue and people told me to shut up. I am convinced that Jack wants Declan on the team to bring the cup to Dromid. If people want proof of this then look at the league and early rounds of the championship when he was really struggling and kept his place. Brosnan cannot play midfield and has done well enough at 11. Hopefully when the team is picked i will cool down a bit!! Methinks Seamus has had a run in with dromid before! Does it relly matter where the cup goes? as a Mayo man said to me today, "sure ye must be sick of looking at it!" The cup's not won yet either, not by a long shot. I was just wondering, what was the reaction like on the forum's when MFR was dropped in 2004???
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Post by macdanger on Sept 7, 2006 23:19:52 GMT
Relatively little discussion in Mayo as regards Donaghy, I don't see us operating with a sweeper in front of him. I reckon Heaney will stick with him and try to punch the ball out rather than try to field it. Once the ball has broken, the biggest danger will be MFR and gooch so the corner backs and wing backs will have to be alert - would be worried enough about gooch in particular.
I'll probably be destroyed for this one, but I can see Donaghy being kept scoreless by Heaney....write it down or print it out.......
Nallen and his lack of pace is a bit of a worry but I think people here are reading too much into the game in '04 when we weren't at the races at all, hopefully it'll be a different story this year. I wouldn't expect Dec O"S to start.
Like someone said, we need a good start and we need to reflect that on the scoreboard, we had a good start against dublin but we were level after 25 minutes having wasted a few chances when we were up.
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Post by kerryeye on Sept 8, 2006 0:08:14 GMT
I'll probably be destroyed for this one, but I can see Donaghy being kept scoreless by Heaney....write it down or print it out....... . Dont think you'll be destroyed for that,its not really that bold of a statement.Star isnt in their to score,if he manages to chip in wit 1 or 2 scores all the better,but he's there to win it and lay it off to Gooch or whoever else is there.
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Post by buck02 on Sept 8, 2006 8:18:05 GMT
In the first half of the league game against Mayo this year Declan played full forward and when Kerry finally woke up he won a load of ball against Heaney, including the few high balls that went in against him. Then theres the well documented 04 final. I dont think Heaney is the greatest under a high ball so Star should do well in there. However surely Moran and Morrison will have a plan in place to address this weakness.
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seamus
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Post by seamus on Sept 8, 2006 8:38:18 GMT
Great point Buck02. I was at that game as well and Declan did very well and kicked a couple of scores. That is until he got itchy feet and went walkabout around Stacks Park! I would'nt be the slightest bit surprised to see Donaghy out around midfield early leaving Gooch and MFR inside. It really depends on how they are doing in training.
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Post by kerrygold on Sept 8, 2006 8:44:38 GMT
they'd want to get the selection right and not upset the players,we dont dont want the team arriving in croker with the lads being flat on the day.
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nk05
Full Member
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Post by nk05 on Sept 8, 2006 9:12:35 GMT
I think they should leave d team d same as d last day,like 2 c a settled team,nothing worse 2 disrupt things now,every1 no's there place,wat roles they av.
Jus hope griffin will b able 2 giv dara support,if we start 2 lose midfield donaghy wil av 2 drop back & that will take away our plan B in d forwards
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