Hicser
Senior Member
Posts: 381
|
Post by Hicser on Aug 26, 2015 21:28:45 GMT
Tyrone need to get new forwards, a new keeper, and a few more younger lads to cover the older tyrone legs. In other words, they need a period of transition, about 3 years. So next year could be very difficult for them, and us to for that mater. I think that the main challengers next year could well be galway. They have pedigree, and were not far away in croke park against us. There is a definite shift of power to down south, Mayo, Kerry, Dublin have opened a gap. Tyrone need a few new players but look best equipped for next year. I can't see Donegal improving, they'll need a few years, otherwise I'd say we'll have the same teams back again at this stage next year. Its my hope that the ultra defensive philosophy is now failing and that a less defensive strategy will evolve again,
|
|
|
Post by Deise Exile on Aug 26, 2015 22:00:29 GMT
Geaney for star after 40 mins and tommy Walsh for Buckley after ht I got half right anyway! I suppose it's too wild Suggesting Tommy Walsh to mark Aidan o Shea. Is he overrated any only performing against sligo
|
|
|
Post by sullyschoice on Aug 26, 2015 22:40:38 GMT
Was that photo taken before or after he had a grip of Aidan O Mahoneys jersey in an effort to fool the referee into giving a penalty. It didnt work and Tyrone lost. Thats one in the eye for the practitioners of the dark arts.
Its a victory for decency and sportsmanship.
|
|
|
Post by tyroneperson on Aug 26, 2015 23:08:41 GMT
Yeah a real triumph of good over evil
|
|
|
Post by donegalman on Aug 27, 2015 0:05:00 GMT
Ultra defensive strategy is failing, no doubt about that, but it is more down to teams who are playing defensively and are able to take their chances at the other end. You lads were very defensive for much of the game, especially the first half last sunday. The Mayo v Dublin game will be incredibly interesting for this reason. I am intrigued to whether it is going to be a shoot out with no holes barred or if there is going to be a defensive strategy to contain. I would guess there is going to be a combination of both. As to the color of the grey, I am not sure, but it will be either very dark or very light. I personally think the level of training and commitment involved to go year in year out playing blanket defense is ultimately going to mentally and physically exhaust the players, and therefore make it unsustainable. If you had a huge bench and could stagger your players without burn out or injury then you would have some hope. But it really would be more economical to find good target men, use them properly and then go out and try to feed them, working backwards from this strategy.
|
|
fitz
Fanatical Member
Red sky at night get off my land
Posts: 1,719
|
Post by fitz on Aug 27, 2015 0:55:28 GMT
Watched the second half - Kerry really dominated the first 20-25 minutes, but the goal chances cloud this, we had 4 bad wides during this time that could have put the game out of sight - counter that of course, if Bradley had stuck the goal, or McCann stuck the ground shot, then things change. My point is the possession and control of the football during this time was significantly with Kerry. Until Maher then turned over for the penalty, the game to me would have been closed out. I think it was the 65th minute that Harte stuck the penalty. Acknowledging McCurry then missed 2 and Morgan 2 frees. Think the last one he was caught in 2 minds to float it or score and made a jock of it. I can't see how McNulty ended up on the floor from Aidan's tackle, as in what movement put him on the ground. I can't see Tierney one close enough - but none of them are stone wall from what I can see - slow motion and zoom required. All of Kerry's goal chance concessions from being run at directly stem from TURNOVERS, not from steady build up when Kerry players are in position where Tyrone are in possession. This is how McMenamin scored in 2011 of course. So clearly a number of our guys from defence and midfield are straying into areas where our safety net is porous if something goes wrong, from being in possession. Not enough folk left minding house. Tierney wasn't on long and no one was tracking him when this happened. Brolly was shocking, it was embarrassing how biased he was and how enraged he was that Kerry won. He was an embittered child. Whelan too focused very little on anything good Kerry did. O'Rourke then looked Kerry biased I suppose trying to offer positive commentary on the team that won the game. He is a bit Kerry biased mind, I forgive him that I suppose what pi$$es me off most was that the focus all through analysis (HT and FT) was on how Tyrone lost the game not on the significant things Kerry had to achieve to win it and as if Tyrone could have without question controlled the outcome. Brolly saying if Bradley goaled the game was over. That's bollicks. There was 25 mins left. Anyway I'm getting a bit green gold jaundicey
|
|
|
Post by beantownfan on Aug 27, 2015 3:14:07 GMT
:DI think Aiden is trying to prevent him from falling, he should be greatfull, he might have injured himself, Could have got a grass stain on his hair or messed up his fringe or anything!! Like you say Aiden was just being considerate! haha The Tyrone fan up in the crowd (the lad with the black top and arms outstretched) is already looking for a penalty!! :-)
|
|
|
Post by wayupnorth on Aug 27, 2015 6:05:24 GMT
Brolly was shocking, it was embarrassing how biased he was and how enraged he was that Kerry won. He was an embittered child. Whelan too focused very little on anything good Kerry did. O'Rourke then looked Kerry biased I suppose trying to offer positive commentary on the team that won the game. He is a bit Kerry biased mind, I forgive him that I suppose what pi$$es me off most was that the focus all through analysis (HT and FT) was on how Tyrone lost the game not on the significant things Kerry had to achieve to win it and as if Tyrone could have without question controlled the outcome. Brolly saying if Bradley goaled the game was over. That's bollicks. There was 25 mins left. I watched the analysis too last night and although the stock response is to ignore it (especially Brolly)we have to remember that this is the national broadcaster which supposedly has high standards to uphold. Brolly long ago became a tired parody of himself and you might as well put Oliver Callan up there and you wouldn't spot the difference. RTE should review this and his other "contributions" and feel thoroughly ashamed of themselves. If you wandered in at the end of the match you might be at a loss to figure out that Kerry had actually won but I would prefer that than to hear the "talking heads" praise Kerry's lovely football that had yielded yet another gallant though futile effort!
|
|
fitz
Fanatical Member
Red sky at night get off my land
Posts: 1,719
|
Post by fitz on Aug 27, 2015 7:11:19 GMT
RTE Player is infuriating btw, the amount of ads that are inflicted is outrageous. Maybe excessive wording . If you pause game during play and come back hours later and resume another bag of ads invade. Am I missing how to skip them?
|
|
|
Post by Ballyfireside on Aug 27, 2015 8:01:06 GMT
RTE Player is infuriating btw, the amount of ads that are inflicted is outrageous. Maybe excessive wording . If you pause game during play and come back hours later and resume another bag of ads invade. Am I missing how to skip them? I found it the same.
|
|
boots
Full Member
Posts: 149
|
Post by boots on Aug 27, 2015 8:04:44 GMT
The simple facts of the matter are; there was contact in the square, but not a foul. The Tyrone player then tried to con the referee by exaggerating the contact from Mahony and threw himself to the floor. The referee made the correct call. Only by backing referees who get those tough calls right is the only way we will stamp that diving out of the game for good!
|
|
|
Post by kerryman22 on Aug 27, 2015 8:13:40 GMT
Listening to a podcast from newstalk Monday night with Anthony moyles *and he said Mayo and Dublin were the real winners the last day as they were so much better than Kerry . He said Kerry just don't have the forwards! He said he doesn't class James o Donoghue as a marque forward.
Couldn't believe what I was hearing . Colm parkinson couldn't believe his drivel either . You have to question do these pundits actually have any knowledge of the game or are they so jealous of Kerry that they can't see the wood from the trees.
*edited as I incorrectly attributed these quotes to liam Hayes
|
|
Joxer
Fanatical Member
Posts: 1,365
|
Post by Joxer on Aug 27, 2015 8:38:33 GMT
The assault of Gooch at the end, having watched the second half again last night, is incredible...another disgrace to 'adorn' the championship from what was probably another 'fine young man'. We can move on now anyway and get back to discussing football!
|
|
Jigz84
Fanatical Member
Posts: 2,017
|
Post by Jigz84 on Aug 27, 2015 8:47:34 GMT
Listening to a podcast from newstalk Monday night with Liam Hayes and he said Mayo and Dublin were the real winners the last day as they were so much better than Kerry . He said Kerry just don't have the forwards! He said he doesn't class James o Donoghue as a marque forward. Couldn't believe what I was hearing . Colm parkinson couldn't believe his drivel either . You have to question do these pundits actually have any knowledge of the game or are they so jealous of Kerry that they can't see the wood from the trees. Off The Ball has gone to the dogs in recent years. There was a time when it was without a doubt the best sports show on radio. Also on Newstalk last Monday morning, you had Shane Coleman, the political correspondent, making his disgust at a Kerry victory known.
|
|
fg
Senior Member
Posts: 292
|
Post by fg on Aug 27, 2015 8:54:12 GMT
Listening to a podcast from newstalk Monday night with Liam Hayes and he said Mayo and Dublin were the real winners the last day as they were so much better than Kerry . He said Kerry just don't have the forwards! He said he doesn't class James o Donoghue as a marque forward. Couldn't believe what I was hearing . Colm parkinson couldn't believe his drivel either . You have to question do these pundits actually have any knowledge of the game or are they so jealous of Kerry that they can't see the wood from the trees. Let us not forget, Liam hayes has history re: his views on Kerry, a most bitter and sad individual, he was the one that said that gooch was OVERATED, enough said. The proof in the pudding will be the all-Ireland final and we will see how either of these two paragons of power will cope with the power of the Kingdom.
|
|
|
Post by taggert on Aug 27, 2015 8:58:07 GMT
Didn't hear Liam Hayes on Newstalk but did hear Anthony Moyles (ex Meath) and BillyJoe Padden (ex Mayo) who both agreed that Kerry were 3rd in the pecking order for All Ireland glory behind this weekends semi-finalists. Colm Parkinson reacted in disbelief to Moyles assertion that Kerry lacked firepower.
The paucity of the analysis seems to compound and echo some of the themes and sentiments expounded by TSG analysts - that Tyrone could have and should have won; that Kerry were lucky to win; that Kerry will eventually be found out by a team that runs hard at them thru the centre.
Little to no credit to Kerry for kicking 18 points against a mass defence employing a double sweeper system; no appreciation of the elements faced by Kerry - greasy ball and sod - in doing so; no acknowledgement that Kerry have returned to another final straight on the back of winning one.
Maybe we are no good!!!!!
|
|
|
Post by Annascaultilidie on Aug 27, 2015 9:06:38 GMT
Listening to a podcast from newstalk Monday night with Liam Hayes and he said Mayo and Dublin were the real winners the last day as they were so much better than Kerry . He said Kerry just don't have the forwards! He said he doesn't class James o Donoghue as a marque forward. Couldn't believe what I was hearing . Colm parkinson couldn't believe his drivel either . You have to question do these pundits actually have any knowledge of the game or are they so jealous of Kerry that they can't see the wood from the trees. Off The Ball has gone to the dogs in recent years. There was a time when it was without a doubt the best sports show on radio. Also on Newstalk last Monday morning, you had Shane Coleman, the political correspondent, making his disgust at a Kerry victory known. The old OTB boys may now be found here www.irishtimes.com/sport/second-captainsThey often use Oisin McConville, Mike Quirke and Malachy Clerkin who I think are a lot more pro-Kerry than many.
|
|
|
Post by blackisbad on Aug 27, 2015 10:23:01 GMT
Watching the game again too, we missed as many chances as they did and much of which was due to conditions. The first penalty wasn't one and neither was the 2nd. Marc's black was harsh as he was in slip slide momentum but ref wouldn't see that, then again it was the linesman who ruled and he should see that. Tyrone are not as good as I first thought and on a dry day we'd have 'em hosed down by HT. The gulf in class is massive and 18 v 12 scores tells the story. Brolly has now lost the plot on Twitter, he is playing Ulster v The Rest card, he is employed as a objective national pundit, and it's not even his own county who lost. He must call by Specsavers on his way to the shrink to address his Small Man syndrome. I suppose the wee nip and tucker nipper does lack breadth of vision so that's what you're going to get. And while one must tolerate bias from others who like the champs dethroned, I think the RTE commentators got worse at the end when they felt it slipping away from Tyrone as we took grip at the death. Someone needs to have a word as it is a poor reflection on the game when our shop window is tainted. They made a sow of themselves with the penalty that was given for what they said was a 'stumble' and that they got right. I really wonder about you, the ultimate in Green and Gold tinted glasses. Whatever about the pens, definitely a black for Marc. I agree that alot of people on this site base their views from watching matches with Green and Gold tinted glasses but u seem to b on this site just to disagree with most of the kerry supporter's views. U seem a small bit bitter.
|
|
|
Post by Dermot on Aug 27, 2015 10:24:50 GMT
Tyrone need to get new forwards, a new keeper, and a few more younger lads to cover the older tyrone legs. In other words, they need a period of transition, about 3 years. So next year could be very difficult for them, and us to for that mater. I think that the main challengers next year could well be galway. They have pedigree, and were not far away in croke park against us. It's like those magic picture thingys that were popular 20 odd years ago....I'm looking at it but I can't see what you see.... Well Dermot, what is the feeling in Tyrone about the season? As some have said here it reminds me of our 2013 semi with Dublin, yes we are beaten on the day ( and had a poor league) but there was a feeling of positivity in spite of this for me anyway. It depends on how the squad react - will they be hahappy with a moral kind of victory or will they kick on. I'd imagine they will kick on. Get some more young blood and be the strongest Ulster challenger in the next few years. Room for optimism there I think. Aye there's certainly a bit of "the one that got away" but who knows what would have happened.... The general feeling is certainly one of optimism for the next few years though we know there are a few changes to be made for sure .. but generally, it feels like an upward curve. Hate to disagree with you there Donegalman but thats the feeling here ... And MH aint going anywhere btw .. Thought he did most things right on Sunday, the players just couldnt convert the opportunities thrown up.. Cant blame MH for that..
|
|
|
Post by Dermot on Aug 27, 2015 10:27:49 GMT
Was that photo taken before or after he had a grip of Aidan O Mahoneys jersey in an effort to fool the referee into giving a penalty. It didnt work and Tyrone lost. Thats one in the eye for the practitioners of the dark arts. Its a victory for decency and sportsmanship. Here Sully, how's you my old friend You know that you can only count the championships victories if you go on to win the All Ireland, otherwise they're pointless .. So that leaves us 3-1 up at the minute .. Do you think you'll be able to win it this year and make it 3-2 ?
|
|
|
Post by donegalman on Aug 27, 2015 10:37:56 GMT
I saw Tyrone U21s already this year, and the sooner they get going in the senior team the better. Loyalty is an awful trap a manager can fall into in lining out his team.
I would also say that this is not a game that Tyrone let slip. You have to assume that Kerry wouldnt have created any chances of their own had they leaked an extra goal in the 2nd half. I have to say that they are too long in the tooth to let that happen. They scored 18 points, 4 in a row at the very end, and could have had a few more in the 2nd half too.
I think that Tyrone have to get new lads on board, or they will face the same situations next season, as we are facing too btw.
|
|
|
Post by Dermot on Aug 27, 2015 10:42:48 GMT
I saw Tyrone U21s already this year, and the sooner they get going in the senior team the better. Loyalty is an awful trap a manager can fall into in lining out his team. I would also say that this is not a game that Tyrone let slip. You have to assume that Kerry wouldnt have created any chances of their own had they leaked an extra goal in the 2nd half. I have to say that they are too long in the tooth to let that happen. They scored 18 points, 4 in a row at the very end, and could have had a few more in the 2nd half too. I think that Tyrone have to get new lads on board, or they will face the same situations next season, as we are facing too btw. Im looking forward to seeing a lot more of the U21's coming on .. some great players coming through and some who didnt want considered for the seniors this year should certainly be a big help ... The current team has a few players I really dont rate and I "hope" MH wont be too loyal .. i dont think he will !!! Im upbeat about next year though..
|
|
|
Post by asithappens on Aug 27, 2015 11:45:07 GMT
Mickey Harte is a great manager - probably one of the best of all time according to many people but he has only ever steered Tyrone through a Championship unbeaten once in 13 attempts (2003). He never got them into 2 Finals in a row when at the time some experts said they were far ahead of everyone else but somehow the man is hailed as a worker of miracles because he managed to beat Kerry 3 times in Croke Park.
|
|
Jigz84
Fanatical Member
Posts: 2,017
|
Post by Jigz84 on Aug 27, 2015 11:52:39 GMT
Kerry: 325 possessions & 93 kick passes
Tyrone: 235 possessions & 28 kick passes
|
|
|
Post by Annascaultilidie on Aug 27, 2015 12:05:07 GMT
John Bannon has said that the Tyrone penalty shouldn't have been a penalty but the second incident maybe was.
I for one haven't a clue about either. There doesn't seem to be any precise rules (Bannon seems to work under the bizarre assumption that there are) and calls are made often entirely in the referee's judgement.
I agree with the two calls but if you asked me to explain why I couldn't really tell you!
|
|
|
Post by glengael on Aug 27, 2015 12:06:17 GMT
A word about the Kerry support on Sunday. And a note of positivity I hope.
Over the past 6 years, particularly since the economic crash of 08/09, I am constantly in awe looking at the number of families, sometimes 3 generations of them, making their way to Croke Park to support Kerry from all parts of the county and country. I have only myself to pay for in terms of match ticket, transport, food, and deciding on whether it will be a day trip or not etc. But so many Kerry families of all ages, shapes and sizes are so loyal in making the journey and the cost of a day in Dublin does add up.
Whatever guff is being spoken about economic recovery, there are still a lot of people who have little enough discretionary income and yet travel to support their native place, to cheer on their neighbours and friends, and they come in their thousands, decked out in the green and gold.
Heuston station was a heartening sight last Sunday with Kerry (and indeed Tyrone) supporters coming off trains from Galway, Waterford, Castlebar, Limerick as well as the Tralee and Cork services.
For some people I know Sunday was the last big family day out of the summer, as it can be difficult to get many tickets for September. I am glad that all who travelled went home with happy memories.
So a word of acknowledgement to all those who make that effort and have made it over the last few difficult years. I still vividly remember my first trip as a child to Fitzgerald Stadium and the impression it left. I count myself lucky to be able to continue to support Kerry and hope that I'll be able to do so for many years to come.
|
|
|
Post by asithappens on Aug 27, 2015 12:32:39 GMT
John Bannon has said that the Tyrone penalty shouldn't have been a penalty but the second incident maybe was. I for one haven't a clue about either. There doesn't seem to be any precise rules (Bannon seems to work under the bizarre assumption that there are) and calls are made often entirely in the referee's judgement. I agree with the two calls but if you asked me to explain why I couldn't really tell you! Tyrone shouldn't have got any penalty last Sunday. The 1st incident saw 2 Kerry players go into tackle Barry Tierney...Killian Young made an attempt (a very fair attempt) at a tackle. After the contact from the attempted tackle Barry Tierney ended up on the ground. He chose to go to ground as he was not forced - there was simply not enough force. This was simulation and therefore a free out should have been given and the Tyrone player given a yellow card. The 2nd incident saw Padraig McNulty grab Aidan O'Mahony's jersey (this is illegal under the rules) and gain an advantage. He had first run on O'Mahony after gaining an illegal advantage. Aidan then in my opinion fouled him. The referee booked the player for diving. His signal seemed to indicate this. The main issue that nobody can dispute is that McNulty fouled O'Mahony first. That is a fact. Kerry got the same outcome (a free out) so this is a case of justice being done but for the wrong offence.
|
|
fitz
Fanatical Member
Red sky at night get off my land
Posts: 1,719
|
Post by fitz on Aug 27, 2015 12:51:34 GMT
Kerry: 325 possessions & 93 kick passes Tyrone: 235 possessions & 28 kick passes That's a stat worth waiting for.
|
|
Jigz84
Fanatical Member
Posts: 2,017
|
Post by Jigz84 on Aug 27, 2015 12:59:29 GMT
Kerry: 325 possessions & 93 kick passes Tyrone: 235 possessions & 28 kick passes That's a stat worth waiting for. Saw it floating around somewhere online earlier, can't recall where though
|
|
fitz
Fanatical Member
Red sky at night get off my land
Posts: 1,719
|
Post by fitz on Aug 27, 2015 13:02:50 GMT
Off The Ball has gone to the dogs in recent years. There was a time when it was without a doubt the best sports show on radio. Also on Newstalk last Monday morning, you had Shane Coleman, the political correspondent, making his disgust at a Kerry victory known. The old OTB boys may now be found here www.irishtimes.com/sport/second-captainsThey often use Oisin McConville, Mike Quirke and Malachy Clerkin who I think are a lot more pro-Kerry than many. Hayes is a French guybag. He's only being consistent. In 09 he said Seamus Scanlon was barely a decent club footballer. Had to apologize after Seamus put in a solid shift in the final. A buddy of mine had a photo with Star and Killian on the Monday night for homecoming. Star had T-Shirt "Hayes -> picture of Hayes ->under picture "Pr1ck". Obviously a lot of stomach churning ABK's out there if our analysts are much to go by. Dublin have beaten Longford, Kildare, and Westmeath. Mayo have beaten New York ?, Galway, Sligo and Donegal. Kerry are AI champions. Dublin and Mayo are clearly number 1) and 2) ? Could this Championship go any better for us? It's an absolutely perfect path and final match before the final. Sep 20 - bring it on.
|
|