|
Post by givehimaball on Apr 23, 2023 23:01:31 GMT
. Armagh as 2nd seed would make it a tougher group. It’s open draw Not for the 1st 2 seeds... Kerry are guaranteed to be paired with a Connacht finalist in their round robin No they are not. There is nothing in the rule-book to back this up. The rule book asys that a provincial winner and the team they beat in the finals can't be drawn in the same group i.e. Kerry and Clare will be in different groups
|
|
|
Post by piggott on Apr 23, 2023 23:30:41 GMT
Presuming Dublin, Galway, and Kerry are provincial champions, they would be Seed 1 in Round Robin. Connaught runners up Sligo would be seed 2 in Kerry's group and Clare likewise in Galway's group. Seed 3 would be selected in an open draw and be away to provincial winners these could be Mayo, Roscommon, Tyrone or losers of Monaghan/ Derry. In the 2nd Round provincial winners are away to 4th seed which could be Armagh/Donegal, Louth, Cork or Kildare. Seed 1 play seed 2 in round 3 most likely in Croker. Top team straight in to quarter final, while 2nd are at home to 3rd in prelimary quarter final.
|
|
|
Post by Ballyfireside on Apr 24, 2023 0:38:59 GMT
Looking as TSG makes me feel so fortunate of what we have, I don't think there is anything that even comes close anywhere in the whole wide world.
Of course there will always a few warts, (e.g. Meath and my beloved Donegal) among the beauty spots (e.g. 53 scores in the Banner v Premier, and 15% of them goals).
While Structure, Energy and Flow was apparent in a few games, it was notably missing with Donegal and where the lack of leadership cripples the spirit. GAA HQ needs to help out here as it is festering to an extent that permanent damage will be done - my fear is that a middle band of talent will drift to soccer and so will be lost forever.
Anything that is bad for Gaelic football isn't good for Kerry as a leading force. Personally I loved to meet GAA folk from rural clubs in Donegal and having shared a lot of days with them I hope they get the assistance required to sort things out. The sad thing is that supporters don't even know what is going on and it looks like TCB don't either - and all that will erode confidence further. What should be a decent enough Div 1 football county will slide down the scale - heart breaking really and at a time when the county needs all the positive spirit it can get.
|
|
|
Post by royalkerryfan on Apr 24, 2023 7:14:11 GMT
Presuming Dublin, Galway, and Kerry are provincial champions, they would be Seed 1 in Round Robin. Connaught runners up Sligo would be seed 2 in Kerry's group and Clare likewise in Galway's group. Seed 3 would be selected in an open draw and be away to provincial winners these could be Mayo, Roscommon, Tyrone or losers of Monaghan/ Derry. In the 2nd Round provincial winners are away to 4th seed which could be Armagh/Donegal, Louth, Cork or Kildare. Seed 1 play seed 2 in round 3 most likely in Croker. Top team straight in to quarter final, while 2nd are at home to 3rd in prelimary quarter final. Connaught runners up are not pre determined to be in any group. It's an open draw.
|
|
|
Post by The16thMan on Apr 24, 2023 8:15:10 GMT
Not for the 1st 2 seeds... Kerry are guaranteed to be paired with a Connacht finalist in their round robin No they are not. There is nothing in the rule-book to back this up. The rule book asys that a provincial winner and the team they beat in the finals can't be drawn in the same group i.e. Kerry and Clare will be in different groups Perhaps I'm wrong but from what I've heard. The Munster & Connacht finalists are out on May 21st and the Ulster & Leinster finalists the following week. That was what made me think the Connacht and Munster finalists would be paired in the same 2 groups but maybe this won't be the case.
|
|
|
Post by onlykerry on Apr 24, 2023 8:34:08 GMT
Making assumptions is always dangerous but here goes - assuming Kerry, Galway & Dublin win their provincial championships the three resulting Pot 2 seeds will not be seen as serious contenders and whatever the draw these will be the "neutral" venue games. Ulster is the one province where a relatively strong team could end up in pot 2. Pot three is the banana skin pot with four strong teams (based on league), the main advantage for Provincial winners is these games are at home and are first up on the schedule. Next weekend will give clarity on what teams are in what pot with the potential (however unlikely) for some weird and wonderful outcomes - If Kildare somehow manage to upset Dublin and Derry beat Monaghan (more likely) then Dublin would end up in pot 4 with a home game against a team from pot 1.
|
|
|
Post by kingdomofciar on Apr 24, 2023 11:44:49 GMT
From the Examiner today......
In a response to a query from the Irish Examiner, it has been explained Clare, Kerry, Galway and Sligo will all play two weeks after the provincial finals on May 7.
The winners of Connacht and Munster will face third seeds at home (either Mayo, Roscommon, Tyrone plus one) in their opening game with the runners-up also at home taking on fourth seeds (either Donegal, Westmeath plus two).
However, the provinces aren’t guaranteed to be paired, i.e. Munster winners with Connacht finalists and vice-versa. The victors can also be drawn in the same group as the runners-up in Leinster and Ulster. Likewise, the Connacht and Munster runners-up could find themselves in the same groups as the champions in the bigger provinces.
However, to ensure all teams have at least 13 days between their provincial final and opening Sam Maguire Cup games, there is a possibility not all group’s first round games will take place on the same weekend.
|
|
|
Post by buck02 on Apr 24, 2023 12:35:03 GMT
The Football Gods have dictated that Meath football has been on a downward spiral ever since their supporters Ole'd every pass in the last 20 minutes of the 2001 semi final.
|
|
|
Post by thehermit on Apr 24, 2023 12:42:22 GMT
The Football Gods have dictated that Meath football has been on a downward spiral ever since their supporters Ole'd every pass in the last 20 minutes of the 2001 semi final. Hah was only thinking the same thing yesterday when I heard the result.
Then again if the Gods choose to mock Meath so where is the apocalyptic reckoning of karma the Dubs surely have coming every since Cluxton's phantom free in 2011
|
|
|
Post by jrmanula on Apr 24, 2023 14:03:16 GMT
There is a glaring anomaly in the wording of championship set up in GAA website,it states that the winner of the league final cannot be a lower seed then the team it beats in the final,so Mayo should be a higher seed than Galway. I know it's not what they meant but it is very sloppy work by headquarters.
|
|
Jo90
Fanatical Member
Posts: 2,687
|
Post by Jo90 on Apr 24, 2023 14:48:16 GMT
There is a glaring anomaly in the wording of championship set up in GAA website,it states that the winner of the league final cannot be a lower seed then the team it beats in the final,so Mayo should be a higher seed than Galway. I know it's not what they meant but it is very sloppy work by headquarters. Its a farce the whole format.I mean what kind of competition have seed 3 teams and maybe seed 4 teams stronger than seed 2 teams and 3 out of 4 teams to qualify. I mean Mayo and Tyrone are probably in better positions than Monaghan Armagh or Derry etc also. In last years World Cup, Qatar were 1st seeds. In the 2021 Euros, in 4 of the 6 groups, 3 of the 4 teams qualified.
|
|
peanuts
Fanatical Member
Posts: 1,857
|
Post by peanuts on Apr 24, 2023 14:50:06 GMT
There is a glaring anomaly in the wording of championship set up in GAA website,it states that the winner of the league final cannot be a lower seed then the team it beats in the final,so Mayo should be a higher seed than Galway. I know it's not what they meant but it is very sloppy work by headquarters. Not sure how its worded jrmanula but the intent is that its only in relation to rankings by league placing i.e. Derry finished the league with more points than Dublin but because Dublin beat them in the league final Dublin are ranked as the 7th highest team rather than Derry.
|
|
peanuts
Fanatical Member
Posts: 1,857
|
Post by peanuts on Apr 24, 2023 14:58:38 GMT
Its a farce the whole format.I mean what kind of competition have seed 3 teams and maybe seed 4 teams stronger than seed 2 teams and 3 out of 4 teams to qualify. I mean Mayo and Tyrone are probably in better positions than Monaghan Armagh or Derry etc also. In last years World Cup, Qatar were 1st seeds. In the 2021 Euros, in 4 of the 6 groups, 3 of the 4 teams qualified. Lower ranked teams get rewarded for getting to provincial finals which gives more counties a realistic chance of participating in the AI series proper. The reason for the 3 teams progressing appears to be to prevent the possibility of dead rubbers in the last group game. It may not be ideal but lets waits and see how it works out. The games would fall quite well for Kerry if they win Munster and the group. They will have a 2 week break to the 1st round robin game and 2 weeks break between each of the other 2 games. If they win the group they will also have a two week break to the QF. As I understand it the Leinster and Ulster finalists will only have a one week break between their 1st and 2nd group games.
|
|
|
Post by kerry97 on Apr 24, 2023 14:59:23 GMT
Really bad weekend for the football championship in terms of entertainment .
I went to Killarney on Saturday and I wasn't expecting much but it was by a distance the flattest atmosphere I can ever recall at a Championship match. Its astonishing to think that Tipperary won the Munster Championship in December 2020 . I understand that a number of their players have retired , gone abroad or opted out and the players available tried hard but overall it made for grim viewing .
With regard to the rest of the weekend , the Leinster Championship has reached new lows , Laois who have a decent pick were shocking , they were like a group who met up for the first time a couple of hours before throw in . They defended with all the intensity of a set of cones . Offaly and Louth had two good wins but I would seriously fear for them in a Leinster final as I can't see Kildare laying a hand on Dublin .
A lot of the teams in that competition look completely demoralised , its really hard to see Meath , Westmeath , Laois and Wexford coming back and challenging Dublin again . The players have shipped too many punishment beatings at this point and I think its completely understandable that players neither have the morale or believe to compete or the desire to join a squad . Going training twenty seven nights in January to generate a good performance and "only" lose by ten to fifteen points seems like a futile exercise . As for Offaly, Louth and Kildare they'll be playing "damage limitation" football against Dublin .
Galway and Roscommon was competitive stuff but it was hard viewing , I thought the whole state of the game was summed up by the Enda McGinley picking a "game management" clip out has a good piece of play on the Sunday Game . 75 seconds of lateral and backwards hand passing is tough viewing . I understand that possession is key but all this low risk/ no risk football is not in the least bit entertaining .
Intercounty Football is in a really bad place. It's extremely boring and I'm not sure what can be done to change this.
|
|
|
Post by jrmanula on Apr 24, 2023 15:03:47 GMT
It also states that the neutral venue for all teams will be Croke Park, including Dublin who will also use Crocker as their home venue. You could not make it up.It is a huge advantage to Dublin from a logistics point of view. They won't easy time travelling in a very tight schedule that we now have got for the championship.
|
|
|
Post by onlykerry on Apr 24, 2023 15:29:26 GMT
When is this great draw scheduled to take place?
|
|
|
Post by jrmanula on Apr 24, 2023 18:16:07 GMT
Draw on May 2 when all provincial finalists are known, live on GAA go.
|
|
|
Post by Ballyfireside on Apr 24, 2023 19:19:42 GMT
Really bad weekend for the football championship in terms of entertainment . I went to Killarney on Saturday and I wasn't expecting much but it was by a distance the flattest atmosphere I can ever recall at a Championship match. Its astonishing to think that Tipperary won the Munster Championship in December 2020 . I understand that a number of their players have retired , gone abroad or opted out and the players available tried hard but overall it made for grim viewing . With regard to the rest of the weekend , the Leinster Championship has reached new lows , Laois who have a decent pick were shocking , they were like a group who met up for the first time a couple of hours before throw in . They defended with all the intensity of a set of cones . Offaly and Louth had two good wins but I would seriously fear for them in a Leinster final as I can't see Kildare laying a hand on Dublin . A lot of the teams in that competition look completely demoralised , its really hard to see Meath , Westmeath , Laois and Wexford coming back and challenging Dublin again . The players have shipped too many punishment beatings at this point and I think its completely understandable that players neither have the morale or believe to compete or the desire to join a squad . Going training twenty seven nights in January to generate a good performance and "only" lose by ten to fifteen points seems like a futile exercise . As for Offaly, Louth and Kildare they'll be playing "damage limitation" football against Dublin . Galway and Roscommon was competitive stuff but it was hard viewing , I thought the whole state of the game was summed up by the Enda McGinley picking a "game management" clip out has a good piece of play on the Sunday Game . 75 seconds of lateral and backwards hand passing is tough viewing . I understand that possession is key but all this low risk/ no risk football is not in the least bit entertaining . Intercounty Football is in a really bad place. It's extremely boring and I'm not sure what can be done to change this. Moving from is it 60 to 90 games isn't the solution, more a dead rubber factory. I think provincials should be seeded and maintain, provincial finals. Maybe have a few competitions for say 4 x 8, with the 8s formed as teams get knocked out. The key is to have teams playing their equals and which can be entertaining and bring them on, encouragement. The way it is going we'll end up with scenarios like no Galway playing in Leinster Hurling. There is only one football county in Munster - sad, but a fact. Hurling is the opposite.
|
|
|
Post by givehimaball on Apr 25, 2023 8:59:19 GMT
In terms of the standard of the championship the big issue is games between teams of differing standards. Once the vote was passed to reject reducing the importance of the provincials this was always going to be the situation.
Once the group stages of Sam and the Tailteann Cup start I would expect things to improve quite significantly as the gap in standards between teams will be a lot less pronounced [personally I think there should have been 3 levels but that boat has sailed]
There's no good logical reason for the provincials to play such am important role in the All-Ireland in this day and age - unfortunately we're stuck with them for the time being because of the provincial councils wanting to hang on to their power and the dead hand of pointless "tradition"
|
|
|
Post by onlykerry on Apr 25, 2023 9:11:34 GMT
In terms of the standard of the championship the big issue is games between teams of differing standards. Once the vote was passed to reject reducing the importance of the provincials this was always going to be the situation. Once the group stages of Sam and the Tailteann Cup start I would expect things to improve quite significantly as the gap in standards between teams will be a lot less pronounced [personally I think there should have been 3 levels but that boat has sailed] There's no good logical reason for the provincials to play such am important role in the All-Ireland in this day and age - unfortunately we're stuck with them for the time being because of the provincial councils wanting to hang on to their power and the dead hand of pointless "tradition" It will be no surprise if the status of making the Provincial final will be diluted in the next few years - give it a year or two or live data and see what happens. Bit like getting an mega oil tanker to change course. Either the Provincials will be seeded or the runners up will lose Pot 2 status will most likely be the first change.
|
|
|
Post by jrmanula on Apr 25, 2023 9:26:56 GMT
I understand that the Irish Examiner have got confirmation from HQ that it is an open draw for all seeds, they seem to be making it up as they go. As regards Croke Park being a neutral venue for the Dubs a lot of counties can't object as they up to their backside in loan repayments to HQ After a drawn A I a number of years ago Dublin we doing relaxation in a pool complex before Mayo crossed the M50
|
|
|
Post by givehimaball on Apr 25, 2023 9:38:24 GMT
I understand that the Irish Examiner have got confirmation from HQ that it is an open draw for all seeds, they seem to be making it up as they go. As regards Croke Park being a neutral venue for the Dubs a lot of counties can't object as they up to their backside in loan repayments to HQ After a drawn A I a number of years ago Dublin we doing relaxation in a pool complex before Mayo crossed the M50 My reading of the fixture booklet that was released in December suggested to me that it was always the rule that it was an open draw in the group stages bar those teams that met in the provincial finals couldn't be in the same group. The problem was some in the media - including John Fogarty in the Examiner - started mentioning that the winner of Munster was down to play the loser in Connacht. This idea spread gained legs which was why the GAA had to come out and clarify things. As regards "Croke Park" being a neutral venue for Dublin, it's a disgrace by the GAA given all the other advantages Dublin have. I think it says a world about Dublin GAA's approach to winning and their lip service approach to fairness. By contrast Kerry GAA for the third year in a row look like they are going along with making life as easy as possible for opponents in terms of match arrangements.
|
|
|
Post by The16thMan on Apr 29, 2023 19:19:18 GMT
Tier 3 teams confirmed: Mayo Roscommon Tyrone Monaghan
Should Kerry win Munster we'll have 1 of these 4 teams in Killarney on May 20/21.
Draw to take place Tuesday and we'll have a more clear picture then. Personally I'd prefer Tyrone or Mayo.
|
|
|
Post by royalkerryfan on Apr 29, 2023 19:56:40 GMT
Tier 3 teams confirmed: Mayo Roscommon Tyrone Monaghan Should Kerry win Munster we'll have 1 of these 4 teams in Killarney on May 20/21. Draw to take place Tuesday and we'll have a more clear picture then. Personally I'd prefer Tyrone or Mayo. Yeah I agree, Mayo for the buzz and the crowd and Tyrone because we owe them one. Plus we need some serious games now.. I wouldn't mind the losers of the Ulster final aswell as seeds 2.
|
|
|
Post by The16thMan on Apr 29, 2023 20:58:20 GMT
Tier 3 teams confirmed: Mayo Roscommon Tyrone Monaghan Should Kerry win Munster we'll have 1 of these 4 teams in Killarney on May 20/21. Draw to take place Tuesday and we'll have a more clear picture then. Personally I'd prefer Tyrone or Mayo. Yeah I agree, Mayo for the buzz and the crowd and Tyrone because we owe them one. Plus we need some serious games now.. I wouldn't mind the losers of the Ulster final aswell as seeds 2. I agree, Kerry need 3 as challenging games as they can get from the Round Robin. Even if we don't finish top of the group it wouldn't be the worst thing ever because there's a good chance we'd have an extra game through a provisional quarter final but we'll see. Hard to plan the ideal roadmap to success in the first year if a structure, we can only speculate.
|
|
|
Post by onlykerry on Apr 30, 2023 0:00:48 GMT
With 3 Provincial SFs' remaining to be played there are five counties still sweating over results to see if they will be playing the the Sam Maguire or Tailteann Cup championships.
A Kildare victory over Dublin (long odds of this happening) would see Kildare secure a place in the Sam and Dublin become a Pot 4 team. Should Offaly and Down both win it would also mean Cork and Louth head to the Tailteann Cup.
Assuming Dublin beat Kildare then either Offaly or Down winning would send Kildare to the Tailteann Cup at the expense of whichever team wins and if both Offaly and Down win then Cork would join Kildare in the Tailteann Cup and we would have 5 lower division teams in the Sam Maguire.
I expect this level of uncertainty is exactly what HQ hoped the new format would throw up (and it gives credence to the line that any county can make the Sam Maguire Championship in any given year) but come the round robin games will it still give one sided games in the Sam Maguire championship - does the Championship proper only begin when we have 12 left standing and knock out games commence - is everything else just revenue generation and shadow boxing. I find it difficult to get enthusiastic about games that don't matter with all these back doors and second chance saloons. Is the championship at risk of becoming a three/four game sprint which will be over before we know it
|
|
|
Post by dc84 on Apr 30, 2023 6:06:09 GMT
Bring it on i say a top team coming to killarney in the summer is a dream just a pity it wont be the dubs what an occasion that would be !
I dont care who we get as i think we wouldnt fear anyone in killarney hope its Tyrone tbh we owe them two i think now !
|
|
|
Post by givehimaball on Apr 30, 2023 11:19:51 GMT
I agree, Kerry need 3 as challenging games as they can get from the Round Robin. Even if we don't finish top of the group it wouldn't be the worst thing ever because there's a good chance we'd have an extra game through a provisional quarter final but we'll see. Hard to plan the ideal roadmap to success in the first year if a structure, we can only speculate. I think Kerry and any team serious about contending for Sam will be doing all they can to avoid playing in the preliminary quarter-final. Winning the All-Ireland via that route looks a lot bit harder to me compared to those who win the group. The teams who finish 2nd and 3rd in the groups will end up playing their last group game the weekend of June 17th/18th then the preliminary quarter-final on the weekend of June 24th/25th and then the quarter-finals on the following weekend of the 1st of July. The the semi-finals the weekend of the 15th/16th of July and the finals the 30th of July. This is after the provincial games and the first two rounds of the group stages. Squad depth and managaging injuries are going to be more important than ever. It's going to be even worse in the Tailteann Cup with the final round of group games, the preliminary quarter-final, the quarter-finals and the semi-finals taking place 4 weekends in a row. Then there's a three week gap to the Tailteann Cup final. Seems a bit strange that there isn't a gap of two weeks between the quarters and the semi-final and then two weeks to the final. Will be very surprised if the teams who get to the final of the Tailteann aren't two of the group winners. I think having that weekend of the preliminary quarter-finals is going to be massive for the four group winners in both Sam and Tailteann and would be expecting all eight of the group winners to make up the 8 semi-finalists in both comps. There might be an upset or two but I expect it will become clear very quickly that winning your group will give sides a massive advantage in terms of reaching the semi-finals.
|
|
|
Post by thehermit on Apr 30, 2023 12:02:40 GMT
I think fellas talking about Kerry needing a game might be in for a surprise today week. I fully expect Clare to give us our fill of it, why wouldn't they,what have they to lose?!!
Could be a much tighter affair than people will give credit for.
|
|
|
Post by thehermit on Apr 30, 2023 12:06:42 GMT
On another subject this GAAGO is a bit of a disaster isn't it? 3-4 weeks into the Championship and again no game on tv on a Saturday. Had to make do with the Radio for the Derry game and totally missed Clare v Limerick which sounded like an epic!
I was totally against the SKY thing but at least pubs had SKY and would throw on the matches. Was in Tralee yesterday and nowhere I saw had GAAGO and was willing to put in either the football or hurling. There was no other sport on yesterday evening so opportunity missed for the GAA.
And don't even get me started about not being able to watch BBC NI 🙄
|
|