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Post by kerrygold on Feb 16, 2015 10:12:43 GMT
A 1.30 start for the NFL would accommodate people who might like to watch the rugby game also. It will be interesting to see if there is any movement from Croke Park on this?
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Post by givehimaball on Feb 16, 2015 11:08:18 GMT
The following is a list of the 26 players who have featured for Dublin so far this year in the league.
Bernard Brogan Brian Fenton Ciaran Kilkenny Ciaran Reddin Conor McHugh Cormac Costello Darren Daly David Bryne Davy Bryne Dean Rock Denis Bastick Emmet O'Conghaile Eoghan O'Gara Eoin Culligan Eric Lowdnes Jack McCaffrey John Small Jonny Cooper Kevin McManamon Michael Deegan Michael Fitzsimmons Philip McMahon Rory O'Carroll Seán Currie Shane Carthy Tomas Brady
Last year the Dubs named 37 players on their panel on their website. Of the 26 players Dublin have used so far in the league, 6 of them weren't named in last year's panel.
Brian Fenton Raheny Ciaran Kilkenny Castleknock Conor McHugh Na Fianna Eoin Culligan Kilmacud Crokes John Small Ballymun Kickhams Michael Deegan Donaghmore/Ashbourne
The following is the 17 players named in last year's panel who haven't featured in the league so far -
Alan Brogan Bryan Cullen Cian O'Sullivan Darragh Nelson Declan O'Mahony Diarmuid Connolly Ger Brennan James McCarthy Kevin Nolan Michael Darragh MacAuley Niall McGovern Nicky Devereux Paddy Andrews Paul Flynn Paul Mannion Phillip Ryan Stephen Cluxton
Now Bryan Cullen has retired and Paul Mannion is studying in China, while Brennan and Connolly have been on club duty with Vincents, while some have been injured or have simply dropped down the pecking order. However whatever way you slice it there is a serious amount of quality in/around the Dublin squad.
It will be very interesting to see just how strong the Dublin team named for the game in Killarney is.
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Post by Mickmack on Feb 18, 2015 8:52:18 GMT
would I be right in thinking that in this decade, Kerry have played Dublin 7 times in league and championship and its 6-1 to the Dubs?
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Post by Seoirse Ui Duic on Feb 18, 2015 10:00:13 GMT
League: 2010 Kerry 1-10 – 1-12 Dublin 2011 Dublin 3-10 - 1-15 Kerry 2012 Dublin 0-11 — 1-14 Kerry 2013 Kerry 0-4 - 1-11 Dublin 2014 Dublin 2-8 - 1-10 Kerry
C'ship 2013 SF Kerry 3-11 – 3 -18 Dublin 2011 Final Kerry 1-11 - 1-12 Dublin
Only 1 win in 7 games indeed
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Jo90
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Post by Jo90 on Feb 18, 2015 11:23:51 GMT
League: 2010 Kerry 1-10 – 1-12 Dublin 2011 Dublin 3-10 - 1-15 Kerry 2012 Dublin 0-11 — 1-14 Kerry 2013 Kerry 0-4 - 1-11 Dublin 2014 Dublin 2-8 - 1-10 Kerry C'ship 2013 SF Kerry 3-11 – 3 -18 Dublin 2011 Final Kerry 1-11 - 1-12 Dublin Only 1 win in 7 games indeed Impressive stuff. If that was Tyrone they'd be already claiming "team of the decade"!
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G_S_J
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Post by G_S_J on Feb 18, 2015 11:34:06 GMT
League: 2010 Kerry 1-10 – 1-12 Dublin 2011 Dublin 3-10 - 1-15 Kerry 2012 Dublin 0-11 — 1-14 Kerry 2013 Kerry 0-4 - 1-11 Dublin 2014 Dublin 2-8 - 1-10 Kerry C'ship 2013 SF Kerry 3-11 – 3 -18 Dublin 2011 Final Kerry 1-11 - 1-12 Dublin Only 1 win in 7 games indeed Impressive stuff. If that was Tyrone they'd be already claiming "team of the decade"! The Dubs have had their fair share of hyperbole over the last year or so... That record is fairly dismal, but we're All-Ireland champions and by the law of averages it should start swinging the other way once again soon. Preferably in August or September.
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Post by Seoirse Ui Duic on Feb 18, 2015 12:18:37 GMT
Most of those are League games. The previous decade shows a very different story. Dublin are currently on a high having one of their best panels/teams ever. They are possibly stronger than they were in the 70s. Only time will tell if Kerry can beat this current Dublin team. I believe Eamon will stick with the youngsters and give them a very tough test, thus preparing them for the championship as they will encounter even tougher games later in the year. I don't think Dublin will go out either as Gavin has learned from pervious years that impressive league form does not lead to impressive championship form. It remains to be seen if Kerry were better than Dublin last year, but I think this year we are. I expect a very close game and a 2 point win for Dublin.
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Jigz84
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Post by Jigz84 on Feb 18, 2015 12:41:47 GMT
Impressive stuff. If that was Tyrone they'd be already claiming "team of the decade"! The Dubs have had their fair share of hyperbole over the last year or so... That record is fairly dismal, but we're All-Ireland champions and by the law of averages it should start swinging the other way once again soon. Preferably in August or September. Kerry left 2 of those League games and both Championship games after them.
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Jigz84
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Post by Jigz84 on Feb 18, 2015 12:44:19 GMT
Most of those are League games. The previous decade shows a very different story. Dublin are currently on a high having one of their best panels/teams ever. They are possibly stronger than they were in the 70s.Only time will tell if Kerry can beat this current Dublin team. I believe Eamon will stick with the youngsters and give them a very tough test, thus preparing them for the championship as they will encounter even tougher games later in the year. I don't think Dublin will go out either as Gavin has learned from pervious years that impressive league form does not lead to impressive championship form. It remains to be seen if Kerry were better than Dublin last year, but I think this year we are. I expect a very close game and a 2 point win for Dublin. I wouldn't say they are. The 70s Dubs reached 6 consecutive Finals, current crop can't even make back-to-back Finals.
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Post by ballybunion on Feb 18, 2015 19:30:25 GMT
Having watched the Dublin squad all through the 70's there is no way the present Dublin squad is better.That was a great Dublin team in the 70's they were just in hard luck that they met a super Kerry team,otherwise they would have won 6/7 All Irelands.
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Post by Mickmack on Feb 18, 2015 21:06:42 GMT
EF wont want it to be 4-0 to Jim Gavin after this leagie game is concluded. He will want to start the process of "knocking them back in their fcukin arrses" to paraphrase a certain Padre Pio Se
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Post by Ballyfireside on Feb 19, 2015 1:05:21 GMT
Having watched the Dublin squad all through the 70's there is no way the present Dublin squad is better.That was a great Dublin team in the 70's they were just in hard luck that they met a super Kerry team,otherwise they would have won 6/7 All Irelands. It is hard to compare but I think the current crop of Dubs are potentially better individually but the '70s panel were a stronger unit. The fat lady hasn't sang yet although there is no way the '70s boys would collapse like recent Dublin teams. More to the point, how would our '70's/'80's era panels compare to recent and current teams? Fitzy's achievement in '14 will be remembered for a long time, we we outsiders of 4 with Dubs odds on, we beat the other two, one of which had already routed the Dubs from the party. Where were you the day of t Bomber's hat trick? Did Ogie play with Shannon Rangers seniors at 16 years of age? And good to see Beale ding well, even if The Ballydonoghue Ingredient helped out a bit, some nice players I'm told, has young Dee prospects beyond club level?
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Post by sullyschoice on Feb 19, 2015 3:04:50 GMT
A 1.30 start for the NFL would accommodate people who might like to watch the rugby game also. It will be interesting to see if there is any movement from Croke Park on this? Why should the Football match time be changed. Let them change the time of the rugby match so they dont clash with our game.
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Post by kerrygold on Feb 19, 2015 8:50:48 GMT
A 1.30 start for the NFL would accommodate people who might like to watch the rugby game also. It will be interesting to see if there is any movement from Croke Park on this? Why should the Football match time be changed. Let them change the time of the rugby match so they dont clash with our game. It is unlikely they will change a televised world event to accommodate the NFL It would be a nice gesture from the GAA to start next weeks games at 1.30 to allow people the opportunity to view all that is on offer next Sunday. A small gesture that wouldn't rock the association.
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Post by ballybunion on Feb 19, 2015 11:29:30 GMT
Ballythefireside:Firstly I would disagree as to the present Dublin lot being individually better than the 70's lads but it is difficult to judge.Present players have the benefit of better coaching,diet,tactics etc which the earlier lot didnt have.An earlier poster mentioned the balooning 'Hail Mary'ball of the 70's out of defence which doesnt look good and if done today could result in the player being substituted.My opinion is you can only beat what is in front of you and if the 70's boys had the 'modern availabilities'they would be individually better but again maybe its my age.Fat Lady has yet to sing. Where was I as Bomber scored the 3 goals probably somewhere between the ground and roof of Hogan,in mid air anyway ie I mean I was off my feet in celebration. Ogie did play at 16 for Shannon Rangers.He played against Feale Rangers in quarter final in 1972 and held his place and won county medal.He played very well. As regards Beale,fantastic times "An rud is annamh is iontach" especially having lost 2 finals.Potential of the Beale players,maybe a few might get a call on Kerry junior panel,hard to say. I think we will defeat Dublin next week.
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Post by Seoirse Ui Duic on Feb 19, 2015 11:54:39 GMT
Why should the Football match time be changed. Let them change the time of the rugby match so they dont clash with our game. It is unlikely they will change a televised world event to accommodate the NFL It would be a nice gesture from the GAA to start next weeks games at 1.30 to allow people the opportunity to view all that is on offer next Sunday. A small gesture that wouldn't rock the association. It kind of shows the GAA for what is perceived to be abroad: a game only played in Ireland of little international importance. 6 nations rugby of course is one of the most important tournaments, only eclipsed by the Rugby World Cup, in a global sport. Rugby union is a professional sport now and the six nations tournament is broadcasted live in over 40 countries. People worldwide will watch Ireland play at home against their biggest rivals. All those people will tune in at the time announced in May 2014. Kerry v Dublin the league is just a league game and of little importance to people not from Kerry or Dublin, bar the GAA enthousiasts in other counties. 10.000 people at most will attend (in my opinion) with a further 120.000 watching the game live on TG4 (my personal estimate of course as around 200.000 seem to watch the league finals but no statistics have been released for the league matches shown so far). Compare this to over a million people worldwide watching Ireland v England in the rugby. It costs RTE a lot of money to show six nations rugby and sponsors and tax payers will want their money's worth from it. I'm not sure how much RTE and other stations pay the IRFU for the privilege of showing the game live but it will be a lot more than the GAA will receive from TG4 for showing the Kerry v Dublin game. TG4 will also provide coverage in a language that, sadly enough, most people in Ireland do not understand. So, it is all about money and money will dictate that the 6 nations games won't be moved. I'm not sure if the GAA is allowed to change the contract with TG4 and move the games forward. I somehow doubt it will be that easy to move a televised game to a different time slot. I don't know the official figures for last Sunday but given the coverage and the press coverage I think even the Scotland v Wales game was watched by a lot more people than Stacks v Slaughtneil, which is a very sad thing in my opinion. I'm still not a big fan of the whole Sky deal, but it would have been good if Setanta or Sky would be showing the other division 1 games that are not on TG4 live. Instead Setanta show certain Saturday games, but a lot of games won't be televised at all. It is easier to be an American Football than a GAA fan in Ireland if you have sky and rely on television coverage of games alone. Even the introduction of the season ticket has not increased attendance of league games much and television coverage also hasn't improved much.
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fivenarow
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Post by fivenarow on Feb 19, 2015 12:19:47 GMT
Having watched the Dublin squad all through the 70's there is no way the present Dublin squad is better.That was a great Dublin team in the 70's they were just in hard luck that they met a super Kerry team,otherwise they would have won 6/7 All Irelands. I'd have to agree with you there ballybunion. If you look at it they were still around & contesting 3 finals in a row again in the 80's, won in 83 against Galway & lost the 84 & 85 finals to us so they were good over a long time - we were just better for most of it.
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Post by Ballyfireside on Feb 19, 2015 18:47:58 GMT
How would our '70's/'80's Golden era teams compare to the best of what we have since seen, Moynihan say vs Horse Kennelly, Gooch/James vs Sheehy/Egan, Walsh son Tommy vs father Sean, Darragh vs Jack, Donaghy vs Bomber, Galvin vs Spillane, Marc vs Deennihan, Tomás vs Uncle Paidi, etc.
Have we since had a better FB that Johnno? A better goalie that Nelligan/Paudie O'Mahony?
Ah I'm terrible, this is even more difficult that comparing teams. I am sure many wouldn't agree with my 'pairings' and which are off the top of my head, it's not a subject you would spend time on as you could change your mind every five minutes. It is interesting though, if only because the intensity and the level we are talking about.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2015 20:52:34 GMT
I think the 70s/80s teams were better . Kerry have not had a real full back since John O'Keefe . Mike McCarthy would be the closest . Kerry had no real bogey team in those years they could beat anyone . Never had trouble with the Ulster teams . Hammered teams like Derry in '76 , Monaghan in '79 , Armagh in '82 , Monaghan in '85 struggled in '86 with Tyrone but overall they beat every teams easy enough . Kerry could not beat Tyrone in '03 , '05 , and '08 . Thats a big difference when comparing those teams .
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fitz
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Post by fitz on Feb 19, 2015 21:14:41 GMT
It really is a pointless comparison. The multitude of differing parameters that affect player and team and then other team is really vast between the eras. Also us as contributors of varying ages are more influenced by what we have seen than not seen. An enjoyable conversation/debate without doubt. I don't think it can be proved either way "without reasonable doubt" Apparently Alan Turing would choose the German secret code challenge every time over trying to solve the best Kerry team conundrum . One just can't be solved.
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Feb 19, 2015 21:44:35 GMT
What is a "real full back"?
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Post by kerrygold on Feb 19, 2015 21:45:04 GMT
The 70s/80s Kerry team would still be hugely competitive in the modern game winning All-Irelands in the process.
Would a selection from that era beat the Kerry team of 2014, certainly.
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Post by southward on Feb 19, 2015 22:06:40 GMT
It is unlikely they will change a televised world event to accommodate the NFL It would be a nice gesture from the GAA to start next weeks games at 1.30 to allow people the opportunity to view all that is on offer next Sunday. A small gesture that wouldn't rock the association. It kind of shows the GAA for what is perceived to be abroad: a game only played in Ireland of little international importance. 6 nations rugby of course is one of the most important tournaments, only eclipsed by the Rugby World Cup, in a global sport.Rugby union is a professional sport now and the six nations tournament is broadcasted live in over 40 countries. People worldwide will watch Ireland play at home against their biggest rivals. All those people will tune in at the time announced in May 2014. Kerry v Dublin the league is just a league game and of little importance to people not from Kerry or Dublin, bar the GAA enthousiasts in other counties. 10.000 people at most will attend (in my opinion) with a further 120.000 watching the game live on TG4 (my personal estimate of course as around 200.000 seem to watch the league finals but no statistics have been released for the league matches shown so far). Compare this to over a million people worldwide watching Ireland v England in the rugby. It costs RTE a lot of money to show six nations rugby and sponsors and tax payers will want their money's worth from it. I'm not sure how much RTE and other stations pay the IRFU for the privilege of showing the game live but it will be a lot more than the GAA will receive from TG4 for showing the Kerry v Dublin game. TG4 will also provide coverage in a language that, sadly enough, most people in Ireland do not understand. So, it is all about money and money will dictate that the 6 nations games won't be moved. I'm not sure if the GAA is allowed to change the contract with TG4 and move the games forward. I somehow doubt it will be that easy to move a televised game to a different time slot. I don't know the official figures for last Sunday but given the coverage and the press coverage I think even the Scotland v Wales game was watched by a lot more people than Stacks v Slaughtneil, which is a very sad thing in my opinion. I'm still not a big fan of the whole Sky deal, but it would have been good if Setanta or Sky would be showing the other division 1 games that are not on TG4 live. Instead Setanta show certain Saturday games, but a lot of games won't be televised at all. It is easier to be an American Football than a GAA fan in Ireland if you have sky and rely on television coverage of games alone. Even the introduction of the season ticket has not increased attendance of league games much and television coverage also hasn't improved much. So what ? Are we that insecure that we need international endorsement of the value of our own sports ? Our games are wonderful and unique; I couldn't give a monkey's what anybody else thinks of them.
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Post by Seoirse Ui Duic on Feb 19, 2015 22:48:09 GMT
It kind of shows the GAA for what is perceived to be abroad: a game only played in Ireland of little international importance. 6 nations rugby of course is one of the most important tournaments, only eclipsed by the Rugby World Cup, in a global sport.Rugby union is a professional sport now and the six nations tournament is broadcasted live in over 40 countries. People worldwide will watch Ireland play at home against their biggest rivals. All those people will tune in at the time announced in May 2014. Kerry v Dublin the league is just a league game and of little importance to people not from Kerry or Dublin, bar the GAA enthousiasts in other counties. 10.000 people at most will attend (in my opinion) with a further 120.000 watching the game live on TG4 (my personal estimate of course as around 200.000 seem to watch the league finals but no statistics have been released for the league matches shown so far). Compare this to over a million people worldwide watching Ireland v England in the rugby. It costs RTE a lot of money to show six nations rugby and sponsors and tax payers will want their money's worth from it. I'm not sure how much RTE and other stations pay the IRFU for the privilege of showing the game live but it will be a lot more than the GAA will receive from TG4 for showing the Kerry v Dublin game. TG4 will also provide coverage in a language that, sadly enough, most people in Ireland do not understand. So, it is all about money and money will dictate that the 6 nations games won't be moved. I'm not sure if the GAA is allowed to change the contract with TG4 and move the games forward. I somehow doubt it will be that easy to move a televised game to a different time slot. I don't know the official figures for last Sunday but given the coverage and the press coverage I think even the Scotland v Wales game was watched by a lot more people than Stacks v Slaughtneil, which is a very sad thing in my opinion. I'm still not a big fan of the whole Sky deal, but it would have been good if Setanta or Sky would be showing the other division 1 games that are not on TG4 live. Instead Setanta show certain Saturday games, but a lot of games won't be televised at all. It is easier to be an American Football than a GAA fan in Ireland if you have sky and rely on television coverage of games alone. Even the introduction of the season ticket has not increased attendance of league games much and television coverage also hasn't improved much. So what ? Are we that insecure that we need international endorsement of the value of our own sports ? Our games are wonderful and unique; I couldn't give a monkey's what anybody else thinks of them. I won't care either. But... it would be a clear reason why the rugby won't be moved to a different time. Globally football isn't held in high regards though despite it being the number one sport in Ireland. Even though people everywhere are obsessed about Ireland there are few that fall in love with Ireland's native games. If the rugby would have clashed with some soccer tournament they probably would have changed starting times.
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Post by Mickmack on Feb 19, 2015 23:31:30 GMT
Matt Williams in last Saturdays Irish Times and Tony Ward on Monday had pieces about the sad state of affairs that rugby now finds itself in as regards defensive systems being the only thing.
I cant see too many GAA people wanting to watch Ireland v England when Kerry V Dublin is an alternative even if its a league game?
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Post by Ballyfireside on Feb 20, 2015 3:37:49 GMT
Teams can't be quantified and so compared scientifically, well apart from on the scoreboard if they meet, but that doesn't mean we can't enjoy a bit of speculation, even if we laugh at what we say when we take another look. Ulster teams of old weren't as good and then they leap-frogged us on physicality, and we were so slow to adapt, only this year did we do so and we won at out first attempt. I think we need to blood our minors on the same style. Although a far better bunch, Donegal clipped our heels in the final.
Overall footballers are getting better as things evolve and they also have the benefit of the experience handed down. Part of me thinks that the '70s/80's panel were unbeatable, and I do think they would be better again in the modern game. Still I couldn't split Bomber and Donaghy or Gooch/JOD and Sheehy/Egan. Maybe I should have paired Galvin with Power, and if so, have we a Spillane today? Marc vs Paidi, Tomás vs Deenihan. With more positional play, corner backs didn't venture forward as much but Jimmy was probably one of the all time tightest markers, him and Paidi of course!
The '14 team in the final would match any previous team and it would be all on the day; we sacrificed the best scorer in the country and still won under a style we had only just adapted to; there will be a number of big performances on a winning team and we had an abundance of those vs Donegal, as many as I recall of any 70's/80's hay day; part of me thinks that maybe we had more and the 20 man game also gives greater flexibility for starters having an off day. Having said that our substitutions are normally due to injury or out of fuel, with a super/impact sub coming in. No team finishes as it started and which is all the better.
I actually half jokingly put the question to Jack O'Shea at the team celebration in '98, all after a few pints, he didn't take me on and ah yes, I suppose on the night that was in it your heart would be with the fellas that had just won, well mine would anyway but maybe not Jacks!
By the way, was the French fella head butting Sexton?, definitely the second time and if so then the first one would be too much of a coincidence, moreover as he was to be singled out; why all the silence, not a word in the media although it was a major topic of discussion otherwise. I think a life ban would be the minimum, as bad as the spearing of BOD.
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fitz
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Post by fitz on Feb 20, 2015 10:40:59 GMT
Teams can't be quantified and so compared scientifically, well apart from on the scoreboard if they meet, but that doesn't mean we can't enjoy a bit of speculation, even if we laugh at what we say when we take another look. Ulster teams of old weren't as good and then they leap-frogged us on physicality, and we were so slow to adapt, only this year did we do so and we won at out first attempt. I think we need to blood our minors on the same style. Although a far better bunch, Donegal clipped our heels in the final. Overall footballers are getting better as things evolve and they also have the benefit of the experience handed down. Part of me thinks that the '70s/80's panel were unbeatable, and I do think they would be better again in the modern game. Still I couldn't split Bomber and Donaghy or Gooch/JOD and Sheehy/Egan. Maybe I should have paired Galvin with Power, and if so, have we a Spillane today? Marc vs Paidi, Tomás vs Deenihan. With more positional play, corner backs didn't venture forward as much but Jimmy was probably one of the all time tightest markers, him and Paidi of course! The '14 team in the final would match any previous team and it would be all on the day; we sacrificed the best scorer in the country and still won under a style we had only just adapted to; there will be a number of big performances on a winning team and we had an abundance of those vs Donegal, as many as I recall of any 70's/80's hay day; part of me thinks that maybe we had more and the 20 man game also gives greater flexibility for starters having an off day. Having said that our substitutions are normally due to injury or out of fuel, with a super/impact sub coming in. No team finishes as it started and which is all the better. I actually half jokingly put the question to Jack O'Shea at the team celebration in '98, all after a few pints, he didn't take me on and ah yes, I suppose on the night that was in it your heart would be with the fellas that had just won, well mine would anyway but maybe not Jacks! By the way, was the French fella head butting Sexton?, definitely the second time and if so then the first one would be too much of a coincidence, moreover as he was to be singled out; why all the silence, not a word in the media although it was a major topic of discussion otherwise. I think a life ban would be the minimum, as bad as the spearing of BOD. 97? Unless you were in a round with Donnellan and Joyce ;-)
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Feb 20, 2015 11:21:39 GMT
I think it is a bit of a myth that Kerry were very defensive in the AI Final.
The difference between Dublin and us was that our backs held their position.
Again I am happy for the media to think we are this ultra-defensive side.
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keane
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Post by keane on Feb 20, 2015 11:48:41 GMT
I think it is a bit of a myth that Kerry were very defensive in the AI Final. The difference between Dublin and us was that our backs held their position. Again I am happy for the media to think we are this ultra-defensive side. Yeah the whole "two sweepers" analysis of the final was laughably inept. Highlighting that two of our half backs were playing in the half back line as though it was a scandalous departure from Kerry traditions!
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Post by tyroneperson on Feb 20, 2015 13:26:35 GMT
Teams can't be quantified and so compared scientifically, well apart from on the scoreboard if they meet, but that doesn't mean we can't enjoy a bit of speculation, even if we laugh at what we say when we take another look. Ulster teams of old weren't as good and then they leap-frogged us on physicality, and we were so slow to adapt, only this year did we do so and we won at out first attempt. I think we need to blood our minors on the same style. Although a far better bunch, Donegal clipped our heels in the final. Wouldn't have considered Tyrone's noughties team to have been any more physical than that Kerry team particularly after 2003. Tyrone weren't a big team really. Weighed less and shorter in stature on average than Armagh's anyway and that Kerry side had a very strong spine. Won at your first attempt is a pretty black and white way of looking at it in my opinion. What does that even mean? Kerry won plenty of matches against Northern teams in the last 15 years e.g. Monaghan and an excellent Armagh team in 2006 and I don't think the Tyrone team were a carbon copy of the Donegal of 2014 anyway. Tyrone's offence was a lot better than Donegal's which was downright poor in the final last year and Tyrone rarely got as many men behind the ball. Dara O'Cinneide for example thought Tyrone were more positive than Kerry in the 2005 final and I'd consider Donegal's performance in the 2014 final as anything but positive. Anyway I'm rambling and I can appreciate why it was a satisfying victory because of this perception that Kerry struggle against Northern teams team - I think Marc O'Se said that himself so I don't think I'm being arrogant when I say that - and obviously it's satisfying anyway but y'know what I mean.
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