mossie
Fanatical Member
Posts: 2,654
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Post by mossie on Jul 18, 2024 18:16:20 GMT
I was at the monaghan game and I couldn,t believe he was bringing David on after 25 mins!For me it smelled of fear from Jack.In my opinion he was saying ...David (and Paudie) go in there and rescue the situation,I can't trust these other 13 players.By doing this he reinforces the idea that kerry are nothing without the Clifford boys,heaps more pressure on the 2 boys while at the same time undermining the other entire panel.He doesn,t trust his players,he doesn,t cultivate trust and I now wonder if the players don,t trust the management team.Let the team dig out results or not without the Clifford boys and he and they may learn valuable lessons.As an example Graham O Sullivan was 3rd choice corner back behind Paul,Dan O Donoghue, and another but through injury he got his start and in my opinion has been Kerry,s most consistent player for the past 3 years.Ahead of the Cliffords in my opinion. we have no business playing David until round 4 of the league in my view and a few others who may find themselves on the longer end of runs in the club and county championships\all ireland club etc. If we cannot manage without David for a few league matches well then come the championship if David is not in A1 form we are on the back foot and wont win Sam
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Post by Ard Mhacha on Jul 18, 2024 18:25:05 GMT
I watched it again yesterday. That was a game that could have went either way, even up until the final few seconds.
Some of the talk after our penalty losses to Donegal and Monaghan last year was McGeeney is too negative, he’s holding the team back, he has to go etc etc. When in reality there was a kick of a ball between winning and losing. Had we won the penalties, he would’ve been a genius. Luckily this time, we came out on the right side of a tight game (so I suppose that makes him a genius).
Tomas O’Se was correct on TSG. Had Kerry buried those two goal chances, they’d have been 9 points up. That would have been the game as good as over. When Kerry did get their goal (to go 5 up), I never thought we were out of it at that stage. We needed a goal, and the only way we would get one was the high ball in. Cause a bit of chaos. And it worked. I don’t know why we didn’t try it more.
The goal lifted our support, and gave the team belief that we could do this. We should have closed it out in normal time. Some sloppy play gave Kerry the chance to draw level. We got the scores the extra time and Kerry didn’t. And yet you could have won it late on. Rian soaring to catch the ball on the line to prevent a winning goal.
To be honest, there were so many things that happened within those 90 odd minutes, it’s impossible to mention everything. I’m just so relieved to get over the line. We battled hard, and the lads gave it everything, but it was far from a perfect performance. We definitely rode our luck, Kerry missed chances, and we just came good in the last quarter (and ET) when it really mattered.
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Jul 18, 2024 20:05:25 GMT
I watched it again yesterday. That was a game that could have went either way, even up until the final few seconds. Some of the talk after our penalty losses to Donegal and Monaghan last year was McGeeney is too negative, he’s holding the team back, he has to go etc etc. When in reality there was a kick of a ball between winning and losing. Had we won the penalties, he would’ve been a genius. Luckily this time, we came out on the right side of a tight game (so I suppose that makes him a genius). Tomas O’Se was correct on TSG. Had Kerry buried those two goal chances, they’d have been 9 points up. That would have been the game as good as over. When Kerry did get their goal (to go 5 up), I never thought we were out of it at that stage. We needed a goal, and the only way we would get one was the high ball in. Cause a bit of chaos. And it worked. I don’t know why we didn’t try it more. The goal lifted our support, and gave the team belief that we could do this. We should have closed it out in normal time. Some sloppy play gave Kerry the chance to draw level. We got the scores the extra time and Kerry didn’t. And yet you could have won it late on. Rian soaring to catch the ball on the line to prevent a winning goal. To be honest, there were so many things that happened within those 90 odd minutes, it’s impossible to mention everything. I’m just so relieved to get over the line. We battled hard, and the lads gave it everything, but it was far from a perfect performance. We definitely rode our luck, Kerry missed chances, and we just came good in the last quarter (and ET) when it really mattered. There's a huge difference between negativity and fear, and winning a tight game. Armagh weren't negative negative nor afraid in ET - they were on previous occasions imo.
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Post by Ballydonoghoor on Jul 18, 2024 21:50:42 GMT
I watched it again yesterday. That was a game that could have went either way, even up until the final few seconds. Some of the talk after our penalty losses to Donegal and Monaghan last year was McGeeney is too negative, he’s holding the team back, he has to go etc etc. When in reality there was a kick of a ball between winning and losing. Had we won the penalties, he would’ve been a genius. Luckily this time, we came out on the right side of a tight game (so I suppose that makes him a genius). Tomas O’Se was correct on TSG. Had Kerry buried those two goal chances, they’d have been 9 points up. That would have been the game as good as over. When Kerry did get their goal (to go 5 up), I never thought we were out of it at that stage. We needed a goal, and the only way we would get one was the high ball in. Cause a bit of chaos. And it worked. I don’t know why we didn’t try it more. The goal lifted our support, and gave the team belief that we could do this. We should have closed it out in normal time. Some sloppy play gave Kerry the chance to draw level. We got the scores the extra time and Kerry didn’t. And yet you could have won it late on. Rian soaring to catch the ball on the line to prevent a winning goal. To be honest, there were so many things that happened within those 90 odd minutes, it’s impossible to mention everything. I’m just so relieved to get over the line. We battled hard, and the lads gave it everything, but it was far from a perfect performance. We definitely rode our luck, Kerry missed chances, and we just came good in the last quarter (and ET) when it really mattered. Well done and it was a proper game of football, albeit with a few trimmings! Nobody likes losing and we are no different, but I never heard an Armagh man moan when it wasn't your day and we wish you all the best in the final. Though stylish, I wasn't sure of your substance when you played us in Tralee and which wasn't helped by the variable energy we were showing. What did worry me though was that your scores were better than ours and did Rian score a replica of point that night last Sat? It will be great if ye stay at the top table as the game needs those type of quality games, real, actual football. I think ye will improve and we could be in for a golden era now where anyone one of maybe 10+ teams could claim Sam and so there will be lots of good games that will win back support. Every good wish to you and Armagh and it is nice that you came on here for an auld chat.
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Post by royalkerryfan on Jul 18, 2024 21:56:47 GMT
Re Cillian Burke,
According to the Kerry football pod today the word is that Cillian is going to Australia for a month to see the set up in Geelong.
No contracts are signed and its a visit to see what it's like out there.
You can only imagine he will be wined and dined and given a first class trip.
But who knows maybe knowing he is the future of this Kerry team might be enough.
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Post by dc84 on Jul 19, 2024 7:48:24 GMT
I hope we are doing everything we can to keep this man in Kerry from what I've seen of him he could be absolutely brilliant for us and exactly what we need
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Post by dc84 on Jul 19, 2024 8:18:17 GMT
I watched it again yesterday. That was a game that could have went either way, even up until the final few seconds. Some of the talk after our penalty losses to Donegal and Monaghan last year was McGeeney is too negative, he’s holding the team back, he has to go etc etc. When in reality there was a kick of a ball between winning and losing. Had we won the penalties, he would’ve been a genius. Luckily this time, we came out on the right side of a tight game (so I suppose that makes him a genius). Tomas O’Se was correct on TSG. Had Kerry buried those two goal chances, they’d have been 9 points up. That would have been the game as good as over. When Kerry did get their goal (to go 5 up), I never thought we were out of it at that stage. We needed a goal, and the only way we would get one was the high ball in. Cause a bit of chaos. And it worked. I don’t know why we didn’t try it more. The goal lifted our support, and gave the team belief that we could do this. We should have closed it out in normal time. Some sloppy play gave Kerry the chance to draw level. We got the scores the extra time and Kerry didn’t. And yet you could have won it late on. Rian soaring to catch the ball on the line to prevent a winning goal. To be honest, there were so many things that happened within those 90 odd minutes, it’s impossible to mention everything. I’m just so relieved to get over the line. We battled hard, and the lads gave it everything, but it was far from a perfect performance. We definitely rode our luck, Kerry missed chances, and we just came good in the last quarter (and ET) when it really mattered. Congrats Ard Mhaca well deserved I've had great respect for the way ye play since I was at the 2000 semis and every game vs Ye since has been a good game if football with not much in it. As you say the margins are fine best of luck in the final
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Post by jerryewe on Jul 19, 2024 15:45:32 GMT
I’m coming to this late but I don’t agree with anyone saying that Tom Sullivans goal chances were crucial. Kerry got a goal afterwards and that put them 5 points up. If Tom sullivan had scored the first chance, who is to say that Kerry would not have coughed up that lead. I can’t remember the score at the time of chances.
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Post by Dermot on Jul 19, 2024 15:54:03 GMT
Haven’t visited here for a while folks but thought I’d post the following after reading some comments
I honestly think sometimes people over analyse a loss .. especially the most winninest teams like Kerry.
There was a the kick of a ball between Kerry being in the final and pages full of praise & hope instead of lament, recriminations & a multitude of ideas on how to “fix” the problem
Sometimes it’s just someone else’s day
Personally I’m all up for seeing a new(ish) team win the AI …. That goes for the Hurling as well.
Next year will be here in a flash …. And as per usual Kerry will be a favourite to win it ….. and it takes the losses to make the wins all the sweeter
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Post by jerryewe on Jul 19, 2024 15:59:10 GMT
Haven’t visited here for a while folks but thought I’d post the following after reading some comments I honestly think sometimes people over analyse a loss .. especially the most winninest teams like Kerry. There was a the kick of a ball between Kerry being in the final and pages full of praise & hope instead of lament, recriminations & a multitude of ideas on how to “fix” the problem Sometimes it’s just someone else’s day Personally I’m all up for seeing a new(ish) team win the AI …. That goes for the Hurling as well. Next year will be here in a flash …. And as per usual Kerry will be a favourite to win it ….. and it takes the losses to make the wins all the sweeter I’d agree with all this. It’s much better for the GAA as a whole that there is a unique final after the years of dublins dominance. There is a lot of counties looking at this thinking they could beat Armagh & Galway whereas I don’t think you have that with Dublin and to a much lesser extent admittedly with Kerry.
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Post by colinsworth1 on Jul 21, 2024 21:33:54 GMT
Seems like a long time ago now but the loss will linger for awhile yet I’m late to chime in and I know everything has been analyzed by now
Just a few points We played so conservatively against Derry that it was not possible to turn it around so fast to an expansive game plan in that time frame
David Clifford many say hasn’t been himself but I’m thinking that he can’t be happy in the role they are asking him to play now A role that keeps him too far from goal Got to be a better way Two games in a row now Burke comes in and changes the attack probably brought in too late yes but really highlights the fact that the running and attacking direct opened up gaps where has that gone ?
Defensively. I thought we did not plan for their impact subs Soupy Cambell is best impact sub in the country I was livid with the room they gave him even after he got his first point he seemed like he had the freedom of the park
The PG experiment didn’t beat fruit The non use of weaker foot by Tom the dropped short shots has me wondering how much work is going into shooting and the technical side of that The working of a score late in the game wasn’t apparent
No complaints overall really better team won on the day Just not sure where we go from here . But remember Armagh have been where we are now as have Clare hurling we learn we stay positive we make the good calls and we come back better MKGA !!!!
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Joxer
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Posts: 1,373
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Post by Joxer on Jul 22, 2024 10:11:42 GMT
I thought on the day and having watched it again now, I haven’t changed my mind about where we failed on the day. All credit to Armagh for taking full Advantage and I hope they go on to deliver Armaghs second well-earned title.
Fear and fitness are two areas we cannot ignore in our own performance. Fear is not part of our football psyche but all year we have watched our players turn down opportunities in favour of passing the ball…in all honesty, the pass is usually to a less-well placed player. Why have they done that all year? Fear of being the one to cough up possession is my opinion but it needs to be eliminated again as quickly from our game as it has come into it. The fitness issue was just as obvious the last day as it was against Tyrone in 2021. This too cannot be ignored.
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Jul 22, 2024 12:10:47 GMT
People are kind of calling for Peter Keane.
Maybe Tally in with Peter Keane would have been the magic formula.
I don't know. I haven't a clue.
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kot
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Post by kot on Jul 22, 2024 12:28:07 GMT
I gave myself a weeks cooling off period due to the dismay and rawness of defeat. Taking the fact that you learn more from losses and only a inches in it etc, I still haven't been moved from my thoughts for next year and moving forward. Fact of the matter is seem to be sqaundering the minor team but as is rightly pointed out, U20/21 is a better barometer so we are drastically failing in the conversion of the younger grade into the stepping stone for senior.
In terms of the senior team, our football all this year and for large swathes of last year has been too conservative and the antithesis of what these lads grew up playing. Ive watched the game back and still can't get my head around how our backs are getting into premium shooting positions more than our forwards. Our attacking skill execution is poor, there is little cohesion and the most galling of all is how many times we had Armagh (and Derry in the game before if you watch back) scrambling when we got the ball only to turn back towards our own goal and let them set.
This is a strategic & tactical failing of the management system and although its less pronounced than the Mickey Harte experiment in Derry, we have been on a downward trajectory. So it is, in my opinion at least, the right time to thank the current management for the joy brought from our first All Ireland in 8 years back in 2022 but to bring in a new set up. Well, new but old as my preference would be a Fitzmaurice & Tomás ticket with Tomás remaining in driving seat for the U20s.
Last point, I listened to Parkinson's podcast during the week and it really irks me and annoys me when the old Brolly trope of Kerry blinking comes up. They are in so many of these contests all the time that its impossible not to find examples of where we came up short. Him (and Brolly & Cavanagh) forgot to mention how Kerry didn't wilt in
'00 semi & final, '07 Quarter & Semi, '08 Semi, '09 final, '14 Semi & Final, '19 Semi Final, '22 Semi & Final, '23 Semi final....
They also beat Tyrone 4 times to go with the 4 defeats they have in the modern era. Same with Armagh, 2 wins & losses. Mayo have done us only the once in knockout football since 1996, Galway & Derry have yet to achieve it.
The only ones we don't have a parity or winning record against is Dublin who have one more win than us but play all their games at home so its not bad really? Its lazy journalism and pure playing to the gallery, nonsense BS.
No mention on how some of these other teams who have caused us to wilt themselves crumbled against the Sligo's, Fermanagh's, Roscommon's of this world in the same time frame? And Cork! Who never ever managed to make us fold in the big day in Croker.
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Post by gaaforlife on Jul 22, 2024 23:25:41 GMT
I gave myself a weeks cooling off period due to the dismay and rawness of defeat. Taking the fact that you learn more from losses and only a inches in it etc, I still haven't been moved from my thoughts for next year and moving forward. Fact of the matter is seem to be sqaundering the minor team but as is rightly pointed out, U20/21 is a better barometer so we are drastically failing in the conversion of the younger grade into the stepping stone for senior. In terms of the senior team, our football all this year and for large swathes of last year has been too conservative and the antithesis of what these lads grew up playing. Ive watched the game back and still can't get my head around how our backs are getting into premium shooting positions more than our forwards. Our attacking skill execution is poor, there is little cohesion and the most galling of all is how many times we had Armagh (and Derry in the game before if you watch back) scrambling when we got the ball only to turn back towards our own goal and let them set. This is a strategic & tactical failing of the management system and although its less pronounced than the Mickey Harte experiment in Derry, we have been on a downward trajectory. So it is, in my opinion at least, the right time to thank the current management for the joy brought from our first All Ireland in 8 years back in 2022 but to bring in a new set up. Well, new but old as my preference would be a Fitzmaurice & Tomás ticket with Tomás remaining in driving seat for the U20s. Last point, I listened to Parkinson's podcast during the week and it really irks me and annoys me when the old Brolly trope of Kerry blinking comes up. They are in so many of these contests all the time that its impossible not to find examples of where we came up short. Him (and Brolly & Canavan) forgot to mention how Kerry didn't wilt in '00 semi & final, '07 Quarter & Semi, '08 Semi, '09 final, '14 Semi & Final, '19 Semi Final, '22 Semi & Final, '23 Semi final.... They also beat Tyrone 4 times to go with the 4 defeats they have in the modern era. Same with Armagh, 2 wins & losses. Mayo have done us only the once in knockout football since 1996, Galway & Derry have yet to achieve it. The only ones we don't have a parity or winning record against is Dublin who have one more win than us but play all their games at home so its not bad really? Its lazy journalism and pure playing to the gallery, nonsense BS. No mention on how some of these other teams who have caused us to wilt themselves crumbled against the Sligo's, Fermanagh's, Roscommon's of this world in the same time frame? And Cork! Who never ever managed to make us fold in the big day in Croker. Agree however it's Sean cavanaghvat it more than Peter caravan
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Post by dc84 on Jul 23, 2024 7:01:34 GMT
People are kind of calling for Peter Keane. Maybe Tally in with Peter Keane would have been the magic formula. I don't know. I haven't a clue. I doubt that tbh jack won the league and all ireland in his first go I'm not so sure that pk would've ,he had a strong start aswell making the final in 19 but things regressed after (maybe like jack). To be fair he had covid to deal with aswell which wasn't easy
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horsebox77
Fanatical Member
Our trees & mountains are silent ghosts, they hold wisdom and knowledge mankind has long forgotten.
Posts: 2,234
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Post by horsebox77 on Jul 23, 2024 7:22:27 GMT
I think Peter Keane was unlucky, we lost David to cramp in 2021, were a kick of a ball in 2019 and 2020 was just a disaster covid wise and the sicker punch in the park, however, I think the county boards appointment of Jack may have left a sour taste in the mouth of Keane, I suspect a few bridges have been burned in that regard...
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Post by tralee58 on Jul 23, 2024 7:50:36 GMT
The Irish Mirror article by Colm Boyle ‘ For life of me I can't understand why David Clifford is burning energy going backwards’ says the Kerry identity is lost. He said ‘ But, for as much as Armagh like to try and be structured and controlled, they are still at their absolute best when they play with instinct, courage and emotion’ Before the match I watched Ireland Rugby beat South Africa away in an incredible match by using instinct courage emotion maximally.
Tactics strategy structure control plays a part for sure but in my humble opinion the likes of Clifford brothers and Seanie thrive on the aforementioned. They seemed stifled. Taking nothing away from a great Armagh performance but you can’t help thinking Kerry be looking forward to a final if they had utilised the above. Can’t help thinking Kieran Donaghy instilled some of that. Anyway months to reflect now. A positive is Kerry ladies be good to hear a few comments from ladies on here. Ciarrai Abu
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Jul 23, 2024 8:59:37 GMT
I think Peter Keane was unlucky, we lost David to cramp in 2021, were a kick of a ball in 2019 and 2020 was just a disaster covid wise and the sicker punch in the park, however, I think the county boards appointment of Jack may have left a sour taste in the mouth of Keane, I suspect a few bridges have been burned in that regard... Sorry I didn't mean literally PK, but someone who likes to play attacking football. I recall him being a little fearful at least once mind.
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horsebox77
Fanatical Member
Our trees & mountains are silent ghosts, they hold wisdom and knowledge mankind has long forgotten.
Posts: 2,234
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Post by horsebox77 on Jul 23, 2024 10:06:06 GMT
I think Peter Keane was unlucky, we lost David to cramp in 2021, were a kick of a ball in 2019 and 2020 was just a disaster covid wise and the sicker punch in the park, however, I think the county boards appointment of Jack may have left a sour taste in the mouth of Keane, I suspect a few bridges have been burned in that regard... Sorry I didn't mean literally PK, but someone who likes to play attacking football. I recall him being a little fearful at least once mind. AH I have you, thing is, there isn't exactly a class load of experienced coaches hammering at the door, any probably mentor would hold a degree of risk or inexperience, there prop is the alternative consortium from the previous vacancy but in truth, this talk of options is half pointless unless a vacancy actually emerges or exists...
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Post by glengael on Jul 23, 2024 11:38:08 GMT
Those calling for the return of Eamon Fitzmaurice might want to ponder on how we went backwards from 2015 Final to the nadir of 2018 (excluding the anomaly that was the 2017 League Final).
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Post by tralee58 on Jul 23, 2024 12:21:53 GMT
I gave myself a weeks cooling off period due to the dismay and rawness of defeat. Taking the fact that you learn more from losses and only an inches in it etc, I still haven't been moved from my thoughts for next year and moving forward. Fact of the matter is seem to be sqaundering the minor team but as is rightly pointed out, U20/21 is a better barometer so we are drastically failing in the conversion of the younger grade into the stepping stone for senior. In terms of the senior team, our football all this year and for large swathes of last year has been too conservative and the antithesis of what these lads grew up playing. Ive watched the game back and still can't get my head around how our backs are getting into premium shooting positions more than our forwards. Our attacking skill execution is poor, there is little cohesion and the most galling of all is how many times we had Armagh (and Derry in the game before if you watch back) scrambling when we got the ball only to turn back towards our own goal and let them set. This is a strategic & tactical failing of the management system and although its less pronounced than the Mickey Harte experiment in Derry, we have been on a downward trajectory. So it is, in my opinion at least, the right time to thank the current management for the joy brought from our first All Ireland in 8 years back in 2022 but to bring in a new set up. Well, new but old as my preference would be a Fitzmaurice & Tomás ticket with Tomás remaining in driving seat for the U20s. Last point, I listened to Parkinson's podcast during the week and it really irks me and annoys me when the old Brolly trope of Kerry blinking comes up. They are in so many of these contests all the time that its impossible not to find examples of where we came up short. Him (and Brolly & Canavan) forgot to mention how Kerry didn't wilt in '00 semi & final, '07 Quarter & Semi, '08 Semi, '09 final, '14 Semi & Final, '19 Semi Final, '22 Semi & Final, '23 Semi final.... They also beat Tyrone 4 times to go with the 4 defeats they have in the modern era. Same with Armagh, 2 wins & losses. Mayo have done us only the once in knockout football since 1996, Galway & Derry have yet to achieve it. The only ones we don't have a parity or winning record against is Dublin who have one more win than us but play all their games at home so its not bad really? Its lazy journalism and pure playing to the gallery, nonsense BS. No mention on how some of these other teams who have caused us to wilt themselves crumbled against the Sligo's, Fermanagh's, Roscommon's of this world in the same time frame? And Cork! Who never ever managed to make us fold in the big day in Croker. Excellent write up agree 👍
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kot
Fanatical Member
Posts: 1,168
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Post by kot on Jul 23, 2024 14:10:53 GMT
I gave myself a weeks cooling off period due to the dismay and rawness of defeat. Taking the fact that you learn more from losses and only a inches in it etc, I still haven't been moved from my thoughts for next year and moving forward. Fact of the matter is seem to be sqaundering the minor team but as is rightly pointed out, U20/21 is a better barometer so we are drastically failing in the conversion of the younger grade into the stepping stone for senior. In terms of the senior team, our football all this year and for large swathes of last year has been too conservative and the antithesis of what these lads grew up playing. Ive watched the game back and still can't get my head around how our backs are getting into premium shooting positions more than our forwards. Our attacking skill execution is poor, there is little cohesion and the most galling of all is how many times we had Armagh (and Derry in the game before if you watch back) scrambling when we got the ball only to turn back towards our own goal and let them set. This is a strategic & tactical failing of the management system and although its less pronounced than the Mickey Harte experiment in Derry, we have been on a downward trajectory. So it is, in my opinion at least, the right time to thank the current management for the joy brought from our first All Ireland in 8 years back in 2022 but to bring in a new set up. Well, new but old as my preference would be a Fitzmaurice & Tomás ticket with Tomás remaining in driving seat for the U20s. Last point, I listened to Parkinson's podcast during the week and it really irks me and annoys me when the old Brolly trope of Kerry blinking comes up. They are in so many of these contests all the time that its impossible not to find examples of where we came up short. Him (and Brolly & Canavan) forgot to mention how Kerry didn't wilt in '00 semi & final, '07 Quarter & Semi, '08 Semi, '09 final, '14 Semi & Final, '19 Semi Final, '22 Semi & Final, '23 Semi final.... They also beat Tyrone 4 times to go with the 4 defeats they have in the modern era. Same with Armagh, 2 wins & losses. Mayo have done us only the once in knockout football since 1996, Galway & Derry have yet to achieve it. The only ones we don't have a parity or winning record against is Dublin who have one more win than us but play all their games at home so its not bad really? Its lazy journalism and pure playing to the gallery, nonsense BS. No mention on how some of these other teams who have caused us to wilt themselves crumbled against the Sligo's, Fermanagh's, Roscommon's of this world in the same time frame? And Cork! Who never ever managed to make us fold in the big day in Croker. Agree however it's Sean cavanaghvat it more than Peter caravan Sorry, my mistake. Indeed I meant Sean Cavanagh!
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kot
Fanatical Member
Posts: 1,168
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Post by kot on Jul 23, 2024 14:17:41 GMT
Those calling for the return of Eamon Fitzmaurice might want to ponder on how we went backwards from 2015 Final to the nadir of 2018 (excluding the anomaly that was the 2017 League Final). It is also worth noting that he did win an All-Ireland in 2014 when I cannot ever remember expectations being lower. 2016 we were beaten in highly controversial circumstances by Dublin. That was Dublin at their absolute beginning of their peak and we had a mix of new kids on the block with aging stars and he had them beat with a novel tactical plan at the time but for said calls. 2017, our performance in Mayo replay was bad but the same ref made some absurd calls in that game too. 2018 was a disaster alright but at that point our old reliables were very much passed their best, JOD's injuries were getting the better of him and it was a little too early for the core of our team now. He has been the one man who has been able to innovate and probably was cursed by overachieving in the first couple of years. I do often wonder how he would have fared if he came in for the his first stint in 2022 rather than 2012 but we'll never know.
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Post by orangerhyme on Jul 23, 2024 14:21:39 GMT
Those calling for the return of Eamon Fitzmaurice might want to ponder on how we went backwards from 2015 Final to the nadir of 2018 (excluding the anomaly that was the 2017 League Final). It is also worth noting that he did win an All-Ireland in 2014 when I cannot ever remember expectations being lower. 2016 we were beaten in highly controversial circumstances by Dublin. That was Dublin at their absolute beginning of their peak and we had a mix of new kids on the block with aging stars and he had them beat with a novel tactical plan at the time but for said calls. 2017, our performance in Mayo replay was bad but the same ref made some absurd calls in that game too. He has been the one man who has been able to innovate and probably was cursed by overachieving in the first couple of years. I do often wonder how he would have fared if he came in for the his first stint in 2022 rather than 2012 but we'll never know. He didn't gave a great panel of players really but I think he got the best out of them. We probably only had a maximum 10 good players back then when in reality you need 17/18. Gooch wasn't the same after his injury, JOD was always injured. Donaghy was on his last legs. It's good he's still young and available to call on when needed.
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Post by shannonsider on Jul 23, 2024 21:59:57 GMT
Those calling for the return of Eamon Fitzmaurice might want to ponder on how we went backwards from 2015 Final to the nadir of 2018 (excluding the anomaly that was the 2017 League Final). It is also worth noting that he did win an All-Ireland in 2014 when I cannot ever remember expectations being lower. 2016 we were beaten in highly controversial circumstances by Dublin. That was Dublin at their absolute beginning of their peak and we had a mix of new kids on the block with aging stars and he had them beat with a novel tactical plan at the time but for said calls. 2017, our performance in Mayo replay was bad but the same ref made some absurd calls in that game too. 2018 was a disaster alright but at that point our old reliables were very much passed their best, JOD's injuries were getting the better of him and it was a little too early for the core of our team now. He has been the one man who has been able to innovate and probably was cursed by overachieving in the first couple of years. I do often wonder how he would have fared if he came in for the his first stint in 2022 rather than 2012 but we'll never know. It’s also worth noting he had perhaps the worst day on the line by a Kerry manager in my life time in the 2015 final, which has NEVER got the scrutiny or comment it deserved to my mind. 1.The team selection, leaving out Darren O’Sullivan and Donaghy was poor. 2.He then compounded that by making appalling changes: James O’Donoghue and Geaney were both doing ok and got 0-3 from play each in a monsoon and left on Gooch who had been no threat and was tracking back into defence after Philly McMahon constantly. 3.When this was pointed out to him by selectors he refused to listen to them and actually blanked them. 4.The worst of all and one of the most shameful things a Kerry manager has done. Brought on his 36 year old brother in law whose legs were gone completely in the last quarter. Paul Galvin was a brilliant player in his day but everyone could see after 2013 his legs weren’t where they used to be. He played very little football at all in 2014 or 2015 and it was shocking to see him brought back in with Kerry. Fitzmaurice never got slated enough on it.
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Post by kerryexile5 on Jul 23, 2024 22:44:07 GMT
Was chatting to a few Clare hurling fans before the hurling final in Dublin on Sunday and they just couldn’t believe how much Kerry have gone away from playing the Kerry way.
They loved the Gooch, Donaghy, Tomas O’se etc.
What is the identity of this current Kerry team?
Kieran Donaghy I think would motivate that dressing room in 2025.
I saw him below in Castleisland at the basketball over Xmas and he is just a leader in everyway.
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Post by thehermit on Jul 24, 2024 11:04:21 GMT
What I don't know about Gaelic Football could fill the British Library, therefore I'd never have any issue with anyone whose deemed sufficiently qualified to get the senior inter-county job.
But Keane had his chances. He fully deserved to get the opportunity and he was, in ways unlucky too - yet we blew a lead in the dying moments of an All Ireland final because we were afraid to lose. Covid or not, 2020 was unforgivable -played with fear and went out to contain a vastly inferior opposition. He got a third chance in 2021 and the gameplan v Tyrone was crazy, even from the top of the Cusack I could see it wasn't working after 15mins and yet we persisted with it to the end. So look I wouldn't be advocating turning back to him going forward.
Eamonn was another who fully deserved the chance and did brilliantly in his first two years. He was also unlucky too in how referee's in Dublin's pocket and the home town crowds robbed us in the likes of 2016. However, as Shannonsider said above, the 2015 final was a disaster. Not starting Donaghy, our captain, when the soaking conditions were perfect for the chaos he brought into any full back line; the substitutions that day; the fact I was sitting nearby and could see Murphy screaming at him to change things and he stubbornly sticking to a pre-conceived gameplan regardless of how the conditions or reality of the play had rendered it ineffective. The 2017 semi-final replay was another disaster, I remember a few of us looking at each other in bewilderment when the changes to the starting 15 were announced over the tannoy before throw-in. You could tell we were fecked before a ball was caught. The less said about 18 the better, bar the moment of exhilaration when a young Mr Clifford rescued a drawn in Clones. Yes Eamonn had a Kerry team that was one of the weakest talent wise in a long time, but it was still good enough in the likes of 18 to be getting to a quarter/semi-final. Now Eamonn is still young, he's a great coach and an excellent innovator and I'm sure he learnt a lot from how the last few years with Kerry went. So if he was interested again after Jack or was sounded out about coming on board, I'd have no major qualms provided he has developed the self-awareness to bring in strong personalities with him who he allowed challenge him.
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Post by homerj on Jul 24, 2024 12:09:09 GMT
which fans are you referring to Kerrymick because i dont see anybody praising Tyrone and Donegal lately - donegal were the supposed new kings of Gaelic football until they ran out of gas and didnt score for the last 20 mins of the all ireland semi final? Tyrone have very few admirers right now and Kerry hammered them just over 1 year ago.
the GAA has a problem, it isnt Kerrys problem. you have to adapt to modern trends and its not Kerrys fault that these trends exist.
kerry missed 19 scoring chances against Armagh, yet you keep telling us we are playing with fear and not attacking. i point blame at Jack and the management team that the wrong men were getting these chances, we didnt adapt smartly enough (same as in 2015 final under fitzmaurice when dublin started this trend), what you are saying is completely different as if Kerry put 15 inside our 21 yard line and go out to win games 5pts to 4.
its pure nonsense, your hatred of Jack O Connor totally clouds any judgement you have on our play.
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Post by gaaforlife on Jul 24, 2024 23:39:56 GMT
"KERRY NOT THE FORCE THEIR NAME CARRIES ANYMORE" Thats the heading of an article in The Examiner is a press conference with Kieran McKeever and Donaghy.McKeever reckons Kerry s name does nt mean much anymore and Galway the best team they have faced over last couple of years.Us "Animals" will always find fault when we lose as we are a county thats won so much we need our fix of winning. It is sad though the way some people outside the county now speak and think of Kerry and make no mistake it is because of our fear and negativity at the moment. Most football fans admired Kerry even in defeat but now we are becoming boring.In the quarter final v Derry some fans were saying its "boring boring Kerry".Imagine if Kilkenny became fearful in the hurling!I think its sad. Even from 14 to 21 while we did nt win Sam,neutrals really enjoyed our football.Now we are one of the teams fans dont want to watch.. Now I know there has to be a happy medium as no point in playing swashbuckling football and getting beaten but when fans find Tyrone and Donegal a more attrative watch than Kerry there is something wrong. Kerry won in 2014 and regularly in finals 2019 2015. As much same record now since 2022 won 2023 finals lost 24 semi final similar back then slightly more attacking maybe Jack needs take head even if Kerry concede a bit more attacking suits Kerry maybe with little defence assurance but attacking conscious game it may help players Kerry have up front
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