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Post by onlykerry on Sept 14, 2021 10:07:21 GMT
The intercounty football season is over and we (in Kerry) are licking our wounds and agonising over who will take charge for 2022.
What could have a huge bearing on the 2022 season is the deliberations planned for October with regard to the structure of the championship for 2022 with some fairly radical changes gaining support it would seem.
Most agree a change is needed and the debate over where the provincial championships sit is one of many decisions to be made. The current proposal B which RTE claim is getting support in the GPA would see the 6th, 7th and 8th place teams in division 1 of the league excluded from the Sam Maguire championship and also excluded from the Tailteann Cup championship it would seem.
If one ranks the counties by their finishing spot in the leagues giving 1 - 8 rankings to Div 1 teams and the Division 2 team ranked as 9 and so on the Sam Maguire championship would be contested by teams ranked 1 - 5, 9, 10, 11, 17 & 25
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Sept 14, 2021 11:56:10 GMT
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Post by hatchetman on Sept 14, 2021 18:59:44 GMT
It's complicated. It could do with a diagram to illustrate how it might work.
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Post by Lolly Valance on Sept 14, 2021 19:15:11 GMT
The intercounty football season is over and we (in Kerry) are licking our wounds and agonising over who will take charge for 2022. What could have a huge bearing on the 2022 season is the deliberations planned for October with regard to the structure of the championship for 2022 with some fairly radical changes gaining support it would seem. Most agree a change is needed and the debate over where the provincial championships sit is one of many decisions to be made. The current proposal B which RTE claim is getting support in the GPA would see the 6th, 7th and 8th place teams in division 1 of the league excluded from the Sam Maguire championship and also excluded from the Tailteann Cup championship it would seem. If one ranks the counties by their finishing spot in the leagues giving 1 - 8 rankings to Div 1 teams and the Division 2 team ranked as 9 and so on the Sam Maguire championship would be contested by teams ranked 1 - 5, 9, 10, 11, 17 & 25 I haven't paid any attention to it to be honest. Where do the 6,7,8 from division one go?
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Post by dc84 on Sept 14, 2021 19:59:49 GMT
The intercounty football season is over and we (in Kerry) are licking our wounds and agonising over who will take charge for 2022. What could have a huge bearing on the 2022 season is the deliberations planned for October with regard to the structure of the championship for 2022 with some fairly radical changes gaining support it would seem. Most agree a change is needed and the debate over where the provincial championships sit is one of many decisions to be made. The current proposal B which RTE claim is getting support in the GPA would see the 6th, 7th and 8th place teams in division 1 of the league excluded from the Sam Maguire championship and also excluded from the Tailteann Cup championship it would seem. If one ranks the counties by their finishing spot in the leagues giving 1 - 8 rankings to Div 1 teams and the Division 2 team ranked as 9 and so on the Sam Maguire championship would be contested by teams ranked 1 - 5, 9, 10, 11, 17 & 25 I haven't paid any attention to it to be honest. Where do the 6,7,8 from division one go? Tommy Murphy 2
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Post by southward on Sept 15, 2021 9:56:50 GMT
The intercounty football season is over and we (in Kerry) are licking our wounds and agonising over who will take charge for 2022. What could have a huge bearing on the 2022 season is the deliberations planned for October with regard to the structure of the championship for 2022 with some fairly radical changes gaining support it would seem. Most agree a change is needed and the debate over where the provincial championships sit is one of many decisions to be made. The current proposal B which RTE claim is getting support in the GPA would see the 6th, 7th and 8th place teams in division 1 of the league excluded from the Sam Maguire championship and also excluded from the Tailteann Cup championship it would seem. If one ranks the counties by their finishing spot in the leagues giving 1 - 8 rankings to Div 1 teams and the Division 2 team ranked as 9 and so on the Sam Maguire championship would be contested by teams ranked 1 - 5, 9, 10, 11, 17 & 25 Surely that's a joke?
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Post by onlykerry on Sept 15, 2021 10:16:39 GMT
If anybody with solid information on the various proposals can comment it would be great but from what I can find on searches this is what I read plan B (the one the GPA appear to support) is - this is all to be decided apparently in October but there is little public debate on it.
Qualification for the All-Ireland series would be based entirely on how teams performed in the league. The top four teams in Division 1 would qualify for the All-Ireland quarter-finals along with the top two finishers in Division 2.
The top team in Division 3 and 4 together with the fifth-placed team in Division 1 and the third-placed team in Division 2 advance to the preliminary quarter-finals.
The second-tier Tailteann Cup would include all the teams in Division 3 and 4 apart from the top-placed teams who qualify for the preliminary round of the Sam Maguire championship.
Both championships would run on a straight knockout format with league finals abolished
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Post by Mickmack on Sept 15, 2021 10:41:18 GMT
The intercounty football season is over and we (in Kerry) are licking our wounds and agonising over who will take charge for 2022. What could have a huge bearing on the 2022 season is the deliberations planned for October with regard to the structure of the championship for 2022 with some fairly radical changes gaining support it would seem. Most agree a change is needed and the debate over where the provincial championships sit is one of many decisions to be made. The current proposal B which RTE claim is getting support in the GPA would see the 6th, 7th and 8th place teams in division 1 of the league excluded from the Sam Maguire championship and also excluded from the Tailteann Cup championship it would seem. If one ranks the counties by their finishing spot in the leagues giving 1 - 8 rankings to Div 1 teams and the Division 2 team ranked as 9 and so on the Sam Maguire championship would be contested by teams ranked 1 - 5, 9, 10, 11, 17 & 25 Surely that's a joke? What would happen the 5th placed team in div 1
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Post by southward on Sept 15, 2021 11:35:13 GMT
What would happen the 5th placed team in div 1 Into some sort of qualifier, apparently. In championship terms, there's few enough serious teams in any given year without disqualifying some of them. In the past few years, were it in place, this proposal would have disbarred Tyrone, Mayo, Donegal and Monaghan, among others, from the race for Sam. Cutting the bottom 3 or 4 might be reasonable in a league with 20 teams, not one with 8 and with only 7 games. This is crackpot stuff; I find it hard to believe anyone would give it serious consideration.
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Post by buck02 on Sept 15, 2021 11:48:29 GMT
So proposal B is saying that if Kildare finish 6th in Division 1 after playing Tyrone, Mayo, Kerry, Dublin, Donegal, Monaghan and Armagh they can't compete for Sam but if you top Division 4 after playing London, Waterford, Leitrim, Wexford et al you can compete for Sam.
When you have a proposal like this coupled with the provencial councils wanting their slice of the cake it's hard seeing a change.
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Post by hatchetman on Sept 15, 2021 16:23:52 GMT
So proposal B is saying that if Kildare finish 6th in Division 1 after playing Tyrone, Mayo, Kerry, Dublin, Donegal, Monaghan and Armagh they can't compete for Sam but if you top Division 4 after playing London, Waterford, Leitrim, Wexford et al you can compete for Sam. That's mad Ted.
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Post by gaelicden on Sept 15, 2021 16:39:09 GMT
So proposal B is saying that if Kildare finish 6th in Division 1 after playing Tyrone, Mayo, Kerry, Dublin, Donegal, Monaghan and Armagh they can't compete for Sam but if you top Division 4 after playing London, Waterford, Leitrim, Wexford et al you can compete for Sam. When you have a proposal like this coupled with the provencial councils wanting their slice of the cake it's hard seeing a change. We finished 6th in the League 3 years in a row 2013-15. Well there goes title 37 if we had that format. It's a complete joke of an Idea alright.
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Post by Ard Mhacha on Sept 16, 2021 17:26:47 GMT
I always thought the league system was unbalanced. 4 games home, 3 away, or vice versa. That 4th game played away rather than home could be the difference in relegation or staying up, or further implications if new championship proposals come in.
I’d prefer a four team division, 3 home, 3 away, against the same teams.
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Post by dc84 on Sept 16, 2021 18:16:51 GMT
I always thought the league system was unbalanced. 4 games home, 3 away, or vice versa. That 4th game played away rather than home could be the difference in relegation or staying up, or further implications if new championship proposals come in. I’d prefer a four team division, 3 home, 3 away, against the same teams. Has its merits but it's too small and limited great thing about the league is the range of teams you get to play 7 different teams posing different challenges. How would you divide it divisions 1 to 8 ? Or split like this year on geography which is awful in my book same teams playing each other year in year out in league and championship would be boring
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Post by One In All In on Sept 17, 2021 15:22:17 GMT
Here is the best discussion I saw on it. . Proposal B all the way for me. League in the summer would be amazing.
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Post by One In All In on Sept 17, 2021 15:22:53 GMT
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Post by One In All In on Sept 17, 2021 16:06:20 GMT
Looking at it again I think something should be done for position 6 in Div 1. If you get relegated (bottom 2) after 7 matches then you deserve to exist the championship.
Tweeting it slightly. Maybe have 4 teams straight through to the quarters (top 4 div 1); have team div 1 team 5 play Div 4 winners away, have team 6 play div 3 winners away, have team 7 play Div 2 runners up away, and have team 8 play Div 2 champions away.
Seeded home QF. Team 1 plays lowest ranked winner of the playoff at home. team 2 plays the second lowest at home and so on (like what happens in the American Football)
Seeded neutral SF in Croke Park. Top ranked team plays fourth ranked team, second plays third.
Every team plays for the Sam Maguire cup with Div 1 being where it is at. Relegation to Div 2 would hurt as only two qualify for the Sam McGuire in Div 2.
No dummy or weak teams as every Div 1 team would want to be in the top 4.
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Post by Lolly Valance on Sept 17, 2021 16:48:38 GMT
Ya the non-inclusion of the 6th placed team in Div1 is a bit of an outlier. If this gets adopted then is that the league and the munster championship done away with or what the story?
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Post by onlykerry on Sept 18, 2021 10:14:43 GMT
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Post by Mickmack on Sept 18, 2021 10:39:29 GMT
Jim McGuinness We tend to sleepwalk into things in life. If the current All-Ireland football championships proposals are passed, then very soon the big summer jamboree, which is an integral part of Ireland’s cultural tradition as well as being a national sports event, will be unrecognisable. And that’s the best case scenario. The worst is that a gourmet meal is suddenly reduced to a dog’s dinner. Is reform needed? There is no question of that. The current model, whether in the knock-out or qualifier system, has shone a light on that. Repeatedly we have seen strong teams scoring north of 0-30 and finishing with a 20-point gap. It is depressing for neutral supporters to witness and leaves the losing county in despair. There are three proposals tabled for Congress: A, B and C. The latter, C, is to preserve the status quo and is redundant. All of the mood music suggests a strong groundswell of support for second proposal, B. I believe that there are some good ideas contained within it. But overall, the vision is flawed and potentially disastrous. Let’s begin with the chief adjustment. The major red flag for me is the removal of the provincial competitions from the All-Ireland championship. They will now be re-imagined as pre-season tournaments to be played in the spring. It completely demeans and undermines the integrity of the localised elements of the All-Ireland which have over 130 years of tradition and stories behind them. Why are the GAA throwing this away? Have they thought about this deeply? It is true that the provincial contests are in a poor state. Leinster is moribund. Munster, despite Tipperary’s fairytale victory in 2020, is currently dominated by Kerry. Connacht is in danger of becoming a two-horse race. But the Ulster championship has never been better. Cavan’s winter surge against Donegal 2020 and now we have Tyrone, dumped in dismal circumstances last November, gathering themselves to win a fourth All-Ireland title this summer. Then you had a series of exceptional games over the summer; Donegal-Derry, Armagh-Monaghan, Donegal-Tyrone. History and tradition Why are the GAA throwing this away? Have they thought about this deeply? Once a thing is gone, it is gone. This is not about conservatism or trying to hang on to what might be perceived as a 20th century tradition. I don’t think the plan is radical enough. But I do think we need to recognise the true value of the history and tradition of these four contests. The meaning of an Ulster medal has to be put in context. I know what it meant to our players in Donegal in 2011, after a 19-year wait. It was precious. And witness the delight of the Tyrone team this year. Was winning Ulster a springboard to their All-Ireland? I believe so. What this proposal does is banish the provincial contests to a mythical island. It has no connection to the All-Ireland contest any more. Therefore it loses any real meaning. The anticipation leaves. The crowds disappear. Do managers even risk playing marquee players? I doubt it. Like the Railway Cup, it will be stripped of all prestige. And it will disappear. And future generations will look back at the film of this year, 2021, for instance, and wonder why the organisation decided to just end all that. You have to ask: what are we replacing it with? What we are saying, suddenly, with this proposal is that the league matters more to the GAA than the championships. On what grounds has this been decided? My fear is that this will be passed. There’s a kind of mindless sense that change is needed. And it will have major repercussions. The league was always a preparation for the championship. Kildare made it back to the Leinster final this summer but Dublin were victorious. Photograph: Ryan Byrne/Inpho Kildare made it back to the Leinster final this summer but Dublin were victorious. Photograph: Ryan Byrne/Inpho Now, the Ulster championship has been fashioned as preparation for the league! The Connacht final is a warm-up for the league! I sometimes wonder if the people behind these ideas have actually gone to Castlebar or to Killarney or to Clones. The atmosphere on these days isn’t fabricated or invented. They are based on decades of familial tradition and a ritual on which the match is just one part. When provincial rivalries catch fire there is a spiritual element to them. That can’t just be extinguished. Or, more troublingly: it can. There are positive aspects to this. The first obvious progression is that teams will get more games. And there is a pathway for lower division league teams to progress through the league and the impetus is a place in the All-Ireland series proper. But you can add a proviso that guarantees a provincial championship winner a place in that theatre as well. I laid out on these pages what I still believe is a format which links league, provincial championship and, crucially, home and away occasions, into one All-Ireland contest. Muddled thinking So, last year, winning the Munster championship was worthy of Tipp’s place in an All-Ireland semi-final. Next year, under current thinking, winning it is worth nothing. That doesn’t sit right. That smacks of muddled thinking and a kind of desperate grappling for a solution. It jettisons the past and doesn’t really consider the future. It is down to money. The GAA doesn’t want four teams competing on All-Ireland final day. In the original proposal presented here, in 2015, a major tenet was having the Tier Two teams linked to big games. They would play in curtain raisers to the televised Sam Magure games all the way through - including the All-Ireland final. There is no mention of that in this proposal. The teams playing in the ‘Tailteann Cup’ would be under no illusion that they are participating in a lesser contest; the latest version of the much maligned B championship. Why can’t a firm commitment to showcase and support and build the other All-Ireland contest be given? Why not create a new contest which in 10 years time will have its own heritage based on teams winning in Croke Park on the ‘All-Ireland final day’ which will feature the two teams playing for the Sam Maguire and the two teams playing for the other cup, which is under proposal as the Tailteann Cup. It is down to money. The GAA doesn’t want four teams competing on All-Ireland final day. There is a clear reason why minor football is held in such esteem in this country. Because it is played before the senior All-Ireland. It is called exposure. That is the reason. Yet and all, the teams from the so-called weaker counties are not given any exposure or promotion or, let’s be honest, equality. Why shouldn’t a brilliant young Waterford footballer get the same opportunity as a Clifford, a McCurry? The reality is they are not even part of the conversation. They are away from the bright lights. Their counties don’t bring crowds and don’t generate money. So we hypocritically bemoan these gaping scorelines in the provincial championships and blame the structures rather than address the uncomfortable truth that we have been starving these counties of opportunity. It’s the old truth. All animals are equal. Some are more equal than others. I think the GAA are scared by what they have seen in Leinster, with Dublin absolutely steam rolling teams and they are petrified at the thought of the game’s marquee side playing in front of nobody. It is easier to pack the weaker counties away where they won’t really be seen. Ironically, there are signs of green shoots in Leinster. Offaly are All-Ireland Under-20 champions. Meath versus Dublin was a contest this summer and Kildare were back in a final. Like everything in life these things can be cyclical. Thirty years ago the Dublin-Meath first round Leinster Championship saga was the jewel in the crown. Now, we are saying that competition has no meaning. Why would you hang about if you are a player in a county in need of development? You’re 11-years-old and you were born in Longford and you see your cousin who lives in Kerry enjoying a completely different sporting experience to you. How is that fair? Where is the GPA in this? Are they fighting their corner for all counties? Proposal B And the new proposal is not great news for some of the stronger football counties either. Simply put, proposal B creates a competition where league form segues into the eight places for the traditional All-Ireland final series. To summarise: The top four teams in Division One are seeded. The other four comprises of the fifth team in Division one, the Division Two winners and the two winners of the preliminary quarter finals - which pits the teams that finish second and third in Division Two against the teams who finish first in Divisions Three and Four. So there is a potential pathway, however remote, for a division four team to make it to an All-Ireland quarter final. (Where they may face the 20-point destruction we spoke of above). But a scenario! This proposal goes through. Tipperary were shock winners of the Munster Championship in 2020. Photograph: James Crombie/Inpho Tipperary were shock winners of the Munster Championship in 2020. Photograph: James Crombie/Inpho Tyrone are All-Ireland champions. Their first two league games see them away to Dublin and Kerry. They lose both. They are now in a dogfight for a top-four or -five finish. They play Monaghan at home needing a win in their final league final. They draw and finish sixth – perhaps even on score difference. That’s them out of the All-Ireland championship. Let’s not destroy the All-Ireland tradition. Except! Were they ever even in the All-Ireland? There is a lack of clarity about what this ‘league’ contest is. Is it a league? Or part of the championship? Or has the actual All-Ireland suddenly been reduced to a weird, abbreviated contest which starts at the quarter-finals and shoe horns at least two teams from the lower divisions in regardless of their quality? To my mind this plan is the result of good intention and dangerously muddled thinking. It is not too late to alter it. Firstly, reclaim the integrity of all provincial championships by guaranteeing that the winner of each gets a place in the top 16 or traditional All-Ireland ‘Sam Maguire’ contest. Decide to try and regenerate the three failing provinces, with Ulster as the ideal model. Absolutely, link league performance to All-Ireland championship seeding. But don’t do it in such a way that actually punishes teams for reaching Division One. Scenario two. You are a really strong promising team in division Two - let’s say Galway or Mayo. Under this proposal, do you really want to push for promotion to Division One and risk finishing outside the top five and therefore have no place in the All-Ireland quarter finals? Or could you rather loiter around second and third in Division Two and then make a run in the preliminary quarter finals? All of these are real scenarios in my mind. Let’s not destroy the All-Ireland tradition. Lets commit to promoting and valuing the other All-Ireland contest so that all players feel as though they have parity of esteem: that they are not just an afterthought. Give those players a chance to think and play in front of 50,000 people rather than 500. There is a critical difference between improving a competition’s structure and utterly erasing the legacy and efforts and accomplishments of teams and counties and people that stretches back to the inception of the GAA. I don’t think people realise how big this decision is. Progress for the sake of it isn’t progress at all. I hope people fully understand the gravity of this impending change.
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Post by Mickmack on Sept 28, 2021 8:23:16 GMT
Kieran Shannon: Gaelic football needs voices for change, or it faces another summer off-Broadway
TUE, 28 SEP, 2021 - 07:00 Kieran Shannon Kieran Shannon
Before the All Ireland quarter-final weekend of 2016, the Super 8s had only existed in Páraic Duffy’s imagination and nowhere else. There had been no demand for it. Not from the GPA or any player, manager, official, or the public itself, as much as there would have been the odd cry for the better teams to play each other more often.
But what the Super 8s had was a Daddy in Duffy. And what that Daddy had was conviction. It was his baby and he was going to move heaven and earth for it to see the light of day. When he announced the pregnancy that particular August, he pre-empted every possible criticism and, in a lengthy document, presented an argument to counter and appease all of them. And sure enough, within nine months, Duffy’s baby was delivered and christened at a Special Congress in the spring of 2017.
It has always been the way when it’s come to any significant reform of the GAA championships. Duffy, as games administration committee chairman, was pivotal in the devising and adopting of the once-ingenious qualifier system. A hurling development committee featuring big names like Loughnane, Griffin, and English, and with the full blessing of then president Seán Kelly, brought the Christy Ring Cup and much more into the hurling world. John Horan wanted a legacy — which ended up being his skilful handling of the Covid conundrum — and so he conceived and delivered the Tailteann Cup.
The problem for the football championship proposals being touted ahead of Special Congress next month is that it has no recognisable parents, or at least one with the sway and the conviction of a Duffy. It may have as much, if not far more, support from the players and the GPA and managers and the public itself than most of the aforementioned previous championship reforms, but it could wither on the vine because it hasn’t been adequately championed by officialdom — at least so far.
Back in February, GAA president Larry McCarthy spoke about his desire for the association to be “bold” and trial one of the proposed new formats, but he’s had precious little to say since on the matter, possibly because they originated from a workforce commissioned by his predecessor and not he himself.
The chairman of that national fixtures calendar review workforce, Eddie Sullivan, has essentially said their work is done now. In this paper, he told John Fogarty that Croke Park could and should review their merits in light of the pandemic experience. Hardly a ringing endorsement of his own group’s work.
As for the “lads in Croke Park” who are “well capable of looking after that”, there hasn’t been a peep from director general Tom Ryan, which appears to be his default form of ‘leadership’.
You would think the only reason Feargal McGill, as director of games administration, signed off on such a flawed format for a 2021 championship was so it would fail spectacularly and demonstrate the need for a bolder championship format for 2022 and beyond, but he gives the air of someone who could take or leave what Sullivan & Co formulated.
The only officials with a bit of urgency and skin in this game would seem to be provincial council officers who see the more imaginative of the proposed formats as not only diminishing the allure of the provincial championships but their own authority. And that increasingly leaves the prospect that while the playing body — at least outside of Ulster — may mostly be in favour of change, county board officers will be more anxious not to offend their fellow blazers than those who don their county jersey.
That’s where the conviction and personal investment of a Duffy-like figure is being sorely missed. Conor O’Donoghue, a member of the Sullivan-chaired fixtures workforce, has gone into considerable detail to outline how the extra games that would go with a provincial round-robin spring league followed by a national league-based championship would bring in greater revenue and sponsorship for most units of the association. But he’s an unfamiliar name and a barely audible voice. He needs some sopranos to join in with him.
Several managers have already piped up, most namely Tony McEntee and Colm Collins. While they’re understandably underwhelmed about the proposal calling for four eight-team provincial conferences — a horse drawn by a committee if ever there was one — they are strongly in favour of the alternative.
Collins doesn’t mind playing Kerry and Limerick and Tipperary yet again in the spring in a springtime provincial round-robin championship, but he’d like his players and the public to experience playing someone else in their opening championship games.
Take Galway for example, who will also operate in Division Two next season. It borders Clare. A Clare club is as likely to play a Galway one in a challenge game as it is one from any Munster county. By right Clare-Galway should be as intense a rivalry as Clare has with any Munster county, as frequent a pairing as Monaghan-Fermanagh, say. And yet Clare and Galway have never played in championship, while seven times over the last seven years alone, Clare have been pitted against their traditional slavemasters Kerry. No wonder Collins claims he and his players are “roaring for change”.
If both motions fail to reach the 60% mark, chances are we’ll be left with the pre-pandemic status quo — without the Super 8s as the split-season means there’ll hardly be time to run them off. It’s a scary scenario for football.
Next summer hurling will again have its round-robin provincial championships. The RTÉ schedule won’t be like what it was these past two championships, where at least every second live televised game was a football one. Instead it will be more like that of 2018 where there was only one football match televised live before the provincial finals; who in May wants to watch Con O’Callaghan go up against Laois when you could instead be watching Tony Kelly going up against Limerick?
But if the new proposals are adopted, you could see O’Callaghan going up against Kerry in Killarney next May. Now that you would not want to miss.
Sullivan has a point that the proposal Collins favours might need a tweak here or there. Jim McGuinness and the Ulster lobby are particularly concerned that it currently has no reward for winning your provincial championship in the spring. There should be. Under the proposed league-based format, every team will have at least seven championship games. There is a big difference between being on the right side of the 4-3 home-and-away split. Every provincial champion should be assured they’ll have a fourth home game.
There is also a strong case that instead of five teams from Division 1 and three from Division 2 qualifying for the All-Ireland series, they should just mix up the 16 teams, split them into Division 1A and 1B with the top four in each making it through to the playoffs alongside the top side from each of the lower two divisions.
But that might be too late or complex to tweak now. What counts is that the thrust of it is passed, otherwise May and most of June will be effectively hurling-only affairs, as it was in 2018 and 2019.
The GPA, or at least its players, might need to get more bolshie with their county board officers and leave them in no doubt as to which format they would prefer. And if McCarthy wants the bold change he spoke about, someone of his or Ryan’s stature will need to speak up.
Otherwise, as Collins put it in paraphrasing Burke, bad stuff will happen to the sport when good people say nothing.
MORE IN THIS SECTION
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Post by Mickmack on Sept 28, 2021 8:33:30 GMT
The hurling championship is basically run off between the top 8 or 9 counties.
Thats why it gets the TV coverage.
Even at that we get a few one sided games.
The football league as it stands gives us the top football counties.
All they have to do is run the league as it is.
Race for Sam Maguire Put the teams who end up in the top 6 positions plus the two who end up top of division 2 into a pot and have a draw for 4 quarter finals. Then you have two semi finals etc.
The two who are relegated from div 1 plus the other 6 in division 2 would play off for the Next valued trophy....call in Paidi oSe cup for now.
The division 3 and 4 teams could be done on the same basis.
Every county could aspire to win the Sam Maguire if they climb through the league divisions.
There would be lots of great even games between counties of even standard.
The TV companies would be interested in televising them as they would be contests that people like to see...the way the hurling is at the moment.
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Post by buck02 on Sept 28, 2021 12:26:31 GMT
Would it be possible for the GAA to put some info on their website that will outline simply what the details are for the proposed formats.
Get some independent company to do it in case the GAA have a bias towards one option and try to skew the info in favour of that.
A bit like what we get before a referendum.
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Post by onlykerry on Sept 28, 2021 12:39:07 GMT
The famous plan B has two major flaws for me 1/ It kills the provincial championship and turns it into a pre season Mc Grath Cup. There needs to be a reward (entry to the championship) for provincial champions. 2/ All division 1 teams should be in the Championship along with the top 2 from Division 2 (as a minimum).
The provincial championships means every county has a theoretical chance of playing for Sam every year.
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Sept 28, 2021 12:42:22 GMT
The famous plan B has two major flaws for me 1/ It kills the provincial championship and turns it into a pre season Mc Grath Cup. There needs to be a reward (entry to the championship) for provincial champions. 2/ All division 1 teams should be in the Championship along with the top 2 from Division 2 (as a minimum). The provincial championships means every county has a theoretical chance of playing for Sam every year. Colm Parkinson makes the point that it is a "league championship" --- the league games are championship games.
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Joxer
Fanatical Member
Posts: 1,365
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Post by Joxer on Sept 28, 2021 14:25:50 GMT
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kot
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Posts: 1,128
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Post by kot on Sept 29, 2021 10:02:14 GMT
In think Proposal B is the best of them to be honest. It has its holes for sure but everyone goes into the league with a theoretical shot at Sam, so that is solved.
You know at the start of the year if you dont perform in the league you are out. Provincial championships arent gone, you can still have the cut & thrust of Ulster but as above…. You have to mind the house for the league too.
I agree with the point though that they could work it such that if you won your province and dont place well in the league that you still can get into the Sam competition. Like back in the old days if you didnt come in CL places but wont the CL you were still able to compete for it.
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Post by dc84 on Oct 2, 2021 11:11:44 GMT
In think Proposal B is the best of them to be honest. It has its holes for sure but everyone goes into the league with a theoretical shot at Sam, so that is solved. You know at the start of the year if you dont perform in the league you are out. Provincial championships arent gone, you can still have the cut & thrust of Ulster but as above…. You have to mind the house for the league too. I agree with the point though that they could work it such that if you won your province and dont place well in the league that you still can get into the Sam competition. Like back in the old days if you didnt come in CL places but wont the CL you were still able to compete for it. Not a hope proposal b will pass id say our Ulster brethren and a few more will put a stop to that. A is nonsensical in my book what will say moving carlow and Wicklow into munster do for anyone? It will be super 8s id say and a tough one for us aswell with (assuming we win munster) dublin in croker beaten Ulster and beaten Connacht a high chance of Galway, Donegal/monaghan and dublin not easy particularly if we have to go to Ulster for a must win last game
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kot
Fanatical Member
Posts: 1,128
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Post by kot on Oct 5, 2021 15:14:29 GMT
In think Proposal B is the best of them to be honest. It has its holes for sure but everyone goes into the league with a theoretical shot at Sam, so that is solved. You know at the start of the year if you dont perform in the league you are out. Provincial championships arent gone, you can still have the cut & thrust of Ulster but as above…. You have to mind the house for the league too. I agree with the point though that they could work it such that if you won your province and dont place well in the league that you still can get into the Sam competition. Like back in the old days if you didnt come in CL places but wont the CL you were still able to compete for it. Not a hope proposal b will pass id say our Ulster brethren and a few more will put a stop to that. A is nonsensical in my book what will say moving carlow and Wicklow into munster do for anyone? It will be super 8s id say and a tough one for us aswell with (assuming we win munster) dublin in croker beaten Ulster and beaten Connacht a high chance of Galway, Donegal/monaghan and dublin not easy particularly if we have to go to Ulster for a must win last game Are the Super 8's not with us for one more year anyway? Or am I wrong there? Yeah, I don't get Ulster's major objection (they love saying "no" I suppose ). - The Ulster Championship stays - They are disproportionately represented in Div 1 as things stand so of a last 16, not unreasonable to think they could have >33% of the participating teams!
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Post by dc84 on Oct 5, 2021 16:06:01 GMT
Ulster championship makes money and has a lot of prestige attached for the counties involved. While option b keeps the provincals they are greatly reduced in importance and will be more akin to pre season competitions than what they are now. Also its fairly likely that in the short term anyway the likes of monaghan,cavan,armagh and Donegal will be fighting hard to make the ai series. Judging by the league the last few years kerry,dublin, Tyrone and maybe mayo are probably the only dead certs to be top 6 every year
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