Sour Grapes ?

[jackiel]

Any reaction to Derek Kavanagh's comments regarding persistant faking of injuries so as to stall the possiblility of a Cork comeback. Is it just a case of sour grapes - personally I didn't see any evidence of it.

[leesider]

Yeah I agree, Kavanagh is talking rubbish. As captain he should know better, it would be a lot better if he played like one.

[kb]

Again it just makes you proud of our team, management and county board. When we loose at least we have the dignity to congratulate the opposition. In '05 it would have been easy for all involved to start complaining about cynical football, remember gooch getting poked in the eye? I was at the game and remember Canavan literally rugby tackling Cooper during Kerry's last attack. But there was never a word about it from the Kerry lads. They congratulated Tyrone. They re-grouped and came back even stronger.
Kavanagh gets wiped out, as does most of the Cork team and then its time to complain about time wasting. They could still be playing that game and Cork would still be loosing.
It is a magnificent team, a class act. Even on the Sunday game they all represented themselves and us very well.
Cork can keep their sour grapes and we will keep Sam!!!!

[Die Hard Kerry Fan]

Was on RebelGAA earlier as well, some furore over comments Pat O Shea supposedly made about showing them how football was played.. Anyone else hear that or is it more sour grapes?

[leesider]

paddywilliams said:

Was on RebelGAA earlier as well, some furore over comments Pat O Shea supposedly made about showing them how football was played.. Anyone else hear that or is it more sour grapes?

I was one of the people on there pissed off but I heard that mp3 of what he said on the other thread and it wasn't as bad as it was made out.
Tom O' Sullivan was gloating in Rathmore as well. I don't mind slagging if it's done with a bit of wit. Neither O' Sullivan nor O' Shea's comments were particularly witty.

[Die Hard Kerry Fan]

Would you be able to send me that mp3 Leesider if ya don't mind?

[leesider]

paddywilliams said:

Would you be able to send me that mp3 Leesider if ya don't mind?

Christ you've some cheek boy!

Here's the link to the offending item(s):
Here is the speeches from the homecoming in tralee.
www.moyvane.com/av/homecoming_2007.mp3

and here is Pat's speech in Killarney a couple of hours later where emotions got the better of him.....in his home town.....with his own people......and with Sam!
www.moyvane.com/av/patoshea_speech.mp3

I only listened to the Pat O' Shea one.

[Die Hard Kerry Fan]

Now, I dunno if Pat O'Shea's speech is as bad as is being made out. Bit of banter really.. I'm sure if we'd beaten Tyrone or Armagh or anyone else in Ireland, that he woulda said the same thing to them. Just happened to be our neighbours, as he rightly said, so might have made it sound that bit worse than it was.

[animal]

Just listened to Pat's speech. For God's sake there's nothing in it. Forget about it.

[pony]

yeah cant see too much wrong with what pat said either

[OnTheForty]

Lucky for Cork if Kerry were doing any time wasting - we would have beat them by 20 pts if we played the full match
I remember Tyrone doing it to us in 03, the Tyrone physio should have got man of the match for his second half performance, he was on the field so much.

[JOAN]

ontheforty said:

Lucky for Cork if Kerry were doing any time wasting - we would have beat them by 20 pts if we played the full match
I remember Tyrone doing it to us in 03, the Tyrone physio should have got man of the match for his second half performance, he was on the field so much.

Classic.....

[Owenabue]

Kb, every Cork member on this website came on here to congratulate Kerry and in every instance ye decided to ingore it. Kavanagh may have been emotional with his interview but I suppose being the losing captain isn't easy. Also the fact ye are still on about what happened to Cooper all these years later is a bit much at this stage, but yet ye accuse us of sour grapes.

[seamus]

My take on it owenabue is that in every single county there are mostly genuine supporters and a few nut jobs. I was embarressed by some kerry fans around me at the dublin game and i saw a few gloating after the game to cork fans. Most cork fans i met were very gracious but there were a few lunatics as well.

With regard to the comments made by Kavanagh, Pat O'Shea, Tom Sullivan i have no problem whatsoever with them. There is no point in dressing up the fact that Tom is from Rathmore and absolutely hates everything Cork. He is entitled to have a cut off his near neighbours.

Similarly Kavanagh and Billy Morgan detest Kerry and i have no problem with their comments. It adds to the spice and at the end of the day Billy was man enough to come into the dressing room after. Kavanaghs quote when you read the full article was taken out of context. He said Kerry have learned how to tackle hard, time waste and be cynical when they have to BUT they are far and away the best team in the land football wise as well.
He is spot on. Remember Donaghys rugby tackle on Shane Ryan with about 10 minutes to go? Cynical play where he was happy to give away a point and get a yellow card.

[watchdehop]

I think this whole issue is being blown up. At the game and there was no hassle before during or after it.
I didn't year Kerry lads yahooing at the game or gloating but if they did it should be condemmed. Anyone who remembers Meath in 2001 should know its not on.
Billy was man enough to come into the Kerry dressing room after wards and fair play to him.
Think Kavanaghs, Pat O Sheas and Tom Sullivans comments are being taken out of controversy.
There was a nice buzz in the immediate after math of the game. It was good that some Cork people come over here to congratulate us and fair play to them for that.
Has it got to the stage where a losing team can't give an opinion and its considered sour grapes? What Kavanagh basically said was if Kerry get a 6 point lead they won't leave you back he also said Kerry are a very good team. OF course the article highlights what might be controvertial.
Tom Sullivan and Pat O'Shea celebrated in front of their own people and I don't think we would have expected Billy or Cork to say any different if they had won.

Finally am I right in saying 200 people turned out for Corks homecoming. Thats got to be tough on the players. If as it now seems that there are more people upset over Kerrys victory speeches than would bother to turn up to see their team home theres something seriously wrong with the game...

[Walter Mitty]

Kavanaghs comments were taken out of context. he mentioned afterwards that all teams do it and its just the way the game is these days.

he was not having a specific dig at kerry. Anyway, people should be taking into account that the guy was seriously upset after the game.

[falveyb2k]

Well he shouldn't claim that a team are faking injuries when they obviously aren't. We didn't do that after the finals of 02 and 05, no matter how disappointed we were

[Deleted]

Look, Kavanagh said things in the heat of the moment as did Tom O'Sullivan.

Would not hold it against them.

[kerrygold]

remember the lack of supporters at cork v limerick games in very recent times

[Owenabue]

Kerrynorth, I think those figures for the homecoming are correct. I couldn't go cos I was ill... still am. Nope, I wasn't on the drink for the weekend, bloody flu has got the better of me.

Would I be correct in saying about 200 or so showed up for yer game against Waterford? Most people tend not to bother going til the latter stage of the championship in most counties, unless for the likes of Munster finals.

[watchdehop]

owenabue said:

Kerrynorth, I think those figures for the homecoming are correct. I couldn't go cos I was ill... still am. Nope, I wasn't on the drink for the weekend, bloody flu has got the better of me.

Would I be correct in saying about 200 or so showed up for yer game against Waterford? Most people tend not to bother going til the latter stage of the championship in most counties, unless for the likes of Munster finals.

I was at the Waterford game and there was a lot more than 200 I would say nearer 1500. Kerry like all counties get more going the further the season goes on though.

Still I would say Kerrys support was up on previous years a good crowd at the monaghan game and of course against the Dubs.


My points about the 200 at Corks homecoming are
1) Its got to be tough on the Cork team can you imagine how many people plagued them for tickets before the game.
2) How can more Cork people be worried about what might be said at a Kerry homecoming than turning up to see the team home ? How can they justify that?

I suppose like everywhere you get fickle fans...

[homerj]

watchdehop said:

Finally am I right in saying 200 people turned out for Corks homecoming. Thats got to be tough on the players. If as it now seems that there are more people upset over Kerrys victory speeches than would bother to turn up to see their team home theres something seriously wrong with the game...

one of the best and to the bone points i have seen on this forum in ages. simple as that. this whole incident sums up what is really wrong with the gaa doesnt it. when kerry lost to tyrone, there was 3,000 or 4,000 there to greet them and about 1,000 at the after match "party" in Jury's. we may be critisied for our lack of support at times, but alot of people live for kerry football and are painted with the wrong brush. I think its time that other counties started looking at themselves first.

[JOAN]

could not agree more with you homej. I do feel bad for the cork team must remember the are the lads who put on the county jersey and should get the respect and full support from all who call themselves GAA fans. Not only when they win. Easy to see where O learys attitude comes from and should be upset with the lack of support. As Kerry I know we fell the team should have more support also but when the chips are down the Kerry fans come out big time..

[islandexile]

kingdomexile said:

Look, Kavanagh said things in the heat of the moment as did Tom O'Sullivan.

Would not hold it against them.

Fully agree Kingdomexile. I'm sure Tom O' Sullivan was sampling some of the train hospitality on the way down and probably regrets saying it in hindsight.

[leesider]

kerrynorth said:

watchdehop said:

Finally am I right in saying 200 people turned out for Corks homecoming. Thats got to be tough on the players. If as it now seems that there are more people upset over Kerrys victory speeches than would bother to turn up to see their team home theres something seriously wrong with the game...

I'm not sure about the figures. sounds extreme. can you confirm owenabue?

But, the thing is, all before the game, the cork players and management were saying how poor their support is, how they only have 300 supporters and thats it, how they'll win it for themselves and f* the supporters.

So. if you're gonna say you'll win it for yourself and no-one else, you are certainly gonna end up losing it by yourself.

Kavanagh:
"I don't think it bothers us any more. We're just a close-knit bunch and we're well used to walking out into a half-empty stadium. It doesn't bother us; we're playing for ourselves.
"It might sound selfish, but we're not trying to play for the supporters. We're playing for ourselves and we want to win for ourselves. Simple as that."

O'Leary:
"It's unbelievably disappointing, our support, even if we're long over it now. The hurlers get caught in a sticky situation and are down three points and the crowd roars them on which is a huge help to a team. We go three down and people just turn their asses to us. That's when we need them.
There's absolutely no doubt about it, if we win this All Ireland, it'll be for this panel of players and management team. I honestly think there's only about two or three hundred genuine Cork football supporters out there."

What Kavanagh said about them playing for themselves does not surprise me as most GAA players play for themselves and not the supporters. They are dead right too. If Cork had actually won on Sunday they should have refused to take part in a parade as a protest.
O' Leary's comment about the difference in support for the hurlers is not entirely correct as there was a poor turnout for the hurlers homecoming last year and they had reached their fourth AI final in a row.
Most fans are fickle anyway. I'm a Cork City supporter and when we won the league in 2005 Turner's Cross was packed to the rafters for most games. This year crowds are a way down.

[Jo90]

I think us Kerry folk should shut up about sour grapes. Billy Morgan gave a very praiseworthy speech in the Kerry dressing room. The Cork players were very gracious in defeat in the media (outside of one out of context line), in the players lounge and immediately after the game where most of them stayed on to watch the presentation. The Cork supporters were simarly well behaved and I've never seen so many of the losing team's supporters on the field after a game.

[Mickmack]

the Cork fans were a joy to spend an afternoon with

[austinstacksabu]

Well said Jo.....anybody Cork related I spoke to was more gracious in defeat which is a rarity - even from ourselves.

[kerrygold]

By the very fact that billy came into the kerry dressing room this time and gave a geniune speech,a line should be drawn under the whole cynical,sour grapes thing etc now.

it might have been,like him or dislike him,a great gaa man leaving the arena after a lifes service to the gaa and fighting corks cause v kerry and signing off with a speech to his greatest foe's down through the years,if it was such then that merits the utmost repect from kerry people.

[Mickmack]

Billy had a look on him that he was finally giving up on getting the better of Kerry. I like Billy. A bit mad like Loughnane but the GAA needs the like of him