mossie
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Post by mossie on Mar 22, 2020 19:34:37 GMT
Eoin Brosnan be entitled to more of a mention in these debates
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Post by Ballyfireside on Mar 23, 2020 0:28:19 GMT
If it was down to actually making the difference between winning or losing then Galvin did it vs the Rebels was it a day he came on as a sub, and Donaghy vs Dgal '14 AI final, vs Mayo in Limerick and got us the draw vs Monaghan in Clones in '18.
Ah you could say a 1 point game is won by every scorer but we are talking more than that above - Paul and Kieran were the difference on the respective days, maybe that's how I should have put it, the most notable differences? Donaghy was held responsible by Dgal in '14 for sure so maybe we should take their word for it and interestingly enough in Laochra Gael he said he was biding his time, waiting for the accident to happen, and which is a masterclass of one the key differences between Club and County players, anticipating, sensing what will happen next, that 6th sense as Brosnan of Kerry Group often mentioned.
Quote of the day - Life is but a game, on and off the field of play
Let's hope there is plenty of extra time and that He will be more Ciaran Branagan and less Niall Cullen with his time keeping - if Fergal Kelly was God then we will all see red ... cheer up!
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Post by sullyschoice on Mar 24, 2020 23:45:08 GMT
I wouldn't even attempt to pick fifteen from that era. You could pick three teams and theh would all be brilliant.
One obvious thing is the severe lack of players from the current squad. Most are not around long enough yet I suppose.
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Post by Ballyfireside on Mar 25, 2020 2:38:38 GMT
I wouldn't even attempt to pick fifteen from that era. You could pick three teams and theh would all be brilliant. One obvious thing is the severe lack of players from the current squad. Most are not around long enough yet I suppose. 'Most' being the operative word, it's 'exponential', adding 5% adds 25%, 'Horse' Kennelly was 'slow and awkward', 'wouldn't get on 'the team' in a month of Sundays in the words of my older and (un-begrudging?) and OF COURSE wise(er?) cousin and Tim RIP's neighbour and of the one-age), Deenihan 'unstylish' in ''thewires' aka 'Dwyer' words, still to this day the both be standout CBs ans CHBs. Bur devil in detail, 'thewires' genius was crafting a team, 'neighbour' compensating', etc, meithesal, it's where we are, back to basics! Slán go foil a chairde and as Mandad says, to hell with tarbh cacas! Hopefully not famous last words, can't get rid of a bad thing!
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Post by piggott on Mar 25, 2020 12:22:51 GMT
Anyone have a go at picking best 15 from Kerry 2000-2009 and Dubs 2011-2019
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Post by buck02 on Mar 25, 2020 13:17:36 GMT
My 1st 15 would be:
Diarmuid Murphy (just about - he would struggle big time with the kick out in todays game) Marc O Se Mike McCarthy Tom Sullivan Tomas O Se Seamus Moynihan Aidan O Mahony Darragh O Se David Moran Paul Galvin Declan O Sullivan Donnacha Walsh Gooch Donaghy Clifford
2nd 15
Brendan Kealy Shane Enright Tommy Griffin Paul Murphy Peter Crowley Eamonn Fitz Killan Young Bryan Sheehan Anthony Maher Darran O Sullivan Sean O Shea Eoin Brosnan James O Donoghue Paul Geaney Mike Frank
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mandad
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Post by mandad on Mar 26, 2020 11:34:02 GMT
Spoke to a life-long friend last evening that I used to regularly go to games with when he was in better health. During the course of our little chat, he reminded me of the painful day in Croke Park in 2001 when our lads downed tools, threw in the towel in no uncertain manner. I didn’t need much reminding - Meath 2-14 Kerry 5 points. To add to the pain, we were defending champions; a team of some standing.
Towards the end of the game, the Meath supporters celebrated every perfunctory fist pass with unsavory cheering that was new to the game. Ironically, it was probably their undoing in the final against Galway later that year.
I can accept defeat, and indeed I have left Championship matches in defeat more often than in victory, but the manner of the defeat was deeply shocking. None of our players scored more than I point in that game! By any metric, an absolute shambles and players whom I held in the utmost of regard lost some of their luster on a dark day for Kerry football. It was a marker I set for myself in the midst of the confusion.
Hearing people defend players in the days that followed because of some ‘issue’ was beyond my comprehension. They pulled on the Green and Gold jersey and then sulked! No excuse is acceptable to me.
With the single exception of Eamon Fitzmaurice, that performance was the worst I’ve ever seen from a Kerry 15 in my lifetime. He gave it everything he had from start to finish. On that basis, coupled with his consistent performances on some of the games great forwards throughout his career, Eamon Fitzmaurice has to be in that team, in my opinion.
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Post by sullyschoice on Mar 26, 2020 16:24:22 GMT
Did Eamonn not get sent off that day for booting some fella up the hole.
I usually plan my holidays with military precision to avoid missing championship matches. That year I made a serious planning error....thank God I did.
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Post by greengold35 on Mar 26, 2020 21:33:37 GMT
Did Eamonn not get sent off that day for booting some fella up the hole. I usually plan my holidays with military precision to avoid missing championship matches. That year I made a serious planning error....thank God I did. You are correct on Fitz - 2nd yellow as far as I remember. One of those truly awful days in CP, never raised a gallop; always wondered what happened that day & some years later was in the company of a few of the participants - all relayed the same story - a huge emphasis on running in the lead up to the game - there was nothing in the legs once they hit Croke Park - who knows?!
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kerryexile
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Whether you believe that you can, or that you can't, you are right anyway.
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Post by kerryexile on Mar 26, 2020 23:40:38 GMT
The running would certainly cause that to happen. There were a few stories that did the rounds at that time about "race horses". The laborious concept of stamina is totally over estimated.
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Post by Attacking Wing Back on Mar 27, 2020 10:10:13 GMT
Declan O'Keeffe
Marc O'Se Mike McCarthy Tom O'Sullivan
Tomas Fitzmaurice O'Mahony
Dara Maher
Galvin Declan Walsh
Cooper Donaghy Clfford
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mossie
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Post by mossie on Mar 27, 2020 23:38:51 GMT
Did Eamonn not get sent off that day for booting some fella up the hole. I usually plan my holidays with military precision to avoid missing championship matches. That year I made a serious planning error....thank God I did. You are correct on Fitz - 2nd yellow as far as I remember. One of those truly awful days in CP, never raised a gallop; always wondered what happened that day & some years later was in the company of a few of the participants - all relayed the same story - a huge emphasis on running in the lead up to the game - there was nothing in the legs once they hit Croke Park - who knows?! the beating Meath got after in the final after made it harder heavy running at that stage of the championship!!??
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mossie
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Post by mossie on Mar 27, 2020 23:39:46 GMT
Declan O'Keeffe Marc O'Se Mike McCarthy Tom O'Sullivan Tomas Fitzmaurice O'Mahony Dara Maher Galvin Declan Walsh Cooper Donaghy Clfford no pony?
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mandad
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Post by mandad on Mar 28, 2020 11:50:43 GMT
The really critical way in which people are deceived by history is not that lies are told, but that things are omitted. Since we are meant to be dealing with facts, what seems to be missing from this conversation is an honest account of failure; groupthink is of no interest or benefit to anyone.
In practice, we are generally averse to criticism of our own. I think the research shows that criticising our own is a serious conversation ender. No one can deny the almost mythic status that the lapse of time has placed upon some of those iconic players. History is replete with proof if proof is needed, of how skilled these lads were.
I am neither competent nor minded to challenge this assertion that too much running is a plausible explanation rather than a convenient fact. That just skates over reality. I just don’t accept it because I know better. On this occasion, the sad truth is that the truth is sad.
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Post by Mickmack on Mar 28, 2020 15:24:40 GMT
Spoke to a life-long friend last evening that I used to regularly go to games with when he was in better health. During the course of our little chat, he reminded me of the painful day in Croke Park in 2001 when our lads downed tools, threw in the towel in no uncertain manner. I didn’t need much reminding - Meath 2-14 Kerry 5 points. To add to the pain, we were defending champions; a team of some standing. Towards the end of the game, the Meath supporters celebrated every perfunctory fist pass with unsavory cheering that was new to the game. Ironically, it was probably their undoing in the final against Galway later that year. I can accept defeat, and indeed I have left Championship matches in defeat more often than in victory, but the manner of the defeat was deeply shocking. None of our players scored more than I point in that game! By any metric, an absolute shambles and players whom I held in the utmost of regard lost some of their luster on a dark day for Kerry football. It was a marker I set for myself in the midst of the confusion. Hearing people defend players in the days that followed because of some ‘issue’ was beyond my comprehension. They pulled on the Green and Gold jersey and then sulked! No excuse is acceptable to me. With the single exception of Eamon Fitzmaurice, that performance was the worst I’ve ever seen from a Kerry 15 in my lifetime. He gave it everything he had from start to finish. On that basis, coupled with his consistent performances on some of the games great forwards throughout his career, Eamon Fitzmaurice has to be in that team, in my opinion. That Meath team had many great players and they all caught fire that day and played the best football that they played since the 1999 final. 2000 was a long season with two replay for Kerry. Kerry were vulnerable as defending champions often are. The two QF games v Dublin were huge games and i had no great confidence heading to Croke Park for the semi final of 2001. Was Tomas suspended for that game? Things were poised perfectly for Meath v Kerry... as they were for Galway in the final.
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Post by lilly1 on Mar 28, 2020 18:28:23 GMT
Sorry im new to this forum but have been reading for a good few years. I have to say I'm very surprised nobody else has picked Tadgh kennely atall. I know he only came back and played 1 season, grabbed an All Ireland and left again, but I feel people are some times picking with their heart rather their head. I mean D. Walsh was very good and always tireless, but Tadgh though not there as long or for so many battles was simply more talented. D Walsh's main strenght was always his work rate but Tadgh by the end of that year was definitely more than a match for him there, plus greater physicality. He simply had more presence. Was very rusty as the year started but steadily improved. Watch back the semi final against Dublin and see his work rate and passing accuracy. Remember him chasing down a fresh all attacking Dublin midfielder (Ryan) and disposal. I know he's not popular for obvious reasons but had he played for longer his worth would have been more apparent. Remember Kerry losing the All Ireland to Armagh in 02 by a point, whilst he was home and training for the Compromise rules. First bsll in the game sgainst the Aussies and he smashed a point over from distance with his first possesion at the start. Made me wonder if he would have been the difference against Armagh. I know they were worried that Paidi was going to bring him in. But didn't. Opportunity lost I always thought. Anyway I always felt the half forward line that started the 09 final, Galvin, Kennely and O'Sullivan has not been bettered since by any team, including Dublin. They had ball winning ability in abundance. Leadership, character, tackling, tracking and seriour scoring ability. Not to mention personality and tempermsnt fot the big day. So they would be my half forward line. Nobody would bully any off them but the also had serious scoring ability. Thoughts?
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Post by lilly1 on Mar 28, 2020 18:36:17 GMT
Also felt Tadgh was doing or did a good job on Corks most influential player Canty in the finsl and as the game was just opening up Jack substituted him, I feel he was just about to have a bigger role in the g a me but it seemed hard work was done and things were turning Kerry's way and so Jack wanted to give others a chance to be involved in the big day and Tadgh was an obvious candidate given he had'nt invested so much in the team in the long term. Understandable I suppose, I think he subbed Darragh too if memory serves me correctly.
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Post by Ballyfireside on Mar 28, 2020 19:01:07 GMT
Sorry im new to this forum but have been reading for a good few years. I have to say I'm very surprised nobody else has picked Tadgh kennely atall. I know he only came back and played 1 season, grabbed an All Ireland and left again, but I feel people are some times picking with their heart rather their head. I mean D. Walsh was very good and always tireless, but Tadgh though not there as long or for so many battles was simply more talented. D Walsh's main strenght was always his work rate but Tadgh by the end of that year was definitely more than a match for him there, plus greater physicality. He simply had more presence. Was very rusty as the year started but steadily improved. Watch back the semi final against Dublin and see his work rate and passing accuracy. Remember him chasing down a fresh all attacking Dublin midfielder (Ryan) and disposal. I know he's not popular for obvious reasons but had he played for longer his worth would have been more apparent. Remember Kerry losing the All Ireland to Armagh in 02 by a point, whilst he was home and training for the Compromise rules. First bsll in the game sgainst the Aussies and he smashed a point over from distance with his first possesion at the start. Made me wonder if he would have been the difference against Armagh. I know they were worried that Paidi was going to bring him in. But didn't. Opportunity lost I always thought. Anyway I always felt the half forward line that started the 09 final, Galvin, Kennely and O'Sullivan has not been bettered since by any team, including Dublin. They had ball winning ability in abundance. Leadership, character, tackling, tracking and seriour scoring ability. Not to mention personality and tempermsnt fot the big day. So they would be my half forward line. Nobody would bully any off them but the also had serious scoring ability. Thoughts? Interesting but didn't play enough as he only came back solely for his own benefit to win one Celtic Cross and then away again, and you can't condemn people for their life decisions - what would he have had here to compare? Not sure either that it was Paidí who cost us vs Armagh by not playing him, Paidí and Horse drank from the same truogh and my guess, and it is a guess, is that Paidí got Tadhgeen on the panel but others would ensure that was as far as he would get, wasn't Mce Fitz also kept off by the same token as his fitness platuea-ed out though he could still have won games for us. That HF line was awesome, 3 foot-soldier leaders, 3 right hoors - fast, determined and full of football, personified 'capable' in the fullest meaning of the word. Tadhgeen mightn't be popular but he shouldn't be unpopular either, it would be unsporting to deny anyone their right to decide for themselves as regards professional sports. To call Tadhg a great player one must also consider that he was a 'borrowed, and returned to sender' professional, who trained full time. Maybe another angle is, would we have won in 2009 without him, bearing in mind he brought a lot of tips from down under, e.g. retreating from the opposition goal-mouth makes it easier to score - natural tendency is to push up. Well that's how I see it and bearing in mind I may not have all the facts and/or slants, ah sure all that matters is that he played a vital role in us winning a Sam and as Listowel's Billy The Kid would say, 'that doesn't make him a bad person' - now where's that bucket? Hey folks, what a great conversation to be having, spoilt for choice, hopefully we will see those days again soon, I'm missing it all terribly, Clocks Forward has me in knots, 'twon't be long 'till smell of fresh mown grass and Championshio time proper, yerra there are more important things to deal with and that is something I can barely say, never thought anything could ever be more important, take care all! Quote of the day, Mandad above The sad truth is that the truth is sad
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Post by Attacking Wing Back on Mar 28, 2020 23:40:36 GMT
Declan O'Keeffe Marc O'Se Mike McCarthy Tom O'Sullivan Tomas Fitzmaurice O'Mahony Dara Maher Galvin Declan Walsh Cooper Donaghy Clfford no pony? No. I know it seems harsh but, I was picking a 15 that I would send out for a match not the best 15 players of the last 20 years. I think Eamonn Fitz is a better centre back to be fair. EF distribution out of defence from centre back was top class. And he could hold the middle. Same reason I have Maher with dara as they would compliment each other. Moran and Dara are too similar and need someone to do the donkey work. I don't get the clamour for kennnelly or those saying he was more talented than D Walsh. Tadhg played for one season and fits and starts at that. Walsh had a great scoring record in comparison. Was good for a goal and a good passer.
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Post by glengael on Mar 30, 2020 9:34:26 GMT
Spoke to a life-long friend last evening that I used to regularly go to games with when he was in better health. During the course of our little chat, he reminded me of the painful day in Croke Park in 2001 when our lads downed tools, threw in the towel in no uncertain manner. I didn’t need much reminding - Meath 2-14 Kerry 5 points. To add to the pain, we were defending champions; a team of some standing. Towards the end of the game, the Meath supporters celebrated every perfunctory fist pass with unsavory cheering that was new to the game. Ironically, it was probably their undoing in the final against Galway later that year. I can accept defeat, and indeed I have left Championship matches in defeat more often than in victory, but the manner of the defeat was deeply shocking. None of our players scored more than I point in that game! By any metric, an absolute shambles and players whom I held in the utmost of regard lost some of their luster on a dark day for Kerry football. It was a marker I set for myself in the midst of the confusion. Hearing people defend players in the days that followed because of some ‘issue’ was beyond my comprehension. They pulled on the Green and Gold jersey and then sulked! No excuse is acceptable to me. With the single exception of Eamon Fitzmaurice, that performance was the worst I’ve ever seen from a Kerry 15 in my lifetime. He gave it everything he had from start to finish. On that basis, coupled with his consistent performances on some of the games great forwards throughout his career, Eamon Fitzmaurice has to be in that team, in my opinion. That Meath team had many great players and they all caught fire that day and played the best football that they played since the 1999 final. 2000 was a long season with two replay for Kerry. Kerry were vulnerable as defending champions often are. The two QF games v Dublin were huge games and i had no great confidence heading to Croke Park for the semi final of 2001. Was Tomas suspended for that game? Things were poised perfectly for Meath v Kerry... as they were for Galway in the final. Tomás was sent off in the 2nd game V Dublin. There's a photo somewhere of Paidi RIP having a chat with the referee, Pat McEneaney I think it was, at full time, presumably to get clarity on that sending off among other things. Meath 2001 was probably the worst afternoon I spent in Croke Park, I stayed til the end. Mind you there have been a few depressing days there since... As you say Mick that Final was perfectly set up for Galway and they made the most of it.
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mossie
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Post by mossie on Mar 30, 2020 17:36:15 GMT
No. I know it seems harsh but, I was picking a 15 that I would send out for a match not the best 15 players of the last 20 years. I think Eamonn Fitz is a better centre back to be fair. EF distribution out of defence from centre back was top class. And he could hold the middle. Same reason I have Maher with dara as they would compliment each other. Moran and Dara are too similar and need someone to do the donkey work. I don't get the clamour for kennnelly or those saying he was more talented than D Walsh. Tadhg played for one season and fits and starts at that. Walsh had a great scoring record in comparison. Was good for a goal and a good passer. Eamonn Fitz certainly held the middle very well, read the game very well and his footpassing was top class. I didn't select him on my team but he was a good 6 it must be said He had a few very good seasons in the 6 jersey but when other personnel came into the equation for the 6 jersey, Eamonn lacked a bit of pace to play in other defensive roles. He didn't seem to have much patience with the centre forward experiment by Pat O'Shea in 2007 and retired in late Spring. Perhaps it was not impatient but a practical and wise decision reading the way things were heading. He got a great 2007 in the end. He was still right side of 30 just about and that season captained Feale Rangers to a senior football championship, got back into the hurling with Lixnaw and was a key figure in them winning the senior hurling championship in 2007. Not a bad year at all! I went for Moran at midfield ahead of Maher but only just! No way could Kenneally be considered ahead of Donncha
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Post by lilly1 on Mar 31, 2020 5:25:06 GMT
Kennely I think went away from the round ball at age 17, and came back to try and win an All Ireland at around 28 or 29. He succeeded in Aus too. Athletic and mentally strong. We all saw how long it tok Tommy Walsh to re ajust when he returned. Tadgh did it in 1 season, forcing his way into a very sucessful team. (Not sure if he took Donnach's place) Yes his kicking was wayward in the beginning. But I think people's opinion of his ability and merits versus other players suffers because of his book, and the Co. board creating a job role for him and then him leaving once he got his medal, and obviously his involvement with AFL recruiting young Irish/Kerry talent. And if it was a popularity contest, then yes you'd put Donnacha in in front of him for his years of valued service. But its not. Kennely had just as much running in him as Donnach and more. He was a good passer, I seem to remember him picking out the Gooch with pin point accuracy from distance, putting him in for an easy score, in the 09 semi,he could obviously score his own poonts too. He was always impressive for Ireland V's Australia.Anyway I just think he was a bigger presence and stronger option than Donnacha, thats only my opinion, but when others say he shouldn't be anywher near consideration then it's obviously based on not really liking the guy.
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Post by hurlingman on Mar 31, 2020 7:50:23 GMT
Kennely I think went away from the round ball at age 17, and came back to try and win an All Ireland at around 28 or 29. He succeeded in Aus too. Athletic and mentally strong. We all saw how long it tok Tommy Walsh to re ajust when he returned. Tadgh did it in 1 season, forcing his way into a very sucessful team. (Not sure if he took Donnach's place) Yes his kicking was wayward in the beginning. But I think people's opinion of his ability and merits versus other players suffers because of his book, and the Co. board creating a job role for him and then him leaving once he got his medal, and obviously his involvement with AFL recruiting young Irish/Kerry talent. And if it was a popularity contest, then yes you'd put Donnacha in in front of him for his years of valued service. But its not. Kennely had just as much running in him as Donnach and more. He was a good passer, I seem to remember him picking out the Gooch with pin point accuracy from distance, putting him in for an easy score, in the 09 semi,he could obviously score his own poonts too. He was always impressive for Ireland V's Australia.Anyway I just think he was a bigger presence and stronger option than Donnacha, thats only my opinion, but when others say he shouldn't be anywher near consideration then it's obviously based on not really liking the guy. I'm no fna of his my any means but he did play a role in that 2009 win. It's impossable to say how good he would have been however as he was only on the team for one seasons.
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Post by buck02 on Mar 31, 2020 19:18:37 GMT
IMO - Tommy Walsh would have done way more in 2008 and 2009 to justify inclusion in a team of 2000-2019 than Kennelly for his 2009 season.
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mossie
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Post by mossie on Mar 31, 2020 22:08:25 GMT
Kennely I think went away from the round ball at age 17, and came back to try and win an All Ireland at around 28 or 29. He succeeded in Aus too. Athletic and mentally strong. We all saw how long it tok Tommy Walsh to re ajust when he returned. Tadgh did it in 1 season, forcing his way into a very sucessful team. (Not sure if he took Donnach's place) Yes his kicking was wayward in the beginning. But I think people's opinion of his ability and merits versus other players suffers because of his book, and the Co. board creating a job role for him and then him leaving once he got his medal, and obviously his involvement with AFL recruiting young Irish/Kerry talent. And if it was a popularity contest, then yes you'd put Donnacha in in front of him for his years of valued service. But its not. Kennely had just as much running in him as Donnach and more. He was a good passer, I seem to remember him picking out the Gooch with pin point accuracy from distance, putting him in for an easy score, in the 09 semi,he could obviously score his own poonts too. He was always impressive for Ireland V's Australia.Anyway I just think he was a bigger presence and stronger option than Donnacha, thats only my opinion, but when others say he shouldn't be anywher near consideration then it's obviously based on not really liking the guy. I didn't pick Donncha in my team as a result of a popularity contest. In fact, Donncha is one of the lowest key media profile Kerry forwards on that era!!! I picked Donncha because of an outstanding contribution over several years to the Kerry jersey I have massive respect for Tadhg and his achievements across the 2 sports but I cant see a rationale to pick on a team of era selection based on one season where he made a good ( at a stretch very good) contribution. I am delighted he got his all Ireland medal and delighted he got opportunity to represent Kerry but hey lets keep perspective
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mossie
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Post by mossie on Mar 31, 2020 22:09:38 GMT
IMO - Tommy Walsh would have done way more in 2008 and 2009 to justify inclusion in a team of 2000-2019 than Kennelly for his 2009 season. good point, and he made a decent contribution in 2019 too. pity we didn't use him better and more in 2019!!
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Post by lilly1 on Apr 1, 2020 2:10:22 GMT
Id tend to agree regarding Tommy Walsh. So Tommy in the full forward line in place of who?
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Post by Ballyfireside on Apr 1, 2020 2:36:43 GMT
I'm often accused of over estimating Tommy's talent pre-Oz, but for those of us who really rated his potential, if Tadhgeen's role in taking him down under was factored into said Tadhgeen's contribution to Kerry GAA then said Tadhgeen would rate very poorly, and poorer still if you factor in that he eased open the flood gates that deluged Mark O'Connor, etc - I reckon Oz has cost us 4 Sams, maybe more - all else being equal there would be no 5 in a row either if Mark was available. Just look at all the tight games where Mark would be worth 3-5 points every day. It is only in writing this that it is hitting home, and as we all know, one can be their own greatest critic when making such a stark point, but I cannot honestly see a counter-argument to this.
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Post by lilly1 on Apr 1, 2020 3:55:58 GMT
I do see where your coming from, but I don't really think you can blame Tadgh for Tommy departing after the 09 final. Tadgh was playing with the Swans at that time and wasn't involved in recruiting Irish players. Im sure his success drew Tommy and others to the possibilities of what could be achieved to some degree as did Jim Stynes success. Ricky Nixon was the guy that recruited Tommy. I would. imagine Tommy asked Tadgh for advise before he decided to join St Kilda. I do completely agree with you that Tommy was a massive loss and both him and Tadgh would have made a huge difference to Sam' if they never left. But players who left after Tadgh began recruiting for the AFL such as Mark O'Connor and possibly Okunbar, yes its very disappointing, that he used his Kerry connection in that way.They are a huge loss. Kerry have probably suffered more than any other county in this regard. Tommy was a savage player who hadn't even peaked before he left. I think Dublin and Kerry's All Ireland tallies would look different if none of these guys left.
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Post by hurlingman on Apr 1, 2020 14:21:14 GMT
I'm often accused of over estimating Tommy's talent pre-Oz, but for those of us who really rated his potential, if Tadhgeen's role in taking him down under was factored into said Tadhgeen's contribution to Kerry GAA then said Tadhgeen would rate very poorly, and poorer still if you factor in that he eased open the flood gates that deluged Mark O'Connor, etc - I reckon Oz has cost us 4 Sams, maybe more - all else being equal there would be no 5 in a row either if Mark was available. Just look at all the tight games where Mark would be worth 3-5 points every day. It is only in writing this that it is hitting home, and as we all know, one can be their own greatest critic when making such a stark point, but I cannot honestly see a counter-argument to this. While Kennely isn't a popular man in Kerry, and rightly so for a lot of reasons imo, i too don't think he really had anything to do with Tommy Walsh going to Oz. He afterall was still a player and with a different team. He may have had something to do with Walsh joining the Sydney Swans later on but that's totaly difference.
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