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Post by Annascaultilidie on Mar 6, 2019 21:54:07 GMT
So you are agreeing that he is living off reputation? So he is given a pass because he’s injured? He might have got away with it in the previous regime but can’t see the new management hanging on to him at the expense of new talent. You're talking ráiméis. If JOD is fit enough and showing in training he will be in there. If he's not, he won't.
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Post by southward on Mar 6, 2019 22:16:38 GMT
So you are agreeing that he is living off reputation? So he is given a pass because he’s injured? He might have got away with it in the previous regime but can’t see the new management hanging on to him at the expense of new talent. All your posts to date seem to be about rubbishing this fella and that. Anything positive to contribute?
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Post by Whosinmidfield on Mar 6, 2019 22:40:48 GMT
Any news on how serious Jack Sherwood's injury is?
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Post by Mickmack on Mar 6, 2019 23:29:23 GMT
I think we can all rattle off instances when Kerry played players who were clearly injured or not fully fit in AI finals over the past decade and a half. It seldom ended well.
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Post by colinsworth1 on Mar 7, 2019 1:31:45 GMT
So you are agreeing that he is living off reputation? So he is given a pass because he’s injured? He might have got away with it in the previous regime but can’t see the new management hanging on to him at the expense of new talent. You're talking ráiméis. If JOD is fit enough and showing in training he will be in there. If he's not, he won't. Love that word Rameis is that a real word In the Irish dictionary long time since I heard that one But absolutely when a man is injured then all bets are off. Cannot pass judgement on an injured player no way . JOD could light up our year yet we have to get him right first Remember it’s early days yet .
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keane
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Post by keane on Mar 7, 2019 12:13:44 GMT
All this 'what have you done for me lately baby' rubbish about James O'Donoghue, there are already corner forwards on the panel who have never done anything. James is better than every corner forward on the panel bar Clifford as the only certainty, maybe Geaney (what have you done for me lately?), O'Brien at a massive push based on a couple of league games this year.
You might prefer to cut JOD loose in favour of Ó Sé, Spillane, Conor Geaney, Tony Brosnan, Shaw, McCarthy... you know, if you're stupid. Who else are we pining for?
My considered opinion is that this year I'd have JOD before every one of them with one arm and one leg without a blink.
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Post by Mickmack on Mar 7, 2019 12:43:49 GMT
All this 'what have you done for me lately baby' rubbish about James O'Donoghue, there are already corner forwards on the panel who have never done anything. James is better than every corner forward on the panel bar Clifford as the only certainty, maybe Geaney (what have you done for me lately?), O'Brien at a massive push based on a couple of league games this year. You might prefer to cut JOD loose in favour of Ó Sé, Spillane, Conor Geaney, Tony Brosnan, Shaw, McCarthy... you know, if you're stupid. Who else are we pining for? My considered opinion is that this year I'd have JOD before every one of them with one arm and one leg without a blink. You last line is ridiculous. A fully fit JOD will start. Everyone knows that.
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keane
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Post by keane on Mar 7, 2019 12:48:55 GMT
70/80% fit JOD ahead of all those mentioned no problem. Half fit ahead of some of them.
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Post by onlykerry on Mar 7, 2019 12:54:12 GMT
Etymology
From Irish ráiméis (“nonsense, poppycock”), from Norman romance.
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Post by kerrygold on Mar 7, 2019 12:59:33 GMT
JOD remains a class act. I don't think his injuries at the moment are too serious in nature.
Mad the way people here continuously write off Kerry players. Had a look at Shane Ryan's dropped ball at the end of the match. Happy to believe he came to claim it in a confident manner but missed timed the jump. I'd imagine management had told him to be coming and claiming those ones rather than punching them away. He needs loads of game time in goals now.
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Post by dc84 on Mar 7, 2019 13:03:36 GMT
The way PK sets his teams up i doubt we will ever see a 3 man full forward line again. The way i see it he likes one cf to roam like a 3rd wf leaving 2 inside for the most part. In that case you can divide the lads mentioned above into two. Id put k.spillane clifford JoD geaney(×2) walsh shaw tos and brosnan in that camp with clifford nailed on and geaney (just about ) getting the 2nd spot.
For the roving role SOB moynihan(if he goes with a different hf line) burns mccarthy and maybe some of the younger lads above into that bracket with obrien/moynihan the men with the jerseys at the moment.
Only o shea and clifford are 100pc nailed on starters for me. SOB and dara Moynihan look like they will be hard moved aswell. JOD would get on any panel in the country and start in most teams maybe barring Dublin or Galway some very harsh comments on here about the man injuries have really hampered him but he keeps coming back with 100% effort and never hides we are lucky to have him!
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Post by Mickmack on Mar 7, 2019 13:23:14 GMT
one of the interesting bits from the Seamus Darby programme was his view that Offaly were far too concerned with limiting Kerry in 1981. This clearly frustrated him.
In 1982 Offaly took the game to Kerry bigtime. The three in the half back line came forward and belted over points... Liam Currams, Sean Lowry and Pat Fitzgerald. That first half seemed to last 5 minutes it was so good.
By comparison, 1981 final was an awful game with the goal by Jacko the only thing worth looking back on.
Offly never really looked like winning in 1981
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keane
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Post by keane on Mar 7, 2019 13:49:03 GMT
The way PK sets his teams up i doubt we will ever see a 3 man full forward line again. The way i see it he likes one cf to roam like a 3rd wf leaving 2 inside for the most part. In that case you can divide the lads mentioned above into two. Id put k.spillane clifford JoD geaney(×2) walsh shaw tos and brosnan in that camp with clifford nailed on and geaney (just about ) getting the 2nd spot. For the roving role SOB moynihan(if he goes with a different hf line) burns mccarthy and maybe some of the younger lads above into that bracket with obrien/moynihan the men with the jerseys at the moment. Only o shea and clifford are 100pc nailed on starters for me. SOB and dara Moynihan look like they will be hard moved aswell. JOD would get on any panel in the country and start in most teams maybe barring Dublin or Galway some very harsh comments on here about the man injuries have really hampered him but he keeps coming back with 100% effort and never hides we are lucky to have him! Yeah I think you're probably right. O'Shea certainty at 11, Clifford certainty at 14. He will have two foragers in the style of how O'Brien and Moynihan (almost certainly those two IMO), say 10 & 15. I have a strong suspicion he will want at least one of the remaining two to be a unit, so you're talking about Gavin or DOC or someone at 12, probably Geaney and Tommy fighting it out for 13 if Tommy gets a bit more promising gametime under his belt in the next few weeks. I'm a little bit worried about the physical size of our HB line if we end up with O'Sullivan, Murphy and White. I could see Kilkenny for instances manhandling the latter two. Maybe TOS is raw boned enough for him.
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Post by dc84 on Mar 7, 2019 14:04:14 GMT
The way PK sets his teams up i doubt we will ever see a 3 man full forward line again. The way i see it he likes one cf to roam like a 3rd wf leaving 2 inside for the most part. In that case you can divide the lads mentioned above into two. Id put k.spillane clifford JoD geaney(×2) walsh shaw tos and brosnan in that camp with clifford nailed on and geaney (just about ) getting the 2nd spot. For the roving role SOB moynihan(if he goes with a different hf line) burns mccarthy and maybe some of the younger lads above into that bracket with obrien/moynihan the men with the jerseys at the moment. Only o shea and clifford are 100pc nailed on starters for me. SOB and dara Moynihan look like they will be hard moved aswell. JOD would get on any panel in the country and start in most teams maybe barring Dublin or Galway some very harsh comments on here about the man injuries have really hampered him but he keeps coming back with 100% effort and never hides we are lucky to have him! Yeah I think you're probably right. O'Shea certainty at 11, Clifford certainty at 14. He will have two foragers in the style of how O'Brien and Moynihan (almost certainly those two IMO), say 10 & 15. I have a strong suspicion he will want at least one of the remaining two to be a unit, so you're talking about Gavin or DOC or someone at 12, probably Geaney and Tommy fighting it out for 13 if Tommy gets a bit more promising gametime under his belt in the next few weeks. I'm a little bit worried about the physical size of our HB line if we end up with O'Sullivan, Murphy and White. I could see Kilkenny for instances manhandling the latter two. Maybe TOS is raw boned enough for him. Totally agree, really need to get the balance right here. Unfortunately we seem to have loads of top quality wingbacks but a shortage of stoppers. Would like to see savage/morley at 6 then two out of TOS white and murphy. Problem is who to leave out??? If i was jim Gavin i would put callaghan 11 howard ten and kilkenny 12 not sure we could handle that with the current makeup not sure about any of those 3 in the fullback line either too susceptible to a high ball.
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Post by colinsworth1 on Mar 7, 2019 15:18:21 GMT
Guys that’s good discussion on our good options up front And maybe lack of size and strength on our backs But for me our midfield has the greatest scope for improvement If we fix that ( and I believe it’s broken ) every thing else improves I think we may have to borrow from peter to pay Paul but our mid field this league league although good is probably not good enough to win the league final or the AI .
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keane
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Post by keane on Mar 7, 2019 15:34:10 GMT
Guys that’s good discussion on our good options up front And maybe lack of size and strength on our backs But for me our midfield has the greatest scope for improvement If we fix that ( and I believe it’s broken ) every thing else improves I think we may have to borrow from peter to pay Paul but our mid field this league league although good is probably not good enough to win the league final or the AI . I don't really know what options we have for midfield. I do think the reason we seem to have been picking big units in the forward line is to try and help out at the middle. Jack Barry has good games and bad games but he always seems to play well against Fenton. Considering Dublin are trying to win five in a row this year being good against Fenton is about the only metric I care about.
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Post by colinsworth1 on Mar 7, 2019 15:48:58 GMT
Guys that’s good discussion on our good options up front And maybe lack of size and strength on our backs But for me our midfield has the greatest scope for improvement If we fix that ( and I believe it’s broken ) every thing else improves I think we may have to borrow from peter to pay Paul but our mid field this league league although good is probably not good enough to win the league final or the AI . I don't really know what options we have for midfield. I do think the reason we seem to have been picking big units in the forward line is to try and help out at the middle. Jack Barry has good games and bad games but he always seems to play well against Fenton. Considering Dublin are trying to win five in a row this year being good against Fenton is about the only metric I care about. Limiting Fintan is good sure but put on your Ole Gunnar Soljster hat and consider having fintan spend his after noon chasing SOS let Fintan do some Defending for a change . Turn the tables here let the Dublin midfield chase us just try it . You saw how they bawlked when TW went in at 14 gotta keep them worrying about us.and you know there concerned right now Imagine if Fenton’s opposite number got his hands on plenty ball and scored a few points you don’t think Gavin would be screaming at him to cover back We want to keep Fintan as far away as we can not just throw in the offensive towel and follow him around all day like a lap dog . We’re don’t do hero worship down here in Kerry . I think we’ve been giving far too much respect to these boys .
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keane
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Post by keane on Mar 7, 2019 15:57:00 GMT
We don't do hero worship is a great soundbyte but we don't do much winning lately either. When they have the ball you have to stop them. They're going to have the ball a lot. If you stop Fenton you have a much better chance of beating them.
We weren't calling for Aidan O'Mahony to kick five points to stop Michael Murphy when he marked him at midfield in the All Ireland in '14. There are some guys you just have to stop by marking them out of it.
Under the previous management in an All Ireland semi-final one of the midfielders asked the sideline who he was meant to be marking when Dublin made a change at midfield. The response was an impassioned 'fuckin drive in to them'. We were beaten by a couple of points. I don't think 'score a few points and put them on the back foot' is at the level of tactical nous we would need to stop the five in a row.
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keane
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Post by keane on Mar 7, 2019 16:12:33 GMT
And just to be fair, it's not that 'attack as the best form of defense' doesn't have merit as an idea - I'm just not convinced that when it comes to trying to win this most important All Ireland that it is the best approach.
Is trying to go for a balls to the wall shootout with say O'Shea in MF to trouble Fenton going to give us a better chance than trying to shut Fenton down and asking Dublin if they can work around it? We've two wins and a draw against them in recent seasons where I'd argue that was the key element.
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Post by Mickmack on Mar 7, 2019 16:37:30 GMT
I know it was only a league game a few weeks ago but didnt JB do a great job in limiting Fenton for 65 mins.
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Post by veteran on Mar 7, 2019 16:51:07 GMT
I would never pick a player who is not fully fit. The history of Kerry football is littered with players starting who were not fully fit..
Currently , Paul Geaney has one problem, injury, and James has two problems, injury and match practice. Eradicate these deficits and both should start. A fully fit Paul Geaney even playing moderately by his standards should start. Even at that level, he will fully engage the opposition. Ditto James , physically fit and match fit. I will go further and put the cat among the pigeons If I was told both are fully tuned but I could only pick one, it would be Paul. At his optimal level he is one of the best Kerry forwards I have seen.
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Post by colinsworth1 on Mar 7, 2019 17:01:40 GMT
And just to be fair, it's not that 'attack as the best form of defense' doesn't have merit as an idea - I'm just not convinced that when it comes to trying to win this most important All Ireland that it is the best approach. Is trying to go for a balls to the wall shootout with say O'Shea in MF to trouble Fenton going to give us a better chance than trying to shut Fenton down and asking Dublin if they can work around it? We've two wins and a draw against them in recent seasons where I'd argue that was the key element. The point I m making is we have been too cagey too worried about the other team too defensive over thinking and I’m referring to the last management mainly . The late late addition of forwards instead of defenders in past two games has worked and shows a new attitude which I like and that is take them on , go at them. Nobody is looking to be reckless about it But midfield is the one area even since PK that offers Sweet F all in attack but we’re ok with leaving that to Wonder boy Fenton I get the idea of shutting their playmaker down or limiting him but can we not see their 8 and 9 run the opposite direction tracking back once in a while .??The Dublin midfield comes into CP thinking of how much go forward ball will I produce today , how many assists will I give How many points will I score will I go down the middle and score a goal? Our Mid fielder s come up to the game and I don’t think their minds ever drift to thoughts on the sweet side of the 45 yard line. Were giving this up before a ball is kicked is this the Kerry way now.? It’s putting fierce pressure on our.back s the opposition 8 and 9 are not really midfielders they are just extra attackers to worry about because we’ve that sorted before a ball is kicked . And our wing forward s used to think the same until PK came along and now we have wing forwards who work as hard defending But at least they worry the wings backs now for a welcome change and can score and punish you now and again .
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Post by Mickmack on Mar 7, 2019 17:03:06 GMT
I would never pick a player who is not fully fit. The history of Kerry football is littered with players starting who were not fully fit.. Currently , Paul Geaney has one problem, injury, and James has two problems, injury and match practice. Eradicate these deficits and both should start. A fully fit Paul Geaney even playing moderately by his standards should start. Even at that level, he will fully engage the opposition. Ditto James , physically fit and match fit. I will go further and put the cat among the pigeons If I was told both are fully tuned but I could only pick one, it would be Paul. At his optimal level he is one of the best Kerry forwards I have seen. PGs ability to fetch the high ball puts him ahead of JOD ...for me.
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Mar 7, 2019 17:09:16 GMT
I would never pick a player who is not fully fit. The history of Kerry football is littered with players starting who were not fully fit.. Currently , Paul Geaney has one problem, injury, and James has two problems, injury and match practice. Eradicate these deficits and both should start. A fully fit Paul Geaney even playing moderately by his standards should start. Even at that level, he will fully engage the opposition. Ditto James , physically fit and match fit. I will go further and put the cat among the pigeons If I was told both are fully tuned but I could only pick one, it would be Paul. At his optimal level he is one of the best Kerry forwards I have seen. PGs ability to fetch the high ball puts him ahead of JOD ...for me. I am a massive fan of Paul Geaney. Massive. But has he really been a great fielder of the ball for Kerry? Has much high ball been sent his way? You are recalling a Sigerson match.
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Post by taibhse on Mar 7, 2019 17:36:31 GMT
On a positive note, James was in tremendous form with his club during the Autumn. I would say that he was very close to being back to his best. Form is temporary, class is permanent, as they say. I would find it difficult to envisage a situation where either he or Paul would not be part of a Kerry 15 if they were back to full fitness, which I am confident they will. The best time for that is the Championship.
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keane
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Post by keane on Mar 7, 2019 17:51:00 GMT
And just to be fair, it's not that 'attack as the best form of defense' doesn't have merit as an idea - I'm just not convinced that when it comes to trying to win this most important All Ireland that it is the best approach. Is trying to go for a balls to the wall shootout with say O'Shea in MF to trouble Fenton going to give us a better chance than trying to shut Fenton down and asking Dublin if they can work around it? We've two wins and a draw against them in recent seasons where I'd argue that was the key element. The point I m making is we have been too cagey too worried about the other team too defensive over thinking and I’m referring to the last management mainly . The late late addition of forwards instead of defenders in past two games has worked and shows a new attitude which I like and that is take them on , go at them. Nobody is looking to be reckless about it But midfield is the one area even since PK that offers Sweet F all in attack but we’re ok with leaving that to Wonder boy Fenton I get the idea of shutting their playmaker down or limiting him but can we not see their 8 and 9 run the opposite direction tracking back once in a while .??The Dublin midfield comes into CP thinking of how much go forward ball will I produce today , how many assists will I give How many points will I score will I go down the middle and score a goal? Our Mid fielder s come up to the game and I don’t think their minds ever drift to thoughts on the sweet side of the 45 yard line. Were giving this up before a ball is kicked is this the Kerry way now.? It’s putting fierce pressure on our.back s the opposition 8 and 9 are not really midfielders they are just extra attackers to worry about because we’ve that sorted before a ball is kicked . And our wing forward s used to think the same until PK came along and now we have wing forwards who work as hard defending But at least they worry the wings backs now for a welcome change and can score and punish you now and again . Fair points, I don't disagree with you too much.
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Post by Mickmack on Mar 7, 2019 18:04:40 GMT
PGs ability to fetch the high ball puts him ahead of JOD ...for me. I am a massive fan of Paul Geaney. Massive. But has he really been a great fielder of the ball for Kerry? Has much high ball been sent his way? You are recalling a Sigerson match. When fit PG is an excellent high fielder. JoD could not have scored that goal in the 2014 final as he would have been outfielded. I suspect however that PG has suffered from back trouble for some time.
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Post by dc84 on Mar 7, 2019 18:06:29 GMT
The way its looking we are building a serious squad especially up front who starts is not the main thing here. Its having players who can finish a game off is id personnally go with jod in this role he is better when the game opens up, him and walsh coming on in a tight game will spook any defence. We now also have wing backs who will keep all wf honest i could be open to correction but i think tos has at least matched scores with everyone he has marked this year?
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Mar 7, 2019 18:06:55 GMT
I am a massive fan of Paul Geaney. Massive. But has he really been a great fielder of the ball for Kerry? Has much high ball been sent his way? You are recalling a Sigerson match. When fit PG is an excellent high fielder. JoD could not have scored that goal in the 2014 final as he would have been outfielded. I suspect however that PG has suffered from back trouble for some time. Geaney was imperious and fit in 2017 and much of 2018. Geaney was isolated against a small player in 2014; I can't recall many other times he fielded for Kerry...I mean that was five years ago. Not knocking him but not much high ball comes his way...and ultimately... yes I like him under a high ball.
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Post by veteran on Mar 7, 2019 19:32:11 GMT
As regards fielding , of the recent Kerry forwards only KD was a better fielder than Paul. His fielding , his ability to kick accurately with either foot and his side step , all these attributes elevate him above the ordinary. My heart would sink if this special player is not fully programmed for the championship.
P.S. In fairness Donacha was no slouch in the air either.
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