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Post by kerrygold on Dec 6, 2016 11:38:20 GMT
If he was going he'd be gone I'd say, same boat as the Gooch I'd imagine.
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Post by MrRasherstoyou on Dec 6, 2016 13:16:28 GMT
What is a reputable source? I have read and heard various sources, forums, individuals, what I read in the media down the years about Kildare's private funding. I don't know if what I've heard was the truth, perhaps like alot of things in Ireland it's a matter of interpretation and debatable facts. Seeing as you have such an interest in it, what is your opinion, and what do you know about it? Hearsay is flimsy under footing for casting aspersions on the characters of people? O'Dwyer and McGeeeny didn't bankrupt Kildare. More got to do with the development of their centre of excellence at Halkfield and the collapse of the €21 million sale of St Conletts Park in the centre of Newbridge during the down turn. Define private finding. Is it the fundraising work of various Supporter clubs. The 120k the kildare panel raised themselves for their training fund each year under McGeeney. Sponsored cars from VW and food hampers from Supervalu enjoyed by BB, or Dessie all loved up in the plush Croker suit counting the 120k per week allowance, maybe a benefactor like JP McManus giving millions to Limerick GAA? or is this private funding something even more sinister? Never said they did. I clearly referred to things reported (as posted above) about what appeared to be mis-use of funds, wherever the funding came from. Will we ever know the truth about how things got so bad, when information about anything other than official funding is never really out in the open? But would you argue it's hard to understand how so much resources (and the dogs in the street know it would have taken more than a shilling) were raised during a period of 20 years or more, from about 91 to 2012, when high-profile managers were coaxed to do a job, and yet barely a sign of progress at the underage levels, never mind sustainably at senior? How would you address that? Would it not raise serious questions for you? And when are you going to post your comparisons and reasons for Kerry 75-2016 Vs Dublin 74-2016?
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Post by kerrygold on Dec 6, 2016 13:42:48 GMT
I made my point and listed my team on another thread. If you want to counter that opinion work away, its up to yourself really.
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tpo
Senior Member
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Post by tpo on Dec 6, 2016 14:43:41 GMT
O'Dwyer brought great crowds to Kildare County and club matches, they were seen as successful getting to All Ireland Final and winning 2 leinsters. McGeenenys team never got the county behind them, they were in Div 2 and Back door never making a impact in Leinster. his personality was much more sober than O'Dwyers and couldn't command the hype. Football in the county died a death during his time as manager
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Post by Ballyfireside on Dec 6, 2016 15:51:00 GMT
I just had another browse of this one, straight talking and calls it as it is, I wouldn't be the expert on sports autobiographies but that he got Book of The Year in that category must be a pretty serious commendation for a one-off project. Maybe the honesty factor ringing through was significant and the role model that he is it might make it a worthy read for the youth and they will enjoy a lot of the kicks in it. Books like this also get youngsters on the ladder and there are worse pursuits than reading.
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dano
Senior Member
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Post by dano on Dec 26, 2016 4:17:57 GMT
Just finished the book. great read. Kieran is a true sportsman and a winner. We are blessed to have him on our side.
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fitz
Fanatical Member
Red sky at night get off my land
Posts: 1,719
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Post by fitz on Dec 26, 2016 9:47:14 GMT
Almost finished it. Definitely one of the best I've read. Refreshing honesty. The man has an infectious draw, and as Jack said, he gives everyone a lift. Incredible influence in the Kerry dressing room, the positivity shines throughout. A lesser man would have quit in 2014, an AI that bore the true meaning of an unbreakable team, but still required his Midas touch. His point against Dublin in 2011, almost saved the day when a the tide had turned so savagely against us. One of the finest points ever scored on the sod. The incredible relationship with Gooch. You would say Gooch never needed anyone, but Kieran wold be as close as it comes.
Loved the line to the McGee's in 14 final. "This is Kerry's day boys!". Also a little insight into the depth of his preparation with the study of Durcan's kick outs.
It saddens me to see and hear the hatred with which large sections of Dublin's supporters have for him. Thought the volume of booing on his substitution through injury in this year's semi was disgraceful. He would be God to them in a Dublin shirt.
Less talented than the O'Ses, Dec, Galvin with the football, I'd argue that since Mo Fitz and Seamo, and until Gooch bits adieu, he'll be most missed.
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Dec 26, 2016 12:02:25 GMT
Almost finished it. Definitely one of the best I've read. Refreshing honesty. The man has an infectious draw, and as Jack said, he gives everyone a lift. Incredible influence in the Kerry dressing room, the positivity shines throughout. A lesser man would have quit in 2014, an AI that bore the true meaning of an unbreakable team, but still required his Midas touch. His point against Dublin in 2011, almost saved the day when a the tide had turned so savagely against us. One of the finest points ever scored on the sod. The incredible relationship with Gooch. You would say Gooch never needed anyone, but Kieran wold be as close as it comes. Loved the line to the McGee's in 14 final. "This is Kerry's day boys!". Also a little insight into the depth of his preparation with the study of Durcan's kick outs. It saddens me to see and hear the hatred with which large sections of Dublin's supporters have for him. Thought the volume of booing on his substitution through injury in this year's semi was disgraceful. He would be God to them in a Dublin shirt. Less talented than the O'Ses, Dec, Galvin with the football, I'd argue that since Mo Fitz and Seamo, and until Gooch bits adieu, he'll be most missed. Obviously not as much football as those players but I think underrated all the same. In Tralee in 2012 against Donegal he kicked two points with the outside of his boot from under the stand that were serious scores. I think he hams up his supposed deficit in ability to be honest. Nobody with doubts about their ability would have taken in those shots.
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Post by MrRasherstoyou on Dec 26, 2016 17:02:20 GMT
Nobody from anywhere would doubt Donaghy's talent, and ability to produce when the chips are down. A true warrior, and leader. Some behaviours that make it easy for opposition to see him as the bad boy, simple as that. And most or all opposition fans would worship him in their own team. Except for the Brolly rant after the final. And a couple of interviews, which were childish. Nothing criminal though
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Dec 26, 2016 19:46:14 GMT
Nobody from anywhere would doubt Donaghy's talent, and ability to produce when the chips are down. A true warrior, and leader. Some behaviours that make it easy for opposition to see him as the bad boy, simple as that. And most or all opposition fans would worship him in their own team. Except for the Brolly rant after the final. And a couple of interviews, which were childish. Nothing criminal though I was going to write something along these lines earlier. I have no problem with other counties not liking him. At the same time I have absolutely no problem with his Brolly interview.
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Post by Mickmack on Dec 26, 2016 22:44:01 GMT
Donaghy and Michael darragh mcauley would be similar. Both awesome competitors, winners and neither as naturally gifted as a lot of their team mates but far more effective when the chips are down
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Post by sullyschoice on Dec 26, 2016 23:55:09 GMT
Donaghy is a much more talented footballer than MDMA. MDMA plays a very important role for Dublin but could you see him even trying to kick a point from out around the 45. The ball could go anywhere. He knows that himself and doesnt even attempt to try and kck long-range.
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Post by Mickmack on Dec 27, 2016 1:44:06 GMT
Donaghy is a much more talented footballer than MDMA. MDMA plays a very important role for Dublin but could you see him even trying to kick a point from out around the 45. The ball could go anywhere. He knows that himself and doesnt even attempt to try and kck long-range. I wasnt comparing Donaghy and MDMA as regards natural ability.
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Post by Ballyfireside on Dec 27, 2016 6:41:05 GMT
A Tyrone man once said to me that we had too much class whereas they had workers, his view was that Mike Frank had more class than most of their forwards though the scoreboard mightn't reflect it.
So a classy footballer who works hard is the solution, a crafty grafter, a caste of arts and crafts - now that's closing in on The Kerry Ingredient enigma!
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Post by MrRasherstoyou on Dec 27, 2016 12:00:57 GMT
Nobody from anywhere would doubt Donaghy's talent, and ability to produce when the chips are down. A true warrior, and leader. Some behaviours that make it easy for opposition to see him as the bad boy, simple as that. And most or all opposition fans would worship him in their own team. Except for the Brolly rant after the final. And a couple of interviews, which were childish. Nothing criminal though I was going to write something along these lines earlier. I have no problem with other counties not liking him. At the same time I have absolutely no problem with his Brolly interview. What Brolly interview? I meant the mini-rant into the camera at the end of the final. I thought it lacked class or dignity but at the same time I could fully understand it
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Dec 27, 2016 12:36:46 GMT
I was going to write something along these lines earlier. I have no problem with other counties not liking him. At the same time I have absolutely no problem with his Brolly interview. What Brolly interview? I meant the mini-rant into the camera at the end of the final. I thought it lacked class or dignity but at the same time I could fully understand it I am talking about the same thing. I am only sorry that Donaghy doesn't show the levels of humanity, personality and passion of a, say, Cluxton.
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Post by Ballyfireside on Dec 27, 2016 13:10:20 GMT
What Brolly interview? I meant the mini-rant into the camera at the end of the final. I thought it lacked class or dignity but at the same time I could fully understand it I am talking about the same thing. I am only sorry that Donaghy doesn't show the levels of humanity, personality and passion of a, say, Cluxton. Ah jazus lads give the man a chance, he'd not claiming to be an artificially modified human being or whatever, he's only a footballer, a great footballer. I thought that was an hilarious statement he came out with, a child amongst children, his love of with dogs tells all you need to know of compassion and dignity, tells me anyway. Many people were hard on him when things weren't going great for him, nobody ever thought he could spring back, without him we wouldn't have won '14, that was massive and will mark him down as a true great is the history book. How could it not?
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Post by MrRasherstoyou on Dec 27, 2016 16:25:07 GMT
What Brolly interview? I meant the mini-rant into the camera at the end of the final. I thought it lacked class or dignity but at the same time I could fully understand it I am talking about the same thing. I am only sorry that Donaghy doesn't show the levels of humanity, personality and passion of a, say, Cluxton. Personality, Cluxton? Presume that's a dig. If it is, I will see your dig (in response to an honest comment which wasn't a dig), and raise you what I have always associated great Kerry (and Dublin) players with - class, dignity, stoicism, do your talking on the field etc. Things have turned a funny circle if a Kerryman is running down a Dublin player for not saying much in comparison to a Kerry player being a bit of a mouth!! If it's not a dig then I retract all of the above......
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Dec 27, 2016 16:39:59 GMT
I am talking about the same thing. I am only sorry that Donaghy doesn't show the levels of humanity, personality and passion of a, say, Cluxton. Personality, Cluxton? Presume that's a dig. If it is, I will see your dig (in response to an honest comment which wasn't a dig), and raise you what I have always associated great Kerry (and Dublin) players with - class, dignity, stoicism, do your talking on the field etc. Things have turned a funny circle if a Kerryman is running down a Dublin player for not saying much in comparison to a Kerry player being a bit of a mouth!! If it's not a dig then I retract all of the above...... No it was a dig. I have a problem with those who talk the talk but can't walk the walk. Donaghy was after walking so no problem with his talking...also there was nothing wrong or disrespectful in what he said. It was a moment of honest human passion. I don't see how you calling it childish or a rant isn't a dig. It might be true as far as you are concerned: that doesn't mean it isn't a dig. I think Cluxton has the personality of a bottle of milk and saying it certainly is a dig. Actually I'd be interested in hearing from Kerry people on here who have a problem with what Donaghy said...probably the same type of nudie-nadies who condemned him for flipping the bird in the direction of some wankers throwing coins and other projectiles at him in an away league game up the country.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 27, 2016 18:16:51 GMT
Heat of the moment stuff from donaghy in 2014. In the same way that cluxton kicking the ball away after Tomas handed to him in 2011 should not be held against cluxton either.
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Post by thebluepanther on Dec 27, 2016 21:02:23 GMT
When the Dubs play Kerry. Donaghy is the villian , to be fair to him he takes it and gives it in spades. His antics at times rile a lot of Dubs and he is a guy who loves it. but when the game is over its all forgotton, Donaghy comes across as a decent guy and stating the obvious if he played for Dublin would be loved. His rant at Brolly is no big deal,game needs characters. but if a few here are honest if Connolly done it they would be s*ing thinking you wouldn't see a Kerry lad do that. As for Cluxton , he does serious work outside football for charities and is always accessable for kids for photos , he is one of the last to leave at any organised event So the fact he is emotionless on the pitch is irrelevant, you won't see too many Dubs losing sleep over it. Does his talking on the pitch with a football and happily away from public eye promotes gaa with the kids. The game has all types of characters .
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Post by Mickmack on Dec 27, 2016 21:51:32 GMT
What looked like the entire Dublin squad and Jim Gavin did their stint on the assembly line packing food parcels for the homeless at the capucin day centre run by brother Kevin last week.
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Post by MrRasherstoyou on Dec 28, 2016 4:15:00 GMT
Heat of the moment stuff from donaghy in 2014. In the same way that cluxton kicking the ball away after Tomas handed to him in 2011 should not be held against cluxton either. Didn't kick it away,don't believe all you read. He dropped it, and left it,presumably because he didn't want anything that wasn't about the team,rather than the individual.
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Post by MrRasherstoyou on Dec 28, 2016 4:26:21 GMT
Personality, Cluxton? Presume that's a dig. If it is, I will see your dig (in response to an honest comment which wasn't a dig), and raise you what I have always associated great Kerry (and Dublin) players with - class, dignity, stoicism, do your talking on the field etc. Things have turned a funny circle if a Kerryman is running down a Dublin player for not saying much in comparison to a Kerry player being a bit of a mouth!! If it's not a dig then I retract all of the above...... No it was a dig. I have a problem with those who talk the talk but can't walk the walk. Donaghy was after walking so no problem with his talking...also there was nothing wrong or disrespectful in what he said. It was a moment of honest human passion. I don't see how you calling it childish or a rant isn't a dig. It might be true as far as you are concerned: that doesn't mean it isn't a dig. I think Cluxton has the personality of a bottle of milk and saying it certainly is a dig. Actually I'd be interested in hearing from Kerry people on here who have a problem with what Donaghy said...probably the same type of nudie-nadies who condemned him for flipping the bird in the direction of some wankers throwing coins and other projectiles at him in an away league game up the country. Not being an archiolgy....archiog....archy, ah feck it a historian, I'd say a dig is a sly or back-handed remark, often sarcastic in manner. My comment was a direct, open criticism. Also, it was a small criticism of one action, in the context of a discussion about KD as supposedly bad-boy figure for oppo fans. Your dig, and subsequent follow-up comment basically rubbished a lad's whole personality. Though I started out laughing at the idea of Cluxton and 'personality', I now find myself identifying with and feeling proud of a fella with what I would call 'real personality', not the superficial, immature, attention-seeking type that some seem to laud. Give me Galvin any day over a mouth,now there's a 'personality' who knows the time, and place for action and talk,and always kept his dignity intact, despite frequent spells of notoriety, and controversy, and a relatively big media profile. I'd be embarrassed for any fella going out of his way to make a show of himself on telly in that way, though I'd have more sympathy if it was in the context of defeat. Especially as it was the useless purpose of giving Brolly the satisfaction of response to his wind-uppery.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2016 10:11:29 GMT
Heat of the moment stuff from donaghy in 2014. In the same way that cluxton kicking the ball away after Tomas handed to him in 2011 should not be held against cluxton either. Didn't kick it away,don't believe all you read. He dropped it, and left it,presumably because he didn't want anything that wasn't about the team,rather than the individual. Really? Would like to see that clip again. Could have swore he gave it a big kick
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Dec 28, 2016 11:05:22 GMT
No it was a dig. I have a problem with those who talk the talk but can't walk the walk. Donaghy was after walking so no problem with his talking...also there was nothing wrong or disrespectful in what he said. It was a moment of honest human passion. I don't see how you calling it childish or a rant isn't a dig. It might be true as far as you are concerned: that doesn't mean it isn't a dig. I think Cluxton has the personality of a bottle of milk and saying it certainly is a dig. Actually I'd be interested in hearing from Kerry people on here who have a problem with what Donaghy said...probably the same type of nudie-nadies who condemned him for flipping the bird in the direction of some wankers throwing coins and other projectiles at him in an away league game up the country. Not being an archiolgy....archiog....archy, ah feck it a historian, I'd say a dig is a sly or back-handed remark, often sarcastic in manner. My comment was a direct, open criticism. Also, it was a small criticism of one action, in the context of a discussion about KD as supposedly bad-boy figure for oppo fans. Your dig, and subsequent follow-up comment basically rubbished a lad's whole personality. Though I started out laughing at the idea of Cluxton and 'personality', I now find myself identifying with and feeling proud of a fella with what I would call 'real personality', not the superficial, immature, attention-seeking type that some seem to laud. Give me Galvin any day over a mouth,now there's a 'personality' who knows the time, and place for action and talk,and always kept his dignity intact, despite frequent spells of notoriety, and controversy, and a relatively big media profile. I'd be embarrassed for any fella going out of his way to make a show of himself on telly in that way, though I'd have more sympathy if it was in the context of defeat. Especially as it was the useless purpose of giving Brolly the satisfaction of response to his wind-uppery. "the superficial, immature, attention-seeking type that some seem to laud." Who is this referring to? If KD how is this not rubbishing (or misunderstanding?) his own personality? I know Cluxton has a helluva lot of qualities - really we are comparing his dullness with the big man's effervescent nature. I am quite happy to say these are both different and impressive men in their own ways but am not willing to concede on the Brolly incident.
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Post by himself on Dec 28, 2016 11:16:13 GMT
He did kick it away after Tomas had turned away but only after thanking him, it just wasn't his own kind of thing. I have colossal admiration for Kieran Donaghy (and I thought the book was absolutely superb - which I hadn't really expected, the vast majority of such things are nothing but cash-ins) but I also think Stephen Cluxton is brilliant. Different personalities, but the same pride, determination, and selflessness on the pitch.
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Post by Mickmack on Dec 28, 2016 12:13:31 GMT
Cluxton and donaghy are chalk and cheese. Cluxton has the cold eyes of the assassin and is not an emotional type of man. Donaghy is all emotion. You would expect them to behave differently in the emotional release seconds after the final whistle after they have won the all Ireland.
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fitz
Fanatical Member
Red sky at night get off my land
Posts: 1,719
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Post by fitz on Dec 28, 2016 16:21:55 GMT
If one read Donaghy's book, and what he'd been through that year, and given the article Brolly wrote about him,earlier that year, the reaction and mini-dig was totally justified. And what about it? It was nothing, absolutely nothing.
"Lacked class" Rashers?.. I think you need to get the full context, because that remark Imo is out of order.
I've nothing but admiration for Cluxton, as others said both he and Star are opposite spectrums of personality, both quality, legendary status. How much I want him to fcuk up during a game reflects how good I know he is and how much of a thorn he is in our side. Anyone who has read John Redmond's (Dub sub Confidential) book will have got deep insight into Cluxton's dedication, mindset and provide a clear vista of why he has reached his playing status zenith.
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Post by MrRasherstoyou on Dec 28, 2016 18:09:49 GMT
If one read Donaghy's book, and what he'd been through that year, and given the article Brolly wrote about him,earlier that year, the reaction and mini-dig was totally justified. And what about it? It was nothing, absolutely nothing. "Lacked class" Rashers?.. I think you need to get the full context, because that remark Imo is out of order. I've nothing but admiration for Cluxton, as others said both he and Star are opposite spectrums of personality, both quality, legendary status. How much I want him to fcuk up during a game reflects how good I know he is and how much of a thorn he is in our side. Anyone who has read John Redmond's (Dub sub Confidential) book will have got deep insight into Cluxton's dedication, mindset and provide a clear vista of why he has reached his playing status zenith. Let's put this in context. Donaghy has always been a massive, successful, superhero,(albeit with lean years of course but never did his media or supporter Star wain much) since he exploded on the Snr IC scene in 2006(?), grabbing ball from the sky like Fionn MacCumhaill+lashing in goals for fun, seemingly smashing the Ulster stranglehold, and thrilling neutrals with his old_school style,aided by exceptional physique+basketball skills. Cluxton had a different first few years at the level. He was talented, not a natural goaly, and played with unorthodox style that at times looked a bit reckless. He messed up badly Vs Armagh, and was vilified for it, worst of all by his own coach. But in the aftermath of the nadir that began with that 2003 qualifier defeat, and the fact that the coach held his team back from meeting the Armagh physicality, I always felt at least Cluxton showed passion in his lashing out. In those few+following years he won some All-stars that were often begrudged+dismissed as 'token' by begrudgers(who as Mr Houlihan often said,will always be with us). In the great battle that was the 2007 semi-final,approaching the end, he had no options out the field for a desperately needed pass that could help set up an equalising score,as Kerry pressed everywhere hard. So he hit it long, and it went to a Kerry player, and Kerry set up a brilliant score that clinched the game. Kerry went on to claim a glorious 2nd Sam in succession. Cluxton was criticised widely by media, mocked by keyboard warriors. Donaghy played a great roaming role, and 'stopped' Shane Ryan from getting a shot in that had goal written all over it at a crucial stage late in the game. Cluxton learned the lessons. I thought about that day after the semi-final this year, when Cluxton ran the whole range of performance, unstoppable early as Kerry stood off his targets, meltdown for 5 minutes that lead to a 10 point turnaround, and would have marked the end of an era for any other major player, ruthlessly, nervelessly brilliant in the 2nd half when any mistake could have led to defeat. An ice-cold assassin, a dull personality that never makes a mistake or takes a chance, who never shows emotion? Far from it I would say. Quite an extrovert in many ways that I can see, including a face full of emotion, and always communicating to players. Faultless? Also far from that. Look, we will never agree on a fundamental principle, which for me is dont be a mouth, dont make claims about foul play and then play the 'what happens on the pitch' card after you've already damned the accused, don't act like an ignoramus when you're supposed to be the senior leader on the team, and that includes frequent roaring or influencing the ref like a moaning soccer professional. All behaviour that to me are far from what made Kerry players stand out for me as great, even whilst they danced on my dreams. I'm all for people being extrovert, but that is not the issue here. Or maybe it's just that times have changed, the game has changed, and I'm an anachronism.
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