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Post by jackmurphy on Mar 14, 2014 17:18:04 GMT
There is no doubt that Cork and Tipp football have a major disadvantage with the dual thing. Cadogan was probably the best forward on the night but wasn't even down to start because he hadn't trained with the squad due to hurling committments. An awful lot of Cork's big clubs like Midleton, Sars, the Glen and Na Piarsigh don't make nay effort in football - young lads like Conor Lehane would probably be good footballers if coached properly.
Cork also loose a lot of young lads to rugby - fellows like Peter O Mahony Darren Sweetnam and Simon Zebo could be IC Footballers if they weren't rugby. Maybe JJ Hanrahan is an example of a loss for Kerry but he's the exception.
Kerry were dominant at U21 in the '90's but are now probably 3rd in Munster. It's been identified as a problem but based on Wed Evening - things are getting worse and not better.
It's easy to blame Dara and say that the Cork Lads are bigger, stronger and faster - Cork were far more skilful - Kerry had no one to match Cadogan, McEoin & Crowley - Vaughan is also at a higher level than Kerry Lads. There are issues and they need serious examination.
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mossie
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Post by mossie on Mar 15, 2014 20:04:04 GMT
There is no doubt that Cork and Tipp football have a major disadvantage with the dual thing. Cadogan was probably the best forward on the night but wasn't even down to start because he hadn't trained with the squad due to hurling committments. An awful lot of Cork's big clubs like Midleton, Sars, the Glen and Na Piarsigh don't make nay effort in football - young lads like Conor Lehane would probably be good footballers if coached properly. Cork also loose a lot of young lads to rugby - fellows like Peter O Mahony Darren Sweetnam and Simon Zebo could be IC Footballers if they weren't rugby. Maybe JJ Hanrahan is an example of a loss for Kerry but he's the exception. Kerry were dominant at U21 in the '90's but are now probably 3rd in Munster. It's been identified as a problem but based on Wed Evening - things are getting worse and not better. It's easy to blame Dara and say that the Cork Lads are bigger, stronger and faster - Cork were far more skilful - Kerry had no one to match Cadogan, McEoin & Crowley - Vaughan is also at a higher level than Kerry Lads. There are issues and they need serious examination. some of the hurling clubs you mention in Cork make a great more effort promoting football than football clubs in Kerry do hurling Na Piarsaigh were senior in football up to a few years ago. Are intermediate now I think. Sars sister club Glanmire play plenty of football. Glen Rovers sister club in football are St Nicks. Midleton throw out a junior football team that was good enough to produce Colm O'Neill in the late 1980s early 1990s
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Post by Mickmack on Mar 17, 2014 12:14:32 GMT
This was the Kerry side beaten by 22 points by Cork in 2011 u21 football final.
The Kerry U21 team to play Cork on Wednesday 6th April at 7.30pm in Pairc Uí Rinn is as follows:
1. Brian Kelly (Legion )
2. Peter Crowley (Laune Rangers)3. Mark Griffin (St. Michaels Foilmore) Captain 4. David O’Leary (Dr. Crokes)
5. Jack Sherwood (Firies ) 6. Barry Shanahan (Austin Stacks )7. Jonathan Lyne ( Legion )
8.Thomas Ladden ( Keel ) 9. Edmund Walsh ( Knocknagoshel )
10. James O’Donoghue ( Legion ) 11. Barry John Keane ( Kerins O’Rahillys ) 12. Alan Fitzgerald ( Castlegregory )
13. Stephen O’Brien ( Kenmare ) 14. Daithí Casey ( Dr. Crokes ) 15. Paul Geaney (Daingean Uí Chúis)
Subs;16. Shane O’Leary (Currow) 17.Pa Kilkenny (Glenbeigh/Glencar) 18. Colm Moriarty (Daingean Uí Chúis)
19. James Walsh ( Knocknagoshel ) 20.Kieran Hurley ( St Pats Blennerville ) 21. Colm O’Shea ( Firies )
22. Niall O’Shea ( Dromid Pearses ) 23. James Coffey ( Beaufort ) 24. Barry John Walsh ( Kerins O’Rahillys )
There are three changes to the team: David O’Leary replaces Pa Kilkenny, Thomas Ladden replaces Colm Moriarty and Barry John Keane replaces his club mate Barry John Walsh who is injured.
Manager: John Kennedy (Asdee); Selectors: Liam Brosnan (Currow), Tom Prendergast (Keel)
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Post by sullyschoice on Mar 17, 2014 15:33:26 GMT
Jesus, there's a fair few of those lads still knocking around
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Joxer
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Post by Joxer on Mar 17, 2014 18:57:08 GMT
This was the Kerry side beaten by 22 points by Cork in 2011 u21 football final. The Kerry U21 team to play Cork on Wednesday 6th April at 7.30pm in Pairc Uí Rinn is as follows: 1. Brian Kelly (Legion ) 2. Peter Crowley (Laune Rangers)3. Mark Griffin (St. Michaels Foilmore) Captain 4. David O’Leary (Dr. Crokes) 5. Jack Sherwood (Firies ) 6. Barry Shanahan (Austin Stacks )7. Jonathan Lyne ( Legion ) 8.Thomas Ladden ( Keel ) 9. Edmund Walsh ( Knocknagoshel ) 10. James O’Donoghue ( Legion ) 11. Barry John Keane ( Kerins O’Rahillys ) 12. Alan Fitzgerald ( Castlegregory ) 13. Stephen O’Brien ( Kenmare ) 14. Daithí Casey ( Dr. Crokes ) 15. Paul Geaney (Daingean Uí Chúis) Subs;16. Shane O’Leary (Currow) 17.Pa Kilkenny (Glenbeigh/Glencar) 18. Colm Moriarty (Daingean Uí Chúis) 19. James Walsh ( Knocknagoshel ) 20.Kieran Hurley ( St Pats Blennerville ) 21. Colm O’Shea ( Firies ) 22. Niall O’Shea ( Dromid Pearses ) 23. James Coffey ( Beaufort ) 24. Barry John Walsh ( Kerins O’Rahillys ) There are three changes to the team: David O’Leary replaces Pa Kilkenny, Thomas Ladden replaces Colm Moriarty and Barry John Keane replaces his club mate Barry John Walsh who is injured. Manager: John Kennedy (Asdee); Selectors: Liam Brosnan (Currow), Tom Prendergast (Keel) Pretty big message there for everyone.....
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Mar 17, 2014 19:25:45 GMT
We need players not teams from underage. Look at Tyrone after all their underage success.
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Post by kerrygold on Mar 17, 2014 20:20:54 GMT
This was the Kerry side beaten by 22 points by Cork in 2011 u21 football final. The Kerry U21 team to play Cork on Wednesday 6th April at 7.30pm in Pairc Uí Rinn is as follows: 1. Brian Kelly (Legion ) 2. Peter Crowley (Laune Rangers)3. Mark Griffin (St. Michaels Foilmore) Captain 4. David O’Leary (Dr. Crokes) 5. Jack Sherwood (Firies ) 6. Barry Shanahan (Austin Stacks )7. Jonathan Lyne ( Legion ) 8.Thomas Ladden ( Keel ) 9. Edmund Walsh ( Knocknagoshel ) 10. James O’Donoghue ( Legion ) 11. Barry John Keane ( Kerins O’Rahillys ) 12. Alan Fitzgerald ( Castlegregory ) 13. Stephen O’Brien ( Kenmare ) 14. Daithí Casey ( Dr. Crokes ) 15. Paul Geaney (Daingean Uí Chúis) Subs;16. Shane O’Leary (Currow) 17.Pa Kilkenny (Glenbeigh/Glencar) 18. Colm Moriarty (Daingean Uí Chúis) 19. James Walsh ( Knocknagoshel ) 20.Kieran Hurley ( St Pats Blennerville ) 21. Colm O’Shea ( Firies ) 22. Niall O’Shea ( Dromid Pearses ) 23. James Coffey ( Beaufort ) 24. Barry John Walsh ( Kerins O’Rahillys ) There are three changes to the team: David O’Leary replaces Pa Kilkenny, Thomas Ladden replaces Colm Moriarty and Barry John Keane replaces his club mate Barry John Walsh who is injured. Manager: John Kennedy (Asdee); Selectors: Liam Brosnan (Currow), Tom Prendergast (Keel) Pretty big message there for everyone..... I didn't realise there were that many of them from the current senior panel playing that night. Kerry won't lack for motivation when playing Cork in the upcoming NFL game.
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Post by glengael on Mar 17, 2014 20:24:19 GMT
As I think I've said before, underage success needs to be managed properly. It is, in itself ,not a guarantee of success.
Nobody is disputing the talent of that 2011 Kerry Under-21 team. I'm looking forward to some day seeing a lot of them display that talent in winning a senior All Ireland.
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Post by Mickmack on Mar 17, 2014 21:45:05 GMT
Is Corks domination at u21 simply down to timing and logistics. Most of the Kerry panel are away at college in Jan, Feb and March in Cork and Limerick and further afield. Most of the Cork panel are at colleges in Cork City. Its much easier for Cork to get together etc. That time of the year is tough on students with end of year exams on the horizon so trying to make training in Killarney etc adds to the pressure. Another factor is that students eat badly when away from home.
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Post by glengael on Mar 18, 2014 9:55:07 GMT
Is Corks domination at u21 simply down to timing and logistics. Most of the Kerry panel are away at college in Jan, Feb and March in Cork and Limerick and further afield. Most of the Cork panel are at colleges in Cork City. Its much easier for Cork to get together etc. That time of the year is tough on students with end of year exams on the horizon so trying to make training in Killarney etc adds to the pressure. Another factor is that students eat badly when away from home. Other counties have to cope with this as well Mick to be fair. At that rate Cork, Limerick, Galway, Kildare and Dublin should be winning everything at this level as they have the oldest 3rd level colleges in the country. As for students not eating well, yes that may be the case. But I do know of at least one county where this is dealt with proactively. When young players are given their training plans or whatever they are called, nutrition is treated as key a part of the plan as the gym routine and it is monitored accordingly. And if assistance is needed with regard to a players diet, it is readily given.
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Mar 18, 2014 10:16:47 GMT
I'd rather have well rounded people/footballers coming out of college and U-21 rather than having them leading the life of a semi-professional drone.
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Post by glengael on Mar 18, 2014 10:59:56 GMT
I'd rather have well rounded people/footballers coming out of college and U-21 rather than having them leading the life of a semi-professional drone. From what I've seen it doesn't have to be an either/or in that regard. There are ways of combining an education, personal development,some semblance of self awareness with the discipline necessary for sporting success.
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Post by clancarre on Mar 18, 2014 11:35:40 GMT
If the performances of seniors in past two weeks is credible, maybe we are doing things correctly. Was at that under 21 game in 2011 and we were nowhere near Cork in the physical stakes. But we seem to have made up the lost ground. I recall Liam Flaherty and Paul Galvin being somewhat light and weak at under 21, they later became physical giants. Remainder of league will tell a lot.
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mossie
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Post by mossie on Mar 18, 2014 19:21:04 GMT
If the performances of seniors in past two weeks is credible, maybe we are doing things correctly. Was at that under 21 game in 2011 and we were nowhere near Cork in the physical stakes. But we seem to have made up the lost ground. I recall Liam Flaherty and Paul Galvin being somewhat light and weak at under 21, they later became physical giants. Remainder of league will tell a lot. things are not right. Paul Galvin played on a team that won a Munster Minor title and lost a real quality humdinger of all Ireland semi to Tyrone. He also played on a team that narrowly lost an all Ireland under 21 final to Westmeath. Present day 21s are not playing in all Ireland under 21 finals The last 4 all Ireland senior titles have been won by Dublin, Donegal and Cork. All 3 have been in the shake up for all Ireland under 21 titles whilst we have not. Donegal were a kick of a ball away from winning an under 21 all Ireland a few years ago when Michael Murphy's penalty hit the crossbar against Dublin. These are the counties that are bringing through the real quality players not us. This argument that we are bringing through the players so lack of under 21 success isn't an issue does not stack up. Its the aforementioned counties that are bringing through the players. If we were bringing them through we wouldn't have come up short in big games in Croke Park the last 4 years running and struggling to replacing retiring and ageing legends
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Post by kerry97 on Mar 18, 2014 23:41:00 GMT
Is Corks domination at u21 simply down to timing and logistics. Most of the Kerry panel are away at college in Jan, Feb and March in Cork and Limerick and further afield. Most of the Cork panel are at colleges in Cork City. Its much easier for Cork to get together etc. That time of the year is tough on students with end of year exams on the horizon so trying to make training in Killarney etc adds to the pressure. Another factor is that students eat badly when away from home. Logistics and fast food the downfall of Kerry Football, as Miriam O' Callagan would say 'Genuinely ?' . The bottom line here was Cork were as a collective a far better footballing side.
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Post by onesided on Mar 19, 2014 11:07:41 GMT
I was at the game in 2011, eventually due to the crazy traffic and on the night Cork were simply outstanding. I vividly remember them kicking points from the 45 and beyond and from very acute angles. Barry O'Driscoll was immense and I think he got a goal on the night along with a glut of points. They also had Aidan Walsh in imperious form at midfield with Ciaran Sheehan, Mark Collins and Donal Og Hodnett - the other goalscorer - running riot up front. At the back they had Damian Cahillane - just out of minor at the time - Tom Clancy and Jamie Wall. Correct me if I am wrong but all of these were training with and competing for starting places with the senior team at the time.
Of the Kerry team of the same night I can only think of a single player who would have been in the running for the Kerry seniors at the time and that was Peter Crowley. I am open to correction on this.
The point that I am trying to make is that Kerry's U21 teams of the past decade did not had the exposure to senior inter county as the standard of Kerry's Golden Generation Mark II was so high. Training with and playing with the seniors undoubtedly brings a young player on in leaps and bounds and Kerry are maybe missing a trick with not having a crop of the U21s training with the seniors.
This year again their was seemingly an agreement in place for none of the U21s to be involved with the senior panel and I find it hard to understand this logic. I know it can sometimes happen that some players are looking to their senior stars to make it happen and grab the game by the scruff of the neck for them but that would be the case at whatever level you are playing at.
This may sound sac-religious but is Darragh the right man for the job at hand. He was a legend in his own time as a player but what coaching knowledge does the man have? This was his first coaching role and it is a pretty damn important one to get right. Eamonn Fitz is the right man for the senior job, Jack O'Connor is a superb coach at minor level but are there other coaches with a proven underage record for coaching. I'm thinking Donal Daly, Micheal Quirke and Vince Cooper. What are people's thoughts on his retention now that he has served his 2 year term?
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Post by An Ciarraíoch Taistealaíoch on Mar 19, 2014 18:39:11 GMT
Of the Kerry team of the same night I can only think of a single player who would have been in the running for the Kerry seniors at the time and that was Peter Crowley. I am open to correction on this. Lyne was marking Sheehan. I remember being iumpressed by Daithi Casey and BJW (when he came on)
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Post by sullyschoice on Mar 19, 2014 18:49:30 GMT
Speaking of BJW. Where is he now. Having seen him play in a Minor final in Killarney I predicted he would be even bettet than his older brother.
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Post by Mickmack on Mar 19, 2014 19:14:40 GMT
Is Corks domination at u21 simply down to timing and logistics. Most of the Kerry panel are away at college in Jan, Feb and March in Cork and Limerick and further afield. Most of the Cork panel are at colleges in Cork City. Its much easier for Cork to get together etc. That time of the year is tough on students with end of year exams on the horizon so trying to make training in Killarney etc adds to the pressure. Another factor is that students eat badly when away from home. Logistics and fast food the downfall of Kerry Football, as Miriam O' Callagan would say 'Genuinely ?' . The bottom line here was Cork were as a collective a far better footballing side. If these sides met in 2014 it would be a far closer affair and Kerry might even win. So what does this tell us if anything? #################################### CORK — S Mellett; L Jennings, D Cahalane, A Cronin; P Daly, T Clancy, J Wall; M Ó Laoire, A Walsh; C Sheehan, M Collins, J O’Rourke; B O’Driscoll, D Óg Hodnett, P Honohan. Subs: D O’Donovan for Cronin (40), E Buckley for O’Driscoll (49), S Beston for Honohan (52), B Coughlan for Sheehan (54), D Nation for Walsh (56). KERRY — B Kelly; P Crowley, M Griffin, D O’Leary; J Sherwood, B Shanahan, J Lyne; T Ladden, E Walsh; J O’Donoghue, BJ Keane, A Fitzgerald; S O’Brien, P Geaney, D Casey. Subs: J Walsh for Lyne (15-26), J Walsh for E Walsh (27), BJ Walsh for Fitzgerald (27), P Kilkenny for Shanahan (h-t), C Moriarty for Sherwood (50), K Hurley for O’Brien (34).
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Post by greengold35 on Mar 19, 2014 21:41:47 GMT
Speaking of BJW. Where is he now. Having seen him play in a Minor final in Killarney I predicted he would be even bettet than his older brother. Barry John Walsh is currently touring South America! He suffered from various injuries for past 2/3 years and has not been at his best; he was in Australia for a while in 2013 & on his return played really well for Rahillys- Rahillys will hope to have him back for the championship this year.
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Post by southward on Mar 19, 2014 22:29:16 GMT
kerryeye made the suggestion on the Kerry Juniors thread that the U21s should become the junior team for the rest of the year. Assuming there's no eligibility issues around this, this seems like a sensible idea. A run in the junior competition might bridge the gap to senior involvement nicely.
The downside of this of course is you might be disappointing lads who would otherwise make the junior side. However, greater good and all that. It sucks that the U21s get only one game and then disband.
Sligo juniors trained with the seniors ahead of their AI final a couple of years ago (and won). Perhaps Kerry could consider something similar in tandem with the above.
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fitz
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Post by fitz on Mar 20, 2014 0:34:45 GMT
Some observations, obvious and maybe not so.. 1)It's got to be better to produce good minor and u21 teams than not. 2) Men are rarely finished product at u21. The Kerry u21s from 11 that are now flourishing at senior are case in point 3) For all Tyrone's underage quality structure, it was one perfect storm of great players from 99 that backboned their 3 AI titles. How many new gems have come since that might make one of those teams? I can think of very few, and they are only possibles: Peter Harte, Mattie Donnelly, Darren McCurry, Kyle Coney? Maybe Frank Byrnes from last year's minors will develop 4) U21 teams whilst contributing more than minors for sure, rarely provide bulk numbers to seniors 5) Keeping 21s separate to seniors is hard to fathom as positive in any way that I can see 6) I agree more nutritious diet plans are better at u21 than not but I agree with 'scaultil, fellas have to live their lives a bit especially at that age and still take the football seriously. Compulsion at that age can lead to resistance and stymie creativity and flair 6) For a very dominant county at u21 in last decade, Cork have one AI. Lot of ingredients to senior success equation clearly fall outside the u21 process and equation 7) Tradition ay senior is tangible and perpetual, bumps in the road aside
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Post by tyroneperson on Mar 20, 2014 2:05:15 GMT
3) For all Tyrone's underage quality structure, it was one perfect storm of great players from 99 that backboned their 3 AI titles. How many new gems have come since that might make one of those teams? I can think of very few, and they are only possibles: Peter Harte, Mattie Donnelly, Darren McCurry, Kyle Coney? Maybe Frank Byrnes from last year's minors will develop Yup, got beaten by Cavan for the third year in a row last night. Apparently the team has only been training since November which doesn't sound right. We definitely have issues at under-21 level. Conor McAliskey's an excellent young footballer - he's been top scorer in the Tyrone championship the last two years but for whatever reason doesn't start as often as he should. Ronan O'Neill should be a good player too and he's still only 21. Conor McKenna was excellent for the minors last year and is eligible again this year though I heard a rumour that he might try Aussie Rules next year which is a worry. We just need a few more Riceys and Conor Gormleys, like them or loathe them. Niall Sludden, a wing back who played on the 2010 minor team, unfortunately broke his leg last summer and I'd be hopeful he'll come through though. but it probably won't be this year. I'd agree we were blessed with that 97/98 team (not 99 heh) - also had Canavagh, Canavan and Dooher as well - as you said the perfect storm. Kerry and Tyrone are in a similar boat at the moment - it's hard to follow up teams with a lot of success. Anyway that's a fascinating update on Tyrone football.
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Post by The16thMan on Mar 20, 2014 2:42:15 GMT
Cork U21 team that played Kerry U21's in 2011:
1. Sean Mellet Carrigaline
2. Liam Jennings Ballincollig 3. Damian Cahalane Castlehven 4. Alan Cronin Nemo Rangers
5. Peter Daly St. Marys 6. Tom Clancy Clonakilty 7. Jamie Wall Kulbrittain
8. Micheál O Laoire Naomh Abán 9. Aidan Walsh Kanturk
10. Ciarán Sheehan Éire Óg 11. Mark Collins Castlehaven 12. John O Rourke Carbery Rangers
13. Donal Og Hodnett O Donovan Rossa 14. Barry O'Driscoll Nemo Rangers 15. Paul Honohan Bishopstown
Subs
16. Darren Farry Nemo Rangers 17. Danny O Donovan Ilen Rovers 18. Thomas Clancy Fermoy 19. John Cronin Lisgoold 20. David Nation Nemo Rangers 21. Brian Coughlan Kinsale 22. Kevin Hallissey Eire Og 23. Eoin Buckley St Michaels 24. Shane Beston Mitchelstown
Cork Senior team that played Mayo on 16/3/14:
1. Ken O'Halloran (Bishopstown) 2. Michael Shields (St. Finbarr's - Captain) 3. Eoin Cadogan (Douglas) 4. Kevin Crowley (Millstreet) 5. Conor Dorman (Bishopstown) 6. Tom Clancy (Clonakilty) 7. Alan Cronin (Nemo Rangers) 8. Andrew O'Sullivan (Castletownbere) 9. Aidan Walsh (Kanturk) 10. Colm O'Driscoll (Tadhg MacCárthaigh) 11. Paul Kerrigan (Nemo Rangers) 12. Tomás Clancy (Fermoy) 13. Colm O'Neill (Ballyclough) 14. Brian Hurley (Castlehaven) 15. Donncha O'Connor (Ballydesmond)
Subs 16. David Hanrahan (Douglas) 17. John McLoughlin (Kanturk) 18. James Loughrey (Mallow) 19. Kevin O'Driscoll (Tadhg MacCárthaigh) 20. Fintan Goold (Macroom) 21. Micheál O Laoire (Naomh Abán) 22. Barry O'Driscoll (Nemo Rangers) 23. Mark Collins (Castlehaven) 24. John O'Rourke (Carbery Rangers) 25. John Hayes (Carbery Rangers) 26. Daniel Goulding (Eire Óg)
From such a successful U21 team that beat Kerry by 22 points they only had 7 players(4 subs) in the panel the last day from the 2011 squad.
[ Alan Cronin, Tom Clancy, Aidan Walsh, Micheál Ó Laoire, Mark Collins, Barry O' Driscoll and John O'Rourke].
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Mar 20, 2014 7:27:37 GMT
I was about to write that Cork might be dominant at U21 in Munster but in the last 20 years they have won only three AI titles, losing two finals. In the same period Kerry have won four and lost two.
Although that is of course too long a timeline (!): in the last eight years they have won two and lost two which is impressive.
Another county with a great underage record is Galway. On the other hand Offaly ain't so hot.
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Post by delorean on Mar 20, 2014 10:51:44 GMT
Yeah we've been dominant in Munster but got a few rude awakenings thereafter. Of the two finals we did win, it took a last minute goal against Down in 2009 and we were particular lucky against Laois in 2007. We've been far from dominant outside of Munster. From such a successful U21 team that beat Kerry by 22 points they only had 7 players(4 subs) in the panel the last day from the 2011 squad. [ Alan Cronin, Tom Clancy, Aidan Walsh, Micheál Ó Laoire, Mark Collins, Barry O' Driscoll and John O'Rourke]. The second Clancy (Fermoy) would bring it up to eight, if you include subs in 2011. Hodnett had been playing regularly also but is injured. Cahalane will also be involved but played a club game at the weekend as he is working his way back from injury. That's ten and obviously Ciaran Sheehan would be an automatic starter had he not headed off to Carlton. That's pretty strong representation from one underage panel really.
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Post by jackmurphy on Mar 20, 2014 19:58:03 GMT
Logistics and fast food the downfall of Kerry Football, as Miriam O' Callagan would say 'Genuinely ?' . The bottom line here was Cork were as a collective a far better footballing side. If these sides met in 2014 it would be a far closer affair and Kerry might even win. So what does this tell us if anything? #################################### CORK — S Mellett; L Jennings, D Cahalane, A Cronin; P Daly, T Clancy, J Wall; M Ó Laoire, A Walsh; C Sheehan, M Collins, J O’Rourke; B O’Driscoll, D Óg Hodnett, P Honohan. Subs: D O’Donovan for Cronin (40), E Buckley for O’Driscoll (49), S Beston for Honohan (52), B Coughlan for Sheehan (54), D Nation for Walsh (56). KERRY — B Kelly; P Crowley, M Griffin, D O’Leary; J Sherwood, B Shanahan, J Lyne; T Ladden, E Walsh; J O’Donoghue, BJ Keane, A Fitzgerald; S O’Brien, P Geaney, D Casey. Subs: J Walsh for Lyne (15-26), J Walsh for E Walsh (27), BJ Walsh for Fitzgerald (27), P Kilkenny for Shanahan (h-t), C Moriarty for Sherwood (50), K Hurley for O’Brien (34). her 2/3 of both sides have reached Senior Level with 2 of the top IC sides in the country. It's impossible to say which county is producing the better IC players at this stage - perhaps by the end of the season we'll know whether Kerrys lack of success is a serious issue/
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Post by kerrygold on Mar 20, 2014 20:32:28 GMT
To some degree the 2014 Munster Senior Final could be a rerun of the 2011 U21 Munster Final, a fascinating mid-summer prospect.
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Post by jackmurphy on Mar 20, 2014 21:54:31 GMT
To some degree the 2014 Munster Senior Final could be a rerun of the 2011 U21 Munster Final, a fascinating mid-summer prospect. Prob not KG. Whilst both counties have introduced 10 or 11 to the Senior Set-up - many are yet to establish themselves. I'd see only Clancy, Walsh and O Rourke as definate starters for Cork - Collins will prob start but that depends on how well P Kelly recovers. Cahalane might get in too although some think he might stick with hurling - J Cleary is his uncle and there is fair annoyance with the way he was treated. Kerry will start Crowley, Griffin and JOD - O Brien and Geaney have a chance too but Darran, Declan, Donncha and Bryan will prob all start - with JOD in there's only 1 slot in the forwards. Both counties have got about the same return from their 2011 U21 squads with neither enjoying an obvious advantage - If JOD continues his progress he could be the stand-out greaduate from the class of '11 - many counties would settle for 1 super star and half a dozen solid IC performers - Kerry may get that. 2011 shows that you can't predict with confidence but Cork look to have a few real IC contenders from this year's U21 side but maybe we'll think differently after the Munster Final - Kerry look to have few candidates from this years fe 21's but we could be singing a different tune in 3 years.
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fitz
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Post by fitz on Mar 21, 2014 0:37:25 GMT
One thing is for sure, the speed of JOD's development into at present, again at present, arguably one of the best or even the best forward in the country is incredible. His performances both of quality and consistency are hugely impressive as well as mental steel and maturity.Gooch did have a great 02 first year but quieter 03, so it is a seriously high bar comparison. Gooch though was a lot younger too in his first full year
Can anyone think of examples of players of that age and stage of senior county team development that would have executed that penalty in front of the hill in a AI semi. Christ, I was barely able to look.
Rashers asked who would be Kerry's killer forward on the scoreboard with Gooch out the field, for semi last year,replied 'JOD' but didn't envisage what he delivered then or since. Sorry, little self serving, but highlighting a good u21 taking monumental steps thereafter
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