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Post by kingdomkerry on Aug 18, 2006 13:22:51 GMT
This is what Joe Kernan had to say.
Kernan unhappy at provincial winner’s lot
Armagh manager Joe Kernan
18 August 2006
Armagh manager Joe Kernan believes that teams that win the provincial football championships are getting hard done by, describing them as ’like a turkey waiting for a stuffing’ against sides coming through from the qualifiers.
For the second time in three years, Armagh have exited at the quarter-final stage despite claiming Ulster honours. Fermanagh caught them out in 2004 and two weeks ago they were put to the sword by a Kerry team which reinvented itself after losing the Munster final to Cork.
Kerry had plenty of match practice while Kernan believes his side are getting little reward for winning the Ulster title.
“We’ve been effectively punished for consistency. In terms of our All-Ireland title prospects winning an Ulster title again was no help,” said Kernan.
“There is something wrong when winning your provincial title doesn’t give you some benefit.
“I feel it there was a form of provincial home advantage maybe it could offer extra incentive for the provincial champions.”
I totally agree and jack o connor some something simular recently. I have been saying this since the qualifiers started. In order to make it fair the provincial winners should get home advantage in the quater final.
That would mean that kerry v armagh should of been on in crossmaglen instead of croke park.
Similarly when kerry played dublin in thurles in the 1/4 finals a few years back that game would have been played in killarney.
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Post by austinstacksabu on Aug 18, 2006 13:34:55 GMT
Have you been to Cross recently? There isn't a ground in Armagh that could cope with that match. We'd all be off to Clones.....and if you've never been to a match in Clones......well, apart from the walk up the hill (where Barry McGuigan trained and which Tommy Lyons had the Dubs march up once before a game in their full kit) and a pint in the brilliantly named "Busted Sofa", Clones is a hoor to into, a hoor to get out of and one of saddest towns in Ireland.
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Post by kerrygold on Aug 18, 2006 13:46:15 GMT
ooo stacks,take her handy there,thats hard on the people living there,you must remember clones town was almost completely surrounded by the border for a very long time,most roads in and out were block by british army check points,as a result shops and business's died a death there,its only in the last five or six years the town is coming back to life a wee bit.
I know a people living in clones,there not sad people at all.
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Post by butchy on Aug 18, 2006 13:54:07 GMT
Not sure what can be done to help the provincial winners. I mean before the Kerry game all they were saying was how much experience Armagh had in Croke Park. I mean they've had the last 3 Ulster finals there and one of them went to a replay also in Croke park. Not Complaints then from Joe. Mayo were aa team also insisting on having there 1/4 final there. Also if you moved 1/4 finals to home advantage then they'd be giving out about lack of games in Croker when the semi final comes around !! Its hard to know what can be done to help the provincial winners. I suppose Armagh were just unlucky to get Kerry at that stage !!
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Post by TheCritic on Aug 18, 2006 14:11:12 GMT
Ah Boo hoo, Armagh just got unlucky, nobody expected Kerry to lose the Munster final and have to face them.
All the other provential winners are still in the AI series!
Armagh just not good enough get over it!!!
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Post by butchy on Aug 18, 2006 14:20:46 GMT
Critic i don't what "provential winners" are but i certainly hope Kerry don't meet any of them. Being a Kerry man i well over Armagh being knocked out !! You do have to admit big difference between Kerry and Westmeath !!
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Post by inforthebreaks on Aug 18, 2006 14:22:07 GMT
Have you been to Cross recently? There isn't a ground in Armagh that could cope with that match. We'd all be off to Clones.....and if you've never been to a match in Clones......well, apart from the walk up the hill (where Barry McGuigan trained and which Tommy Lyons had the Dubs march up once before a game in their full kit) and a pint in the brilliantly named "Busted Sofa", Clones is a hoor to into, a hoor to get out of and one of saddest towns in Ireland. This coming from a man from Tralee!!!!!! sorry stacks. just joking. |
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Post by TheCritic on Aug 18, 2006 14:43:14 GMT
Critic i don't what "provential winners" are but i certainly hope Kerry don't meet any of them. Being a Kerry man i well over Armagh being knocked out !! You do have to admit big difference between Kerry and Westmeath !! Sorry butchy my spelling isn't up to much today, should have read Provincial Winners. And if Armagh had beat us on the day would we be hearing the same SH!TE from Joe Kernan!! Sour Grapes! |
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RashersTierney
Senior Member
Ballymun is the North Kerry of Dublin,but quieter!
Posts: 369
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Post by RashersTierney on Aug 18, 2006 14:48:28 GMT
Critic i don't what "provential winners" are but i certainly hope Kerry don't meet any of them. Being a Kerry man i well over Armagh being knocked out !! You do have to admit big difference between Kerry and Westmeath !! Yeah, and a big difference between Mayo & Tyrone last year |
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moth
Senior Member
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Post by moth on Aug 18, 2006 14:49:15 GMT
Joe is correct. However, Roscommon complained bitterly the first year that despite winning the Connacht final that they never got to play in Croker.
The best option would be to offer the provincial champions the choice between Croke Park or a venue in their provence. For Armagh, the choice would have been between Clones and Croker, for Cork Thurles and Croker, for Dublin ...
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pony
Senior Member
Posts: 385
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Post by pony on Aug 18, 2006 15:03:43 GMT
think this year Armagh possibly were training twards meeting cork or someone other than Kerry in the q-final(no disrespect to cork).
point must be made that when Kerry play provincial loosers in the q-final its seen as an easy run to the AI final no matter who they are!
so to sum it up BOO HOO big Joe!
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Post by butchy on Aug 18, 2006 15:06:28 GMT
We certainly wouldn't. The qualifier system was brought into help the weaker counties and not doubt it has for most part with Fermangh and a few more doing very well out of it but it has also helped the stronger counties Galway and Tyrone especially winning AI. Kerry and Armagh both got to AI finals thru back door. In Fact only in 2004 has there been 2 provincial winners in the final. I wouldn't say it sour grapes by Kernan. In fairness he has a point
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diehard
Senior Member
"Have you ever seen a man eat his own head?"
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Post by diehard on Aug 18, 2006 15:10:58 GMT
yeah Tralee has to be the most depressing town in ireland
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patc
On Probation
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Post by patc on Aug 18, 2006 15:50:58 GMT
I probably class allot of what Joe/Mickey say in relation to their teams as very one sided/contrived, but to be fair he has a point....from a basic tournament point of view the current c'ship system is flawed, and in a way it does penalise the early pace setters in terms form, as in the provincial c'ship winners.
Any competition must afford all entrants the same allowances......if one team is allowed to lose one competitive game, then all teams must benefit from the same rule....since its introduction we have seen now seen the majority of the eventual c'ship winners coming through the qualifiers. Is it not reasonable then to suggest that it seems to place the straight provincial winners at a disadvantage in terms of their ability to fine tune their game, and biuld up a head of steam?
There is no doubt that the bigger teams, who may often struggle for form/hunger in the early stages, get the required shot in the arm by being beaten, build a little form in the qulaifiers and ultimatley arrive for the Qtr's in HQ with a more finely tuned game/hungrier attitude.....
Not speaking as a Kerry man, but I do think Kerry will beat Cork on Sun, and this is due to certain positional changes of course, but also allot to do with basic hunger and pride, and now bouyed by the Armagh victory, Cork are facing a very different Kerry team....
I certainly don't know what the answer is? But just for arguments & discussions sake, is there merit in exploring/discussing the idea of 'Champions League' style format...whereby the provincial c'ship is retained of course, but run as a seperate localised competition?
We then have 8 pools of 4 teams, or 4 pools of 8 teams, which all play each other once, with the top two graduating, on a seeded basis, to a knock out stage/s, running on straight elimination to the ALL Ireland Final.
If it were a pool of 8 teams, it could replace the National League, and make these games more meaningful, also forcing managers to now play a squad game, making the full 30 panel members, much more relevant....
There would be drawbacks, in terms of crowd attendance to so many games and so forth but I think that whatever system is employed, it should, and has to offer equal opportunities to all participating teams.....
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KevinT
Senior Member
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Post by KevinT on Aug 18, 2006 20:12:14 GMT
yeah Tralee has to be the most depressing town in ireland If there's a town in Ireland with more All Ireland medals(or indeed a street ) I'd love to hear about it. I Love being from this "depressing town" with its Street of Champions ! Great place to be "depressed "! |
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Post by Mickmack on Aug 18, 2006 20:30:05 GMT
I agree with Joe Kernan.
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Post by sullyschoice on Aug 18, 2006 21:07:25 GMT
To be honest I cant see Ballyheigue being the place to be either, pattern or no pattern.
I was never in favour of this proposal before but now I believe it has merits.
Scrap League and in the early part of the year run the provincial championships. Then come April/May run the group stages of the championship (comletely separate). Poor teams get to play a hell of a lot more games each year which may benefit them.
Would people be in favour of a straight open draw for the groups or a seeding process. I am sure the boffins in the various committeeeees of the GAA must have thought of this idea before but maybe ther were vetoed by the die hard dinosaurs who would accuse the proposal of being too like soccer. Well we use the same shaped ball after all dont we!!!!
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