It's been a great game of chance,but Jacks are low

[RashersTierney]

austinstacksabu said:

joan said:

I had a feeling that Mayo would pull it out yesterday. well done to both teams great game to listen to.
Ps where is Rashers.

Locked into the Sunset house until next Thursday.....

:(Actually the Annesley House is the place, has great bands playing these days.

"I never turned to drink. It seemed to turn to me."

Fantastic game, Mayo played possibly even better than Tyrone in last year's quarter final replay, the two best performances I've seen in person in many, many years. Kerry V Armagh this year should be up there too, but I only saw that on telly.
Incredible atmosphere. I was working on a long shift for the day that I couldnt get out of but got the couple of hours off (undercover!) and managed to get the only ticket left by trawling around the streets & pubs for about an hour and a half. Lucky for me, as it would have been much harder to take not being there.

:-XGlad to see yis are all showing yer true colours here with rubbing in our hard defeat. How anyone can say that Eugene Magee is a Dublin fan is bordering on blatant misrepresentation
Kerrygold doesnt really seem to have much else to say these days but all the things he/she hates about the Dubs, and yet..................he/she was so friendly way back in the bright gleams of early summer. Must be the green mist of August come over him/her.........
Not one of you has mentioned how gracious we have been in defeat, how dignified Pillar was/is. No whingeing & moaning, like so many coaches, no sly comments about the ref or incidents.
As for the melee at the start, if Mayo decide to become the first team in 22 years of championship to come down that end against Dublin then of course there will be argy bargy. Pillar barged a Mayo physio who was shoving a Dublin player out the way. A PLAYER! who could get injured or put off before the game. What would yous have wanted Jack O'C to do? Walk away and pretend he didnt see it?

Whelo went in for an almost 50-50 ball to break the ball with his fist, both players were flying at full tilt, giving everything, his fist struck McGarrity as the lad's head went down as he caught the ball. But I know its easier just to have a go at the nation's easiest scapegoat. In the 70s it was Mullins, in the 80s Duffer, in the 90s choose any of Charlie, Jayo, Vinny etc, and nowadays its Whelo (and still Jayo!) He will be back to defy yis yet, great Raheny man that he is.

The rituals before games, look, it's whatever works for them, they were trying to deal with all the expectation & hype, the distraction of the Hill, not to ignore it, but harness it. It was a brave idea I suppose


Since the start of this year I had been saying Mayo were really a team to watch. I felt far too much was made of the pasting they took from us in Parnell Park on a muddy, spalshy pitch in March, also that they would/could use that as major motivation for when the likely showdown came in the summer. All year so far since that game, Mayo have been mocked and derided by the nation as being perennial chokers - I reckoned this, and the breakthrough of their Under-21s winning their first All-I at any level in 14 attempts, could be the making of them.
The build-up was almost perfect for them, all the tight games, and Dublin getting none as all opponents except Longford way back folded pathetically. Mayo timed their effort to perfection. SOme of the scores & some of their play especially, as well as some of Dublins, was pure joy. I had a fantastic seat with a great view of the skill & effort by all players.
I wont go into the reasons why it went wrong for us too much. If Vaughan had got that 50 over, if Russell had given us the blatant free in front of the posts when Sennan was held down, if the three efforts that hit the woodwork had gone in, if Ryan hadnt blocked Clucko's view as he tried to dive & anticipate the shot for Mayo's goal, we'd all be back next week for a thoroughly deserved replay.

No doubt we can look at the seemingly crazy decision-making of putting Ryan & Whelo in defence, taking off Ryan (possibly injured), taking off Cosgrove who although kicking some terrible wides, did some good stuff too & could have been the hero to make up for 2002 by kicking one/both of those kicks at the end. Felt Marko should have played at least one or both of them short and taken a return himself.
Collie Moran should have come in earlier, Shaugho should have come in, and what I have been screaming for all year, Paddy Christie should have come in for Cahill.
Rhyno & Brogie were magnificent & Whelo was getting better & better through the game but the move back did him/us no favours. Magee did well when he came in. Cullen really struggled defensively but was brilliant coming forward.
Taking Mossy off made no sense to me, he wins oceans of ball when the supply is good, and gets great scores from play. Keaney going off form was a big blow for us, yet he still scored 1-2!! Jayo did a mountain of work as usual. Bonner had his best game yet, again why was he taken off?
Mayo defended for the most part superbly. Their midfield, especially McGarrity & Brady - fantastic. Mortimer & McD, though did some wild things, were a joy to watch, artists. Dillon, O'Neill both brilliant. Kilcoyne did well.
I said before this game that Kerry would much prefer to play Dublin, now I'm really sure of that. I think Mayo will really be close this time, they really wont have a better chance, and that's not just a lazy cliche.

The session last night was mighty, MAyo & Roscommon & Letrim hoolied, the Dubs hugged them all genuinely, (or for comfort? )and told Mayo that they'd better effin do it this time, good winners & good losers, couldnt happen to nicer people, Mayo, and if there was another team I'd have wanted to win this year it was them of course. The West has a new genuine contender, and that's great for football & the GAA, and great for the West.
Congrats to Louth, who shouldnt be forgotten in all of this, next year they & Longford make Leinster look more hopeful.

It was a worthy drowning of the sorrows. I met my ex-better half, who happens to be from Westport, we danced the night away in the Big Tree, & I made it to work today to take all the abuse. Luckily my boss is a blue...........

So all the flags, the bunting, the buzz, the rough inner-city areas looking like a festival, the best atmosphere/pageantry I've ever seen in this old & rapidly changing city that still seaches for its identity......was it all in vain? A final would have made it all seem worth it. "This time next year eh? This time next year........."

It could have been so great, I though we'd payed our dues in 2002 to earn our bit of nostalgia this time round. Don't mind the cynics, it would have been very magical for us to have met yis in the final. "Compliments pass when the quality meet." Insults too! Good insults...........

Enjoy the build-up to yet another final, hope it's a great game. Ol' Rashers is going away now, to be quiet, some wounds to be licked, and thinking to be done. It's been, of course, a very special 3 months, and being on here was a privilege, an education, and the best buzz in a long time. Dont let the magic fade!


Sadly our dreams of the great final, and a shot at the special cup have been cruelly shattered again, but as the quare fella said,
"When I came back to Dublin I was courtmartialed in my absence and sentenced to death in my absence, so I said they could shoot me in my absence."
And remember: "I value kindness to human beings first of all, and kindness to animals. I don't respect the law; I have a total irreverence for anything connected with society except that which makes the roads safer, the beer stronger, the food cheaper, and old men and women warmer in the winter, and happier in the summer."

And......
"The most important things to do in the world are to get something to eat, something to drink and somebody to love you."
And finally.........the ould triangle..........went JINGLE, JANGLE.................ALL ALONG...THE BANKS....of the ROYAL....Canal

G'luck now, see yis.

Al.

[kerryeye]

Great post Rashers,just wondering when it will be available in paperback.

[austinstacksabu]

Rashers,

One of the most honest pieces I've ever read - not many hardened souls would admit to having danced with the ex in the Big Tree :-)

Kerry people know the pain you're going through, we've had two whisker thin losses since 2002. The best way to deal with it is to accept it, and look to next year.

Pillar was indeed very gracious in defeat - the handbags at the start were just that, handbags. I wouldn't have gone down there if I were Mayo. There's other ways of rattling a team. The Mayo lady getting knocked out was pure accidential - balls will fly if you've 60 players and a platoon of nutritionist and water and ball and gear and all kinds of specialists wandering about in the same spot as if it was down town Kowloon in Hong Kong.

I watched the game again tonight on the box out here, and I still can't see how it is getting the classic tag. There was lots of good football, some great scores, tension, edge, you name it. But there were some woeful wides, some limp passes, defences being questioned time and time again, and some very strange substitutions on Dublins behalf. I still can't figure out why Shane Ryan was taken off. Was it Kevin McStay (who I've alot of time for) saying that Dublins fitness programme was beginning to show in the first half when Shane Ryan made a 70 yard gallop with the ball. I presume Kevin doesn't remember Shane single handedly doing that for most of the second half in the replay against Tyrone last year!! He is Dublins hardest working player and was proving that again yesterday. He shouldn't have been taken off if he wasn't injured, and it didn't look like it.

Mayo are a stubborn team, and have a very tight bond, something Mayo teams haven't had that strong in the past. But they are beatable, if Star isn't out with this jaw rumour. I'd have given no more than five Dublin players more than 5/10. Mayo beat them by a point despite Dublin hitting the wood work three times and just coming short with the last two kicks.

Mayo will be incredibly hard and played well yesterday. But it wasn't a classic.

Hopefully you won't be going anywhere Rashers, your semi neutral thoughts on the final will be required as we get carried away talking about tickets etc.

[seamus]

Good post Rashers,
There is definitely a difference between our 2 counties though.
We are so much better at nicknames.
You have Whelo, Jayo, Ryano, Shaugho and Brogie. We have the Star, the Pony and the Gooch.
Put a bit of thought into the nicknames next year!

[gunther]

You'd wonder what the hell has a nutritionist down on the field of play anyway - it's hardly likely that they'll need an emergency feed of steak before the game....

[kerrygold]

this a discussions board where people debate and give their point of view.

its not a medium to personally attack other members,maybe you should remember the spirt of the forum.

enjoy the rest of the year.

[eastciarrai]

Hard luck Rashers, I feel your pain. Firstly dublin got caught in the wrong place at the wrong time. Mayo forwards just decided to start kicking points from anywhere sunday because they'd nothing to lose. Your boys also had the game won, you blitzed them after half time and a combination of incredibly good and bad substitutions and the fact Mayo had nothing to lose and started running at you was your downfall.
Pillar hitting your man a belt of a shoulder was immature on his part. It showed that the mayo team plan had got to him and resorting to that showed that to his own dublin team which got to them. A cool head and a good f'ing match with Micky or Morrison would have done better.
Whelan tackle was bad enough for a red card and short suspension at most, no more.
Good shout on louth and longford too. If we had not got those goals against longford and they found a good back line, we could have been in trouble.
I'm disappointed we're not playing the Dubs, the craic, the banter and I'd even enjoy the media circus that kerry dont have.
Hopefully we'll hear more from you rashers as your the only one in this forum who can get "godo" into a football forum and not seem potty. And of course there's always next year. ;D

[kerryman]

I'm not paying much notice of the Whelan getting sent off thing. That was good luck for Dublin, but Mayo should bear in mind that the Jackeens hit the posts a couple of times..

[Jo90]

Hard luck Rashers. If it's any consolation losing a semi-final isn't as bad as losing a final. Dublin and their fans have really lit up this years championship. I hope next year we see Darragh Ó Sé v Cieran Whelan in the All-Ireland final. A soft 1/4 final might have been part of your undoing.
Someone elsewhere noted that the All-Ireland winners for the last 10 years have made the knockout stages of the league and it'll obviously be the same case this year. That lucky draw Kerry got against Dublin in April might have made all the difference!
Padraic Nally can also claim a role in Mayo's success - he dispelled Mayo's reputation for inaccurate shooting!

[puckaroo]

Rashers, I read it while at work, an epic post. Brought a tear to the eye. The build up of a big Kerry & Dublin final has all been in vain over the last while. But looking at how Kerry played against Armagh and how Mayo played against yous Dubs, It looks like it could be a crackin game!

Lets hope so anyway! and most of all that Sam trots on home to the Kingdom.

[Jo90]

[Mickmack]

Post of the year there Rashers.

On the question of Eugene McGee, his report of last years all ireland final made NO mention of the assault on Gooch which turned the game......... he never mentions such incidences or the referee in his reports.

Rashers .......... the sooner dublin forget all this Hill 16 bull* the better. The slow haka-like march to the Hill is simply putting pressure on young dublin players. No one on the Hill can kick a point when the chips are down. Another thing......... the Hill only supports its team when it is winning...... it goes deathly quiet when the team needs its support most.

Dublin always appears to be in all the unforgettable matches but lose........ and a lot of the time its lost on the sideline. Last year Pillar put young Lally wingback on Sean Cavanagh of all people........ game over in minutes.

Taking off Quinn and Ryan was insane.

Having said all of that....... Mayo were inspired............. where did Kevin o Neill come out of after all these years for gods sake. Also......... Dublins run was too easy but then...... I thought the same of Mayos run to the semifinal.

Great shot of Mortimor and Cluxton at the end........

Dublins sportsmanship was commendable at the end........ fair play but they lost their composure as the beginning over the Hill 16 business.

You sound a bit of a sore loser leaving the forum now that Dublin are gone........ but its a free country..........

regards

Mickmack

[Riocht]

Sorry Rasher .. But a great idea by Mayo! I have to commend them for going to the Hill goal! Magic!

Look Mayo were Hungrier ... "Bhí ocras an Domhain orthu agus dhein Átha Cliath dearúd ar sin"

[balbriggandub]

We are not soar loser's and never will be.Dublin played crap and only lost by a point.mayo played out of there skin and only one by a point.great winning score by the way.mayo have been around the block longer then Dublin and it was always a 50/50 game therefore they pipped us and we are still learning.Personnelly I have been on the beer to get over the lose and find it just the tonic.Dublin will find the future bright you would feel and remain upbeat.Anyway we will learn from it and be back.

[kerryman]

mickmack said:

Another thing......... the Hill only supports its team when it is winning...... it goes deathly quiet when the team needs its support most.

Spot on. Thats a big thing I've noticed at Dublin matches. The fans going quiet when the chips are down. That can't be good for the Dublin players' moral (and does wonders for the opposition).

[JOAN]

Hard luck Rashers. Good to hear from you. Dont go away enjoy your post

[RashersTierney]

Cheers Joan, yours arent so bad either! This is Joxer, writing on behalf of Rashers, who is locked away in recovery for a while!He said to say thanks to all for the kind words, ould Rashers is on the road to recovery. I myself am also on the road, to Stuttgart, via Austria. I think I got lost in the Alps There was snow on the mountain tops for Jaysus sake! - first time I ever saw snow in August. Bit like Mayo beating the Dubs
Mickmack, you just cant resist winding poor Rash up ye fecker He hasnt a bad loser bone in his body, and he never said he was leaving, he said Rashers was going away for a while!.....
As for The Hill, I think yis are all jealous. The Hill DOES also sing when we're losing, and I know that I do most of my shouting when things arent going so well, usually just after we concede a score!
Agree 100% with whoever said about the League. I had a pain in my **** from people saying, "Oh the league doesnt matter". It was obvious that our inconsistency in the league, considering we still had alot to prove, was a sign of something not yet right that would come back to haunt us.
We Dubs will find it hard to get much involved with the build-up this final, involving MAyo who shattered our dreams, against our greatest rivals who we should have been playing.
You have to understand that in the last few years we have suffered alot of traumatic defeats - first time EVER to Mayo, Tyrone, Westmeath, Laois, Armagh (twice), plus 2 more defeats to Kerry (making it 6 since we last bet yis), no national titles, no All-I final appearances, and dont even get me started on the 90s!
Anyway, time to put away the violins, I need to go out & enjoy Salzburg. I'll give yis the low down on Mayo's secret Alpine training..........
I'll be in McGowans in Frankfurt to watch the hurling on Sunday - Kilkenny to win and keep my big accumulator bet going (Italy, Kilkenny, Mayo, Derry City)

Joxer, on his way to Stuttgart (again)

[Mickmack]

[Mickmack, you just cant resist winding poor Rash up ye fecker He hasnt a bad loser bone in his body, and he never said he was leaving, he said Rashers was going away for a while!.....


I knew that would bring you back Rashers!

[kerrygold]

paul curran has an article in to-days evening herald as to where dublin went wrong,what their weaknesses were and what surgery they will need to carry out for 2007.

its interesting,to the point and honest.

and surprise surprise the word cynicism doesn't rear its ugly head nor does he blame the ref or any oposing player.

a refreshing read.

[RashersTierney]

Just back from an epic few days, it'll take me a while to get my head round it all - one day we were walking through snowy Alpine hills in the morning, and by the evening we were walking round Stuttgart in T-shirts & shorts. Were any of you there? I was the ugly eejit wearing the Panathanaikos top.........
Lots of Gah shirts to be seen, and not a bit of bother anywhere. Incredible atmosphere, when the anthem was sung I nearly cried, wonder what it sounded like on tv?
The main square in Stuttgart (a huge thing with a park) was like a scene from Woodstock. At the end of it all on Sunday morning in the unearthly hours of dawn the Germans just hoovered everything up. If any of yis are missing loved ones, they are most likely being spat out of the rubbish trucks in some big tip outside Stuttgart, or on a barge bound for China..........
I can hardly talk and I'm on the special milk for my liver. Havent met so many mad characters nor seen such carousing since.................last Sunday week?
So my big bet is still on, I'm getting nervous now! Watched the game in a state of zomby-like semi-consciousness in Frankfurt, with a gaggle of Cork heads. I was too tired to cheer for Kilkenny, they did well, I actually thought on the day that Cork would win but they could easily have lost by more. In anyway, well done and all that but we really need to see the likes of Galway, Wexford, Limerick, Waterford, Offaly & Dublin stepping up to the plate from next year on, to keep the game interesting for all.

Didnt see the Paul Curran article but it doesnt surprise me at all, both he & Keith Barr are two of the best commentators on Gah around. While I'm at it, so is Billy Keane, and of course great entertainment as well.
I cant think about what went wrong yet, but I do know this - theres no point making changes for the sake of it - if we had got the draw we deserved, I feel we would have won the replay. Who would be talking about "surgery" then? I think any changes need to be in terms of belief, which is an elusive thing to get at the best of times.
Havent heard the full story on Mark Vaughan, but as ever in Ireland, anyone who "gets a name" for himself for being openly/honestly "cocky" is sure to be singled out for hassle. I suppose it could have been some twisted idea of "revenge" for John Finn.........? I think the lad will come good with experience, sadly for us he wasnt quite able to seize the moment the last day, I had predicted beforehand that he would get just suchan opportunity & I hoped he would be the hero to shut all the critcs up. I also had great hopes for a return by Paddy C, and he was never given the chance. I better get out of this prediction lark!

[Mickmack]

I am amazed at the easy ride Pillar is getting compared to Tommy Lyons................... Pillars decision making on the day is an issue............yet ............. hardly a word is said.

Is this because he doesnt court publicity like Tommy did?

[RashersTierney]

Yeah I guess so Mick. I agree, the decisions were awful, worse than last year against Tyrone. It's amazing really, considering he kept the same team all year even in the League, despite alot of pressure to move Cahill & bring back Magee, then he goes completely mad in one game. If we dont do very well in the League next year, I'd really fear for him, and us.
I think that as play-scoring forwards Keaney and Quinn ARE good enough, but they didnt produce against Mayo, due to lack of confidence/composure, yet they did well against Tyrone last year, under similar pressure, so I cant understand the drop-off against Mayo this year, unless they just went off the boil over the long-drawn out summer of easy wins (post Longford). The free-taking issue is an on-running sore that has to be nailed.
As for the backs, what the hell happened there?! Cullen is good enough to have coped with that kind of onslaught, but didnt; as Cahill then also didnt cope, as we feared he wouldnt, where was Christie, where was O'Shaughnessy & Moran, instead of the madness of moving Ryan & Whelan back? Looks like a bad case of Hari-Kiri to me, and whatever about Mayo producing a big performance, I never thought the decision-making could go so bad.

[kerrygold]

i think dublin lost that game before it even started.they would have been better off going down to the other end for their warm up,all they will have to do is do it once and no other team will bother with the hill end again.
pillar has got a one game suspension for next years championship for the shoulder charge on morrison,too much needless energy being exspended on matters not to be caught up in.
Also marching to the hill,it proberly drives the oposition on as much,i see no point or value in it.
If dublin remembered they were in croke park and not the Olympia and concentrated on football they would be better off.

[Mickmack]

kerrygold said:

i think dublin lost that game before it even started.they would have been better off going down to the other end for their warm up,all they will have to do is do it once and no other team will bother with the hill end again.
pillar has got a one game suspension for next years championship for the shoulder charge on morrison,too much needless energy being exspended on matters not to be caught up in.
Also marching to the hill,it proberly drives the oposition on as much,i see no point or value in it.
If dublin remembered they were in croke park and not the Olympia and concentrated on football they would be better off.

I agree 100%. The Hill is a millstone around Dublins neck as this stage. All their own fault. Tommy Lyons said that it cost Dublin matches when it was un available!!!

Marching towards the hill!! For FFS? Like the grand old Duke of York

[RashersTierney]

It's all very well to be wise after the event, it's amazing how many people turn into sages that have forseen everything that came to pass and why it happened, just after a one point game!
If none of the above had happened, are you saying Dublin would have won? And if we hadnt won, coaches around the land would be saying, "the Dubs dont make enough use of their '16th man', they try to ignore it, but the pressure of expectation means they cant ignore it" That's what was being said before the last 2 years.
Also that if Dublin had gone up the other end, "why didnt they accept the challenge? They showed they werent up for the battle, just like in 2003, when Lyons held them back from going into the tunnel the same time as Armagh, and in the 2nd half they wilted against the physical challenge."
Lookit, every team has their own rituals, some of these are never really seen, Dublin's one this year was very visible, and in that I'd agree that it brought more pressure & inspired opponents (erm, except Laois, Offaly & Westmeath, who not only were not good enough, but gave up before the end, or in Westmeath's case, before the beginning)
Last year against Tyrone the crowd really got behind the team in the 2nd half & I'm sure it really drove them on to make that fight-back.
Again, about Pillar expending needless energy, Jaysus it was a bit of argy bargy, you're reading into stuff much more significance than it deserves. If Mayo had won easily you could mention these things, but really, it's all empty speculation & gossip.
We lost because it was Mayo's day, and the management showed inexperience & panicked. Mayo played great & most of everything went right for them, and we had some unlucky breaks, I predicted a draw before the game, if we'd got what we deserved nobody would have been having any enquiries about all this stuff, amazing the difference one point makes!
In 2000 in the Semi, Kerry barely survived against Armagh, also against Galway in the final, who remembers any of that now.
It doesnt pay to explain things on the basis that the result proves all the theories, though no doubt its all great entertainment for yis