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Post by kerrygold on May 7, 2006 18:15:11 GMT
The race for sam has commenced with an un eventfull uninspiring game in casement park with down beating cavan by 5 points.
Maybe over the next five months we could use this thread to discuss championship games other than kerrys and predict and debate up coming games for other counties,while keeping an eye on the form of players and teams that may cross our path during the summer and autum months.
Hard to see any challengers for sam coming from casement park from to-days game, down seem very dependent on the one trick, ball into benny coulter.
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Post by Mickmack on May 7, 2006 19:35:13 GMT
While it is unlikely that down or cavan will be in the hunt in september......its worth remembering that in 2005 tyrone and cavan drew in a poor first round match. Two significant results from today are mayos win at Under 21 and cavans win over down at minor level. I would love to see cavan coming back into the frame.
Mayo look a reasonable bet to reach the final this year given the draw etc. With Mayo you never know but they seem to be getting things right at underage level.........
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Post by kerrygold on May 7, 2006 23:25:38 GMT
ya,congrats to mayo,great to see them winning one at last,having lost the minor in '05 and u21 in '04 plus the senior.throw in two recent club championship victories also in recent years. agree mickmack,they will be there or there abouts.
two interesting games next sunday,louth v meath,louth coming up to div.1 and meath relegated from div.1,there must be a bit of common ground there in the middle somewhere,should be close,local derby game.
also monaghan v armagh,two neighbouring counties,have a feeling monaghan will give it a right good cut,should be interesting,might give us an indication to the well being of armagh.
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Post by austinstacksabu on May 8, 2006 11:01:17 GMT
Cracking idea Kerrygold.
Was listening to both games on the wireless yesterday on the road up from Kilkenny. If anybody was listening to RTE Radio 1, Martin McHugh was co-commentator with Michael O'Muircheartaigh. There's a time to add a few golden nuggets but Martin was going over the top in analysing the strategy both teams were employing, why players were changing, what new tactic they were employing every time the ball broke free or a player passed wind. Slightly OTT and it really didn't allow Michael to get into the game at all.
Have predicted Down for Ulster despite Armagh last year being the only team to come through from the preliminary round to win in 50 odd years. They sounded patchy enough especially as Cavan had a few injuries and suspensions to contend with. Ballybofey is not a great place to get a win from against Donegal but fingers crossed.
Congrats to Mayo, and especially Pat Holmes their manager yesterday. As a Kerry man I was quite happy to hear Cork being beaten. Pat has seen his fair share of national final losses so was delighted for him. He's actually a very good manager despite what his record shows as Mayo senior manager a few years back.
Big weekend of games next Sunday. Double header down the road in Croke Park but am tempted by the lure of Tipp and Limerick down in Thurles.
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RashersTierney
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Post by RashersTierney on May 8, 2006 11:03:55 GMT
I would never read too much into a first round match, especially in Ulster! Cavan certainly seem to have gone into a big slump, which is a big shame, with their history and interest in GAA, they really ought to be up there challenging the top teams on a much more regular basis. Ulster needs it again, and GAA nationally needs it. DOwn have started greats easons before like this, but on the evidence we have, it seems they are not ready yet as I suspected. Will improve I'm sure, but I think Donegal can just take them. Down will possibly do well backdoor, maybe reach a quarter final even. Next year they should be much stronger. Lightening will not strike twice, Armagh will be ready for Monaghan this time I feel. Big breakthrough for Mayo U-21s, must be a huge boost to the seniors, like a dam beginning to burst. Is it too soon for the 21s to have an impact at senior this year? Probably, but the psychological boost for the seniors should be enough to see them beat Galway and just about Dublin or Laois in the Quarters/Semis. They would have revenge in mind against Dublin! I think its one year too soon for Louth, and Meath may just mug them, its a big monkey on the Wee County backs.
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RashersTierney
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Post by RashersTierney on May 8, 2006 11:07:56 GMT
Westmeath and Offaly, who would want to predict it? I expect Westmeath to be much more competative than last year, but Dolan is a big loss if he's really out. Offaly could be anything, hammered Fermanagh away in last game of League - signs of a classic Offaly revival? Usually go well in first game of champo, so I give them the nod, just. Offaly have better forwards, Westmeath better backs. Will the Limerick revival fianlly account for the monkey of Tipp? Will Babs have them bursting the door down? Impossible to predict this one.
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Post by Dermot on May 8, 2006 16:20:34 GMT
Cracking idea Kerrygold. If anybody was listening to RTE Radio 1, Martin McHugh was co-commentator with Michael O'Muircheartaigh. Slightly OTT and it really didn't allow Michael to get into the game at all. Have predicted Down for Ulster McHugh is always OTT - he tries too hard - Personally, I wouldn't loose any sleep if he went into media oblivion ! Stacks.........Down for Ulster ? You must be kidding ! I'll eat Colm O'Roukes hat it that comes true.
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Boris
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Post by Boris on May 8, 2006 16:37:10 GMT
I dont think Down will fear playing Donegal in Ballybofey.Donegal looked woeful in their two league finals vs Louth.
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Post by austinstacksabu on May 8, 2006 16:42:14 GMT
Cracking idea Kerrygold. If anybody was listening to RTE Radio 1, Martin McHugh was co-commentator with Michael O'Muircheartaigh. Slightly OTT and it really didn't allow Michael to get into the game at all. Have predicted Down for Ulster McHugh is always OTT - he tries too hard - Personally, I wouldn't loose any sleep if he went into media oblivion ! Stacks.........Down for Ulster ? You must be kidding ! I'll eat Colm O'Roukes hat it that comes true. It's just something I've had in my brain for a while - I really think they will come good at some stage from the underage success they have had at minor and U21 in recent years.....good as in win Ulster but not Sam..... I don't think they'll go down the Limerick route of all underage, no adult success.
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Post by Dermot on May 8, 2006 17:22:58 GMT
You might be right Stacks, but I feel they won't be too much trouble for a year or two yet.
Wish the Feck Coulter was from Tyrone though.....He's some player...One of the most versatile in the game as well.
Boris - I think Donegal will blow them away.......But you never know..... Cassidy was a bad loss for them but if it takes that to get their attitude right then its worth it.
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Post by kerrygold on May 8, 2006 19:21:02 GMT
donegal failed to beat louth over two games for the division 2 final,what makes you think dermot that they will blow down away.
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Post by kerrygold on May 8, 2006 19:27:50 GMT
i think offally might beat westmeath too rashers,dolan is the heart and soul of the westmeath attack,massive loss,those midland derby games take on a life of there own,nothing cast in stone there involving games between offaly,weatmeath and laois.
i still think monaghan will give armagh a right good game.will armagh be able to turn on the tap on demand after a fairly dormant league campain,not an easy thing to do.
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RashersTierney
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Post by RashersTierney on May 8, 2006 20:19:24 GMT
I agree Kerrygold, but Armagh have a score to settle, so should be a cracker, Monaghan dont fear them.......its an awful shame but this game is not on tv. Strange, as 3 channels are covering alot of the games in the coming weeks, including Westmeath-Offaly. Yet neither of those two are really contenders, both even very unlikely to win Leinster (though I expect an Offaly revival any year!)
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Post by kerrygold on May 9, 2006 8:31:11 GMT
you never know with offaly,there a county that know how to win,not sure if they have the players though to make meaningful break through at the moment.
an attractive double in croker this sunday,louth v meath 2 oc,westmeath v offaly 4 oc,there expecting a crowd of 40000 people,a nice way for anyone in the vacinity to wet the appitite for the summer ahead in croker.
i see rashers the dublin minors containing 10 of the dublin colleges team beat laois in the minor hurling championship,seems the initative to promote hurling in the capital is starting to bear fruit,that can only be a good thing at the end of the day.
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Post by Dermot on May 9, 2006 10:22:30 GMT
donegal failed to beat louth over two games for the division 2 final,what makes you think dermot that they will blow down away. Donegal have the players to do it ...... even though they don't always perform. I just think they will click a bit better in the championship than the league - Also, they have a cute manager. I could be totally wrong but I think Donegal will go fairly far this year (direct or via qualifiers I don't know ?)
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seamus
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Post by seamus on May 9, 2006 10:32:58 GMT
Can't see it Dermot. You can't throw out your 2 best players for going on the beer. Jack had a few issues last year but brought them together and sorted it out like men. I'm Stacks on this won. Down to cause a bit of a stir. They have in Coulter one of the best forwards and he is now a full time footballer as well!
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Post by austinstacksabu on May 9, 2006 13:25:31 GMT
I thought Rock Cassidy and the other lad had been brought back into the Donegal fold? Donegal are a funny fish, and have been for some time. To me, they are the great underachievers of the last three years. They should have beaten Armagh that day in the All Ireland semi final, and had the game plan to beat them. They should have beaten them in the drawn Ulster quarter final last summer too. And going back a little further, their collapse against Dublin a few years ago is well documented.
They have had some really quality players on the squad for a few years now but even the great Brian McEniff couldn't control their discipline problems. It's a pity. I think their fast brand of football played out towards the wings (Roper was vital to this) and in to a two man full forward line is as close as any team has come to breaking down Tyrone / Armagh.
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BIGMAC
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Post by BIGMAC on May 9, 2006 13:38:56 GMT
I thought Rock Cassidy and the other lad had been brought back into the Donegal fold? Donegal are a funny fish, and have been for some time. To me, they are the great underachievers of the last three years. They should have beaten Armagh that day in the All Ireland semi final, and had the game plan to beat them. They should have beaten them in the drawn Ulster quarter final last summer too. And going back a little further, their collapse against Dublin a few years ago is well documented. They have had some really quality players on the squad for a few years now but even the great Brian McEniff couldn't control their discipline problems. It's a pity. I think their fast brand of football played out towards the wings (Roper was vital to this) and in to a two man full forward line is as close as any team has come to breaking down Tyrone / Armagh. ON THE SCORE SHEET THAT DAY IN CROKER IT LOOKED ALOT CLOSER THAN IT WAS STACKS,REMEMBER WE KICKED 21 WIDES THAT DAY AND STILL WON AND IN THE REPLAY LAST YEAR WE RAN OUT COMFORTABLE ENOUGH WINNERS.DONEGAL ARE UNDERACHIVERS AND I DONT SEE THEM BEING TO MUCH OF A THREAT THIS YEAR AND IF DOWN WIN ULSTER AFTER SUNDAYS DISMAL PREFORMANCE I'LL EAT DERMOTS KACKS (WASHED 1'S OF COURSE) ;D ;D ;D
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Post by kerrygold on May 9, 2006 13:52:37 GMT
your keeping very quite about the armagh monaghan game bigmac,are ye planning a carnival of exibition football or are you not sure how to call it?.
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Post by austinstacksabu on May 9, 2006 15:01:24 GMT
I thought Rock Cassidy and the other lad had been brought back into the Donegal fold? Donegal are a funny fish, and have been for some time. To me, they are the great underachievers of the last three years. They should have beaten Armagh that day in the All Ireland semi final, and had the game plan to beat them. They should have beaten them in the drawn Ulster quarter final last summer too. And going back a little further, their collapse against Dublin a few years ago is well documented. They have had some really quality players on the squad for a few years now but even the great Brian McEniff couldn't control their discipline problems. It's a pity. I think their fast brand of football played out towards the wings (Roper was vital to this) and in to a two man full forward line is as close as any team has come to breaking down Tyrone / Armagh. ON THE SCORE SHEET THAT DAY IN CROKER IT LOOKED ALOT CLOSER THAN IT WAS STACKS,REMEMBER WE KICKED 21 WIDES THAT DAY AND STILL WON AND IN THE REPLAY LAST YEAR WE RAN OUT COMFORTABLE ENOUGH WINNERS.DONEGAL ARE UNDERACHIVERS AND I DONT SEE THEM BEING TO MUCH OF A THREAT THIS YEAR AND IF DOWN WIN ULSTER AFTER SUNDAYS DISMAL PREFORMANCE I'LL EAT DERMOTS KACKS (WASHED 1'S OF COURSE) ;D ;D ;D Not sure I'd agree with you there BigMac - if you also remember, Donegal had a man unfairly sent off, and only for that, they would have had a full back in place for that late goal from Stevie - any decent full back worth his salt would have been able to handle that ball in from McEntee. Also, was it not John McEntee who came on and used his elbow to great effect over by the Cusack on the 40 and didn't even get a card for it - the man should have been straight off and not around to pass the ball into Stevie Mc. Ye had a fair amount of wides alright in the first half that day, but Donegal were down to 14 men - Ray Sweeney should not have got the second yellow.
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RashersTierney
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Post by RashersTierney on May 9, 2006 23:38:10 GMT
I agree baout Donegal, they seem to have imploded since 2002. In fact their collapse that day probably helped Armagh beat Dublin in the Semi! I think as it stands Ulster is not as strong as it was overall, unless Donegal, Derry, Down really step up the plate. I predict a non-Ulster winner this year, Kerry or Mayo
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BIGMAC
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Post by BIGMAC on May 10, 2006 12:22:50 GMT
your keeping very quite about the armagh monaghan game bigmac,are ye planning a carnival of exibition football or are you not sure how to call it?. i'm under orders from big j not to divulge the plan for sunday
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BIGMAC
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Post by BIGMAC on May 10, 2006 12:33:57 GMT
ON THE SCORE SHEET THAT DAY IN CROKER IT LOOKED ALOT CLOSER THAN IT WAS STACKS,REMEMBER WE KICKED 21 WIDES THAT DAY AND STILL WON AND IN THE REPLAY LAST YEAR WE RAN OUT COMFORTABLE ENOUGH WINNERS.DONEGAL ARE UNDERACHIVERS AND I DONT SEE THEM BEING TO MUCH OF A THREAT THIS YEAR AND IF DOWN WIN ULSTER AFTER SUNDAYS DISMAL PREFORMANCE I'LL EAT DERMOTS KACKS (WASHED 1'S OF COURSE) ;D ;D ;D Not sure I'd agree with you there BigMac - if you also remember, Donegal had a man unfairly sent off, Also, was it not John McEntee who came on and used his elbow to great effect over by the Cusack on the 40 and didn't even get a card for it Ye had a fair amount of wides alright in the first half that day, but Donegal were down to 14 men - Ray Sweeney should not have got the second yellow. we've all had to deal with having a man sent off unfairly at some time the marsden incident in 2003 springs to mind and i know when this happens to armagh the players pick themselves up and excert even more effort.as for mcentee did that elbow not miss and was it not in front of the ref so ur point is sorta mute there and again show me the team that has'nt had players throw an elbow and i'll show u a team of liars.21 wides that day not all in the first half the second was as bad but when u add up the stats that day u'l see that it was armagh who held the upper hand but just could'nt convert there advantage to pts.we can all make excuses for when we lose and how unfairly we were treated but the only thing that counts is the score on the board at 5pm on 17/9/06
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BIGMAC
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Post by BIGMAC on May 10, 2006 12:36:13 GMT
your keeping very quite about the armagh monaghan game bigmac,are ye planning a carnival of exibition football or are you not sure how to call it?. armagh by 6
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Post by buck02 on May 10, 2006 13:01:05 GMT
I wonder will Armagh do like 2003 and in an attempt to avoid Tyrone and the other physical Ulster teams during the months of June and July take their chance through the qualifiers. Wouldnt be surprised with a subdued Armagh display and a monaghan win.
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Post by Dermot on May 10, 2006 13:01:27 GMT
as for mcentee did that elbow not miss ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D Class stuff indeed BM - Even I wouldn't have the gaul to post that one....... Brilliant !
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BIGMAC
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Post by BIGMAC on May 10, 2006 13:28:08 GMT
I wonder will Armagh do like 2003 and in an attempt to avoid Tyrone and the other physical Ulster teams during the months of June and July take their chance through the qualifiers. Wouldnt be surprised with a subdued Armagh display and a monaghan win. big j has allready stated that route 1 will be his preferred choice.i firmly expect armagh to come out all guns blazing and show their intent for the ulster title.kerry paid the price last year for the lack of a hard game,armagh and tyrone benefited from having 3 tough close games with eachother and it was obvious whoever won the semi replay would be formidable opponents in the final, it would be foolish for armagh to opt for the easy route (and i dont think it is 1) and i expect armagh to play to win
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BIGMAC
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Post by BIGMAC on May 10, 2006 13:29:19 GMT
as for mcentee did that elbow not miss ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D Class stuff indeed BM - Even I wouldn't have the gaul to post that one....... Brilliant ! i've a neck for anything bar soap and water ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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BIGMAC
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Post by BIGMAC on May 10, 2006 13:32:08 GMT
Armagh's 'Dad's Army' still up for fight Tuesday May 9th 2006 ADVERTISEMENT
Armagh manager Joe Kernan
JOE KERNAN has dismissed suggestions that his Armagh squad have too much mileage on the clock to survive against some of the turbo-charged opposition that are revving up for action in this season's Bank of Ireland football championship.
An indifferent League campaign in which Armagh survived in Division One only on scoring difference after snatching a dramatic late win over Wexford in the final game has inevitably led to claims that the Orchard will be easier to raid than in previous seasons.
Armagh are bidding to win a sixth Ulster title in eight seasons and to become the first county to win the three-in-a-row since Down in 1959-60-61 but an erratic League season has raised doubts about their prospects as they prepare the defence of their provincial title against Monaghan in Clones next Sunday.
However, Kernan insists that critics are misreading the signals and rubbishes claims that age profile of the team will come against Armagh.
"We're not sending out a Dad's Army team, you know. In fact, if you take out Geezer (Kieran McGeeney) and Paul (McGrane) the average age of the team is in the mid-20s. And as everybody knows, Geezer and Paul are some athletes so we're not worried what age they are," said Kernan.
Having spent a week in La Manga as part of the specialised build-up to the championship, Kernan is confident that the squad are perfectly primed for the season ahead.
"We had 12 injured players at the start of the League so we never really got settled into any sort of decent rhythm. The important thing was to stay in Division One and we managed that by beating Wexford. We have a full squad to pick from now which makes a huge difference."
Armagh beat Meath by 1-14 to 1-12 in a challenge game at the weekend, with Oisín McConville in fine scoring form.
Kernan is expecting a big season from his Crossmaglen colleague and is delighted with what he has seen in recent weeks.
"I'd be very confident that Oisin will have a really good campaign. His use of the ball is excellent and he seems to be back to his very best."
Stunned
Kernan, who is heading into his fifth Championship season as manager, needs no reminding that Monaghan beat Armagh in the first round of the Ulster championship in 2003, a result that stunned the football world as they were defending All-Ireland champions at the time.
"Monaghan will feel they can do the same again. They were very unlucky to be relegated from Division One this year. Seamus McEnaney has done a great job with them and being in Division One will stand to them. We'll have to switch on to this game quickly," said Kernan.
Despite reaching the All-Ireland final via the back door in 2003, he has no doubt that the direct route remains the best option.
"You remain in charge of your own destiny if you go the provincial route. You know who and when you will be playing next which is always a help. We've been down the qualifier route before and we don't want to go back unless we have to."
Martin Breheny from the indo
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BIGMAC
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Post by BIGMAC on May 10, 2006 13:41:27 GMT
Orange Must Squash Farney ARMAGH must beat Monaghan next Sunday in the Ulster Championship if they are to quash the doubts that have surfaced about the team during the National League. Armagh's less than impressive league performance doesn't mean that this current team are on a downward curve. But nonetheless I think that doubts have arisen and the players themselves know that they can't afford to lose to Monaghan.
It is for that reason I believe Armagh will beat Monaghan - they simply have more to lose from defeat than Monaghan do. Armagh must suppress any doubts - even those within the panel and victory over Monaghan is the only way to do so. However, they won't have it easy against Monaghan. The Farney County are not far away from being a very good team.
They have some very talented players and Seamus McEnaney has left no stone unturned to bring them to the next level. If the likes of Damien Freeman, Tomas Freeman, Paul Finlay, Eoin Lennon and Rory Woods can click on the day then Armagh could find themselves in big trouble. Monaghan caught them on the hop somewhat three years ago, but Armagh made easy work of them in 2004. I have a lot of time for both Joe Kernan and McEnaney, as managers. They are both great at preparing and motivating players, but I feel Joe will have the tougher task in that regard this weekend.
The Monaghan players won't need much to get up for this game, but it may take more work to get the Armagh lads motivated. The worry I would have about Armagh is that their defence looks suspect. I don't feel Aidan O'Rourke is a full-back while Enda McNulty and Andy Mallon are not the biggest of corner-backs around. I think Monaghan will play Ray Ronaghan at full forward and pump high ball to high balls in on top of O'Rourke. Overall, the current Armagh team wouldn't have you shaking in your boots, so its important they can lay down a marker on Sunday and send out a warning to others to let them know that they haven't gone away.
It will be interesting to see if they play Kieran McGeeney at midfield - and I think they will with Ciaran McKeever lining out at centre-back. Their main strength is in the forward department where Stevie McDonnell, Ronan Clarke and Oisin McConville are as good as anybody else out there. I think corner-forward is McConville's best position and I feel we might have a big Championship from him this summer.
Kernan has never been a manager afraid to try out new things and I hear that they have implemented a new training regime this year which was specifically designed to make the players faster. Word is that most of the players are up to 20 per cent quicker than they were this time last year. That is a good move by Kernan, because mobility has been a problem for them in recent years. Monaghan, on the other hand, are still trying to get over the disappointment of suffering relegation back to Division Two. They put everything into remaining in the top flight this year and although they came agonisingly close to achieving that, ultimately they dropped back to Division Two.
That has been a big disappointment for both the players and management. In many ways, this game presents them with a chance to get a big win under their belt and prove they are not that far away from the top teams. The main thing for them is belief. Have they got the belief in themselves to go out, compete and beat Armagh? We'll find that out on Sunday.
Martin McHugh - Irish Star
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