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Post by glengael on Nov 29, 2021 9:24:14 GMT
I don't know if this has been posted before but here's next year's master schedule. Based on this, we'll be playing Cork sometimes between 16th of April and the 14/15th of May (assuming 2 weeks between Munster SF and Munster Final on the 28th May) So in the senior football, are they going back to the pre 2018 qualifier system or the Stupid, sorry super 8's ?
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Post by Mickmack on Nov 29, 2021 9:36:30 GMT
I don't know if this has been posted before but here's next year's master schedule. Based on this, we'll be playing Cork sometimes between 16th of April and the 14/15th of May (assuming 2 weeks between Munster SF and Munster Final on the 28th May) So in the senior football, are they going back to the pre 2018 qualifier system or the Stupid, sorry super 8's ? Back to the 'two strikes and you are out' system.
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Post by Mickmack on Nov 29, 2021 9:39:50 GMT
Back to the 'two strikes and you are out' system.
Ulster teams will be focusing on the ulster championship towards the end of the league so we might see repeats of the Tyrone v Kerry league game of 2021 so lets not get carried away by a one sided game!
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Post by thehermit on Nov 29, 2021 10:03:23 GMT
When have we ever done that???
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Post by dc84 on Nov 29, 2021 10:14:33 GMT
Am I the only one who thinks the super 8s really benefit us ? The way it was prior we were always coming in cold to a quarter final. If for example we breeze through munster again its hardly great preparation if we then draw Tyrone, Donegal Galway or mayo in a qf surely ?
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Post by southward on Nov 29, 2021 10:32:47 GMT
Am I the only one who thinks the super 8s really benefit us ? The way it was prior we were always coming in cold to a quarter final. If for example we breeze through munster again its hardly great preparation if we then draw Tyrone, Donegal Galway or mayo in a qf surely ? Agree. Could never understand the antipathy towards the super 8s. * More games at the business end for all who make it. * A guaranteed home game in the championship. And a guaranteed away game for Dublin. * Proper preparation for anyone with ambitions of Sam. What's not to love?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2021 10:44:15 GMT
Am I the only one who thinks the super 8s really benefit us ? The way it was prior we were always coming in cold to a quarter final. If for example we breeze through munster again its hardly great preparation if we then draw Tyrone, Donegal Galway or mayo in a qf surely ? Agreed but the county board voted against the recent championship restructure so they must have a different view.
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Post by hatchetman on Nov 29, 2021 11:10:23 GMT
Am I the only one who thinks the super 8s really benefit us ? The way it was prior we were always coming in cold to a quarter final. If for example we breeze through munster again its hardly great preparation if we then draw Tyrone, Donegal Galway or mayo in a qf surely ? Agreed but the county board voted against the recent championship restructure so they must have a different view. But the recent championship restructure that the county board voted against was not the super 8's.
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Post by thehermit on Nov 29, 2021 11:43:13 GMT
Yes I thought the Super 8s were great. The game in Clones was brilliant, esp getting a taste of what a proper championship match is like up there rather than a subdued league game.
And the buzz around Mayo in Killarney the next year was terrific, scorching weather, the pubs hopping and a brilliant performance. The last train back to Tralee was some craic with everyone singing.
It defo bought a lot more days of colour and atmosphere in the summer when you want it most.
Aside from the farce of Dublin having 2 home games, it was a good system.
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Post by dc84 on Nov 29, 2021 11:55:26 GMT
Yes I thought the Super 8s were great. The game in Clones was brilliant, esp getting a taste of what a proper championship match is like up there rather than a subdued league game. And the buzz around Mayo in Killarney the next year was terrific, scorching weather, the pubs hopping and a brilliant performance. The last train back to Tralee was some craic with everyone singing. It defo bought a lot more days of colour and atmosphere in the summer when you want it most. Aside from the farce of Dublin having 2 home games, it was a good system. Exactly , is that not what people want more championship games in the height of summer against good teams? 2019 was great I thought mayo in a hot day in killarney, cracking draw vs Donegal in croke park and a good win in Meath, it really battle hardened us for the semi vs Tyrone that year I felt. The structure next year Is so boring same old stuff wake me up when the real stuff starts in the quarters !
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Post by Mickmack on Nov 29, 2021 12:55:18 GMT
Mayo were out on their feet that day in Killarney having had a run of games to get to the super 8.
Kerry made the super 8 via Munster teams whose first priority is hurling.
The league gives us the top 8 teams. There is no need to have another method at arriving at that group of 8.
So just let them play each other....7 games....3 at home or 4 at home depends.
Let the semi finalists be the top 4.
You would have great days in Clones and other venues too.
And Kerry would get to play all their peers....unlike the old super 8. Did Kerry ever play Dublin in a supef i game for example.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2021 13:07:08 GMT
I get what you ré saying but the reality is we were only beaten in 2 quarter finals out of 17. One was 2010 after a replay and extra time v Cork when Down beat us easily. The other was Donegal in 12 when we did nt come in cold as we came through qualifiers v Westmeath and Tyrone. wasn't the munster final in 2010 against limerick Mick, we played Cork in the semifinal that year. We were missing Galvin and Tomás through suspension for the Down game and McQuillan made sure we never got a foothold in the game calling us up for incorrect hand passes.
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Post by dc84 on Nov 29, 2021 13:09:42 GMT
I get what you ré saying but the reality is we were only beaten in 2 quarter finals out of 17. One was 2010 after a replay and extra time v Cork when Down beat us easily. The other was Donegal in 12 when we did nt come in cold as we came through qualifiers v Westmeath and Tyrone. I hear what your saying Mick but the strenght of cork at that time meant munster was as strong as any other province. That cork team were excellent and really tested us every year often beating us and showing up weaknesses they are a long way off that now We beat them by 22 points last year !! Just from a development point of view the likes of Tyrone have an advantage sane league as us, then they play fermanagh ok thats much the same as tipp or clare. Then a resurgent Derry easily as good if not better than cork then monaghan probably and Donegal in the final sone seripus qtests for them that will bring on their team in a way that could take us years. Nothing beats championship experience against good sides. In the scenario above Tyrone would play 2 div 1,sides a div 2 and div 3. Whereas best we would play is cork and clare two div 2 teams Tyrone will probably beat all those teams but they will be tested and will learn whats working and whats not on all probability we will beat cork and clare handy enough without learning a thing!
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Post by southward on Nov 29, 2021 13:33:03 GMT
Yes I thought the Super 8s were great. The game in Clones was brilliant, esp getting a taste of what a proper championship match is like up there rather than a subdued league game. And the buzz around Mayo in Killarney the next year was terrific, scorching weather, the pubs hopping and a brilliant performance. The last train back to Tralee was some craic with everyone singing. It defo bought a lot more days of colour and atmosphere in the summer when you want it most. Aside from the farce of Dublin having 2 home games, it was a good system. And even that was better than the previous system, which it seems we're going back to, whereby they had every meaningful game at home.
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Post by dc84 on Nov 29, 2021 13:48:51 GMT
Mayo were out on their feet that day in Killarney having had a run of games to get to the super 8. Kerry made the super 8 via Munster teams whose first priority is hurling. The league gives us the top 8 teams. There is no need to have another method at arriving at that group of 8. So just let them play each other....7 games....3 at home or 4 at home depends. Let the semi finalists be the top 4. You would have great days in Clones and other venues too. And Kerry would get to play all their peers....unlike the old super 8. Did Kerry ever play Dublin in a supef i game for example. That would have been ideal if voted in , the more i think about it about the best way to do it would be split div1 and 2 into 1a and 1b and 2a 2b for 3/4. Top 6 in divs 1a/2b and top 2 in 2a/b go into round of 16 with top 4 in 1a/b having home advantage. That means every team has a chance of making knockouts at start of season. Also it would be competitive at the bottom of the divs to make knockout and at the top to make top 4. How you split the divisions would be tricky personally I think a ranking system based on previous league would be the way to go odds from 1a go into next years 1a, ie 1st 3rd 5th plus 2nd 4th 6th from 2a and 1st from 2a and 2nd in 2b. This would mean more diversity of opponent year on year and would hopefully bring on the teams in div2 and 3 as they would be playing a higher calliber of team. Just as example using the last full league 2020 this would be 1a and 1b. 1a Kerry Galway Donegal Mayo Armagh Westmeath Clare Cork 1b Dublin Tyrone Monaghan Meath Roscommon Kildare Laois Down Sorry about the long post and throwing another structure in the mix!
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Post by Mickmack on Nov 29, 2021 14:11:46 GMT
I dont understand how people can say that a super 8 system that never saw Kerry play Dublin was great
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Post by thehermit on Nov 29, 2021 14:18:54 GMT
I dont understand how people can say that a super 8 system that never saw Kerry play Dublin was great What's rare is wonderful - Clones for a Kerry match, Meath for a Kerry match, bringing the likes of Mayo down to Killarney in the summer sun etc.
But I'll reiterate it was a farce Dublin being left in Croker for the first two games (hence why they were never chasing a result when they went to Omagh).
If they had to travel like the rest of us, we'd have seen them in Killarney or in Ballyboofey or McHale.
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Post by southward on Nov 29, 2021 14:41:48 GMT
I dont understand how people can say that a super 8 system that never saw Kerry play Dublin was great Sure it was only in place for 2 years. We would have surely got them the next time.
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Post by Mickmack on Nov 29, 2021 15:26:40 GMT
I am proposing making it into a real super 8 group where teams all play each other.
There would be away games in Omagh, Castlebar, Clones etc with a definite game v Dublin.
What we had was two super 4s with usually a dead rubber at the end....Kerry v Kildare while Galway pulled their punches v Monaghan. Or that pointless game v Meath in Navan.
It would be great fun if say the top 3 teams made the semis while 4 and 5th played off for the other semi final spot.
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Post by southward on Nov 29, 2021 16:53:41 GMT
I am proposing making it into a real super 8 group where teams all play each other. There would be away games in Omagh, Castlebar, Clones etc with a definite game v Dublin. What we had was two super 4s with usually a dead rubber at the end....Kerry v Kildare while Galway pulled their punches v Monaghan. Or that pointless game v Meath in Navan. It would be great fun if say the top 3 teams made the semis while 4 and 5th played off for the other semi final spot. I'd support that plan, Mick. Might be a congested schedule though, no room for postponements or replays certainly. Btw, a game can't be labelled a dead rubber if there's something at stake beforehand. Kerry were still in the hunt facing up to Kildare; as it turned out, the win was in vain thanks to Galway's no-show v Monaghan but that doesn't meet the criteria for a dead rubber. Even the Meath game in 2019 - we still had to turn up and at least avoid getting hockeyed to be sure of progression. As far as I can tell, the only super 8 game that was actually a dead rubber was Dublin/Tyrone in 2019 - that's one game out of 12 to date.
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Post by Ballyfireside on Nov 29, 2021 18:58:17 GMT
Given the history with The Battle of Omagh I didn't know what to expect at that Healey Park game, and right I was - from a supporters perspective alone it had a pure magic effect to it. Tyrone fans were delighted to see the Dubs in their local turf, that tempered feeling - awesome really. Than the Dubs all proud, 'this is what we are about, take a good look', and strangely enough Tyrone appreciated them, admired them, if for the numbers alone, a brotherhood atmosphere - I'd say it was planned by Tyrone and fair dues, it would certainly weigh in favour of such future exhibitions and was the GAA in it's finest regalia, sure I'm still talking about it and me a neutral even though it didn't feel like that at all, it had a carnival effect.
That Healey Park is more intimate than say Croker enabled one to gain a rare insight to the telepathy between Cluxton and those he delivers ball to, amazing stuff really - there I was within 10' of him as he'd place his kick.
Clones within 24 hours marked a memorable GAA weekend with the local company, the weather and Donaghy Clifford obliging - oh that goal!
'Nothing beats being there' for sure and didn't I even bump into auld Bertie and he as cross as a bag of cats as they'd say up here, a face like a wet weekend and the sun splitting the rocks.
So massive potential here and I'd say the auld Dub supporter wouldn't be against more 'decentralisation' of fixtures.
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Post by dc84 on Nov 30, 2021 10:46:06 GMT
I see your point DC but coming in"cold"never really bothered us or Dublin. Flip it the other way and the Ulster teams used to say before they were burnt out after Ulster campaigns making it harder for them to progress. I was nt a fan of the super 8s persais and if a team had already qualified they could field a weaker team in their final game and be the cause of a good team getting knocked out. It was open for a bit of gamesmanship. I think it bothered us plenty of times last year for example. Also just from an entertainment point of view id rather more games against good opposition in the Summer personally rather than playing munster opposition.
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Post by dc84 on Nov 30, 2021 10:59:31 GMT
Oh I'd rather more games too but not super 8s.I would like maybe a league /championship format or two legs quarter finals. Same as that , but I'd rather super8s over what we have now until they scrap the provincals.
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Premier
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Post by Premier on Dec 7, 2021 9:28:21 GMT
In terms of the Kerry panel for next year, I think the best way of dividing it up is to categorise them into; Certs, Fairly Secure, On the Fence, In trouble, Outside Certs, Outside Maybes. These are for the panel now, not the team Certs: Brian Begley Jason Foley Tom Sullivan Gavin White Diarmuid o Connor Paudie Clifford Sean o shea David Clifford Mike Breen Killian Spillane
Fairly secure: Shane Ryan Paul Murphy David Moran Dara Moynihan Tony Brosnan Micheal Burns Tadgh Morley Paul Geaney Graham O’Sullivan Paul o Shea
On the fence: Jack Barry Gavin Crowley Stephen o brien
In trouble: Adrian Spillane Jack Sherwood Pa Kilkenny Kevin sullivan David Shaw Kieran Fitz Brian Leonard
Outside Certs: Joe o connor Dylan Casey Shane Murphy Stefan Okunbar
Outside Maybes: Wayne Guthrie Jack o shea Greg Horan Cormac Coffey Jack savage Sean O brien Adam Donoghue Andrew Barry Barry Mahony Evan Cronin Dan McCarthy
I’m sure there’s a good few there I’ve forgotten too
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Post by greengold35 on Dec 7, 2021 11:36:21 GMT
In terms of the Kerry panel for next year, I think the best way of dividing it up is to categorise them into; Certs, Fairly Secure, On the Fence, In trouble, Outside Certs, Outside Maybes. These are for the panel now, not the team Certs: Brian Begley Jason Foley Tom Sullivan Gavin White Diarmuid o Connor Paudie Clifford Sean o shea David Clifford Mike Breen Killian Spillane Fairly secure: Shane Ryan Paul Murphy David Moran Dara Moynihan Tony Brosnan Micheal Burns Tadgh Morley Paul Geaney Graham O’Sullivan Paul o Shea On the fence: Jack Barry Gavin Crowley Stephen o brien In trouble: Adrian Spillane Jack Sherwood Pa Kilkenny Kevin sullivan David Shaw Kieran Fitz Brian Leonard Outside Certs: Joe o connor Dylan Casey Shane Murphy Stefan Okunbar Outside Maybes: Wayne Guthrie Jack o shea Greg Horan Cormac Coffey Jack savage Sean O brien Adam Donoghue Andrew Barry Barry Mahony Evan Cronin Dan McCarthy I’m sure there’s a good few there I’ve forgotten too I would be adding : Daniel O’Brien, Mike Potts & Darragh Lyne to the “ Outside Maybes” & moving Seán O’Brien up a step to the outside certs.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 7, 2021 12:21:14 GMT
In terms of the Kerry panel for next year, I think the best way of dividing it up is to categorise them into; Certs, Fairly Secure, On the Fence, In trouble, Outside Certs, Outside Maybes. These are for the panel now, not the team Certs: Brian Begley Jason Foley Tom Sullivan Gavin White Diarmuid o Connor Paudie Clifford Sean o shea David Clifford Mike Breen Killian Spillane Fairly secure: Shane Ryan Paul Murphy David Moran Dara Moynihan Tony Brosnan Micheal Burns Tadgh Morley Paul Geaney Graham O’Sullivan Paul o Shea On the fence: Jack Barry Gavin Crowley Stephen o brien In trouble: Adrian Spillane Jack Sherwood Pa Kilkenny Kevin sullivan David Shaw Kieran Fitz Brian Leonard Outside Certs: Joe o connor Dylan Casey Shane Murphy Stefan Okunbar Outside Maybes: Wayne Guthrie Jack o shea Greg Horan Cormac Coffey Jack savage Sean O brien Adam Donoghue Andrew Barry Barry Mahony Evan Cronin Dan McCarthy I’m sure there’s a good few there I’ve forgotten too I would be adding : Daniel O’Brien, Mike Potts & Darragh Lyne to the “ Outside Maybes” & moving Seán O’Brien up a step to the outside certs. are Heinrich and quilter still U20 nexr year?
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Post by Whosinmidfield on Dec 7, 2021 12:23:54 GMT
How I’d view it with a thought to how Jack might view things
Certs: Brian Begley Jason Foley Tom Sullivan Gavin White Diarmuid O’Connor Paudie Clifford Sean O’Shea David Clifford Mike Breen Killian Spillane Shane Ryan Paul Murphy David Moran Dara Moynihan Tony Brosnan Tadgh Morley Paul Geaney Gavin Crowley Stephen o brien Eddie Horan Joe O’Connor Graham O’Sullivan
Fairly secure: Jack Sherwood Jack Barry Micheal Burns Paul O’Shea
On the fence: Ronan Buckley David Shaw Brian Leonard Adrian Spillane
In trouble: Pa Kilkenny Kevin Sullivan Kieran Fitzgibbon
Outside Certs: Dylan Casey Shane Murphy Stefan Okunbor Dan O’Donoghue
Outside Strong Chance: Donal O’Sullivan Daniel O’Brien Eanna O’Conchuir Barry Mahony Evan Cronin Adam Donoghue Tomás O’Sé
Outside Maybes: Wayne Guthrie Jack Savage Sean O’Brien Andrew Barry Dan McCarthy Luka Brosnan Dara Roche Michael O’Gara Gavin O’Brien Pa Warren Michael Foley Colm Moriarty James McCarthy
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Post by Whosinmidfield on Dec 7, 2021 12:26:08 GMT
I would be adding : Daniel O’Brien, Mike Potts & Darragh Lyne to the “ Outside Maybes” & moving Seán O’Brien up a step to the outside certs. are Heinrich and quilter still U20 nexr year? Quilter is overage in 2022. Heinrich is u20 in 2022 and 2023.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 7, 2021 13:36:17 GMT
are Heinrich and quilter still U20 nexr year? Quilter is overage in 2022. Heinrich is u20 in 2022 and 2023. Ah plenty of time for Heinrich, I suppose the fact quilter isn't starting for Stacks he won't make it.
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horsebox77
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Post by horsebox77 on Dec 7, 2021 18:24:47 GMT
Great panel of players amassed there, may I ask why there appears to be a high opinion tide on change of goal keeper, I wouldn't fault Ryan for the three green flags against Tyrone but more individual outfield errors that proved costly.
I personally don't rate Murphy or Guthrie. I also think the semi final loss and concession of soft goals has dipped the stock of O'Brien.
I don't see the necessity of change for the sake if it.
The returning Diarmuid Murphy as opposed to current keeping coach may also improve matters.
Regardless of Tyrone's game plan we did win 100% of our kickouts
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