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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2019 10:25:06 GMT
Time to lock the summer talk thread!
Winter is coming
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Sept 26, 2019 11:03:47 GMT
Time to lock the summer talk thread! Winter is coming What about Autumn? Winter already came.
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Post by Mickmack on Oct 29, 2019 23:11:50 GMT
Pat Griffin from Glenbeigh has died. Wing forward in the winning teams of 1969 and 1970.
My memory is hazy, but i remember thinking back then that he was a very skillfull half forward.
For some reason i have this idea in my head that he got injured playing against the aussies in one of the early attempts at marrying Gaelic football with Australian rules football. I could be wrong in this of course.
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Post by An Tarbh Rua on Oct 30, 2019 9:41:31 GMT
Pat Griffin from Glenbeigh has died. Wing forward in the winning teams of 1969 and 1970. My memory is hazy, but i remember thinking back then that he was a very skillfull half forward. For some reason i have this idea in my head that he got injured playing against the aussies in one of the early attempts at marrying Gaelic football with Australian rules football. I could be wrong in this of course. An exceptionally skilful player who would probably be murdered in today's game. I thought he played CHF rather than wing forward. His son was a good club player for Clonakilty for many years - same style but lacked a bit of toughness for county level. Condolences to his family.
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Post by veteran on Oct 30, 2019 11:33:32 GMT
Pat Griffin, one of my all time favourite Kerry footballers, has died. Because of his quiet, shy persona and understated approach on and off the field, he is often forgotten when Kerry footballers are discussed. I rate him as one of the best we have produced.
In the winter of 1962/spring 1963 the county was agog with talk of a boy wonder who was about to join the panel, Pat Griffin. Nobody had heard of him. His father was a native of Glenbeigh but had moved to Kildare where Pat was born and spent his formative years, playing minor for Kildare in 1962. I remember the 1963 Munster final in Killarney, because even though the team included the two Mickos, Tom Long, Seamus Murphy etc all the talk was about the Glenbeigh prodigal son. The game was not very advanced when all present realised that the hyperbole attendant on this stripling was well founded. This tall , athletic , dark haired boy with Hollywood handsome features was spellbinding. He seemed to possess all the necessary attributes for greatness but it was his mesmerising skill that enthralled, exemplified best by his solo up to an opponent and then with an effortless shimmy glided past. Pat played wing forward that day but his reputation was cemented as a CHF.
Even though we won the 1962 All-Ireland , Pat was unfortunate to come around when Kerry were in decline. We did not win the All-Ireland again until 1969, a drought in those days. In the meantime, players like Pat, Denis and Donie O'Sullivan, Mick Fleming , Mick Morris toiled in vain. In 1968, Pat was captain and probably reached an apotheosis in his career. He was stupendous in every game but alas we were beaten in the final, through no fault of Pat I can assure you. There is no doubt he would have been the unanimous footballer of the year if Kerry had won. In those days I was young and foolish, still foolish I suppose, and a couple of us decided to go out to the Kerry function in the International Hotel in Bray. I am not sure if that establishment still exists. In any case, I made my way up to Pat to have a few words with him. I still cringe when I think of it. However, Pat ,through to form, was typically gracious even though he was obviously distraught being a losing Kerry captain. He listened patiently to my inane comments, asked me about my own life and wished me well. You cannot buy class. I made a vow that night that I would never again attend a Kerry All-Ireland function, pestering the players, certainly not a losing one. I have not broken that vow.
Kerry went on to win the All-Irelands in 1969 and 1970, perhaps the NFL in both years as well, and therefore this incomparable stylist operating on the forty got his well earned rewards. Around that time , this all conquering Kerry team went on a "world tour", taking in Australia where Pat sustained a back injury. This severely limited his effectiveness and eventually forced him to opt out all together.
Pat spent most of his life as a garda in Clonakilty. Incidentally, he was married to a sister of a hurling contemporary from Kilkenny, Pat Delaney. Another CHF!
In dark moments, I often ruminate on past Kerry deeds and past Kerry footballers. Those thoughts often meander back to memories forged by the boy who came back from the flat lands of Kildare to the mountains of Kerry and went on to enrapture the natives. Pat , rest in peace. Forever indebted.
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Post by Mickmack on Oct 30, 2019 13:26:27 GMT
Wonderful stuff Veteran.
So a half forward line of Brendan Lynch, Pat Griffin and Eamon oDonoghue...
My hazy memory about his back injury is correct so. What i remember in fact is my father lamenting that fact Kerry had anything to do with going to play against the aussies resulting in his Kerry heroes getting badly broken up. I wasnt sure if it was Pat that got injured.
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Post by greengold35 on Oct 30, 2019 15:21:15 GMT
Wonderful stuff Veteran. So a half forward line of Brendan Lynch, Pat Griffin and Eamon oDonoghue... My hazy memory about his back injury is correct so. What i remember in fact is my father lamenting that fact Kerry had anything to do with going to play against the aussies resulting in his Kerry heroes getting badly broken up. I wasnt sure if it was Pat that got injured. Wonderful stuff indeed. That half forward trio were some players - Lynch with his pace & wonderful left foot - can still see him, in my minds eye, bending in a beauty into the top corner in the ‘72 drawn game vs Offaly - fantastic memories. Also, how good was Eamon O’Donoghue? A beautifully balanced footballer, had an almost telepathic understanding with Mick O’Connell - a very under rated player. Think his nickname was “ The Clever” or just “Clever” but it was most apt.
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Post by ballybunion on Oct 30, 2019 16:20:50 GMT
The stylish velvet skills of Pat Griffin I was lucky to witness and will never forget.He was an idol of mine as a garsun. I began going to All Ireland finals in the 60s,64,65,68 (3 losses) not a great decade for us but the fantastic skills of Pat Griffin were something to behold.Then came 69 and 70 and Pat and team mates were rewarded. A gentleman also and at the unveiling of the Paudi O Se monument a few years ago I had the great honour of meeting Pat. A handsome man,he was weathering his illness well and enjoyed meeting his old team mates as well as Sam Maguire. RIP Pat,from the flatlands of Kildare and Belcamp College he came to us and we were lucky.
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tpo
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Post by tpo on Oct 30, 2019 23:09:04 GMT
Is my memory deceiving me or did Pat solo at full flight and then stop and turn sideway to kick points ? I would have only seen him a few times
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Post by Mickmack on Nov 2, 2019 11:09:36 GMT
Irish Times Logo User Menu NEWS
South Africa’s captain Siya Kolisi celebrates his side’s victory over Wales at International Stadium Yokohama. Photograph: Ashley Western/PA Wire
Gerry Thornley Follow Tue, Oct 29, 2019, 05:00 0 It’s impossible, from this juncture anyway, to ascertain the social significance of Siya Kolisi potentially captaining the Springboks to victory in next Saturday’s World Cup final. But, almost akin to Barack Obama winning the US elections, the possibility would have been utterly unthinkable at least until the mid-90s.
“You don’t dream about that where I am from,” Kolisi said after Saturday’s semi-final, even though he had already taken rugby nine years before he watched the 2007 final at the age of 16.
Before the tournament started Bryan Habana, the hero of the 2007 triumph, placed the scenario on a par with Nelson Mandela handing the trophy to Francois Pienaar at Ellis Park in 1995.
“If South Africa go on and win with Siya Kolisi as the captain, it will be absolutely monumental. For us as a country to have that inspiration, for 70 per cent of our population to have that example, would be immensely important – on a par with Mandela in ‘95 if not greater. It would be historic.”
Right path Unlike Habana, who was at Ellis Park in 1995, Kolisi revealed after their 19-16 semi-final win over Wales that he watched the 2007 final when South Africa beat England in Paris from a tavern in a Zwide township.
Kolisi’s mother, Phakama, was 16 when Siya was born and his father, Fezakele, was in his final year of school. Kolisi’s mother died when he was 15, leaving his late grandmother, Nolulamile, to raise him.
In an interview in the Japanese media before the Rugby World Cup, Kolisi said, “It’s tough to stay on the right path because sometimes hunger makes you do things that you never thought you would do. Some of my friends would steal and some passed away because they got into bad things.”
Kolisi “never dreamed of being a rugby player” as a child and now says the sport was “my way out”. After trying rugby for the first time when he was seven years old, Kolisi not only quickly took an immediate liking to it, but stood out so much that at the age of 10 he was spotted by his primary school trainer, Eric Songwiqi, who brought him up to the local club, African Bombers.
At the age of 12, Kolisi impressed scouts at a youth tournament in Mossel Bay and was awarded a bursary at the leading Port Elizabeth rugby school, Grey High, where Ireland’s incoming attack coach, Mike Catt, was also once a pupil.
Related Rugby World Cup: Gerry Thornley's best and worst moments, top five tries and more The Joe Schmidt era: Burnout the inevitable result of a regime based upon excessive control Eddie Jones has England primed and ready for finale with Springboks
Kolisi’s star grew through the Eastern Province Kings youth set-up between 2007 and 2009. He played in the famed Under-18 Craven Week and for the SA schools team before being offered his first contract at Western Province at age of 18 by Rassie Erasmus.
Kolisi played for the South African under-20s side in the 2010 and 2011 IRB Junior World Championships, and in 2012 he graduated to the Stormers squad before making his Springbok debut in June 2013 against Scotland at the Mbombela Stadium in Nelspruit. He replaced the injured Arno Botha in the fifth minute and was named man of the match in a 30-17 win.
South Africa’s Siya Kolisi and Duane Vermeulen celebrate after beating Wales. Photograph: James Crombie/Inpho Erasmus appointed Kolisi as the Springboks’ first black captain in its 126-year history in May 2016, and in Saturday’s final he will win his 50th Test cap.
Kolisi married Rachel Smith, a former marketing executive, in 2016 and they have two children from their inter-racial marriage, a son Nicholas Siyamthanda (four) and daughter Keziah (two). Since 2014, his half-siblings, Liyema and Liphelo, children of his late mother, have been part of the Kolisi household, after five years in orphanages and foster care in Port Elizabeth.
All the while, Kolisi’s roots remain in Zwide, which he frequently revisits.
“He was from my primary school, Emsengeni Primary, and I took him to the local club, African Bombers. I also coached him there,” Songwiqi said last week.
“Even then, he showed discipline and those leadership qualities. Working with the other boys, they understood one another. There were two other boys who also did well. But Siya as an individual, I could see he would reach the highest point in life in rugby.
Commitment “Looking at his attributes and the commitment he showed, I could see that he could make it one day; the dedication and that enthusiasm. He was so passionate about what he was doing.
“When we heard the news [of Kolisi being made captain], it was an exuberant moment in the Zwide community, knowing him, and that he was a disciplined boy. He has ploughed back into the community, and the school where he played rugby. He is not looking after himself alone.
“He looks after the poorest communities and clubs in Zwide. He is playing a vital role to change the lives of youngsters and players.”
Before the semi-final, South African president Cyril Ramaphosa made a video call to Kolisi in which he wished the Springboks well ahead of the semi-final against Wales, prior to which Kolisi dedicated their performance to the people of South Africa.
“I have seen what winning a World Cup does for our country,” said Kolisi. “I am old enough to remember the 2007 World Cup and I remember what it did for the country then and I know what it will do for the country now.
“We have many different races in our country, and we have 11 official languages. It’s one of the positives in our country; it’s really beautiful and that’s why we’re called the Rainbow Nation. We have different races in the team as well, which is really beautiful, and I think it’s very important for the country for us to do well, and for us as a team.
“It just shows that when we decide to work together for one goal as a team or a country we can make anything happen. We can achieve all our dreams or goals. That’s why we want to give our best this week and hopefully do the same in the final.”
Kolisi has endeared himself to supporters back in South Africa with his regular messages and insights into the squad on social media, and in the aftermath of the Boks’ win over Wales he posted a video of the squad celebrating in the dressing room.
“We just want to say thank you so much for your support. It really means a lot to us. We gave our best today for you and please one more week to go, six more days... Keep on supporting us and send the messages. We appreciate it,” Kolisi said with his team-mates in the background.
Ramaphosa will be in attendance next Saturday. Pressure? More like inspiration, and with Kolisi as captain, plenty of it.
Rugby World Cup
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Post by Mickmack on Nov 2, 2019 11:10:22 GMT
Isnt sport an amazing unifying force!
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Fado
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Post by Fado on Nov 2, 2019 11:16:07 GMT
Three good Munster men running the show😉
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Post by Control5 on Nov 3, 2019 9:29:21 GMT
I changed the title so that we will have one thread for what was Winter Talk, Summer Talk etc
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Post by Mickmack on Nov 3, 2019 15:40:48 GMT
Hurling How iconic save put beguiling Wexford on the hurling map
The passing of Art Foley closes a chapter on the team that continues to inspire generations
Dermot Crowe
Art Foley, who died on Monday last in New York, will be remembered for a save he made in the closing stages of the 1956 All-Ireland hurling final that had seismic and far-reaching consequences. It formed an instrumental part of a metamorphic sequence of play in a terrific contest with Cork, leading to one of the game's most epic finales.
With three minutes left the ever-threatening Christy Ring gained possession and made for the Wexford goal. The finer points of what happened next are still in dispute. The main thread of the narrative is not.
Ring let fly and the diminutive Foley in Wexford's goal was equal to it. He needed to be. His side led by two points, and a goal, especially one by Ring, would surely have inspired a Cork victory. Ring would have had his ninth medal. Wexford hurling might not be the beguiling and romanticised entity it is today.
In the game's pivotal moment, the ball quickly travelled down the other end where Tom Ryan sent a raking handpass to Nickey Rackard. In a piece of perfect casting, the greatest name in Wexford hurling landed the deathblow, netting with a low shot to the corner. Wexford were already champions, having defeated Galway in the final a year before to end a 45-year wait. But to beat Cork gave them a status they'd never attained before and wrote them into everlasting legend.
The death of Foley at 90 ended a significant chapter for that storied era, he being the last surviving member of the team that won the final in '56 and which started the '55 decider, giving hope to all counties outside the traditional fold. In a decade often depicted as repressive and severe, with heavy emigration, Wexford brought an abundance of novelty and glamour and dauntless expression which made them huge crowd-pullers and popular all over the country. A jazzy addition to the traditional acts. The previous six All-Irelands before Wexford's breakthrough in '55 were shared between Cork and Tipperary.
"Why are all these massive crowds following Wexford?" asks Liam Griffin. "The Wexford support base for hurling grew with the rise of the Wexford teams of the 1950s. There was a romantic connection between them and all hurling people. Why? Because they came up to challenge the dominant counties."
At the time Wexford looked more likely to prosper in football than hurling. The 1950s, led by the Rackards, changed all that. Only a few survivors remain from the '56 panel: Ted Morrissey, Oliver Gough and Pat Nolan. Morrissey played in the Leinster final before losing his place and had also been on the squad in '51 when Wexford reached the All-Ireland final. Nolan was Art Foley's goalkeeping deputy in '56, later winning All-Ireland medals over a long career in '60 and '68. Gough came on in the '55 final.
In a way the loop that began the most famous end-to-end move in Wexford hurling history, starting with Foley's save and concluding with Rackard's goal, was replicated in life itself. The first of that celebrated '56 team to die was Rackard, in April, 1976, at the age of 54 after succumbing to cancer. When the team was celebrating its silver jubilee in 1981, Foley came home from the US for the occasion, having emigrated with his wife Anne and their three young children at 27 in the late 1950s. By the time of the silver jubilee of the '56 win, only Rackard was missing. Gradually over the years the numbers diminished. Ned Wheeler went this year. Billy Rackard was the last of that famous band of brothers to die ten years ago. Now, Foley, literally the last one standing, has gone too. The deeds, though, remain timeless and immortal.
The save which made Foley famous followed him around all his days. "The big story of Art Foley is that save because it is the seminal moment of that time," as Liam Griffin puts it. It is also probably the most enigmatic save in the history of the game - the Mona Lisa of hurling saves, such has been the variety of interpretations. Even Ring seems to have offered contradictory accounts.
Raymond Smith has an account from John Keane, the former Waterford great, who was umpiring that day. He recalled Ring shooting from 25 yards and the ball moving "so fast that the thought flashed through my mind, this must be a goal . . . and I couldn't believe my eyes when I saw that he'd saved it."
One newspaper referred to "a powerful close-in shot" and another to a "piledriver" which was one of "several miracle saves" made by Foley on the day. Val Dorgan, Ring's biographer, reported a "vicious strike" that was saved just under the cross bar and he also used the word "miraculous".
Later, Ring claimed in conversations with Dorgan that he was off balance after being impeded by Paddy Barry and didn't get sufficient power in the shot. Yet Ring himself is quoted in The Irish Press after the match as follows: "It was one of the best saves I ever saw. I thought it was all over when I went through."
It wasn't until the next decade that All-Ireland finals began to be televised, leaving iconic moments like this shrouded in some mystery. Speaking to the Irish Echo in 2011, Foley himself gave this account:
"Well, he shot and I blocked it straight up in the air. This is where they always get it wrong. They always say I caught it and cleared it, straight to Nickey [Rackard] and he scored the goal. But I blocked it out and Pat Barry [Cork] doubled on it, and it hit the outside of the net.
"I pucked it out to Jim English and he passed it to Tom Ryan, and he got it to Nickey and Nickey got the goal, and we went on to win."
It was in keeping with Foley's personality to play down the save's merits. In an interview in 2014, Ned Wheeler referred to Foley as "a gentlemen of few words". They stayed in touch regularly on the phone up to shortly before Wheeler's death.
Ted Morrissey was another in frequent contact, a player who moved to Enniscorthy to work and joined the St Aidan's club which Foley played for. "I used to ring him every couple of weeks until recently," says Morrissey, now 89. "I rang him recently and he had fallen, the wife told me he was in the nursing home.
"He was very clear, he had a great memory, could tell me all the people who lived on the street where he was. He worked as a lorry driver, that's what he was doing before he left. I suppose he thought there was a better life over there."
What did they talk about? "About hurling and old times and the people he knew and he'd be asking me about the people around Enniscorthy. Unfortunately, by the last few conversations there weren't many left that he knew."
Foley was just 5'6" at a time when there were marauding full-forwards aplenty and the goalkeeper didn't have the protection in the rulebook he has now. He was dropped after conceding six goals in the 1951 National League final and didn't play in the All-Ireland final later that year against Tipperary when Wexford suffered a heavy loss. Wexford opted for a novice 'keeper, something Billy Rackard later said had been a mistake.
When he made the save in '56 Foley was given an appreciative and sporting hand-shake from Ring. The Cloyne man was notoriously competitive but often commented on the sportsmanship of Wexford and specifically his marker Bobby Rackard. At the end of the '56 final Nick O'Donnell and Rackard chaired Ring off the field which is another lasting and remarkable feature of that final.
Foley spoke of that moment to Ted Morrissey. "Nicko (O'Donnell) came to Arty and says, 'we'll shoulder him off the field'. And Arty says to him, 'how the hell will we do that, you are 6'2 and I am 5'6 . . . go and get Bobby with you'. So Nicko and Bobby shouldered him off and Arty was a back-up man, giving them a push from behind."
Ring stated after the '54 final when Cork defeated Wexford that Cork had never defeated a cleaner team. Perhaps the very different experience he had against Galway in the previous year's final had something to do with that, but the relationship between the counties at the time was cordial and warm. Ring being chaired off the field was its Olympian moment. At a time when hurling was notoriously rough and macho, these displays of sportsmanship were notably different from the norm. It deepened Wexford's unique appeal.
Tony Dempsey, the former Wexford county chairman, and former senior hurling manger, met Foley and his wife and some of the family over lunch in Long Island a few years ago, where they made a presentation to him for his services to the county. They spoke of that decision to carry off Ring. "He told me Bobby caught Ring like a doll and lifted him up," said Dempsey, noting the power for which he was renowned.
Foley survived in spite of his height limitations, helped by having O'Donnell in front of him. He left school at 13, like many others who were obliged to at the time, and followed his father Tommy, a truck driver, into employment at Davis's Mills in Enniscorthy.
He told Dempsey in New York how he routinely carried 12-stone bags of flour up and down ladders at 14. "He took out a photo album and showed a photo of himself jumping for the ball," says Dempsey, "and proportionate to his body he had massive muscles, massive quads and massive thighs."
In New York he ended up in long-term employment for TWA, spending 34 years as a crew chief. He came home occasionally, sometimes for reunions.
After winning the '56 final, and entering legend, Wexford's victorious players began the triumphant journey home on the Monday night, stopping off in the Market Square in Enniscorthy.
A Mr Browne from the county board introduced the players individually. "The greatest ovation was reserved for the goalkeeper Arty Foley whose brilliance in the net contributed much to Wexford's victory," the Irish Independent reported. Forty three years after they laid Nickey Rackard to rest in Bunclody, the first of that special team, Art Foley has gone to his eternal resting place in New York. Their deaths took place decades and thousands of miles apart. But their spirits will remain inseparable.
Sunday Indo Sport
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Post by mitchelsontour on Nov 4, 2019 22:10:38 GMT
Don't know if anyone has mentioned it yet but according to the o'neills website there is a new county jersey on the way.
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peanuts
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Post by peanuts on Nov 4, 2019 23:15:15 GMT
Don't know if anyone has mentioned it yet but according to the o'neills website there is a new county jersey on the way. if its to replace the mustard colour jersey then fine but I hope there's not going down the route of changing the jersey every year a la soccer.
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Post by kerrygold on Nov 5, 2019 8:56:24 GMT
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Post by mitchelsontour on Nov 5, 2019 14:48:02 GMT
Don't know if anyone has mentioned it yet but according to the o'neills website there is a new county jersey on the way. if its to replace the mustard colour jersey then fine but I hope there's not going down the route of changing the jersey every year a la soccer. Unfortunately it's not the mustard abomination.
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Post by Tadhgeen on Nov 6, 2019 21:03:08 GMT
Nice interview with John Egan... /
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Post by southward on Nov 9, 2019 14:23:59 GMT
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 9, 2019 14:56:28 GMT
Ridiculous to be bringing Clifford into this article
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Post by Mickmack on Nov 10, 2019 23:45:27 GMT
Gaelic Football Colm O'Rourke: 'A young player could be needed by four teams next January - this ridiculous schedule must end'
Colm O'Rourke
We are being treated to a right Hungarian goulash of fixtures early next year. Everything is being thrown in.
The All-Ireland club championship has been brought forward. So has the Sigerson Cup, while the under-20 championship will be run off in February and March. The preparation for that will be in direct opposition to third-level Freshers competitions and for the older players, the Sigerson or other third-level competitions. The age limit at schools level is now 19 and a half so that's thrown into the mix as well.
No insult to the goulash but this is a right dog's dinner. And this is without mentioning the start of the league. If you are confused by all of this then join the party.
Some might just look at the fixtures and think that some of the games are not exactly on at the same time. Well that is true but what about preparation for all these teams? One thing for sure is that every good-quality young player will get a savage amount of training and games in the month of January. A good player around 20 could be wanted for training by his county senior squad, the county under-20 team, his third-level team and if his club return to action early, he might be asked to show his face there too.
There is another guarantee here too, and that is the fixture mess will cause a great deal of conflict between team managers because of course every team manager believes their team is the most important. Will county team managers whose star player is on a Sigerson team be happy to train without them until that competition finishes? Not a chance. Will the senior manager allow the best under-20 players to go with that team until they finish their championship? Answers on a postage stamp to that one. Will the under-20 manager tell his best player who is playing schools football to stick with that team while the school are in the championship? Not likely.
The loser, as always, is the player. This is because players are often far too honest and will not tell some of these selfish, self-serving managers to take a running jump. Or maybe they feel they can't speak up or they will be dropped. Hence the need for an outside authority at county board level to make decisions in the best interests of players and then to make sure they are implemented. This is the role of a welfare officer, one with teeth. Would a county board give someone this much power? It is badly needed.
In January a player in a third-level college is probably doing exams and should be concentrating on them. They should also have a life. This means the odd night in Coppers mixed in with a couple in the gym and a couple more on the training ground. What they absolutely don't need is to be driving up and down the country to training sessions, getting home after midnight after being away for six or seven hours. There is no physical benefit from that and it is draining mentally.
A good manager will say to his young players that they should concentrate on their studies, play with their colleges mid-week and come home for a light session at the weekend. Of course the conflict then arises with the under-20 squad. Boutros Boutros-Ghali or Kofi Annan would be needed here.
And if your county is in danger of relegation from the second division or chasing promotion from the third to ensure being in the race for Sam next year, then the stakes get even higher. Will a player's welfare trump a manager fighting for his life? For a senior manager, results are all that matter. Hence the need for someone who can decide what player plays with which team and how often they should train. County boards must treat the development of their young players with the greatest degree of seriousness. I don't know many, if any, who take the long view.
Then there is the other area, where I do have some current knowledge. For years I have had disagreements with county minor managers who want to run the guts out of school footballers and do not care about second-level competition. 'The school does not count' is often the instruction - just concentrate on the county. When minor went to under-17 I thought nearly all of the problems were solved, but now an under-20 competition is set into the middle of the schools games. Whoever thought of putting the under-20 championship into this slot needs to be informed that it is a really stupid idea.
It would be much better if a decree came from Croke Park on what teams players were entitled to play with at this time of year. Something like third-level players playing with their colleges until their competitions end, then under-20 players having to stick with their team and second-level schools players having no training or games with the under-20 team until their school is out. Then appoint a player welfare officer in each county to enforce it.
Of course it would cause anomalies and some counties would be worse hit than others, but if the GAA believe in protecting their players then this is the minimum required. By our actions not our words we are judged.
None of this takes into account that January is the worst month of the year for games and training, yet the GAA have made it the busiest month of the year. Where is the common sense there? There is no point in arguing that most of the games are in February as the real preparation for all games will take place in January.
Hopefully there will be a bit of global warming in three months but these fixture plans are dicing with wind, rain, snow and frost not to mention the physical and mental wellbeing of our greatest resource - young, talented players. On top of that is the big risk of overload injuries caused by different training regimes. The new fixtures committee, whose report is imminent and eagerly awaited, will surely bring some sense to this madness.
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Post by glengael on Nov 11, 2019 10:40:08 GMT
Difficult to disagree with Colm O'Rourke there.
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Post by Mickmack on Nov 14, 2019 9:34:35 GMT
The U-20 football championships will be the centrepiece of the GAA's St Patrick's Day celebrations in Croke Park, replacing the All-Ireland senior club finals which have been moved to January.
It will feature either the All-Ireland final or a semi-final double-header, depending on the scheduling of the provincial programmes.
The U-20 championships are being played much earlier in 2020, having taken place in summer over the past two seasons. Cork beat Dublin in this year's final, played in Portlaoise in early August.
Central Council are expected to approve the U-20 proposal when they discuss the 2020 fixtures plan at their meeting on Saturday week.
The senior club finals will be played on January 19 as part of a streamlining of the fixtures programme. The ultimate aim is to complete them before Christmas as soon as possible. However, that's not expected to be introduced for a few years.
The club football and hurling finals have been played in Croke Park on St Patrick's Day since the mid-1980s, so removing them left a void.
The GAA believe that it's vital to have games in Croke Park on the national holiday and would have liked to feature senior action.
It's understood that some counties were sounded out about playing an Allianz League game, but it wasn't possible as the national holiday falls on a Tuesday next year.
It would mean any counties involved on St Patrick's Day would be in action again five days later, leaving them at a disadvantage as the leagues reach the crucial final stages.
The hurling league final and the final round of divisional football games are due to be played on the weekend of March 21/22.
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Nov 14, 2019 9:59:23 GMT
The U-20 football championships will be the centrepiece of the GAA's St Patrick's Day celebrations in Croke Park, replacing the All-Ireland senior club finals which have been moved to January. It will feature either the All-Ireland final or a semi-final double-header, depending on the scheduling of the provincial programmes. The U-20 championships are being played much earlier in 2020, having taken place in summer over the past two seasons. Cork beat Dublin in this year's final, played in Portlaoise in early August. Central Council are expected to approve the U-20 proposal when they discuss the 2020 fixtures plan at their meeting on Saturday week. The senior club finals will be played on January 19 as part of a streamlining of the fixtures programme. The ultimate aim is to complete them before Christmas as soon as possible. However, that's not expected to be introduced for a few years. The club football and hurling finals have been played in Croke Park on St Patrick's Day since the mid-1980s, so removing them left a void. The GAA believe that it's vital to have games in Croke Park on the national holiday and would have liked to feature senior action. It's understood that some counties were sounded out about playing an Allianz League game, but it wasn't possible as the national holiday falls on a Tuesday next year. It would mean any counties involved on St Patrick's Day would be in action again five days later, leaving them at a disadvantage as the leagues reach the crucial final stages. The hurling league final and the final round of divisional football games are due to be played on the weekend of March 21/22. Good for second level students. Not so good for third level students.
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Post by kerrygold on Nov 14, 2019 10:12:41 GMT
So David Clifford, Sean O'Shea, Kerry and their underage team mates could have won a few u20/21 All-Ireland medals without all this messing around with the grade & seasonal sittings of the championship.............................You couldn't make it up!
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Post by Mickmack on Nov 14, 2019 10:55:03 GMT
IrishExaminerOpen Menu
By Eoghan Cormican Staff writer
Follow @cormicaneoghan Wednesday, November 13, 2019 - 06:30 AM Former Dublin footballer Ger Brennan is fearful scheduling changes to the Sigerson Cup and All-Ireland U20 football championship could lead to young players dropping out of college.
In a bid to free up third-level players for the Allianz football league, Croke Park have decided to squeeze the 2020 Sigerson Cup into a much smaller timeframe than recent editions of the third-level football competition.
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Throwing in on the weekend of January 11/12, and with the backdoor element removed, the Sigerson Cup will conclude two and a half weeks later on January 29.
The All-Ireland U20 football championship, meanwhile, which was run off during the months of June, July, and August this year, will have an early February start in 2020.
Two-time All-Ireland medal winner Brennan, who is in his fifth year as University College Dublin GAA executive, has described the changes as “illogical”.
He firmly believes Croke Park top-brass no longer value the role or importance of the GAA in third-level institutions.
“UCD have roughly 600 students involved in Gaelic games, that includes 42 student coaches and administrators. We field 19 teams and also have a handball club. We are a massive presence in the biggest university in the country.
“You only have to walk into CIT, where you have someone like Keith Ricken overseeing matters, or UCC [to realise that] most students would be lost without having a GAA club to go to. I imagine a lot of them would definitely fall out of college,” said Brennan.
“It is just total ignorance from the GAA’s higher powers. They have totally ignored the reality of life for the third-level GAA officer who is trying to promote our games in universities and add value to the student experience.
“We use the term student-athlete in UCD. A guy is a student first, he’s an athlete, hurler, or footballer second.
“Around 30% of third-level institutions have their exams after Christmas in January. What you are doing by squeezing the Sigerson Cup into January is you are putting immense pressure on the student during this period.”
It will be much the same story for U20 footballers in February.
Those still in secondary school will have their Leaving Cert mocks to contend with at the same time as the U20 championship is throwing-in, while U20 players at third-level will be just finished their post-Christmas exams and an All-Ireland freshers championship which is being shoehorned into a near three-and-a-half-week period.
“There is a lot good about the GAA, but I just don’t know why, with regard to Sigerson and U20 football, they have decided to change it again and squeeze the life out of young players who are going to be absolutely knackered both physically and mentally.
“They’ll be chasing their tails academically, they’ll be chasing their tails playing for the universities, and they’ll be chasing their tails playing for their respective U20 teams.
“The players are the only ones who are going to suffer here.”
Ger Brennan: ‘A guy is a student first, he’s an athlete, hurler, or footballer second.’ Ger Brennan: ‘A guy is a student first, he’s an athlete, hurler, or footballer second.’ The Sigerson Cup was played across a 36-day window earlier this year.
Brennan’s preference would have been to leave it untouched for the moment, along with the summer running of the U20 football championship, and instead wait for the recommendations of the fixtures review taskforce which GAA president John Horan established at the beginning of summer.
“[Hierarchy] are moving one cog in a huge machine without really giving heed or proper planning to the effects on another part of that same machine. And there are consequences the whole time.
“Between the GPA, CPA, and the other different stakeholders involved, there needed to be more time given to coming up with a satisfactory season plan that incorporates and values the different competitions accordingly.
“A plan that takes the pressure off students having to be driving up and down the road non-stop and fellas failing exams or fellas suffering injuries, dropping out of college, whatever, because they are so knackered and fatigued. It is just not good.
“I am not sure who is pulling the strings or what the agenda is here. It is not working out anyway. You are putting the cart before the horse the whole time. For one, I’d start the national league a little later.”
Another committee put together by John Horan, and chaired by former All-Ireland winning Kilkenny coach Michael Dempsey, was asked to review the youth/player development pathway at inter-county level. Brennan, along with CIT GAA development officer and All-Ireland U20 winning manager Ricken, met with the committee to outline the value of the GAA at third-level.
Their input and the views of many other third-level GAA officers stands in total contradiction to the scheduling changes subsequently imposed.
“That report, I don’t think it even got a chance to be read by the GAA hierarchy, whether that be the Central Competitions Control Committee (CCCC) or Central Council or whomever. It appears this report was commissioned as a box-ticking exercise and hierarchy were going to do what they wanted to do anyway. Lip service was paid to the third-level institutions.
“If you look at the evidence that is there, the GAA hierarchy just want the senior and fresher third-level championships out of the way as quickly as possible. What is the reason for all this? I’d give an educated guess that it probably comes down to money and what sort of revenue third-level brings in for Croke Park as a whole.
“From their point of view, the attitude is to get these competitions out of the way and then we can focus on the real stuff — the senior inter-county competitions. That is what the GAA hierarchy are all about, in my opinion.”
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Post by Mickmack on Nov 14, 2019 11:08:15 GMT
7 league games, a provincial championship, 3 super 8 games, a semi final and a final at inter county level in the first 8 months of the year is not leaving much room for much else.
You would have to ask whether the sigerson should move to september now when the inter county is over and exam pressure is not as intense.
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Nov 14, 2019 11:43:01 GMT
7 league games, a provincial championship, 3 super 8 games, a semi final and a final at inter county level in the first 8 months of the year is not leaving much room for much else. You would have to ask whether the sigerson should move to september now when the inter county is over and exam pressure is not as intense. County Championships.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 14, 2019 13:48:04 GMT
7 league games, a provincial championship, 3 super 8 games, a semi final and a final at inter county level in the first 8 months of the year is not leaving much room for much else. You would have to ask whether the sigerson should move to september now when the inter county is over and exam pressure is not as intense. County Championships. College finishes in May for most
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