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Post by kerrygold on Aug 6, 2017 16:43:22 GMT
Some game in Croker, a one point game all the way through. Galway marginally the better team and deserved the win. A couple of insane Joe Cooney points late in the game.
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Post by Mickmack on Aug 6, 2017 17:15:22 GMT
Another enthralling match and its Galways turn to win by a point.
Lots of errors too and missed opportunities but the stakes were high today.
Nothing against Waterford or Cork but I hope Galway win this final.
I thought the ref gave Tipp nothing today to be fair.
Joe was having a poor game and then he does the supernatural at the end.
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Post by onlykerry on Aug 6, 2017 18:27:08 GMT
Out and about today so had to rely on radio to follow the game - only the closeness of the scores stopped me from switching to anything else - found the commentary of cringeworthy in the extreme. RTÉ are using idiots who make noise with John Mullane particularly irksome today. Can they not just call a game and inform listeners of what's happening and leave the idiots in the crowd without a mike.
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Post by kerrygold on Aug 6, 2017 19:12:44 GMT
The game on the radio post Micheal O'Muircheartaigh has fallen through the floor.
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Post by seaniebo on Aug 6, 2017 19:37:17 GMT
The standard of hurling has dipped a wee bit which made today's encounter more enthralling rather than a classic hurling affair. I think a Kilkenny team of 5 years ago would have won today's match by some distance. For the neutral it's no harm that's no longer the case and we're treated to these tussles. A 6 week break for Galway didn't help matters today but they prevailed and well deserved it in a game riddled with mistakes and missed chances.
Tipp's inability to put back to back All Ireland's is quite remarkable. They go back to the 60's when they last achieved that feat. To say they underachieve of late is an understatement. It's something like 5 championships in 50 years which is an extraordinary stat.
On a personal note I'd like to see the winner come from the other side. That said it will take doing to down Galway now.
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Post by Mickmack on Aug 6, 2017 20:15:49 GMT
Cork won the u17 all ireland today. As regards hurling, the future is red.
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Post by Kingdomson on Aug 6, 2017 22:39:03 GMT
Thanks to the magnificent hurling men of Galway and Tipperary, you were the perfect antidote to the football dross we endured on Saturday.
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Post by southward on Aug 6, 2017 22:41:15 GMT
Des Cahill at it again trying to finger a Galway player for suspension with his emails from concerned citizens bullsh*t.
Would you ever f**k right off Des.
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Post by Mickmack on Aug 6, 2017 22:43:18 GMT
The standard of hurling has dipped a wee bit which made today's encounter more enthralling rather than a classic hurling affair. I think a Kilkenny team of 5 years ago would have won today's match by some distance. For the neutral it's no harm that's no longer the case and we're treated to these tussles. A 6 week break for Galway didn't help matters today but they prevailed and well deserved it in a game riddled with mistakes and missed chances. Tipp's inability to put back to back All Ireland's is quite remarkable. They go back to the 60's when they last achieved that feat. To say they underachieve of late is an understatement. It's something like 5 championships in 50 years which is an extraordinary stat. On a personal note I'd like to see the winner come from the other side. That said it will take doing to down Galway now. Maybe... but KK never has the level of skill Tipp have.. I mean Buggles, Callanan etc etc and on a different level. KK had far more grit and determination I grant you that.
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Post by kerrygold on Aug 6, 2017 22:46:14 GMT
Strange comment, Carey, Shefflin, Power to name but a few.
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Post by Mickmack on Aug 6, 2017 23:23:57 GMT
I cant ever recall an 11 to 15 with a combined skill level quotient.
Given a decent level of service which didnt happen today ......
Noel McGrath John O’Dwyer Seamus Callanan John McGrath
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Post by kerrygold on Aug 6, 2017 23:29:53 GMT
Callanan missed a bagful today, bubbles was quiet enough. Tipp can be a bit of an enigma at times.
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Post by veteran on Aug 7, 2017 8:29:03 GMT
The match yesterday was not unlike the Mayo/Roscommon draw in that at times the quality was poor but it was so competitive and the outcome so uncertain that one was totally enthralled. Galway seem to have adopted the claustrophobic physicality Kilkenny model. No doubt Joe's last point was worthy of deciding any match but I felt the pass he received was a throw ball which of course would be consistent with the lawlessness which currently pervades our two codes.
PS This should be on the football thread but wasn't it disappointing to see Johnny Cooper going down holding his head after receiving a phantom blow to that region. This happens all too often with players who masquerade as "hard men". We witnessed it some years with one of our own. I am fond of Des Cahill but that incident should have highlighted if he felt the KD incident of the previous week warranted mention. Must do better Des.
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kerryexile
Fanatical Member
Whether you believe that you can, or that you can't, you are right anyway.
Posts: 1,108
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Post by kerryexile on Aug 7, 2017 21:50:22 GMT
The standard of hurling has dipped a wee bit which made today's encounter more enthralling rather than a classic hurling affair. I think a Kilkenny team of 5 years ago would have won today's match by some distance. For the neutral it's no harm that's no longer the case and we're treated to these tussles. A 6 week break for Galway didn't help matters today but they prevailed and well deserved it in a game riddled with mistakes and missed chances. Tipp's inability to put back to back All Ireland's is quite remarkable. They go back to the 60's when they last achieved that feat. To say they underachieve of late is an understatement. It's something like 5 championships in 50 years which is an extraordinary stat. On a personal note I'd like to see the winner come from the other side. That said it will take doing to down Galway now. Maybe... but KK never has the level of skill Tipp have.. I mean Buggles, Callanan etc etc and on a different level. KK had far more grit and determination I grant you that. Mick, I accept your opinion but Kilkenny had Sheflin, Eddie Brennan, Ritchie Hogan and more. Is it your opinion that the Tipp players have more individual creativity and can swing a game where Kilkenny play more as a team?
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Post by Mickmack on Aug 7, 2017 22:37:13 GMT
Maybe... but KK never has the level of skill Tipp have.. I mean Buggles, Callanan etc etc and on a different level. KK had far more grit and determination I grant you that. Mick, I accept your opinion but Kilkenny had Sheflin, Eddie Brennan, Ritchie Hogan and more. Is it your opinion that the Tipp players have more individual creativity and can swing a game where Kilkenny play more as a team?
No team will ever match KK on having leaders all over the pitch with grit and determination. But Tipp in full flow in 2016 were the most skillfull All Ireland champions I have seen. It was spell binding at times.
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Post by glengael on Aug 8, 2017 10:00:59 GMT
Whatever way it goes now we will have 'new' All Ireland champions in hurling which can't be a bad thing. Cork are the most recent winners of the 3 left and that was 12 years ago. Galway are 29 years waiting and Waterford haven't won in 58 years.
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Post by kerrygold on Aug 8, 2017 13:02:23 GMT
Whatever way it goes now we will have 'new' All Ireland champions in hurling which can't be a bad thing. Cork are the most recent winners of the 3 left and that was 12 years ago. Galway are 29 years waiting and Waterford haven't won in 58 years. Yes, a real novel feel about this years hurling championship now. Cork are the team left with real championship pedigree however!
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Post by Mickmack on Aug 8, 2017 15:19:26 GMT
And Galway have never beaten either of the other two in senior hurling championship as far as i know
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Post by kerrygold on Aug 8, 2017 15:23:35 GMT
Galway made hard enough work of beating an out of sorts Tipp team although I felt Galway were the better team on the day.
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Post by Mickmack on Aug 8, 2017 15:35:08 GMT
I think there was war between Cork and Galway in Christy Rings time. I remember reading about it a long time ago in a book by Raymond Smith. Ring was at the centre of it and i think round two took place in Barrys hotel after the game. There was bad blood between the counties at the time over it.
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Post by veteran on Aug 8, 2017 15:37:48 GMT
And Galway have never beaten either of the other two in senior hurling championship as far as i know I have a vague memory of Galway beating Cork in the eighties on a terrible day in the a semi-final. Not sure.
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Jigz84
Fanatical Member
Posts: 2,017
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Post by Jigz84 on Aug 8, 2017 16:03:47 GMT
And Galway have never beaten either of the other two in senior hurling championship as far as i know I have a vague memory of Galway beating Cork in the eighties on a terrible day in the a semi-final. Not sure. 1985 was the year.
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Post by Mickmack on Aug 8, 2017 20:28:48 GMT
I should have said an All Ireland final in relation to Cork. Galway ambushed them in 1975 and 1979 too and KK picked up the cup in September both years
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Post by Mickmack on Aug 8, 2017 20:32:28 GMT
I think there was war between Cork and Galway in Christy Rings time. I remember reading about it a long time ago in a book by Raymond Smith. Ring was at the centre of it and i think round two took place in Barrys hotel after the game. There was bad blood between the counties at the time over it. More on this.... For many people, Galway's life as an elite hurling county began in the mid-1970s, when longtime ex-player Michael 'Inky' Flaherty coached the side to a stunning victory over Cork in the 1975 All-Ireland semi-final. That was six years after they said goodbye to Munster hurling. One could draw a parrellel between Galway in 1975 and the Dublin hurlers in the Anthony Daly era. In that light, one would anticipate Galway's efforts in Munster, should it ever come to this, to be more fruitful this time around. It was Galway's lot, as Cyril Farrell said, to be cut off from the rest of hurling "by both history and geography." Not that the game was ever wholly ignored there. The club championship in Galway always attracted feverish support. The county boasted a relatively strong team in the late 1940s and early 1950s. The won the Railway Cup in 1947, the National League in 1951, and the Oireachtas Cup in 1952. Indeed, Formula 1 mogul Max Mosley, son of the old Blackshirt leader, lived in south Galway in his youth and recalled in his autobiography that "that corner of Galway (Clonfert) had some inspirational hurling players at the time." But they fell short of an All-Ireland. They beat Kilkenny in the 1953 All-Ireland semi-final. But they narrowly lost a controversial final to Cork, during which star defender Mickey Burke was struck off the ball by Christy Ring. Burke had rendered Ring nearly anonymous at that point but by the time the final whistle blew, he was having his teeth fixed up in a Dublin emergency unit. With Burke dazed and taken out of action, Cork pulled ahead and won by a couple of points. In retaliation, Ringy was attacked on a flight of stairs in the Gresham Hotel by an unidentified Galway player. The box in the head caused Ring to lose his footing. The following morning in Barry's Hotel, a posse of Galway players went to rough up Ring at breakfast but they were met by a gang of Glen Rovers players who'd rallied around their man. While some Cork journalists praised Galway for their "attractive" and "constructive" hurling, the Cork Examiner's Tom Higgins accused the Galway support of unruly behaviour and said he hoped it would be "at least another 24 years before Galway are seen in an All-Ireland final." Higgins's article did prompt outrage in Galway hurling circles. A myth grew that Galway supporters burned a copy of the Examiner in Eyre Square, though Dermot Crowe and Ronnie Bellew, who've written about the game in 'Hell for Leather: A Journey through hurling in 100 games', say there's no evidence that this occurred. The Galway trainer, Padraig Fahy, demanded that Burke's attacker, aka, Ring, be expelled from the GAA.
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Post by kerrygold on Aug 8, 2017 21:00:46 GMT
Interesting read, some great GAA stories out there.
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Post by glengael on Aug 10, 2017 9:20:36 GMT
The death of Tony Keady at such a young age is very sad indeed. Part of the great Galway team of the 80's and the subject of one of the great GAA controversies of the time.
May he rest in peace.
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Post by Mickmack on Aug 10, 2017 9:29:59 GMT
Jesus I am shocked to read that he has died. He was at the game on Sunday and got a heart attack on Tuesday.
McInerney, Keady and Finnerty. What a half back line that was.
This will cast a terrible gloom over Galway hurling after Sundays high.
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Post by Mickmack on Aug 10, 2017 21:50:41 GMT
By Peter Sweeney
RTÉ Sport journalist
Whatever he did in this great hurling career, Tony Keady was always going to be remembered for the ‘affair’ that bore his name.
This icon, larger-than-life figure, gentleman and devoted husband and father will be recalled as such, though mention of his name will always bring to mind the Tony Keady Affair - even for those who are too young to remember it or who can’t recall how it played out.
This was the GAA at its officious, nitpicking and unbending worst and robbed one of its great players his shot at history. For younger fans, this is Diarmuid Connolly's current 12-week suspension and the coverage and rancour it provoked times a thousand.
Having lost the All-Ireland finals of 1985 and ’86, Galway recorded back-to-back Liam MacCarthy Cup wins in the following two years.
They were the dominant force at the time, in 1989 they were going for three in-a-row and Keady, who died at just 53-years-old on Wednesday, was their rock at centre-back. This was a player of style and substance and manager Cyril Farrell built a brilliant defence around him.
Having won the 1988/’89 National League (back then it was split before and after Christmas) Galway had three months off before they entered the All-Ireland championship at the semi-final stage.
As reigning Hurler of the Year, Keady was part of the All Star team that travelled to New York in May 1989 and he liked it so much he decided that he was going to stay for a while.
"I had a brother, Bernard, over there and I was thinking of staying over there at the time. Only the bit of success was coming I probably would have gone a bit earlier," said Keady, in an interview with Newstalk in 2015.
"I stayed over. I didn’t think there’d be any major complications, as far as I knew I was going to come back and play but little did I know it was going to turn out the way it did."
Back then it was routine for star inter-county players to travel back and forth from Ireland to the east coast of the States to play big club games. Money often changed hands and as the GAA in the Big Apple wasn’t formally recognised by Croke Park at the time, a blind eye was turned.
Keady, then a 25-year-old with the game in the palm of his hand, was persuaded to line out under his brother’s name for the Laois side, and though they were called Laois they were backboned by Galway men, against Tipperary. At home Tipp were the Tribesmen's main rivals for Liam MacCarthy having lost the ’88 final, their first in 17 years, by four points.
"We were pucking about and they were announcing the team," he recalled.
"A ball went out over to the wire and as I was going over to the wire it just hit off number six ‘Bernard Keady’. Someone said to me at the wire ‘howaya, Tony. That’s not you, is it?’
"It went out of proportion because we won that game by 15 or 16 points and if four or five of us didn’t play we still would have won it. I just thought all along that it would all just settle down.
"You go through all these meetings and thinking that it would all work out and I’d be able to hurl. I remember Cyril saying I’d get off. A lot of people didn’t know about the GAA or hurling at the time and they were suspending me."
Someone on the Tipp side objected to his presence and Keady was suspended for two games in New York. But then someone got wind of this news back home and Croke Park’s Games Administration Committee swung into action. Keady got 12 months.
It still isn’t clear why the Killimordaly man was the one - and only - they decided to make an example of. Tipp’s Paul Delaney did the exact same thing and played in the contentious All-Ireland semi-final in 1989.
Galway moved heaven and earth in order to try to have their star player’s name cleared. Farrell threatened to pull his team out of the semi-final against Tipp, prompting Croke Park to call an emergency meeting of their powerful Management Committee.
Tipperary’s delegate voted to allow Keady play against his own county, but the four non-hurling counties in Connacht, much to Galway’s lingering disgust, gave the appeal the thumbs down and Keady lost the vote 20-18.
The great Galway half-back line of Pete Finnerty, Keady and Gerry McInerney in 2015
The 12-month ban stood and he would have to sit out the semi-final, a highly-anticipated rematch of the previous year’s All-Ireland.
In the end the bad feeling spilled out onto the pitch in a fractious match that saw Galway duo Sylvie Linnane and Michael ‘Hopper’ McGrath get the line. Tipperary came out on top and went on to win the All-Ireland.
"They probably wanted to make a stance around that time and with us going for a three in-a-row there was going to be hype so they might have said that they’d make a scapegoat of this fellah," said Keady.
"I don’t really know, to be honest, why they did it and why they didn’t see sense."
Keady carried no bitterness about losing that match, in fact he graciously said his stand-in Sean Treacy put on a better display than he could have managed in the number six jersey, but it was clear that he never really got over the mean-spirited actions witnessed in GAA committee rooms at the time.
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Post by Mickmack on Aug 10, 2017 22:00:12 GMT
In my experience there have been three episodes where the GAA authorities acted terribly namely
Tony Keady in 1989..as above in a vindictive and unilateral manner
Colin Lynch in 1998 when they suspended him on video evidence even though video evidence wasnt allowed at the time in such matters
Paul Galvin in 2008 when they broke their own rules to ban him for 6 months
The refereeing performance in the 1989 semi final between Galway and Tipp by the Wexford official was so biased it was unbelievable. Tipp went on to get their handy final win to popular GAA acclaim against Antrim that year and the 18 year famine was over.
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Post by Mickmack on Aug 11, 2017 9:20:56 GMT
Jackie Tyrrell: Cork can face down Waterford challenge a second time Subscriber only Leaders like Anthony Nash, Mark Ellis and Conor Lehane can carry them through
Cork face a unique challenge on Sunday. They are going into an All-Ireland semi-final knowing the only thing that stands between them and the final is a team they’ve already beaten. Eight weeks ago, they stormed into Thurles and ruined Waterford’s day with a great performance. But now they have to do it again or their season will have been ultimately unsatisfying.
The mental challenge here is really tough. In 2013, Cork beat Clare in Munster but lost the All-Ireland final to the same team after a replay. The drawn game that day came down to tiny margins and the replay was the Shane O’Donnell show.
Ultimately, the Clare challenge in September was different to what it had been in June and Cork weren’t able to rise to it accordingly.
So now they face Waterford again.
There are dangers everywhere in the build-up to this one. For the younger lads, this will be their first time playing a championship match in Croke Park. For some of the older ones, like Mark Ellis, Damien Cahalane, Alan Cadogan and Bill Cooper, they’ve never won a game there. Even without going near the idea of having to play a team they’ve already beaten, there are loads of mental boxes to be ticked before Sunday.
You can’t win an All-Ireland in the week of a game but you can most certainly lose it
I’ve been on both sides of this coin. In 2015, Kilkenny played Galway in the All-Ireland final having beaten them in the Leinster final earlier in the summer. For the first half of that final we fell into what you’d think would be a fairly obvious trap – we had a small bit of complacency and it killed us.
We obviously felt we had Galway’s number because we had beaten them in probably 80 per cent of the matches we’d played against them over the years.
We had won the Leinster final by eight points – the day Joe Canning got his wonder-goal on the turn down at the Hill 16 end of Croke Park. But no matter how we tried to guard against it, we obviously still had it somewhere in our heads that we’d come through the All-Ireland final okay.
We were three points behind at half-time and there were some loud voices and strong characters laying down the law in the dressing room that day. And to be brutally honest about it, if we had been up against a team that was mentally stronger than that Galway team, it would have been too late for us in the second half. But back then, Galway had a little chink in their psychology when it came to Kilkenny. They have clearly turned a corner and they don’t have it anymore but it was a problem for them then.
Same trap Cork could very easily fall into the same trap, albeit for different reasons. They have a back-and-forth relationship with Waterford, with neither of them having the upper hand at any stage.
But you have to remember, Cork are coming in here on the crest of a wave. Cork hurling has been on a high all summer. The under-17s won their All-Ireland last Sunday. The minors are in the semi-final as the curtain-raiser. Everything is positive, positive, positive. You can easily lose your focus.
Brian Cody used to drill into us the idea of focus around this time of year. “You can’t win an All-Ireland in the week of a game but you can most certainly lose it,” he’d say. His point was that these are the weeks when there’s way more razzmatazz, way more interest from the outside. When you’re in a county panel, you’re cut off from the outside world most of the time. And, to be perfectly honest, the outside world isn’t that interested in you most of the time either. Except around now. Focus is everything.
It takes a very strong management team and a very hungry, ambitious core group of leaders within the panel to protect that level of focus. The leaders need to be around the younger players in particular this week to ensure it doesn’t slip. They set the tone and the environment for other players to experience that tunnel vision.
As soon as Cork came back together after their Munster final win, that environment should have been set. As soon as Waterford qualified, the panel should have zoomed completely in on them. Nothing else matters – work, job, family, everything. It all goes into being 100 per cent mentally and physically ready for Cork to be the best version of themselves.
The first sign of complacency or taking your eye off the ball needs to be nailed, whether it’s a player, county board official, backroom team member, whoever. Don’t assume anything. Make sure every last detail is done. Every day, every ball, every training session, every recovery session, all done correctly.
The upside of playing a team you have beaten before is that you have 70 minutes of concrete experience to draw from. The downside is that you could very easily overanalyse what happened the first day.
Because of their style of play and the way they set up, Waterford force you into a volume of video analysis that goes above the norm anyway. Management, players, stats teams – everyone has probably been through the video from the game in June a heap of times by now.
In Kilkenny, we used an app called Hudl. You could log in and filter video clips by individual, filter it by team, whatever you wanted. If your training sessions were filmed, you could go through them. You could watch your own highlights, get into the real nitty-gritty of anyone’s game.
Video clips I never got too lost down the rabbit hole with the video clips but if I was detailed to man-mark somebody specifically, I would study his highlights on the Hudl app. What side does he want the ball on? When does he make his run? Does he jink one way and go the other? Does he have positions on the field that he shoots from automatically? When does he turn back inside? What does he not like to do?
I don’t know this for sure but I would imagine that with younger guys, there is a danger they could get too caught up in going through video clips on their phone. Any lad in his 20s these days is absolutely handcuffed to his phone anyway and I could just see them sitting at home at night this week, hitting clip after clip and overloading on information. The one thing Cork don’t want to lose is the lovely freedom of expression that has been the hallmark of their hurling so far this summer. You don’t want paralysis by analysis to take the edges off them. Fill them with too much information and they might start worrying about the opposition too much and forget to play their own game. Another thing for management to keep an eye on.
From Waterford’s point of view, this is not a bad position to be in at all. It’s a mental challenge for them too, of course. But there’s a big difference between having to mentally guard against something that might happen and using something that has happened for motivation.
I never liked leaning on revenge for motivation but it’s very hard not to. My ideal attitude was always: “We’re doing this for ourselves as a team, it doesn’t matter who we’re playing.” But occasionally, when I felt we owed a team for a defeat, whether it was in a previous game that summer or for an All-Ireland the year before, that small little pinprick of revenge would be there giving me a jab to try and get my attention.
My instinct was to try to keep it out of there and to try to be cold-blooded and analytical about the whole thing. But after a while, I remember saying, “You know what? Let it in”. Because revenge is good. Revenge is hurt. Revenge motivates you, pushes you to find that extra couple of per cent. And as I got older, I decided not to look at it as revenge but rather just another reason to push myself a little bit harder.
So it does give you that bit of impetus if you look at it the right way and Waterford will have that in the build-up to this weekend. It’s not actually revenge against Cork. It’s revenge against yourself and the way you let yourself down the first day. Waterford probably feel they put all their eggs in the championship basket and then didn’t live up to what they said they would do. That’s what they will want to avenge, far more than anything Cork did on the day. Different man
That’s why I think from a mental point of view, you’d rather be coming in here in Waterford’s position rather than Cork’s. So the question is, how do Cork handle it? Now, more than ever, the onus is on their leaders to carry this for them. For this weekend and onwards to the final, they need the likes of Anthony Nash and Mark Ellis and Conor Lehane to be pushing everything.
They need to be like “Playoff” LeBron. Rarely in any sport do opposing teams come up against each other as much as in the NBA playoffs. Two teams play the best of seven games to progress through each round First Round, Conference Semis, Conference Final and NBA Final. That’s a potential 28 games in the play-offs alone after a regular season. These guys could have beaten each other three times already but they have to do it again in a Game Seven. How?
Players from the Cleveland Cavaliers said LeBron James became a different man in the playoffs last year. Even after one of his best overall regular seasons, he just found another level. Playoff LeBron became a hash-tag. Opposing coaches spoke after games of how he’d taken it up a notch. One team-mate told a story of how LeBron played 38 minutes of a hard game one night and when everyone else arrived to the gym the next morning, he was already there with a full sweat on. “The playoffs are coming, man,” he said.
I remember reading that and thinking of Henry Shefflin. Different sport, different circumstances, different universe. But the same thing in terms of leadership. Always around this time of year, we would arrive at training in Nowlan Park and Henry would have been there before us practising frees. You’d go out onto the pitch to start pucking around and he’d already have a sheen of sweat on him.
On a very simple, basic level, I would look at that and go: “Right, there’s our leader and our best player and he’s finding another level when it matters. What excuse could I possibly have for not pushing on and trying to find another one myself?” Leadership like that sends out massive waves through a squad and bit by bit, player by player, it all adds up.
From watching them this summer, I get the feeling Cork have those kind of leaders now. You wouldn’t have said it about them in the past but just the way they’re coaxing their younger players through games, taking responsibility and driving on, they look mentally stronger than before.
I’ll give them a hesitant nod for Sunday on that basis.
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