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Post by Attacking Wing Back on Apr 8, 2017 0:45:36 GMT
Eamonn has gone for a team to contain the Dubs. And when they unload the bench to strike for home with 20 mins left we will do like wise.
The dubs will introduce legs in the middle third to try to burn us off as the do every game.
We can introduce our own speed merchants in bjk, darran and barry. Added that donaghy will prob come in and O'Brien will go to the half forward line we will have legs.
Be great to see how Shannahan, Barry, McCarthy all react to a tight game (hopefully) in croker.
Our backs look threadbare but we have enright and young to come back, no to mind the u21s
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Post by MrRasherstoyou on Apr 8, 2017 7:07:49 GMT
Well here we go, yet again. In the good/bad old days Kerry and ourselves didn't play at all between the 87 league final (a minor compensation for us after 4 straight All-I Final defeats to yourselves), and the 2001 Qtr final double fiesta in Thurles. After that there were 3 more big games in that decade, all Kingdom wins, one easy, one tight, one almighty hammering.
In this decade there have already been 5 big clashes, all won by us. And the 6th tomorrow. That's a very intense period of rivalry, only matched by 75-85, when there were 9 major clashes, 6 of them All-Finals, Kerry winning 6. Throw in 87 and it was 10, with 4 Dublin wins, 2 of which were league finals.
I think Kerry may be due a win or two, if not tomorrow then in summer......
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Post by Deise Exile on Apr 8, 2017 7:29:40 GMT
The Kerry Dublin rivalry is class. AroundTralee after the league game added to the mystic. Pity this week has been sullied discussing Paul Curran's sanctamonious piece in the Herald. I think deep down EF is sick to his teeth of Jim Gavin talking about Dublin's 'traditional style'. EF brought a bit of balance this week. A bit more honesty from Gavin would add balance too. Gavin is masterful , aka Mourihno or Fergusson, at managing the media. EF stepped it up a notch this week and from what I've read and heard on podcasts and radio, most pundits are applauding him for it. I wouldn't expect blinkered Dublin media to agree with it. Sure Philly's explanation to Gooch about how he plays the game says everything about the balance rgst should be inserted into the 'narrative'. Finally it stuck me as deeply ironic in RTE piece about the game yesterday and discussing the perceived feeling that Kerry were the aggressors in Tralee and it showed one of Kerry players leaving the pitch with blood streaming from his nose. Tomorrow another chapter in an age old rivalry. Hopefully near capacity crowd and a good vocal kerry support. See yous in Coppers Rashers!!
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Post by kerry4life on Apr 8, 2017 7:46:22 GMT
The gap between the two is closing. Dublin are probably not the force they once were although they still are the best in the country but many of their players have a huge amount of football played and at the level they played it at its impossible to keep it going forever. Kerry have brought in some new talents and should now have the legs to at least stay with the Dubs for the full 70 and that was the difference many times in the past. The bother still though is the class Dublin can pull off the bench in those latter stages, we need big games from all of the panel to make sure we dont fall into the old trap again and get wiped out late on.
So in a way Kerry are kind of where Dublin were 5 or 6 years ago and Dublin are where Kerry were around 5 0r 6 years ago. One team starting a new chapter and one team beginning to wind down a bit. The thing with Dublin is you would expect them to come back and develope quicker than it took Kerry. Kerry and Dublin in my eyes seem to be the only two that realistically could win Sam over next couple of years. Kerry didnt play well in the league and still managed to make the final which doesnt say much for the rest of them.
Kerry maybe another year away its hard to say at he moment. We are only in the early stages of development and many of the young lads will probably learn a few hard lessons yet. But whos to say we cant sneak one while developing.
As for this match I think Kerry have a good chance if we can match their legs in the last 10/15 mins, and even if we do win its only to break the duck really and to get a bit of pride back, I wouldnt be going around Croker jumping and shouting,its still only the league and the real business is ahead of us yet.
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Post by MrRasherstoyou on Apr 8, 2017 9:33:16 GMT
The Kerry Dublin rivalry is class. AroundTralee after the league game added to the mystic. Pity this week has been sullied discussing Paul Curran's sanctamonious piece in the Herald. I think deep down EF is sick to his teeth of Jim Gavin talking about Dublin's 'traditional style'. EF brought a bit of balance this week. A bit more honesty from Gavin would add balance too. Gavin is masterful , aka Mourihno or Fergusson, at managing the media. EF stepped it up a notch this week and from what I've read and heard on podcasts and radio, most pundits are applauding him for it. I wouldn't expect blinkered Dublin media to agree with it. Sure Philly's explanation to Gooch about how he plays the game says everything about the balance rgst should be inserted into the 'narrative'. Finally it stuck me as deeply ironic in RTE piece about the game yesterday and discussing the perceived feeling that Kerry were the aggressors in Tralee and it showed one of Kerry players leaving the pitch with blood streaming from his nose. Tomorrow another chapter in an age old rivalry. Hopefully near capacity crowd and a good vocal kerry support. See yous in Coppers Rashers!! Can't argue with most of that, a fair Kingdom perspective. Not Copper's though! If Kerry win, which places will be full of celebration of the famine ending? It's still a National final, no matter what anyone says. I think with Kerrys injuries, even allowing for Jack being out, Dublin should win by 2 or 3. Kerry need 2 goals to win, and Dublin to get one goal max
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Post by Mickmack on Apr 8, 2017 10:40:07 GMT
In the spring of 2015 i observed that dublin had a major problem at midfield as MDMA and Bastick were hardly 70 minute men any more and young OCongnaille didnt look to me like he would be the solution. Sam was in kerry at the time. Suddenly, out of nowhere comes Fenton to put Dublin on an upward curve and he gets man of the man and an all star and sam hasnt left dublin since. Dublin have never lost a match since he arrived on the scene.
So any talk of dublin going into decline should be tempered by how many more Fentons are lurking in the background. We have not seen con ocallaghan yet and cormac costello will only get better when he is injury free.
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fitz
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Post by fitz on Apr 8, 2017 13:13:41 GMT
I think we're a bit short still, but am greatly encouraged by some of the performances, and more so some of the new performers. With the 21s looking as mean and ruthless as ever we've had, underpinned by a bank of top minors I think it is more of a question of when we'll break through
Dublin still have the best of the 15 v 15 comparison with our lads, and they are ice cold, but no team has yet to really enter the last 10 mins against them with real momentum, so I think that's what needs to be brought to breakthrough.
I'd say this unbeaten record now is now an unnecessary drag to them, and players probably sick of it. I wonder is there even a flicker of pressure, "we don't want to get beaten in Croker, and certainly not by Kerry". Probably not. I'm reaching. Once our lads give it socks, keep their discipline, we can't have a red card, and perform, I'll be happy. Obviously a win would be beautiful, but I'll take another progressive defiant performance.
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Post by Kingdomson on Apr 8, 2017 13:49:40 GMT
It's a big debut for the referee Paddy Neilan at this level <http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/right-man-for-dublin-v-kerry-final-has-not-refereed-any-toptier-games-this-season-35598304.html>
No doubt Paddy will look to stamp his authority on it early. Personally, i'd be far happier to see Bryan Sheehan as a free taking option on from start to just keep our score board ticking over from the get go, especially should early frees fall our way. Once your frees are popping over it gives great confidence and easies pressure on other players to have a cut. Looking at Dublin, Dean Rock is often not the most threatening forward from general play but his frees are so often invaluable come the long whistle. I'd hate to lose this fixture by 1 or 2 points and be looking back in frustration at missed free opportunities. This being said, I wish the selected team and all the players and management the very best tomorrow.
Up the Kingdom!
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dart
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Post by dart on Apr 8, 2017 14:03:55 GMT
Yeah up the Kingdom, I've been looking forward to this game since I was halfway back to the car in Killarney last Sunday. I always feel we'll take them and the 2015 final was the only recent encounter I where I knew at halftime it wasn't gonna happen for us, all the other games we had a chance until late on. So here's hoping for another national title tomorrow and if not let it be a great learning experience for when it matters.
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Post by kerryboy83 on Apr 8, 2017 14:16:54 GMT
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 8, 2017 14:24:20 GMT
Very strong Dublin team especially when you consider that Kerry are missing at least 5 starters
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Post by kerryboy83 on Apr 8, 2017 14:29:29 GMT
I spose fionn on brogan, shanahan on rock, griffin on Andrews, Crowley on Connolly, Morley on Kilkenny and murphy on Flynn?
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Post by kerry4life on Apr 8, 2017 17:46:35 GMT
I remember when Kerry were going well from 04-09 years at times we would be glad to see Kerry getting an odd loss here and there once it wasnt knock out and even the odd huge scare in knock out was good. We always came back stronger again. U would have to wonder if Gavin wouldnt mind a loss here. It would give them great appetiate again if they met Kerry. On the Kerry side I think we actaully could do badly with a win to get a bit of confidence and pride back in the jersey.
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Post by brucewayne on Apr 8, 2017 18:05:39 GMT
I spose fionn on brogan, shanahan on rock, griffin on Andrews, Crowley on Connolly, Morley on Kilkenny and murphy on Flynn? Fionn on Brogan looks ok. I'd put Griffin on Rock, Andrews can be nifty out and I think after last week's display Shanahan would do a fine job quietening him. Morley for Kilkenny looks good. Murphy was on Connolly above in Croke Park in the league opener in 16 and he did a fine job. It seemed that his harrassing style frustrated 'cool hand' Connolly considerably. Hope Crowley is back to himself, Flynn is not far off form.
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Apr 8, 2017 18:43:22 GMT
I remember when Kerry were going well from 04-09 years at times we would be glad to see Kerry getting an odd loss here and there once it wasnt knock out and even the odd huge scare in knock out was good. We always came back stronger again. U would have to wonder if Gavin wouldnt mind a loss here. It would give them great appetiate again if they met Kerry. On the Kerry side I think we actaully could do badly with a win to get a bit of confidence and pride back in the jersey. We are clutching here.
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Post by Ballyfireside on Apr 8, 2017 18:51:12 GMT
Those match-ups really get the blood pressure on the up, in a funny way (peculiar AND haha!) I'd prefer to be where we are and the Dubs know it is only a matter of time before another 30 year spell kicks in.
Rarely has the tempo been so great for the 'warm up' that is the league.
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fitz
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Post by fitz on Apr 8, 2017 19:46:41 GMT
I suppose Philly and Fitzsimons will switch. Their left defensive side is somewhat inexperienced. The front 6 we're very familiar with.Not seen much of Reddin. Someone opine on him? Bottom line, no surprises really.
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Post by kerryfanatic on Apr 8, 2017 19:53:55 GMT
Tomas Quinn in irish examiner wrote interesting article today on the rivalry between Dublin and kerry
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Post by Chinatown on Apr 8, 2017 20:54:27 GMT
I remember when Kerry were going well from 04-09 years at times we would be glad to see Kerry getting an odd loss here and there once it wasnt knock out and even the odd huge scare in knock out was good. We always came back stronger again. U would have to wonder if Gavin wouldnt mind a loss here. It would give them great appetiate again if they met Kerry. On the Kerry side I think we actaully could do badly with a win to get a bit of confidence and pride back in the jersey. We are clutching here. How cool is this for Mr Crean!
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Apr 8, 2017 21:16:02 GMT
How cool is this for Mr Crean! That man is used to the cold. There is a campaign to name Farranfore after Crean. By the by I know the Firies pitch is in Farranfore. Any good stories 'bout the clubs there? PS: There is a lad in Annascaul who loves telling visitors that Tom Crean never went to Antarctica and that it is all a hoax to entice tourists.
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fitz
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Post by fitz on Apr 8, 2017 22:05:50 GMT
Tomas Quinn in irish examiner wrote interesting article today on the rivalry between Dublin and kerry And?...for those blindsided.
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Post by wayupnorth on Apr 8, 2017 22:38:29 GMT
I remember when Kerry were going well from 04-09 years at times we would be glad to see Kerry getting an odd loss here and there once it wasnt knock out and even the odd huge scare in knock out was good. We always came back stronger again. U would have to wonder if Gavin wouldnt mind a loss here. It would give them great appetiate again if they met Kerry. On the Kerry side I think we actaully could do badly with a win to get a bit of confidence and pride back in the jersey. We are clutching here. Better clutching than drowning.
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Post by wayupnorth on Apr 8, 2017 23:31:12 GMT
How cool is this for Mr Crean! That man is used to the cold. There is a campaign to name Farranfore after Crean. By the by I know the Firies pitch is in Farranfore. Any good stories 'bout the clubs there? PS: There is a lad in Annascaul who loves telling visitors that Tom Crean never went to Antarctica and that it is all a hoax to entice tourists. Tom Crean wasn't,picked by Scott for the final push to the South Pole and Scott and his entire team perished. Shackleton took Crean all the way with him including the final trek across South Georgia. A measure of a great leader is being able to recognise and pick great players.
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Aodhan
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Post by Aodhan on Apr 8, 2017 23:42:38 GMT
Below is a link to the analysis of the Tralee game using the newly developed GaaProstats statistical and video analysis program. It covers the unnecessary frees that Kerry conceded which is also evident in other games of late and badly needs to be addressed while maintaining the intensity level. Some may seem to be of the soft verity but the referee cannot be given the option. link
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fitz
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Red sky at night get off my land
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Post by fitz on Apr 9, 2017 0:35:49 GMT
Below is a link to the analysis of the Tralee game using the newly developed GaaProstats statistical and video analysis program. It covers the unnecessary frees that Kerry conceded which is also evident in other games of late and badly needs to be addressed while maintaining the intensity level. Some may seem to be of the soft verity but the referee cannot be given the option. link Pretty stark reading. Are Dublin that far ahead in their tackling legality, it would be interesting to see even deeper analytics, on all tackling in that game. I think such analytics as highlighted well here, regarding Kerry's fouling, it is only scratching the surface. The bigger questions are emotional ones, and I think being able to properly analyse a players behaviour in various aspects of real game time,especially challenging ones, would unlock a much greater ability to positively affect players performances. Dublin are out in front on this too. The biggest and most painful example being the Dublin goal in 2011. We should have an emotional response plan for catastrophic in game events. That day we had none, no whiteboard or stats can influence then. That game could have been saved, we hadn't a clue what to do. Dublin knew what to do at the end of 2013 final when down a man and no more subs. I don't see amidst the panic of many of the last ten mins of our games that anything preventative has been worked. Maybe more losses need to be incurred and learned. First one, what is the underlying reason for our terrible foul count?. I'd rather foul than let in a score from play? To such an extent that as provided in the stats, a covering player is there, but tackling player still fouls. So, he's unaware of his colleague or he's that wired up on his 1:1 battle, that he doesn't care or didn't notice, or verbal communications are feeble or non-existant? Realizing we foul, can't just provoke a reaction, got to stop fouling lads. It's why, and that is what needs fixing, for that example.
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Post by MrRasherstoyou on Apr 9, 2017 0:45:27 GMT
I think we're a bit short still, but am greatly encouraged by some of the performances, and more so some of the new performers. With the 21s looking as mean and ruthless as ever we've had, underpinned by a bank of top minors I think it is more of a question of when we'll break through Dublin still have the best of the 15 v 15 comparison with our lads, and they are ice cold, but no team has yet to really enter the last 10 mins against them with real momentum, so I think that's what needs to be brought to breakthrough. I'd say this unbeaten record now is now an unnecessary drag to them, and players probably sick of it. I wonder is there even a flicker of pressure, "we don't want to get beaten in Croker, and certainly not by Kerry". Probably not. I'm reaching. Once our lads give it socks, keep their discipline, we can't have a red card, and perform, I'll be happy. Obviously a win would be beautiful, but I'll take another progressive defiant performance. It would only be natural if they did think about that on some level, they aren't robots. Any sort of distraction is good news for Kerry, alot of the media stuff is very much with that in mind I feel. From my point of view it's a pity the bloody so-called 'unbeaten run' didn't end during the regulation league. If it ends now it will be interesting to see the impact. But in truth, all that really matters is the winning and losing (or drawing) of this game.
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Post by stevieq on Apr 9, 2017 8:30:47 GMT
Best of luck to Kerry team and management. Safe travel to all making the trip. I hope we will be there in some numbers. There is a level of excitement about this one. We could be looking back on this as a watershed momnent.
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Post by Mickmack on Apr 9, 2017 9:20:53 GMT
Below is a link to the analysis of the Tralee game using the newly developed GaaProstats statistical and video analysis program. It covers the unnecessary frees that Kerry conceded which is also evident in other games of late and badly needs to be addressed while maintaining the intensity level. Some may seem to be of the soft verity but the referee cannot be given the option. link Pretty stark reading. Are Dublin that far ahead in their tackling legality, it would be interesting to see even deeper analytics, on all tackling in that game. I think such analytics as highlighted well here, regarding Kerry's fouling, it is only scratching the surface. The bigger questions are emotional ones, and I think being able to properly analyse a players behaviour in various aspects of real game time,especially challenging ones, would unlock a much greater ability to positively affect players performances. Dublin are out in front on this too. The biggest and most painful example being the Dublin goal in 2011. We should have an emotional response plan for catastrophic in game events. That day we had none, no whiteboard or stats can influence then. That game could have been saved, we hadn't a clue what to do. Dublin knew what to do at the end of 2013 final when down a man and no more subs. I don't see amidst the panic of many of the last ten mins of our games that anything preventative has been worked. Maybe more losses need to be incurred and learned. First one, what is the underlying reason for our terrible foul count?. I'd rather foul than let in a score from play? To such an extent that as provided in the stats, a covering player is there, but tackling player still fouls. So, he's unaware of his colleague or he's that wired up on his 1:1 battle, that he doesn't care or didn't notice, or verbal communications are feeble or non-existant? Realizing we foul, can't just provoke a reaction, got to stop fouling lads. It's why, and that is what needs fixing, for that example. Fouling aint the problem per se, It fouling within scoring distance that is the problem. So work it back.... you need to stop the opponents running at you at speed at a position where a free equals apoint. ..... you need to foul 65 yards from goal. Its what Dublin does
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Post by beantownfan on Apr 9, 2017 13:15:39 GMT
Kerry need to cut down drastically on the frees, simple as.. The AI semi final, and the meeting in Tralee we did great work on limiting the Dubs scores from play.. If we again give away 9 or 10 scorable frees we will loose. If we limit it to 5 or 6 scorable ones we are in with a great shout. As Tomas said in his piece yesterday, Kerry have become guilty of giving up a lot of lazy frees, hand pulls, jersey pulls etc. As he put it when, you give up a free you want the man to stay hurt. Sometimes a free is inevitable, but it should at least be the result of contact and not just grabbing a player by the hand.
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Post by MrRasherstoyou on Apr 9, 2017 16:51:12 GMT
Many congrats to all on here, a great game and win. Yis learned the lessons and responded brilliantly to the goal. Must be a huge relief, I know the feeling, though yous only had to wait six years to get it. Yet again Kerry and Dublin produce a classic in Croker, proud to have seen it.
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