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Post by southward on Feb 12, 2017 15:28:11 GMT
Enough with the "it's just February" nonsense, that excuse seems to have found a home in our vocabulary in recent times. There are players on this squad who have been tried and tried again and again, they are simply not good enough! Of the more recent old guard... Brian Kelly, Mark Griffin, John Lyne, Mike Geaney, Barry John Keane, all not good enough! End of story. Of the so called newer guard... Conor Keane, (Legions version of Kieran O' Leary, not good enough for this level) Adrian Spillane, (at best not ready yet) At this point, I would take the very best of the U21's (the recent additions and ones brought in this year, have been great) and the very best of our seniors and that's the only panel that wins an All-Ireland, lack of goals in 2015, lack of goals in 2016, 2 games into 2017 and you feel kerry players would fist the ball over the bar with an empty net staring at them in the face, not good enough. Winning this game would have been a statement, and they bottled it. Fitzmaurice, my opinion, not good enough yet, he has the potential, but he's lacking, and it shows in his teams performance. There are no excuses for losing this game, losing O' Donoghue before the game, Geaney and Young early on, no excuse. And what to make of O' Donoghue, you cannot build a winning team around players who are more absent than present. Correct in everything you have said. BJK is now 27? And he still hasn't made it? Why persistent? It's the same across the board for several players. JOD, we would be better off planning without him, one good season really. When we are talking about missing players like killian young as having an affect on team things must be very bad! Anyway not many people here will agree with you or me. Most still think now average players still have a place in the kerry squad going on past achievements. We are lucky that the standard of football across the country is so bad or else we wouldn't be making it past 1/4 finals! Are ye f*ckin serious? BJK not good enough? Scored 1-3 from play last night, and from the bench at that. If that was Paul Geaney or JOD, fellas would be raving about it. Dunno why but he's a popular target for people on here. Seems to me he always contributes energy and scores when he gets on. I'd love to see individual stats on scores per minutes played over the past few years; I'd be willing to bet BJK would be pretty high up on the list.
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Post by homerj on Feb 12, 2017 15:50:22 GMT
David Moran continuing to take frees is indeed, bizzare.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2017 16:05:41 GMT
Correct in everything you have said. BJK is now 27? And he still hasn't made it? Why persistent? It's the same across the board for several players. JOD, we would be better off planning without him, one good season really. When we are talking about missing players like killian young as having an affect on team things must be very bad! Anyway not many people here will agree with you or me. Most still think now average players still have a place in the kerry squad going on past achievements. We are lucky that the standard of football across the country is so bad or else we wouldn't be making it past 1/4 finals! Are ye f*ckin serious? BJK not good enough? Scored 1-3 from play last night, and from the bench at that. If that was Paul Geaney or JOD, fellas would be raving about it. Dunno why but he's a popular target for people on here. Seems to me he always contributes energy and scores when he gets on. I'd love to see individual stats on scores per minutes played over the past few years; I'd be willing to bet BJK would be pretty high up on the list. Yes dead serious. Why would you keep a player in the squad who is 27 years old and never held a starting position in the championship team? That goes for several other players. Take Dublin... 20mins left in an AI final and they bring paul mannion off the bench, kerry bring BJK on. Says it all really.
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Post by bilythewalsh on Feb 12, 2017 16:17:21 GMT
A lot of dithering going on at kick-out time, hopefully that issue will have been ironed out come the summer.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2017 16:52:26 GMT
Bjk has been a big impact player for kerry the last 3 seasons. If you are looking for deadwood on the panel, there are other places to look.
More worrying for me is the number of hamstring injuries. Should not be happening.
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Post by hurlingman on Feb 12, 2017 16:53:20 GMT
Enough with the "it's just February" nonsense, that excuse seems to have found a home in our vocabulary in recent times. There are players on this squad who have been tried and tried again and again, they are simply not good enough! Of the more recent old guard... Brian Kelly, Mark Griffin, John Lyne, Mike Geaney, Barry John Keane, all not good enough! End of story. Of the so called newer guard... Conor Keane, (Legions version of Kieran O' Leary, not good enough for this level) Adrian Spillane, (at best not ready yet) At this point, I would take the very best of the U21's (the recent additions and ones brought in this year, have been great) and the very best of our seniors and that's the only panel that wins an All-Ireland, lack of goals in 2015, lack of goals in 2016, 2 games into 2017 and you feel kerry players would fist the ball over the bar with an empty net staring at them in the face, not good enough. Winning this game would have been a statement, and they bottled it. Fitzmaurice, my opinion, not good enough yet, he has the potential, but he's lacking, and it shows in his teams performance. There are no excuses for losing this game, losing O' Donoghue before the game, Geaney and Young early on, no excuse. And what to make of O' Donoghue, you cannot build a winning team around players who are more absent than present. A lot of people wont agree but it is true. BJK have been on the panel since 2010 i think. In that time he's never been able to hold down a starting place, granted he's had good games off the bench but i think it might be time to look elsewhere. In the semi-final last year he scored a great point but went missing after that. Mikey Geaney another. I just dont see what the management see in him. Was he not dropped from the panel at one point? Lyne is another i just dont understand. Whole games can go by where he might get the ball 2/3 times and will stay on for the full game. These 3 alone are all now 27/28 and haven't been able to hold down a place in the team. This is when they should be at their best and i cant see them getting any better. Re the keepers. Everyone is hyping up Share Murphy but he has a lot to prove. As has been said he didn't set the world alight yesterday by any means. For all the good he's done Fitzmaurice has been found wanting a number of times. Last night being another one. He's trying of the same old players over and over is a worry. Had Marc and Mahoney not retired he'd still be picking them. Another point made about picking players based on the county championship. While he's used the Junior teams over the last few years well he seems to ignore the SFC. Rathmore a very close second as the best team in the county have one player on the panel, yet Legion have 4?! and in my opinion none of the 4 are anything special, and i include JOD in that. Was very good in 2013 ans 2014 but hasn't been anything close since.
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fitz
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Red sky at night get off my land
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Post by fitz on Feb 12, 2017 17:01:54 GMT
Enough with the "it's just February" nonsense, that excuse seems to have found a home in our vocabulary in recent times. There are players on this squad who have been tried and tried again and again, they are simply not good enough! Of the more recent old guard... Brian Kelly, Mark Griffin, John Lyne, Mike Geaney, Barry John Keane, all not good enough! End of story. Of the so called newer guard... Conor Keane, (Legions version of Kieran O' Leary, not good enough for this level) Adrian Spillane, (at best not ready yet) At this point, I would take the very best of the U21's (the recent additions and ones brought in this year, have been great) and the very best of our seniors and that's the only panel that wins an All-Ireland, lack of goals in 2015, lack of goals in 2016, 2 games into 2017 and you feel kerry players would fist the ball over the bar with an empty net staring at them in the face, not good enough. Winning this game would have been a statement, and they bottled it. Fitzmaurice, my opinion, not good enough yet, he has the potential, but he's lacking, and it shows in his teams performance. There are no excuses for losing this game, losing O' Donoghue before the game, Geaney and Young early on, no excuse. And what to make of O' Donoghue, you cannot build a winning team around players who are more absent than present. Correct in everything you have said. BJK is now 27? And he still hasn't made it? Why persistent? It's the same across the board for several players. JOD, we would be better off planning without him, one good season really. When we are talking about missing players like killian young as having an affect on team things must be very bad! Anyway not many people here will agree with you or me. Most still think now average players still have a place in the kerry squad going on past achievements. We are lucky that the standard of football across the country is so bad or else we wouldn't be making it past 1/4 finals! What has Killian Young done to deserve such a disrespect?. He's been a constant in the Kerry team for 10 years and appeared in 6 All Ireland finals, and I can't remember any of them with thoughts that he let us down badly on any of the days. If things are bad then Jack, Pat and Eamonn haven't a clue between, he was and is a constant in all their teams. I don't get the fatalistic black or white comments on this game, on Feb 11. Some folks seem to want a nailed down first 15, ready for an All Ireland final yesterday.
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Post by gaacrazy on Feb 12, 2017 17:06:03 GMT
I totally agree hurling man regarding the players you mention. I wouldn't include o donoghue in the same bracket as mikey Geaney and Lyne however. Don't know how Conor Keane can get a chance on the squad after a polo season. U are correct, Rathmore only team that seem to be able to beat Crokes have only one player on the squad now, and got to contact championship semi and have one three in a row east Kerry, up I remember wen legion got to county final they had A total of 7 players around the Kerry setup for McGrath cup etc, laughable really
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Post by hurlingman on Feb 12, 2017 17:38:51 GMT
Correct in everything you have said. BJK is now 27? And he still hasn't made it? Why persistent? It's the same across the board for several players. JOD, we would be better off planning without him, one good season really. When we are talking about missing players like killian young as having an affect on team things must be very bad! Anyway not many people here will agree with you or me. Most still think now average players still have a place in the kerry squad going on past achievements. We are lucky that the standard of football across the country is so bad or else we wouldn't be making it past 1/4 finals! What has Killian Young done to deserve such a disrespect?. He's been a constant in the Kerry team for 10 years and appeared in 6 All Ireland finals, and I can't remember any of them with thoughts that he let us down badly on any of the days. If things are bad then Jack, Pat and Eamonn haven't a clue between, he was and is a constant in all their teams. I don't get the fatalistic black or white comments on this game, on Feb 11. Some folks seem to want a nailed down first 15, ready for an All Ireland final yesterday. There was a while when Young was playing in the full back line when he was poor enough, but otherwise he's alway been constant. I dont think people want a first 15 now, its just that the same players are being tried time and time again and are offering nothing. What doesn't help is the fact that the U21 championship is on during the league, so there aren't too many chances to look at younger players
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Post by playitfair on Feb 12, 2017 17:52:43 GMT
Bjk was easily kerrys best forward in the inside line last night.
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Post by southward on Feb 12, 2017 17:53:53 GMT
Now JOD should be discarded as well? Some right comedians on here today.
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Post by playitfair on Feb 12, 2017 17:59:52 GMT
Now JOD should be discarded as well? Some right comedians on here today. I totally agree. Some of the comments have been bizarre. There is another one going around about Mark griffin being roasted by poor Andy Moran. 2 points to make about that. Andy Moran has been a great player for Mayo. Secondly, the space mayo created for him was impressive. Maybe the experts here's should andlyse the role or lack of a sweeper.
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Post by hurlingman on Feb 12, 2017 18:03:19 GMT
Now JOD should be discarded as well? Some right comedians on here today. What has he done since 2014?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2017 18:13:49 GMT
Fitzmaurice has persisted with players like Jonathan Lyne and Mikey Geaney who are clearly not County standard for a while now. Good club players that's it. Another thing is we had poor u21s teams for years now and not a lot of talent came through. In 2014 it changed but it will take a while for these minor teams to make their mark. Mark Reen and Daithi Casey are far better footballers than Geaney and Lyne but Fitzmaurice doesn't seem interested. February is not July but this was a bad performance no matter who was playing. Yesterday had Fitzmaurice written all over it just bad decision making again. i have been saying it for a long time Paul Murphy belongs in the backs. Having said that our half forward line is an issue that needs solving right away. If we keep going like this we will be fight relegation. You need to use the League to find new players but not the same old players every year. Kelly and Kealy should be dropped from the panel. Not good enough neither of them. That won't happen either. My fear is we will be going into the Championship with the same old heads as last year and that can only mean one result.
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Feb 12, 2017 18:45:24 GMT
Now JOD should be discarded as well? Some right comedians on here today. What has he done since 2014? Been injured.
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MeathExile
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I wonder, is there a goal in this game??
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Post by MeathExile on Feb 12, 2017 18:57:34 GMT
Re the Mark Griffin-Moran topic - I recall a similar situation vs Monaghan in Killarney 2-3 years ago, when Shane Enright was roasted in the second half by his man (mainly high balls that day), and we ended up losing that one. It was painfully obvious for everyone there that day. There seems to be a thought that the league is for learning, as I hope that this would not happen in championship. Although I am not sure what we learned from league final last year with Marc/Brogan.
Losing to a team of Mayos stature by a couple of points with a team containing so many new lads at this stage of the year is not a disaster, but the trend of fade-outs in second half is worrying. That and the 3 hamstrings last night would make you wonder re the type of training being done.
Some crazy stuff on here re Young/JOD/BJK.....reality check required.
If Daithi Casey is not brought into the panel when league is over we are leaving out our potentially best attacker - he was fantastic for Crokes yesterday. Full of direct running and good finisher. Is there a personality cash with Eamonn or what?
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Joxer
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Post by Joxer on Feb 12, 2017 19:09:20 GMT
Now JOD should be discarded as well? Some right comedians on here today. I was thinking the same thing...we're not at midterm break already are we?
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Post by southward on Feb 12, 2017 19:17:15 GMT
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Post by Ballyfireside on Feb 12, 2017 19:18:43 GMT
Yip, a few big Qs: 1. Why is BKJ a career impact sub? 2. Any of Moran's wild kicks could lose a game and how many placed kicks does it take to prove he is not the right man? 3. Are they the two best goalies in the county? 4. Switches during the game - Galvin and Marc/Geaney crazy stuff -why wasn't Griffin getting a roasting addressed? 5. How is it that the game's top county stops playing at HT? With competition so intense, why do fellas feel so comfortable?
Now I know I am not even living in the county, but these are very reasonable questions.
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Post by Deise Exile on Feb 12, 2017 20:04:12 GMT
Total over reaction to last nights league game. Kerry are easily in the top 3/4 teams in the country and in my opinion as a very average Mayo team proved last year, any of the other 3 teams are capable of beating the dubs in a one off day. Kerry will stay up, may make the final but will he be in full motion come August and hopefully ready for the dubs come September. Some of the posts here are must likely from hurlers on the Ditch with axes to grind with players from clubs they don't like
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Post by tommynk on Feb 12, 2017 21:22:29 GMT
Now JOD should be discarded as well? Some right comedians on here today. What has he done since 2014? A comment worthy of hoganstand.
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Post by Ballyfireside on Feb 12, 2017 21:27:23 GMT
Total over reaction to last nights league game. Kerry are easily in the top 3/4 teams in the country and in my opinion as a very average Mayo team proved last year, any of the other 3 teams are capable of beating the dubs in a one off day. Kerry will stay up, may make the final but will he be in full motion come August and hopefully ready for the dubs come September. Some of the posts here are must likely from hurlers on the Ditch with axes to grind with players from clubs they don't like Some of the posts here are must likely from hurlers on the Ditch with axes to grind with players from clubs they don't like -'Some' but not all and my sole objective is to see us lift Sam. If Mayo stop the internal wrangling then I can see them beat The Dubs as they have a vintage crop. Tyrone are emerging and we are also on the up but we have it all to do to win Sam in '17, Crowley is a new leader but we need more to break through to that elite level, moreover having lost Marc O'6 and AO'M. We need fellas that can stand up to the seasoned greats the Dubs and Mayo have and we need sharp decisiveness on the line. We appear to have say 40 good to greats which is more than enough but the problem is that we have say 10 elites when we need 15-20 -ah you could argue about the specifics of this but I am just trying to generalise really. Mayo have near enough 15 elites and the Dubs have 20, and the subs these 3 bring on supports my figures. I suppose the big factor is the old chestnut of the difference between a great club player and county standard -and then then progression through the ranks to becoming elite sportsmen, Dogs as Veteran called 'em - Moynihan, Galvin, all 3/4 O'6's, Aidan, KD, Gooch, etc. Maybe the hallmark is that you know these fellas will consistently beat their markers and you need 10 to do that on a given day to win, not all will do it so I am allowing 5 which might be elites not firing or non-elites who do their best but don't win the individual battle. I know I state the obvious when I say that to win an All Ireland you have to be better than 30+ other teams, and that is a colossal challenge and where anything can happen in any one the numerous 15 v 15 contests. I suppose that's what makes it all so interesting, cruel and all as it sounds. And yes, we are all greedy animals, and probably proud of it. An ex county player was telling me today that elites can emerge within 6 months, so who are we expecting to make that breakthrough in '17 -Crowley is almost there, Paul Murohy has arrived but for the life of me I cannot get my head around him at CHF -is he not an attacking wing back?, JO'D has also arrived and of course there are others -but have we the 15?, or 20? My hero also says that a betting man would be on Mayo this year and you are really gambling on whether they can unite by killing off this individualism bug that has gotten into them, this issue is also part of the issues with Cork and Meath. You will never get it with good management, Harte and Gavin -Dwyer set the standard with us as regards team culture of and it is a maintenance job after that.
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keane
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Post by keane on Feb 12, 2017 21:33:23 GMT
BJK not good enough? Scored 1-3 from play last night, and from the bench at that. If that was Paul Geaney or JOD, fellas would be raving about it. Dunno why but he's a popular target for people on here. Seems to me he always contributes energy and scores when he gets on. I'd love to see individual stats on scores per minutes played over the past few years; I'd be willing to bet BJK would be pretty high up on the list. May be of interest:
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Post by fenit67 on Feb 12, 2017 21:58:34 GMT
I have been critical of Kerry's league endeavours in recent years but some of the criticism being meted out is almost rabid. We could well have had the game wrapped up at half-time yesterday but we didn't and in the second-half the performance wasn't good enough. I feel that this is due to a lack of leadership on the field and too much sideline control which would be a common complaint for many teams.
Players these days have been turned into compliant yes men who question absolutely nothing and that extends into how they behave in their private lives which is wrong. The players need to look at themselves and decide what needs to be done on the field because once you cross that white line you are alone with your teammates. Billy O'Shea gave a prime example of the modern player's mindset yesterday when he cited Peter Crowley having surged forward, beating two players and then stopping and meekly turning around and passing the ball backwards! This type of action is all too common in our play.
Where has the bold attacking football gone? We are capable of beating any team but that will not happen until we have a defence worthy of the name as far too often we employ the Red Sea defence allowing our goalkeeper to become a star or a culprit. Speaking of goalkeepers what the hell is happening with our kickouts? Before my visual coverage was switched to Cork v Waterford in the small ball I saw some atrocious efforts. What happens at training as regards a kickout strategy? I think it would be better to lamp the ball out to midfield and take your chances because at present we are playing with fire.
Having said all that we will retain our place in Division 1 for next year but the manner of retention is yet to be decided. Yesterday we were shorn of key elements before and during the match. Those of my fellow posters who suggest that James O'Donoghue does not merit his place need to reappraise their ability to judge a player's merits and likewise for Barry John Keane. We have some wonderful players and the makings of a fine team but this will take time and patience; from everybody. The management must also allow the players to play the game and make decisions based on how the game is going.
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Post by Deise Exile on Feb 12, 2017 23:07:43 GMT
There's a lot to be positive about. A new team is developing. Sure there's plenty to evolve and one wonders if Eamonn is the right man but with Maurice on board you'd have to be confident that the backroom team has improved. Jack Barry I still maintain is a Hugs huge positive and hopefully in the mould of Brian Fenton
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Post by Mickmack on Feb 12, 2017 23:35:47 GMT
When a team like Mayo gets their collective heads together and set up properly and start running at you, they are hard to stop ...legally.
Maybe its time to finally accord a bit of respect to Mayo.
In my opinion, the only reason Mayo didnt beat Kerry in the championship in 2015 and 2016 was that they didnt meet. . Kerrys future is very bright but not this year at senior level and maybe not in 2018.
I am looking forward to the Sigerson, the U21 championship and the club finals.
The league has thrown up the two Jacks so far and one or two more.
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Post by SCB-ROCK on Feb 13, 2017 3:36:33 GMT
After Keane's 26th minute goal, Mayo outscored Kerry by 0-11 to 0-3! For the second successive league tie Kerry didn't score for the last 15 minutes, including added time.
Kerry gave Cillian O'Connor 12 attempts to convert frees.
Andy Moran, scored three and won four frees, of which O’ Connor converted three for a total of six points. And yet Fitzmaurice made no change to how Kerry were defending Moran, either in personnel or strategy. This is a 33-year-old who spent a year on the sidelines in 2012 after surgery to repair a cruciate injury.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2017 6:32:55 GMT
Correct in everything you have said. BJK is now 27? And he still hasn't made it? Why persistent? It's the same across the board for several players. JOD, we would be better off planning without him, one good season really. When we are talking about missing players like killian young as having an affect on team things must be very bad! Anyway not many people here will agree with you or me. Most still think now average players still have a place in the kerry squad going on past achievements. We are lucky that the standard of football across the country is so bad or else we wouldn't be making it past 1/4 finals! What has Killian Young done to deserve such a disrespect?. He's been a constant in the Kerry team for 10 years and appeared in 6 All Ireland finals, and I can't remember any of them with thoughts that he let us down badly on any of the days. If things are bad then Jack, Pat and Eamonn haven't a clue between, he was and is a constant in all their teams. I don't get the fatalistic black or white comments on this game, on Feb 11. Some folks seem to want a nailed down first 15, ready for an All Ireland final yesterday. No disrespect meant by it. But as you said yourself the man is around 10 years plus and we need him playing in second round of the league? As one person has commented Fitz would still be playing Marc and AOM if they still wanted to play! I am just annoyed with the same names on the team sheet and we all know the younger players won't be next or near championship team! No rejuvenation in the championship 15!
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Post by greengold35 on Feb 13, 2017 8:53:56 GMT
There are a no of issues at the moment and not all of them to do with personnel or some guys playing poorly/having an off day. Our game plan seems to be built around attacking half backs/mid field hitting the line at pace every 1/1.5 minutes, making the extra man and creating scoring chances; this works fine for about 30/40 minutes when inevitably we run of out legs and players can no longer perform to this level; this explains the " fade outs" in the last 15/20 minutes when unless we introduce fresh legs there is literally no more to give. We play with a half forward line whose job seems to be to defend and make way for the players coming through. Secondly, and as important is our lack of a kick out strategy; playing the ball wide to a corner back is fine if he is unmarked or in space; playing a ball to a corner back facing his own goal is quite literally a different ball game- Mayo pushed up on Ronan Shanahan, a rookie playing his first game at inter county level and put him under enormous pressure- his only option was to play the ball back to Kelly in goals- problem was exacerbated now as Kelly had to play the ball under pressure resulting in much confusion and losing possession. Why we did not change this is a mystery but no more mystifying than some of the other decisions or lack of on the sideline. The Mark Griffin issue aside, we began playing with Adrian Spillane on the wing in the half forward line in front of the stand-about 15 minutes into the game, Liam Hassett came over and issued some instructions to Adrian and he went to the other side of the pitch and presumably played wing back for the remainder of the game?? We introduced Barry O'Sullivan late in the game, a midfielder all his young life for club, county and UCD and we played him at centre forward- its no wonder guys are confused. I have great faith in all our players to play to their max and give their all- I think its time now for management to step up to the plate, make the hard decisions and carry out the role they were appointed to do.
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Post by SCB-ROCK on Feb 13, 2017 8:54:42 GMT
As we all know Kerry didn't win a minor title from 94' to 2013, and haven't won a U21 title since 2008 (if memory serves). Why?
In one of the greatest football counties in the country, how is that allowed to happen? In those 20 years didn't the Kerry county board (KCB) go to the public looking for money? Didn't KCB receive funds from club matches played in the county? Didn't Kerry Group give hundreds of thousands/Millions of pounds/Euros in that time?
And yet no investment in youth, a generation of kids unattended to. Do people really believe it was lack of talent? I certainly don't!
Why has it taken until 2016 for ground to be broken on a center of excellence?
I grew up in the shadow of Fitzgerald Stadium, why has there only been one major stadium improvement in the last 40 plus years? (Lewis Road end)
We've being paying dearly for that lack of investment in our youth for the last few years, with the same names recycled in the hope that what didn't work the year before will work now.
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