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Post by Mickmack on Mar 21, 2016 7:58:18 GMT
Tight finishes were nothing new to Ciaran Carey in his playing days with Limerick but rarely has a win seemed more like a defeat than this big shock in Birr yesterday. While victory will do an enormous amount of good for hurling in Kerry but the reality that their first win over Offaly since 1957 wasn't long sinking it when it emerged that, far from reaching the quarter-finals, they would have to face Laois in a relegation play-off.
Wexford and Offaly are in the quarter-finals with two wins while Kerry, also on four points, face a relegation play-off against pointless Laois. Carey wants the system changed.
"It's strange and it's something the so-called big boys need to look at. I firmly believe anyone who is on zero points should be the team to go down," he said.
But Carey said they would now focus on facing a Laois side who they defeated in Portlaoise on the opening weekend.
Ability
Eamon Kelly, the Offaly manager who guided Kerry to promotion and the Christy Ring Cup last year, wasn't surprised by their ability.
"They fought harder and they wanted it more. They were far sharper in the tackle. They showed huge character in coming back and they deserved their victory."
Offaly, who now meet Kilkenny in the quarter-finals, were again dependent on the accuracy of Shane Dooley after failing to push on when Joe Bergin and James Mulrooney struck for goals early in each half.
The accuracy of John Egan kept Kerry in touch while the pace of Jordan Conway was also key to their challenge. Offaly led by 1-11 to 0-10 at the break and quick points from Dooley and Bergin put further daylight between.
Egan responded with an excellent goal and while Mulrooney cancelled it, Kerry were right back in contention when Colum Harty drilled home a goal.
Kerry drew level going into the final quarter and hit the front for the first time 14 minutes from the end through Conway and while the lead changed hands in the closing stages, Kerry sealed the win with late points from Egan and Shane Nolan.
scorers - Kerry: J Egan 1-10 (0-9f), J Conway 0-3, C Harty 1-0, J Griffin, M Boyle 0-2 each, S Nolan 0-1. Offaly: S Dooley 0-13 (8fs, 1 s-l, 1 '65'), J Mulrooney, J Bergin 1-1 each, C Egan, S Ryan 0-1.
Kerry - A McCabe 8; B Murphy 7, P Kelly 6, K Carmody 6; J Diggins 7, D Dineen 7, T Murnane 7; D Collins 6, J Griffin 7; B O'Leary 6, M O'Leary 7, J Buckley 6; J Conway 8, M Boyle 7, J Egan 8. Subs: C Harty 7 for Buckley (35), S Nolan 7 for B O'Leary (54), T Casey 6 for Diggins (58), S Weir 6 for Kelly (63), P Lucid 5 for Griffin (70).
Offaly - J Dempsey 6; N Wynne 7, C McDonald 6, P Rigney 6; P Camon 6, C Doughan 6, D Shortt 6; S Kinsella 7, S Ryan 6; P Murphy 6, C Egan 7, J Mulrooney 7; S Dooley 8, J Bergin 7, S Cleary 6. Subs: J Sampson 6 for Murphy (32), C Kiely 6 for Cleary (42), K Connolly 6 for Kinsella (52), S Connolly 6 for Wynne (55), P Guinan 6 for Ryan (64
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Post by Mickmack on Mar 21, 2016 8:01:56 GMT
Clare have hit their initial target for 2016, securing promotion to Division 1A at the first attempt, but according to Davy Fitzgerald neither they nor Limerick should be forced into the situation in which they found themselves yesterday. Both were already guaranteed a place in the League quarter-finals but only one of them could squeeze into the escape chute from 1B.
Clare achieved it more easily that the scoreline suggests but Fitzgerald remains convinced that the system is seriously flawed.
"The whole structure should be changed. I don't believe ourselves and Limerick should be down in 1B. I would love to see more teams in 1A.
"It's a no-brainer as far as I'm concerned. I would encourage the GAA to look at it again. Let's have more teams up there," he said.
Limerick would probably agree after once against missing out on promotion on a day when self-inflicted damage was a contributory factor.
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Post by wayupnorth on Mar 21, 2016 8:26:34 GMT
Seems crazy that with four points we have to play for survival against a team with no points. Still we wouldn't complain if the boot were on the other foot! Hope it's a double header with Cork and a double victory for the Kingdom!
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Post by buck02 on Mar 21, 2016 10:48:42 GMT
Seems crazy that with four points we have to play for survival against a team with no points. Still we wouldn't complain if the boot were on the other foot! Hope it's a double header with Cork and a double victory for the Kingdom! The GAA spend far too much time tweaking the rules of the games and lose site of such issues as this. Think about it for a minute. You lose ALL of your games and you still get into a play-off to avoid relegation against a team that won 2 games.
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Post by kerrygold on Mar 21, 2016 11:26:02 GMT
Seems crazy that with four points we have to play for survival against a team with no points. Still we wouldn't complain if the boot were on the other foot! Hope it's a double header with Cork and a double victory for the Kingdom! The GAA spend far too much time tweaking the rules of the games and lose site of such issues as this. Think about it for a minute. You lose ALL of your games and you still get into a play-off to avoid relegation against a team that won 2 games. And with Kerry having something in the order of a 20 point better difference over Laois..........................
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G_S_J
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Post by G_S_J on Mar 21, 2016 12:42:18 GMT
It may look unfair, but I think the system works.
The gap between 2A and 1B is huge, it can't be as simple as a one up one down. It only makes sense a team must really prove it to get promoted, like Kerry did last year. It showed they were equipped to deal with 1B hurling by coming up against those odds.
Likewise if we lose to Laois and then the 2A champions, we're probably not good enough to be in it next year and the 2A champs will have proven they are.
I think we can expect a closer contest against Laois, though they finished with no points, yesterday they showed they have come on a fair bit running Wexdord so close.
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Post by Mickmack on Mar 21, 2016 13:59:47 GMT
You make a valid point gsj...
It very hard to get promoted from 2a now though.
These playoffs are usually great games.They have the cuttin of knockout championship. Kerry's game v Antrim was a cracker from start to finish with two late points giving Kerry a last gasp one point victory. They were the better for it in the long run too I suppose.
Hurling is an unforgiving game. You can be marginally off the pace and you can get hockeyed.
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Post by hurlingman on Mar 21, 2016 14:02:39 GMT
It may look unfair, but I think the system works. The gap between 2A and 1B is huge, it can't be as simple as a one up one down. It only makes sense a team must really prove it to get promoted, like Kerry did last year. It showed they were equipped to deal with 1B hurling by coming up against those odds. Likewise if we lose to Laois and then the 2A champions, we're probably not good enough to be in it next year and the 2A champs will have proven they are. I think we can expect a closer contest against Laois, though they finished with no points, yesterday they showed they have come on a fair bit running Wexdord so close. Well that's true. However I think the real problem is the fact that a team gets two chances to stay up. I think it would be fair enough if the team who finished bottom play the 2A champions.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 21, 2016 14:03:07 GMT
To finish with four points and having to play a team that finished with no points is a farce
Laois should be either relegated automatically or else play off against the winners of 2A
Cork should be relegated from 1A as well instead of having to play Galway in another farce of a play off
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G_S_J
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Post by G_S_J on Mar 21, 2016 14:56:33 GMT
It may look unfair, but I think the system works. The gap between 2A and 1B is huge, it can't be as simple as a one up one down. It only makes sense a team must really prove it to get promoted, like Kerry did last year. It showed they were equipped to deal with 1B hurling by coming up against those odds. Likewise if we lose to Laois and then the 2A champions, we're probably not good enough to be in it next year and the 2A champs will have proven they are. I think we can expect a closer contest against Laois, though they finished with no points, yesterday they showed they have come on a fair bit running Wexdord so close. Well that's true. However I think the real problem is the fact that a team gets two chances to stay up. I think it would be fair enough if the team who finished bottom play the 2A champions. That would be better in fairness. The bottom team should play the 2A champs.
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Post by Ballyfireside on Mar 21, 2016 20:06:39 GMT
Munster Hurling is now the most dominant of all GAA provinces with all 6 having 'good' teams, although I suppose we are a bit away from a Munster Final? Ulster football might be next with 3 teams that could win the provincial. Is Munster football next with 4/5 of 6.
I suppose the worrying facet is that Leinster Football is in such a bad state while Connaught gets fresh air from Roscommon's emergence. Leinster has but a single live contender while Connaught have say 3?
Now don't come down on me like a ton of bricks, where one draws the line is a matter of opinion.
Can Kerry Hurlers win a Munster Final within 5 years I wonder?
What I have also realised is that we call them 'Kerry hurlers', as if they were a separate entity; no longer is the case and here's to great days ahead, and not a day too soon.
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Post by Mickmack on Mar 21, 2016 20:07:59 GMT
Big changes in the line up that loais sent out v Wexford compared to what Kerry faced.
Ominous sign perhaps
Laois v Kerry
E Rowland; O Carroll, D Maher, C Healy L Bergin, N Foyle, R Mullaney; M Whelan B Reddin; C Collier , S Maher, P Purcell; D Palmer, C Dwyer PJ Scully
Subs: J Phelan for B Reddin 46m, J Lennon for M Whelan, M Kavanagh for D Palmer 55m, T Delaney for D Maher inj 68m.
Laois team v Wexford
E Rowland;
C Healy, R Mullaney, D Maher;
L Bergin, M Whelan, T Delaney;
P Purcell, C Stapleton;
J Lennon, C Dwyer, W Hyland;
PJ Scully, W Dunphy, S Maher.
Subs: P Lalor for Delaney , C McEvoy for Bergin (45), R King for Dunphy (45), B Reddin for Stapleton (55), B O’Meara for D Maher (64).
Scorers for Laois: PJ Scully 0-9 (7f), C Dwyer 0-3, W Hyland 0-2, J Lennon 0-1, W Dunphy 0-2, C Stapleton 0-1, P Purcell 0-2, S Maher 0-1
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Joxer
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Post by Joxer on Mar 21, 2016 21:33:49 GMT
Big changes in the line up that loais sent out v Wexford compared to what Kerry faced. Ominous sign perhaps Laois v Kerry E Rowland; O Carroll, D Maher, C Healy L Bergin, N Foyle, R Mullaney; M Whelan B Reddin; C Collier , S Maher, P Purcell; D Palmer, C Dwyer PJ Scully Subs: J Phelan for B Reddin 46m, J Lennon for M Whelan, M Kavanagh for D Palmer 55m, T Delaney for D Maher inj 68m. Laois team v Wexford E Rowland; C Healy, R Mullaney, D Maher; L Bergin, M Whelan, T Delaney; P Purcell, C Stapleton; J Lennon, C Dwyer, W Hyland; PJ Scully, W Dunphy, S Maher. Subs: P Lalor for Delaney , C McEvoy for Bergin (45), R King for Dunphy (45), B Reddin for Stapleton (55), B O’Meara for D Maher (64). Scorers for Laois: PJ Scully 0-9 (7f), C Dwyer 0-3, W Hyland 0-2, J Lennon 0-1, W Dunphy 0-2, C Stapleton 0-1, P Purcell 0-2, S Maher 0-1 If you describe that as ominous Mickmack, how would you deal with the fact that Offaly actually beat Wexford...a week or so after Wexford hammered us....
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Post by Mickmack on Mar 21, 2016 21:55:09 GMT
Well Joxer I would say that Wexfords guard was down against Offaly especally after racing into a big lead.
And Offaly probably underestimated Kerry.
Laois only lost to Wexford by a point but Wexford hadnt much to play for in fairness.
Laois beat Offaly by 8 points in last years Leinster Championship.
The Laois team that lined v Wexford is very different to what Kerry played. The Laois manager mentioned that he was short ten of his championhip side for the Kerry game.
Its impossible to get any handle on form but I expect that Laois will put up a mighty battle against Kerry.
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Post by southward on Mar 21, 2016 22:00:31 GMT
Ironically, it wasn't in Laois' interest to beat or draw with Wexford, though they nearly did. To do so would have meant they'd face them in the play-off. Instead, they play us, who they probably would fancy more.
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Post by southward on Mar 21, 2016 23:25:32 GMT
Quite aside from the unfairness of us having to play a team with no points, it's simply absurd to have two teams in the firing line from a pot of just 6. Likewise with Galway and Cork in Div IA.
And of course the pressure of expectation is on Kerry again and anything can happen. If we end up going down to 2A again, it will be a disgrace on the authorities.
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Post by Mickmack on Mar 21, 2016 23:41:04 GMT
Munster Hurling is now the most dominant of all GAA provinces with all 6 having 'good' teams, although I suppose we are a bit away from a Munster Final? Ulster football might be next with 3 teams that could win the provincial. Is Munster football next with 4/5 of 6. I suppose the worrying facet is that Leinster Football is in such a bad state while Connaught gets fresh air from Roscommon's emergence. Leinster has but a single live contender while Connaught have say 3? Now don't come down on me like a ton of bricks, where one draws the line is a matter of opinion. Can Kerry Hurlers win a Munster Final within 5 years I wonder?
What I have also realised is that we call them 'Kerry hurlers', as if they were a separate entity; no longer is the case and here's to great days ahead, and not a day too soon. You would have to be feeding them a few ton of the Kerry Ingredient every week. The pick is about the same as for Shannon Rangers
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Post by Deleted on Mar 22, 2016 9:34:23 GMT
The step up from 2A to 1B is huge
But the step up to the Munster Championship well that is just massive,
I do hope that some day we will return to the Munster Championship and to be competitive in it,but things need to be done one step at a time
For now,the team needs to become an established Division 1 team and also an established team in that Leinster qualifying group,get comfortable playing at that level.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 22, 2016 11:57:11 GMT
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Post by sullyschoice on Mar 22, 2016 22:34:31 GMT
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Post by Mickmack on Mar 23, 2016 22:50:12 GMT
10 things the hurling league has taught us
Colm Keys
Standards ripe for an eight-team top flight
The six-team model has worked relatively well over the last five years but it is consistently on trial.
A clear break between the top two in 1B and the rest is now evident. Limerick have been runners-up in each of the five years of 1B's existence, with the demoted team from 1A bouncing straight back up.
Kerry have proved that the gap at the other end is as easy to bridge. It's off the agenda at a time when it needs to be addressed most.
The isolation of the Kilkenny bench
More sparing than ever has been the deployment of the Kilkenny bench during games. We've highlighted this before but the final audit saw Brian Cody make just 10 substitutions, two enforced because of bad injuries.
By comparison Cork and Offaly with 24 each and Limerick with 23 made most. Still, Cody managed to give game time to 25 players, with Padraig Walsh and TJ Reid not missing a minute.
Cork's leaking defence
Cork are officially the most porous defence in the 2016 Allianz Hurling League. The Rebels' concession of 9-118 in their five-game programme edges them ahead of Laois, who shipped 9-113 in Division 1B and Donegal, who were taken for 10-112 in 2B.
Take it a stage further and in the five years of the five-team divisions no county has come close to conceding that amount in the premier flight. Last year Clare conceded 9-98, 20 points less. Oddly, Cork scored more (8-89 to 4-94) than top team Kilkenny.
Kilkenny more sinned against than sinners these days
Kilkenny's reputation for physical ferocity is a repetitive theme. Even on Sunday Dublin manager Ger Cunningham spoke of a different kind of challenge when you visit Nowlan Park, a more physical game than anything else they had experienced.
That said, some of the heaviest and reckless challenges have been delivered on men in black and amber in this league. Padraic Maher's neck-high challenge on TJ Reid was just a yellow card in the referee's eyes.
For the second successive season Conor Fogarty was forced out of a League game in Pairc Ui Rinn because of a wild swipe. Last year he sustained a broken bone in the leg that kept him out for 12 weeks, this time the damage was enough to keep him out of action on Sunday - when Michael Malone, enjoying his first League exposure, was felled by Chris Crummey's challenge, forcing him off.
It's not too long since Michael Rice had his fingers mangled and Reid had his knee cap smashed in high-profile Croke Park Championship games.
They're tough, they can give it and take it, but there is a limit.
Michael Breen's strong midfield case for Tipp
Plenty of re-organisation for Michael Ryan after a heavy toll of off season departures especially in the engine room where James Woodlock and Shane McGrath, their premier partnership for so long, took flight.
But into the breach has stepped Michael Breen, who has got better as the League has progressed as the anchor tenant, with 1-9 in his last three games alone. He looks set for a partnership, with Brendan Maher surely happy to be facing the goals again.
Wexford's woes
While Limerick can somewhat feel hard done by over their continuation in the second tier, Wexford have no such cause.
Since the divisions were re-organised into six teams their record from 25 games at the regulation stage has been 12 wins, a draw and 12 defeats, a 50pc return. That 2013 draw against Limerick was as good as it got for them but otherwise their form has been underwhelming.
TJ Reid's golden run
Has a reigning Hurler of the Year ever followed on in a League campaign quite like it? The Ballyhale man's influence on the All-Ireland champions grows and grows. In five games he has hit 1-54 of Kilkenny's 4-94, a return of just under 54pc. By comparison with other marksmen who have played the full complement of games, Patrick Horgan has hit 37pc (2-36) of Cork's 8-89 while David Treacy's 1-34 is also 37pc of 6-83 for Dublin.
Davy Fitz spreads net wide
The balance between winning games and giving game-time has been finely struck by Clare with 30 players involved in their five matches, including three goalkeepers.
Kudos to Kerry and Carey
Regardless of what fate is in store for them Ciaran Carey has done a commendable job in pushing Kerry hurling on. To beat Laois and Offaly and narrowly miss out on a quarter-final represents the best relative league achievement so far.
Irish Independent
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Post by watchdebreakswillye on Mar 23, 2016 23:06:17 GMT
Wouldn't It have been something magical if Kerry were playing Kilkenny in the quarter final. It nearly became a reality.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 24, 2016 11:07:48 GMT
John Egan: League displays show Kerry hurling on upward curve Experienced Kerry forward John Egan believes their exploits in the league this season shows that the Kingdom hurlers can survive with the big guns. And the former Kerry captain, their top marksman in a campaign which saw them win away to Laois and Offaly, said they will not dwell on the disappointment of going so close to securing a shock quarter-final spot in their first season up in Division 1B. Kerry finished on the same number of points as quarter-finalists Offaly and Wexford but an inferior scoring difference means they will face a relegation play-off with a Laois team, who didn’t pick up a single point in their five matches. “There was nothing further from our minds,” said Egan, regarding their quest for a quarter-final spot before taking on Offaly. “Getting the performance and then trying to beat Offaly would have been a huge positive for us. The way things were set up, it was going to be an outside chance that we were going to make it. We are pleased with the way things went, we have another crucial game coming up, so our confidence will be high and we can get back training Tuesday night. “I am really looking forward to the rest of the year.” Egan’s haul of 1-10 in the 2-18 to 2-17 win over Offaly on Sunday took his league tally this season to 1-23. He took over the free-taking duties from Shane Nolan after the opening few games but 1-11 of his tally has been from play. The St Brendan’s clubman insists it is vital for Kerry to be playing against the top counties if they want to continue progressing. “We want to be playing up with all these big counties and improving all the time. “It’s very important that young players would get confidence winning these games.” Current Offaly manager Eamon Kelly led them to the Christy Ring Cup title last season and Egan said that good work is now being taken on by Ciarán Carey. “We had a great two seasons with Eamon and he really brought us on. This year Ciarán Carey has taken it on another bit and we have a really young team, there are a lot of young players out there, two or three lads today had their first start so it’s great for them.” He knows they face a test when they host Laois in the relegation play-off, with Cheddar Plunkett’s men looking for revenge for the 1-24 to 2-14 opening day loss. “We played really well up there, but I think they were missing a couple of players on the day. “I am sure it will be a 50/50 game, and they will be mad up for it since we have beaten them already. We are hoping this win over Offaly can springboard our season into having plenty of these performances,” added Egan. www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/john-egan-league-displays-show-kerry-hurling-on-upward-curve-388792.html
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G_S_J
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Post by G_S_J on Mar 24, 2016 11:57:42 GMT
Wouldn't It have been something magical if Kerry were playing Kilkenny in the quarter final. It nearly became a reality. Cody is supposed to be very fond of Kerry football, you'd hope he'd be kind to us and leave his Cats in first gear for the 70.
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Post by watchdebreakswillye on Mar 24, 2016 12:17:29 GMT
Wouldn't It have been something magical if Kerry were playing Kilkenny in the quarter final. It nearly became a reality. Cody is supposed to be very fond of Kerry football, you'd hope he'd be kind to us and leave his Cats in first gear for the 70. All the other big ''p u s s I e s' haven't figured out a way to 'bate' The Cats over many many moons now, so 'twould be no disgrace if they 'bate' our boys. The pundits love a David & Goliath battle, especially when the underdog keeps going and fighting to the bitter end. I hope I live to see the green & gold and the black and amber battling it out one day to the sound of the clash of the ash.
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G_S_J
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Post by G_S_J on Mar 24, 2016 12:21:18 GMT
Cody is supposed to be very fond of Kerry football, you'd hope he'd be kind to us and leave his Cats in first gear for the 70. All the other big '*' haven't figured out a way to 'bate' The Cats over many many moons now, so 'twould be no disgrace if they 'bate' our boys. The pundits love a David & Goliath battle, especially when the underdog keeps going and fighting to the bitter end. I hope I live to see the green & gold and the black and amber battling it out one day to the sound of the clash of the ash. There was that famous draw back in 1980 between the two sides. So the form isnt too bad.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 24, 2016 19:58:41 GMT
Gave them a good game of it as well in the early 90s in a league game in Tralee,I think they won by 2 or 3 points in the end
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Post by homerj on Mar 24, 2016 20:09:22 GMT
Gave them a good game of it as well in the early 90s in a league game in Tralee,I think they won by 2 or 3 points in the end My first ever hurling game, DJ was playing. Anybody got a link to the score ?
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Post by neilesflynn on Mar 25, 2016 1:20:34 GMT
If I can remember that game correctly, might be wrong!!! But Dj only scored a few frees that day. It was Charlie Carter that did most of the damage. DJ Carey's brother was in goals that day for Kilkenny can't think of his name but he made a couple of good saves.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 25, 2016 16:01:49 GMT
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