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Post by Ard Mhacha on Mar 31, 2015 14:38:22 GMT
I cant see us winning this match at all ... Kerry to stay up and us to drop to D2 ... We're sho1te :-( Ah them Tyrone boyos are at it again! Heaping all the pressure on Kerry. Don't heed him. Tyrone will be ready No disrespect, but I'd prefer to meet Kerry in Div 2 next year. A wee weekend in Killarney, and all that... And just for something different. Maybe we might see some highlights of Div 2 for once too, while a big gun is there. Although with RTE involved, I wouldn't bet on it.
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Post by donegalman on Mar 31, 2015 14:46:15 GMT
Kerry played a poor game v Mayo and it was a crisis. Kerry played a reasonably good game away to derry and people were happy once again. Kerry played a good game at home to Dublin and it was back to the all ireland winning form. Kerry were beaten badly by Cork in Cork, which seems to happen every year in the league, and it was back to the drawing board. Kerry had a good win at home to Donegal, and people were lauding the team again as showing well. Kerry had a very poor defeat at home to Monaghan, and things were back to square 1.
Bar the Monaghan game, I would say that Kerry are showing very usual league form. I dont think that Tyrone are going to send Kerry down, unless Kerry fail utterly to turn up in Omagh. I cant see this, as Tyrone are a pale shadow of where they were at in recent years. Beaten by Monaghan, Scraping a draw against derry in the last 2 months in Omagh. LAst year, beaten by Armagh, and salvaging a draw against down in the champoinship in Omagh. The last time they won in Omagh was v Louth in a back door game in june.
For this reason, I cant see Tyrone bucking the losing trend on Sunday.
All things are not well in Tyrone, and it is sad to see.
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keane
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Post by keane on Mar 31, 2015 15:04:28 GMT
If Kerry needed to beat Tyrone by ten points this weekend to stay up I'd back them to do it. Tyrone are a poor team, badly managed, playing ineffective tactics. I would be surprised if Kerry don't comfortably get over them.
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Post by watchdebreakswillye on Mar 31, 2015 15:09:33 GMT
I think that it is significant that Tommy has been involved from the first league game and has seen game time in each game (I think). He has played even though it appears to many of us watching he doesn't warrant his place on the team or as one of the first subs. If we can see that you can be damn sure Eamonn and the selectors can see it as well. I'd put it this way: by putting Tommy on the pitch in these league games they are not doing it so that he will have a winning impact on that particular game but are playing the long game and hoping that every minute he plays at this level (i.e. higher that club football) will bring him further along the road. They clearly see him having a significant role to play in the summer. Contrast that to Paul Galvin who while back in training has not been named on any panel. Both lads are coming into the championship from the cold and it is interesting to see the approach taken with both. People might be getting a little frustrated with Tommy's progress but give him time. And if it doesn't work out sure didn't we win an All-Ireland without him last year? Anything we get out of him this year is a bonus. Don't forget that Tadgh was far from a permanent fixture on the team in '09 (neither was Tommy for that matter!)Funnily enough didn't Tadgh replace Tommy early in the '09 semi final? So be patient. Anything positive that Tommy gives us this summer is a bonus and something we didn't have last year. Same goes for Paul. If he makes a positive contribution we are gaining not losing. As for Colm Cooper, well, anyone looking for him to be included in Tyrone needs their head examined. I can't recall a more serious injury to affect such a high profile player. We were always told the cruciate was as bad as it got. Wrong!! Colm got the cruciate + 1. Patience is the key and Omagh is not the place to be testing the knee. I don't have too many worries about his return. 2013 was a landmark year for Colm in a new playmaker role which he excelled in. It will be easier to return to this type of role than as a jinky No 13. Spot on animal. Eamon Fitzmaurice is giving as much game time as possible to Tommy Walsh to enable him to get back into the swing of things. This won't happen overnight. Tommy has to gel back in with his team mates, get confident with playing with the round ball again, understand and fit into the tactics for each individual game (last year Kerry had different tactics for different teams), get to know the strengths and weaknessess of his team mates, positional sense etc. Tommy's story is very similar to that of Gooch's and Paul Galvin's (you could nearly throw in Aidan O' Mahony, James O Donoghue, Donnacha Walsh, Darren O' Sullivan & Marc O' Shea to the mix as well). All have been out of the loop for different lengths of time and for different reasons. Tommy, Gooch and Paul Galvin in particular will need time to re-adjust, learn and fit in with what Eamon Fitzmaurice & Co. decide. Their team mates have a huge role to play too because thay will need their encouragement, patience, understanding and support. It's kind of an intriguing thing really because everyone on the panel will want to be on the first 15, but a true team player will be unselfish and will help a team mate who is vying for the same position as he is. Marc O' Shea is a great example of this from last year - eventhough he was dropped, he never faltered in his committment to the team and his honesty of endeavour. I have great faith in Eamon Fitzmaurice and his backroom team to manage the present challenges. Eamon is a shrewd operator. He needs to be able to man manage, be a psychologist, tactician, agony aunt and a hundred more things I can't even imagine. Kieran Donaghy, as captain and leader, has a huge role to play as well. I am 100% confident that we are blessed to have such a team in place at this moment in time to negotiate the Green & Gold through the tough battles that lie ahead. A lot of other counties would sell their souls to the devil to have what we have, who we have and to be where we are. PS: I'd be inclined to 'mind' the Gooch too for as long as needs be. He's a much loved and valuable player and 'twould be a holy show to witness some gurrier trying to soften him up. 'Tis a bit like letting your darling daughter off out to her first disco and you at home a nervous wreck thinking of all the mad young hoors that'd be eyeing her up. Lord save us!
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animal
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Post by animal on Mar 31, 2015 15:21:10 GMT
People might be getting a little frustrated with Tommy's progress but give him time. And if it doesn't work out sure didn't we win an All-Ireland without him last year? Anything we get out of him this year is a bonus. Don't forget that Tadgh was far from a permanent fixture on the team in '09 (neither was Tommy for that matter!)Funnily enough didn't Tadgh replace Tommy early in the '09 semi final? So be patient. Anything positive that Tommy gives us this summer is a bonus and something we didn't have last year. Same goes for Paul. If he makes a positive contribution we are gaining not losing. I just realised I got my games from '09 mixed up. Tadgh replaced Tommy in the 1/4 final v Dublin and not the semi-final.
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keane
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Post by keane on Mar 31, 2015 15:34:55 GMT
What is going on with Donnchadh Walsh at the moment?
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Post by givehimaball on Mar 31, 2015 15:52:10 GMT
Tyrone's result so far in the league.
Tyrone 0-09 Monaghan 1-13 Mayo 1-07 Tyrone 1-11 Tyrone 0-11 Derry 1-08 Dublin 1-9 Tyrone 0-12 Tyrone 2-10 Cork 0-17 Donegal 1-13 Tyrone 0-06
They've scored a total of 3-59 and conceded a total of 5-67
A whopping 50% of their entire total came from deadballs 1-31. As such you have to think if the Kerry team is anyway decent in terms of not conceding scoreable frees, the odds of Kerry winning should shoot up.
As a comparison Kerry have scored 1-23 from deadballs out of the Kerry total of 5-74 which works out at 29%
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Post by givehimaball on Mar 31, 2015 16:03:52 GMT
On Tommy Walsh probably make sense to keep an eye on how some of the other recent returnees from the AFL are doing.
Marty Clarke has been affected by illness while Caolan Mooney has only started 1 game for Down in the league so far and been very much a bit part player so far (I think he night have picked up a knock) Padraig Flynn in Kildare has also struggled to get game time. I think those are the only 4 back at the same time.
Interestingly all 3 of Walsh, Mooney and Flynn have scored goals in the league which probably signifies nothing.
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Post by wayupnorth on Mar 31, 2015 17:49:38 GMT
Where Counties finish with Equal Points (Riail 6.20 T.O. 2012):
(i) Where two teams only are involved - the outcome of the meeting of the two teams in the previous game in the competition;
(ii) Scoring Difference (subtracting the total scores against from total scores for);
(iii) Highest total score for;
(iv) A Play-Off.
As a correction to my earlier post, if we lose to Tyrone and there is a winner in the Donegal/Mayo match there will be three teams on six points at the next to bottom of the table one of whom will be relegated. In that case, barring a complete annihilation of Donegal or Mayo, it will come down to the points difference between ourselves and Tyrone. This means that Tyrone need to win by two points to stay up. If the Donegal/Mayo match is drawn, it's down to head to head if we lose which means Tyrone stay up.
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Post by wayupnorth on Mar 31, 2015 17:53:41 GMT
No disrespect, but I'd prefer to meet Kerry in Div 2 next year. A wee weekend in Killarney, and all that... And just for something different. Maybe we might see some highlights of Div 2 for once too, while a big gun is there. Although with RTE involved, I wouldn't bet on it.
Think we would be travelling to Armagh as our last League meeting was in Tralee?
Anyway don't be impatient - time enough to meet in Division 1 in 2017!
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Post by wayupnorth on Mar 31, 2015 18:17:31 GMT
Armagh, Cavan and Derry are already confirmed as being in Division 2 next year and then it's 4 from the current lot of Down, Roscommon, Meath, Cavan, Laois, Galway, Westmeath, Kildare plus whoever gets relegated from Division 1. Very little in the way to get excited about there and very little that looks like serious All-Ireland contendors either. Division 1 will be Dublin, Monaghan, Cork for definite plus most likely both Donegal and Mayo plus 2 from Down, Roscommon, Meath and Cavan plus either Kerry or Tyrone most likely. In other words the serious competition. I can see whoever gets promoted being seriously up against it and would imagine that the two teams that do get promoted would be extremely strong favourites to go straight back down again. The one positive if we do get relegated is that it's very hard to see Kerry being down in Division 2 for more than a year. However I think it would be a serious waste of a year in terms of player development. Reduces the odds of someone doing a Paul Murphy in terms of development considerably in my opinion. It's Fermanagh coming into Div 2 with Armagh. Which would mean if Cavan and Down stay there and Tyrone get relegated that there would be six out of eight teams from Ulster. Great preparation for the 2016 Ulster Championship!
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Post by Ard Mhacha on Mar 31, 2015 18:35:29 GMT
No disrespect, but I'd prefer to meet Kerry in Div 2 next year. A wee weekend in Killarney, and all that... And just for something different. Maybe we might see some highlights of Div 2 for once too, while a big gun is there. Although with RTE involved, I wouldn't bet on it.
Think we would be travelling to Armagh as our last League meeting was in Tralee?
Anyway don't be impatient - time enough to meet in Division 1 in 2017!
Maybe, but we had to go to Laois 3 years running in recent times.
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Post by misteallaigh abú on Mar 31, 2015 19:40:21 GMT
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Post by misteallaigh abú on Mar 31, 2015 19:46:22 GMT
These two lads were behind me in Tralee on Sunday, keen followers of the game! We could have done with at least one of them on the pitch!
I wonder how Paul Geaney is? Does anybody know how serious the injury he received is? If he doesn't start, it certainly limits our options. Hopefully Sheehan will be back as he was a massive loss to us last weekend. I would love to travel to Omagh,however, prior plans have scuppered any chance of that. I do believe that the game is on TV so at least we will be able to watch it.
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Post by watchdebreakswillye on Mar 31, 2015 19:48:04 GMT
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fitz
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Post by fitz on Mar 31, 2015 23:15:14 GMT
If Kerry needed to beat Tyrone by ten points this weekend to stay up I'd back them to do it. Tyrone are a poor team, badly managed, playing ineffective tactics. I would be surprised if Kerry don't comfortably get over them. I would agree although their performances against Dublin and particularly Cork are decent. If we play well, that is 12-13 guys performing well we will be too strong. We haven't regularly played well though. Hopefully the stakes will focus lads to the wheel. If the opined views that heavy stamina training was in vogue last week, one would have consider the wisdom of that prescription. Maybe though after beating Donegal, Monaghan weren't given the respect and attention deserved. I don't think that will be the case this weekend.
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inchperfect
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Post by inchperfect on Mar 31, 2015 23:47:28 GMT
Donegal 1-13 Tyrone 0-6 AN EXHIBITION of free-taking from Michael Murphy means Tyrone and Kerry will face-off on Sunday at Healy Park as both bid to survive the drop to the Allianz League Division Two. ... we'll definitely need Sheehan for next week then. If Tyrone are coughing up frees.
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Post by Ballyfireside on Apr 1, 2015 1:00:05 GMT
Tyrone's result so far in the league. Tyrone 0-09 Monaghan 1-13 Mayo 1-07 Tyrone 1-11 Tyrone 0-11 Derry 1-08 Dublin 1-9 Tyrone 0-12 Tyrone 2-10 Cork 0-17 Donegal 1-13 Tyrone 0-06 On this basis alone a gambler would have a big bet on Tyrone. They have done better than us bar vs Donegal, Dublin and Derry, and those 3 results were hardly shameful. It is a home game for them and in front of a big support contingent they won't mind settling an old score of a game one evening in Killarney. Whatever issues they have at the moment, they will set them aside for an hour. A big margin either way is a possibility although that it's a league decider might tighten it up. I'll be there and it has always been a great event these past number of years; they like to give us 'a wee rub' as they'd say, and then a big proud giggle and handshake after as if nil happened and regardless of the result. 'You can't beat being there' as they say and meeting their die-hards is always such a pleasure and the reception Mickey got that evening by the lakes didn't go unnoticed. The tempo is always high and which makes it all the better although a few pints with 'em after a Saturday evening game would be even better.
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fitz
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Post by fitz on Apr 1, 2015 7:04:24 GMT
I think the keen rivalry exists mostly at fan level now. Of those involved from a playing perspective only Star, Joe Mc, big Cav from starting perspective remain. Cav was never really into the confrontation end of things. Marc, Daz and Tommy would also be from the heated heady days but will be likely subs. With Jack replaced by Eamonn the sideline battle has also largely moved on. Yes there will always be some element remaining but both teams will I reckon be primarily focused on winning the game for the sake of avoiding relegation. The sideshow is minimized. I think Mickey cuts a tired figure now from length of tenure and that terrible tragedy that befell him and his family with Michaela. I think Tyrone need a new voice and rebuilding. I genuinely hope after and when he steps aside, he finds a new avenue to direct his energies. An amazingly resilient man who has brought unprecedented success to his county. A brilliant manager and a fine man. An inspiration to many people, with great dignity and humility, even if he did mask very well that steel and ruthlessness he instilled in his teams.
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kerryexile
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Post by kerryexile on Apr 1, 2015 8:53:17 GMT
Where Counties finish with Equal Points (Riail 6.20 T.O. 2012):
(i) Where two teams only are involved - the outcome of the meeting of the two teams in the previous game in the competition;
(ii) Scoring Difference (subtracting the total scores against from total scores for);
(iii) Highest total score for;
(iv) A Play-Off.
As a correction to my earlier post, if we lose to Tyrone and there is a winner in the Donegal/Mayo match there will be three teams on six points at the next to bottom of the table one of whom will be relegated. In that case, barring a complete annihilation of Donegal or Mayo, it will come down to the points difference between ourselves and Tyrone. This means that Tyrone need to win by two points to stay up. If the Donegal/Mayo match is drawn, it's down to head to head if we lose which means Tyrone stay up. That clarifies it – considering the points differences we cannot be depending on the kindness of strangers - we have to go and win the game. The below table is from Gaa.ie - didn't copy very well I thinkwe could lose by 1 pt and stay up. Lose by 2 pts we go down. it is not possible force a play off. As Wayupnorth says - all assuming that the big points advantage that Donegal & Mayo have is not cancelled out by one having a huge win. Pos Team P W L D F A Points 1 Cork 6 5 1 0 105 90 10 2 Monaghan 6 4 2 0 84 80 8 3 Dublin 6 3 2 1 89 70 7 4 Donegal 6 3 3 0 81 73 6 5 Mayo 6 3 3 0 91 88 6 6 Kerry 6 3 3 0 89 100 6 7 Tyrone 6 1 3 2 68 82 4 8 Derry 6 0 5 1 66 90 1
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Post by kerrygold on Apr 1, 2015 9:20:10 GMT
The calculation is simple enough, win the game and stay up and maybe qualify for the semi finals.
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kot
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Post by kot on Apr 1, 2015 9:25:20 GMT
I cant see us winning this match at all ... Kerry to stay up and us to drop to D2 ... We're sho1te :-( Ahaaaaa Dermot, adopting a bit of the cute hoorism are you?
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Post by Ballyfireside on Apr 1, 2015 9:49:29 GMT
I can understand Dermot's fear kot and my previous comment voices similar concern. I'd also share fitzwop's general views and now that Tyrone have arrived I do think their challenger status is no longer and we are grateful when we beat them. A great GAA culture there and v modest too. They absolutely love and very much respect Kerry and they used to watch videos of our Golden era games, on the way home after the pub, probably after a night discussing it and that is when they weren't at the helm themselves. It is only a few years ago that they did a clean sweep of absolutely every competition in Ulster, I stand corrected on this and I believe it even included the ladies. Mickey had to fight hard at the outset and he even had to train in a car park initially, a bit like the initial rejection McGuinness got in Donegal. It is a tough life and our own managers were hardly exceptions. And the way social media is going with everyone is throwing in their tuppenny bit, it is hardly going to ease up any day soon. Anyway here's to a big day out on Sunday and a place in the semis for us. I'd be interested to hear more about Tyrone and while I live close by I know nothing that I haven't read on here.
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Post by A.N. Other on Apr 1, 2015 10:55:43 GMT
Dont think Ill be making the trip. Is it on Tg4 does anyone know?
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Post by donegalman on Apr 1, 2015 11:14:53 GMT
Every team has shown to be flaky in this league, with one performance that exposed a serious weakness in either form or personnel for whatever reason. (Bar Cork).
The monaghan game must be a concern for Kerry.. simple reason is that you can be forgiven losing to Mayo, as when they click they are almost unstoppable. Similarly, the match against cork is a game that Kerry seem to do very badly in during the league. So whatever weakness has been exposed in the monaghan game, I expect to be corrected this week.
Tyrone on the other hand have been set back to a level where they are going to really struggle to bounce back from. I am not sure they have the room for improvement that Kerry have. Tyrone have been poor in their games v Derry, dire v Monaghan and terrible v Donegal. Unlucky v Cork. Impressive v Mayo and unlucky v Dublin.
The one worrying trend here for Kerry, if there is one, is that Tyrone seemed to do well this year v non ulster opposition, going over to mayo and down to dublin putting in big performances. On the other hand, they lost to cork at home. So the signs are less daunting for Kerry thus.
If I were to call this game, I would say that it will be close until about half way through the 2nd half. Then Kerry will pull away. The poster above rightly pointed out that a free taker is vital in this game. But I would say that a goal is even moreso. I expect one.
Personally glad that it is not us that have to go to mayo looking for a result, we have a long season as it is without this sort of messing about, but on the other hand, I would say that this level of competition is all good for Kerry as it is a long gap between now and munster final day in killarney.
I expect to see them in the league semis.
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Post by Annascaultilidie on Apr 1, 2015 11:21:44 GMT
I just think Kerry weren't really up for the Monaghan game and were stuck to the ground: be it from heavy training or whatever. The performance had the signs of not much tactical work done during the week.
I was impressed on the other hand by Monaghan's mini-tactics for example the positioning of the number nine.
I would hope that if Kerry focus on the Tyrone game that they should be OK but it of course no done deal... a few goals for Tyrone could make things very difficult.
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Post by Ballyfireside on Apr 1, 2015 12:08:08 GMT
Supporters club are travelling I take it, the last time they had a great session in the Club house at Healy Park the night before the game.
Should the forum start doing the same?, have a meeting point say 30 mins before the game for starters? I'm up for it Sunday, put faces to names on here, scary! Is there an expedition to The North Pole from Annascaul?
And re donegalman, Tyrone's form this year vs Non Ulster teams is amazing, or worrying for us, and even though Mayo have a good record vs Tyrone the Red Hand prevailed in Castlebar.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2015 12:18:49 GMT
I would not write off Tyrone . They always raise their game for kerry and and they will want to win at home . Donaghy needs a rest but I would play him in this game . They have to move the ball fast and change it up . Tyrone will drop a man back expecting the high ball into Donaghy and Kerry need to vary it . Move the ball out to the wings and corners leave O'Brien and Geaney and Keane beat their men one on one . Hopefully Sheehan will be back as our Free kicking is sad . Will Paul Murphy be back ? I don't see too many changes . Kelly will probably start . I think Kilkenny should be dropped hasn't done it for me . Enright , Griffin and Possibly Marc . If Murphy is back put him in the corner with Lyne , Crowley , and Killian . Maher and Moran in the middle . O'Brien , Sheehan if fit , if he's not fit maybe Darren and Buckley . Geaney if fit if not I would give Thomas Hickey a game . I know he's just back but Tommy Walsh is still way off the pace of it so he would stay on the Bench . Donaghy and Keane 14 and 15 . Daithi Casey should get a game . No point having him in there unless you use him also Podge O'Connor . They won't get it easy from Tyrone should be a tough physical battle . They have to use the open space and move the ball by foot a lot of foot passing County players should be able to do that no problem .
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Post by Ballyfireside on Apr 1, 2015 12:41:22 GMT
I wonder what impact all these negative spin offs from Aussie Rules will have. You'd have to be worried about Tommy and hopefully he will come through, but that might not always be the case. I'd always be mad for change and experimenting but I absolutely fail to see any merits of The International Rules, well apart from overly exposing amateur players to physical professionals. What is the benefit? I enjoyed the one game I was at more so than it looks on TV but that's hardly enough of a reason.
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Post by Dermot on Apr 1, 2015 12:41:24 GMT
I cant see us winning this match at all ... Kerry to stay up and us to drop to D2 ... We're sho1te :-( Ahaaaaa Dermot, adopting a bit of the cute hoorism are you? N0, not at all Kot... I will be genuinely amazed if we win ... And Healy Park isn't exactly a fortress for us either as we have a better away record this past few years...
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