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Post by skybluezone on Oct 12, 2014 17:14:20 GMT
Didnt take long for the anti Kerry media bias to disappear so! Or the anti Dub bias to resurface once Sam didnt stay in the Dublin! So far we've had Flynn shouldnt get one, that Connolly doesnt deserve one cos he only did it in club football. But Sigerson is fine as a barometer if its a Kerryman we are discussing! Oh and James McCArthy only got nominated to 'get the Dubs numbers up'. So its clear that league counts for zero, which i can live with but must be entitle them to a couple of noms? Sure they imploded so much they are hot favs to win in 2015. Interesting. And Cluxton is gone to pot altogether, shouldnt be near one! Cluxtons's poor free kicking at the business end will cost him his All-Star this year in light of the errors by his main competitors and could potentially open the door for Rory Beggan, who coincidently contributed heavily on the score sheet for Monaghan from placed balls. A big challenge for Clucko to direct operations again from number 1 in 2015. The Dubs were flaky during the league while the Leinster championship resembles a bit of a stag party now for the Dubs, pissing their way through it, neither competition will hardly carry much collateral when the gongs are being banded about, apart of course from Cinderella who should be home by midnight on the night of the gongs. so what you are saying is that when weighing up the Dubs performance that Leinster shouldnt count cos they hosed through it and League shouldnt count cos they were flaky, but still won it. Which leaves the qf v Monaghan which they hosed through, and the sf v Donegal, who did a number on them. No one here has mentioned the Monaghan game So essentially lets judge them on the game they lost. Fair enough, even on that one Flynn and Connolly were immense, outrageous points scored by both, and on truth the only goodthing to come out of thatfor us.Fitzwop, you sayCluxton should only be judged against himself, but isnt the concept of the allstars that u are judged against the rest in your position? You both are correct in saying he wasnt great this year but he was still better than Durkan for instance. When any decentg team you play is specifically setting up to nullify your threat and you are the keeper then enough said. Of course there is a bit of my looking thru sky blue goggles but as supporters we all display that tendancy. Its is fair to say that I am not yet in BallyKthefireside territory, who informs us in another thread that Kerry won cos they had 20 great players compared to Donegal and Mayo having only 10, which by inference would suggest that Dublin may have about 5.! Sure I'm only loking for 2 or 3!
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Post by Mickmack on Oct 12, 2014 22:24:35 GMT
Delivering in the sigerson cup final in a tight evenly matched game is infinitely better that scoring easy points for Dublin in a facile win again against weaker counties with tiny populations and no resources and no AIG millions. Dublin had just two challenges in 2014... win the semi final and win the final and they blew it and hardly any of them came out of it with any credit. Given their resources it was a spectacular failure that the footballers of Kilkenny would be embarrassed about. I wouldn't given them any all star!
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seamo
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Post by seamo on Oct 12, 2014 22:45:18 GMT
Cluxtons's poor free kicking at the business end will cost him his All-Star this year in light of the errors by his main competitors and could potentially open the door for Rory Beggan, who coincidently contributed heavily on the score sheet for Monaghan from placed balls. A big challenge for Clucko to direct operations again from number 1 in 2015. The Dubs were flaky during the league while the Leinster championship resembles a bit of a stag party now for the Dubs, pissing their way through it, neither competition will hardly carry much collateral when the gongs are being banded about, apart of course from Cinderella who should be home by midnight on the night of the gongs. so what you are saying is that when weighing up the Dubs performance that Leinster shouldnt count cos they hosed through it and League shouldnt count cos they were flaky, but still won it. Which leaves the qf v Monaghan which they hosed through, and the sf v Donegal, who did a number on them. No one here has mentioned the Monaghan game So essentially lets judge them on the game they lost. Fair enough, even on that one Flynn and Connolly were immense, outrageous points scored by both, and on truth the only goodthing to come out of thatfor us.Fitzwop, you sayCluxton should only be judged against himself, but isnt the concept of the allstars that u are judged against the rest in your position? You both are correct in saying he wasnt great this year but he was still better than Durkan for instance. When any decentg team you play is specifically setting up to nullify your threat and you are the keeper then enough said. Of course there is a bit of my looking thru sky blue goggles but as supporters we all display that tendancy. Its is fair to say that I am not yet in BallyKthefireside territory, who informs us in another thread that Kerry won cos they had 20 great players compared to Donegal and Mayo having only 10, which by inference would suggest that Dublin may have about 5.! Sure I'm only loking for 2 or 3! Connolly and Flynn certainly deserve All-Stars based on their performances in the CHAMPIONSHIP!! I'm sick of talk about the league and how a guy plays for his club . Ye may well get a 3rd All-Star, who knows. I do hear what your saying though; some of us are now suffering from what so many before us suffered from; becoming prisoners of the moment. Declaring a team unbeatable after one victory, or complete failures after one loss. I would have thought all that rubbish would have died down around here by now! lol
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Post by Mickmack on Oct 13, 2014 7:04:11 GMT
Kerry, Dublin, Donegal and Mayo were so far ahead of the rest that the only way to judge the performances of players from these 4 is how they performed when it mattered in the semi final and the final. If Flynn and Connolly deserve all stars for the first 20 mins v Donegal...fair enough. On this logic, Donnacha OConnor must be in the frame for his 7 mins against Mayo.
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Post by homerj on Oct 13, 2014 8:43:29 GMT
the more you look at it, the more the fact that Connolly is even being considered for player of the year becomes farcical.
he had one top class game this year - says alot about the lads on the Sunday game that they even voted for him.
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Post by clarinman on Oct 13, 2014 9:14:47 GMT
The Sunday Sport team on Radio 1 yesterday picked a half forward line of Flynn, Connolly and Donnacha Walsh on their team of the year. After a long debate they decided to include Donnacha by moving Murphy to full forward. As a result Donaghy lost out.
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Post by MrRasherstoyou on Oct 13, 2014 11:17:50 GMT
A great friend of mine and an ardent GAA follower,now gone to his eternal reward once told me this story concerning All Star awards. 1977 Dublin got the better of Kerry in the All Ireland semi final and then very easily defeated Armagh in the final.There was very little between Kerry and Dublin that year.Dublin got 9 All Star awards from the media know alls who selected the All Stars in those years,Kerry got 2 awards.The following year 1978 Kerry took the 9 All Star team apart in the All Ireland final and defeated Dublin by 17 points. My friend wrote to the Independent GAA reporter and All Star selector stating that seeing that Kerry had defeated the super 9 All Star team by 17 points could Kerry also expect 9,10 or maybe 11 All Stars awards in 1978.The team had walked through the All Ireland.He printed the letter in the Indo and replied that it made sense and maybe Kerry should get 10 awards. Kerry got 6 awards in 1978. My point and its only my opinion is that Kerry rarely get their due so I am expecting 5 awards 6 would be a bonus for US.I would not be giving Connolly an All Star award but going on the point I am trying to make above I think he will get one as I think there is still bias in the selection. I don’t get excited about the all stars. Maybe it’s because I have seen a lot of episodes like the one narrated by Ballybunion. I also think it’s the credibility of the selectors – i.e. the media. When you grow up in Kerry you learn about the game from men that have been there – under that dropping ball and learned how to deal with every situation. As the years go by you accumulate a wealth of knowledge. So much so that when I open a newspaper now that claims to have an in-dept analysis of any game I don’t even bother reading it. Too many times I have found that the college of journalism whatever it does, does not imbue that type of knowledge. So why should I get excited about a team picked by a bunch of these hacks. As everyone knows the media is very pro Dublin. Connolly is a great footballer but has not done enough this year to deserve one. Funny how when a Dublin club wins the All-Ireland club it becomes relevant for the All Stars. St Brigid’s won it last year and St Gall’s of Antrim won it in 2010. Who from those teams got All Stars? The goal that Connolly got recently that all the media is talking about, even O’Rourke referred to in the All-Ireland coverage was in a game they won easily in the SECOND ROUND OF THE COUNTY CHAMPIONSHIP. Do Sky have a selector this year? If they do will someone paid by Murdoch have the spirtit the All Stars at heart or will they be a diligent employee and turn it into a business opportunity? “Its life, Jim, but not as we know it” Any way best of luck to the lads. Some will get the awards they deserve and some won’t. Interesting viewpoints. The quantity of ex-Kerry players and sports' people who have articles in the Irish Bindependent clearly is a factor in this terrible bias of which you speak. And also the fact that nearly every other GAA correspondent is from outside Dublin, possibly all of them? In the IT it's a similar story, though with less Kerry representatives, and this is clearly, as you might say, 'more of it'. That leaves the Examiner. A national paper also now, and is, as it has always been, a bastion of capital-ist favouritism. I certainly detected an (admittedly almost logically impossible) increase in the level of bias this year, with the cross-media campaign by those arch pro-capital-ists such as Spewan McKenna, Martin Brayhony, Billygoat Keane, Wee Mairtin McSpew, Kevin McSpray, and some others, against the massive advantages that Dublin clearly possess and against the imminent destruction of the GAA that this state of affairs was bringing about. These noteworthies were, with the exception of some not quite concealed triumphalism, well.....noteworthy for their subduedness on the same subjects upon which they expounded through the year, after the All-I semis. Curious. Thankfully that nightmare scenario has been staved off for another year at least as Kerry, against every disadvantage known to man & womankind, managed to save the GAA single-handledly. Well, Gaelic Football anyway. Oh, and Donegal did their bit too. And, let's be honest, so did Dublin. Who obviously cowed under the weight of shame of all their advantages and decided to do the honourable thing. The All-Stars are a bit of craic though. It's interesting that people will speak wistfully of talented players in weaker counties who 'deserve' an All-Star based on performances in Club, Sigerson, League, and Provincial championships, not to mention similarly unheralded, disadvantaged, and prejudicially ignored players in their own county, yet will at the same time dismiss talented players from stronger counties who played very well on the basis that 'only the semi and final matter'. And that the semi doesn't matter either where it suits. Interesting theories all from the University of Contradictory Cake-Having & Eating.
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Post by onlykerry on Oct 13, 2014 11:57:20 GMT
Running some stats on the All Stars - since the beginning in 1971 64% of the All Stars have been picked from the All Ireland Finalists. With the winners averaging 6.2 and the loser averaging 3.4. Three times in those 43 years the winner and loser received the same number of All Stars and once (1991) the loser received more than the winner (Down 4, Meath 6). Also interesting to note that Dublin on three occasions received more All Stars than the losing finalists even though they lost before the final - who would bet against that number going to 4 this year? Loais and Kildare have both done this once. If we use the measure of All Star awards as a benchmark for finals then 1983 ranks as the worst final since 1971 with the finalists sharing 5 awards. The lowest number of All Stars won by the All Ireland winners is 4 - and this has happened on four occasions (1971, 1983, 1991, 2010). Nine is the most won by a county in one year and this was done twice (Dublin 1977 and Kerry 1981)
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Post by MrRasherstoyou on Oct 13, 2014 12:55:54 GMT
Running some stats on the All Stars - since the beginning in 1971 64% of the All Stars have been picked from the All Ireland Finalists. With the winners averaging 6.2 and the loser averaging 3.4. Three times in those 43 years the winner and loser received the same number of All Stars and once (1991) the loser received more than the winner (Down 4, Meath 6). Also interesting to note that Dublin on three occasions received more All Stars than the losing finalists even though they lost before the final - who would bet against that number going to 4 this year? Loais and Kildare have both done this once. If we use the measure of All Star awards as a benchmark for finals then 1983 ranks as the worst final since 1971 with the finalists sharing 5 awards. The lowest number of All Stars won by the All Ireland winners is 4 - and this has happened on four occasions (1971, 1983, 1991, 2010). Nine is the most won by a county in one year and this was done twice (Dublin 1977 and Kerry 1981) So will 1983 be the benchmark for this year then? A year when Dublin won a great All-I very similar to Kerry this year, but including a great performance in Cork in the semi-replay, albeit the final was marred by the sendings off. But despite the losing teams in 1983 being clearly inferior (Cork played well in the drawn semi), the winners only got 3 All-Stars. Kind of puts some of the claims here currently in a more sensible context.
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Post by skybluezone on Oct 13, 2014 13:36:19 GMT
Delivering in the sigerson cup final in a tight evenly matched game is infinitely better that scoring easy points for Dublin in a facile win again against weaker counties with tiny populations and no resources and no AIG millions. Dublin had just two challenges in 2014... win the semi final and win the final and they blew it and hardly any of them came out of it with any credit. Given their resources it was a spectacular failure that the footballers of Kilkenny would be embarrassed about. I wouldn't given them any all star! Any allstars Dublin are awarded should be handed straight over to AIG headquarters! Their coaches have had a hugely beneficial impact since the signing of the sponsorship contract all of...12 months ago??? In this time Dublin have went from All Ireland Champions to washed up has beens. On second thoughts lets forward any Allstars to the HQ of O2. Surely they made the difference in 2013!!!
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Joxer
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Post by Joxer on Oct 13, 2014 13:37:07 GMT
Having a 'difficult' Monday Rashers?
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Post by onlykerry on Oct 13, 2014 14:30:29 GMT
Running some stats on the All Stars - since the beginning in 1971 64% of the All Stars have been picked from the All Ireland Finalists. With the winners averaging 6.2 and the loser averaging 3.4. Three times in those 43 years the winner and loser received the same number of All Stars and once (1991) the loser received more than the winner (Down 4, Meath 6). Also interesting to note that Dublin on three occasions received more All Stars than the losing finalists even though they lost before the final - who would bet against that number going to 4 this year? Loais and Kildare have both done this once. If we use the measure of All Star awards as a benchmark for finals then 1983 ranks as the worst final since 1971 with the finalists sharing 5 awards. The lowest number of All Stars won by the All Ireland winners is 4 - and this has happened on four occasions (1971, 1983, 1991, 2010). Nine is the most won by a county in one year and this was done twice (Dublin 1977 and Kerry 1981) So will 1983 be the benchmark for this year then? A year when Dublin won a great All-I very similar to Kerry this year, but including a great performance in Cork in the semi-replay, albeit the final was marred by the sendings off. But despite the losing teams in 1983 being clearly inferior (Cork played well in the drawn semi), the winners only got 3 All-Stars. Kind of puts some of the claims here currently in a more sensible context. 1983 stands alone as a low point for sport and the GAA - poor football in a final is not uncommon but thuggery has no place in sport and the All Star awards attempted to recognise this. (Note - the winner got 4 too many and the losers 1)
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Post by MrRasherstoyou on Oct 13, 2014 15:08:02 GMT
9 So will 1983 be the benchmark for this year then? A year when Dublin won a great All-I very similar to Kerry this year, but including a great performance in Cork in the semi-replay, albeit the final was marred by the sendings off. But despite the losing teams in 1983 being clearly inferior (Cork played well in the drawn semi), the winners only got 3 All-Stars. Kind of puts some of the claims here currently in a more sensible context. 1983 stands alone as a low point for sport and the GAA - poor football in a final is not uncommon but thuggery has no place in sport and the All Star awards attempted to recognise this. (Note - the winner got 4 too many and the losers 1) There was some great football in that final, in the 2nd half, despite the worst weather conditions for a final in memory(82 had the rain but not the wind). There has been 'thuggery' as you put it in many finals, such as the 2009 final. I don't think any other final has had the extent of melees involving numbers of players that the 1996 final had. I suppose you must have missed that one? I doubt if the teams involved in 1996 were 'punished' to anything like the extent that those in 1983 were. Wonder why that was? At least the 1983 final didn't have the extent of intentional, pre-planned tactical football negativity that this year's final did. Which incidentally was played in excellent conditions, was it not? And the All-Stars ARE about more than the final. In fact it's ludicrous that people say 'best players of the year' should be judged on finals and to a lesser extent semi-finals. It only goes to highlight again the madness of the competitive structure of the Snr IC competitions
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Post by MrRasherstoyou on Oct 13, 2014 15:20:15 GMT
Having a 'difficult' Monday Rashers? Not at all Mr. Daly sir. The Gentleman, scholar, and mere student of football that is Mr. Tierney, Esquire, in this prestigious school, is singularly delighted and honoured to have somethings once again worth discussing with my worthy teachers here.
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Post by onlykerry on Oct 13, 2014 15:51:34 GMT
There was some great football in that final, in the 2nd half, despite the worst weather conditions for a final in memory(82 had the rain but not the wind). There has been 'thuggery' as you put it in many finals, such as the 2009 final. I don't think any other final has had the extent of melees involving numbers of players that the 1996 final had. I suppose you must have missed that one? I doubt if the teams involved in 1996 were 'punished' to anything like the extent that those in 1983 were. Wonder why that was? At least the 1983 final didn't have the extent of intentional, pre-planned tactical football negativity that this year's final did. Which incidentally was played in excellent conditions, was it not? And the All-Stars ARE about more than the final. In fact it's ludicrous that people say 'best players of the year' should be judged on finals and to a lesser extent semi-finals. It only goes to highlight again the madness of the competitive structure of the Snr IC competitions The "trauma" of 1983 will live long in the memory and the numbers of players on the field at the end of the game along with the All Star allocation are facts that will forever give recognition to what went on. 96, 09 and any other year you care to pick cannot compare. Agree the All Stars SHOULD BE about more than the final but the stats suggest otherwise with 64% of the awards since 1971 going to the finalists. Differentiating between a good player and a good team is always difficult plus many of the pundits picking the All Stars do so based on the games they see (obviously) and how many games do they actually get to see. John Galvin of Limerick was one of the best players of his generation but never got enough visibility to get recognition for his skills. Year after year he was the toughest midfielder that Cork and Kerry All Stars encountered.
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Post by onlykerry on Oct 13, 2014 15:52:39 GMT
Dublin are the only side to get 4 All Stars in a year in which they did not play in the final.
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Post by MrRasherstoyou on Oct 13, 2014 16:05:26 GMT
There was some great football in that final, in the 2nd half, despite the worst weather conditions for a final in memory(82 had the rain but not the wind). There has been 'thuggery' as you put it in many finals, such as the 2009 final. I don't think any other final has had the extent of melees involving numbers of players that the 1996 final had. I suppose you must have missed that one? I doubt if the teams involved in 1996 were 'punished' to anything like the extent that those in 1983 were. Wonder why that was? At least the 1983 final didn't have the extent of intentional, pre-planned tactical football negativity that this year's final did. Which incidentally was played in excellent conditions, was it not? And the All-Stars ARE about more than the final. In fact it's ludicrous that people say 'best players of the year' should be judged on finals and to a lesser extent semi-finals. It only goes to highlight again the madness of the competitive structure of the Snr IC competitions The "trauma" of 1983 will live long in the memory and the numbers of players on the field at the end of the game along with the All Star allocation are facts that will forever give recognition to what went on. 96, 09 and any other year you care to pick cannot compare. Agree the All Stars SHOULD BE about more than the final but the stats suggest otherwise with 64% of the awards since 1971 going to the finalists. Differentiating between a good player and a good team is always difficult plus many of the pundits picking the All Stars do so based on the games they see (obviously) and how many games do they actually get to see. John Galvin of Limerick was one of the best players of his generation but never got enough visibility to get recognition for his skills. Year after year he was the toughest midfielder that Cork and Kerry All Stars encountered. "Trauma". Seriously, you're on a wind-up here. I'd say the only real trauma you experienced was Galway not winning with 2 extra players and a 40-mile-an-hour gale plus heavy squalls of rain behind their backs in the 2nd half. So the 1996 final outright scrap between multiple players following on multiple off-the ball and on-the-ball dirty deeds, which still only lead to two sendings off (of at least one wrongly identified player) doesn't compare? Fair enough, it must be something to do with the green, gold and red jersies, maybe televisions were different by then. 1983 had great games before the final. In the final, which was at least partly ruined by the worst weather of any final I can recall, 2 players behaved very badly/stupidly, and got sent-off and very severe suspensions. That doesn't explain why the rest of the players (15 from Galway, 13 from Dublin - the other 2 sendings off were minor discressions compared to some things that have happened in other finals) were punished in terms of not receiving All-Stars. Yes Galway were very poor in the final, and Cork deserved recognition for having beaten Kerry and taken part in a great semi. That only leaves one other conclusion about the attitude of the committee that year
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Joxer
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Post by Joxer on Oct 13, 2014 16:06:01 GMT
Having a 'difficult' Monday Rashers? Not at all Mr. Daly sir. The Gentleman, scholar, and mere student of football that is Mr. Tierney, Esquire, in this prestigious school, is singularly delighted and honoured to have somethings once again worth discussing with my worthy teachers here. and you must always consider yourself most welcome in this venerable establishment Mr. Tierney. Indeed eat, drink and make merry but always consider your blood pressure and perhaps that of your compatriot from the skybluezone when the natives here, both long and short in the tooth, seek to incite one to anger. After all, you above perhaps most of the visiting delegates, realise that God has proven once again that he is certainly in his heaven and that all is right with the world for the 37th time in recent history. I'm sure you understand that when nobody stands in the gap between our dreams and reality, we must then turn to poking the caged animals in advance of their release next spring and a resumption of hostilities. It helps to while away the days and weeks, supping by the turf fire from the glorious canister.....
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Post by kerrygold on Oct 13, 2014 16:41:30 GMT
Cluxtons's poor free kicking at the business end will cost him his All-Star this year in light of the errors by his main competitors and could potentially open the door for Rory Beggan, who coincidently contributed heavily on the score sheet for Monaghan from placed balls. A big challenge for Clucko to direct operations again from number 1 in 2015. The Dubs were flaky during the league while the Leinster championship resembles a bit of a stag party now for the Dubs, pissing their way through it, neither competition will hardly carry much collateral when the gongs are being banded about, apart of course from Cinderella who should be home by midnight on the night of the gongs. so what you are saying is that when weighing up the Dubs performance that Leinster shouldnt count cos they hosed through it and League shouldnt count cos they were flaky, but still won it. Which leaves the qf v Monaghan which they hosed through, and the sf v Donegal, who did a number on them. No one here has mentioned the Monaghan game So essentially lets judge them on the game they lost. Fair enough, even on that one Flynn and Connolly were immense, outrageous points scored by both, and on truth the only goodthing to come out of thatfor us.Fitzwop, you sayCluxton should only be judged against himself, but isnt the concept of the allstars that u are judged against the rest in your position? You both are correct in saying he wasnt great this year but he was still better than Durkan for instance. When any decentg team you play is specifically setting up to nullify your threat and you are the keeper then enough said. Of course there is a bit of my looking thru sky blue goggles but as supporters we all display that tendancy. Its is fair to say that I am not yet in BallyKthefireside territory, who informs us in another thread that Kerry won cos they had 20 great players compared to Donegal and Mayo having only 10, which by inference would suggest that Dublin may have about 5.! Sure I'm only loking for 2 or 3! The Leinster championship is well and truly dead, Offaly, Meath, Kildare and Laois are all counting snowdrops in lolo land. Pasting teams in this environ counts for little and is no good to Dublin. Playing all their games in Dubs Park only exacerbates the issue for Dublin.
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Post by kerrygold on Oct 13, 2014 16:56:11 GMT
The "trauma" of 1983 will live long in the memory and the numbers of players on the field at the end of the game along with the All Star allocation are facts that will forever give recognition to what went on. 96, 09 and any other year you care to pick cannot compare. Agree the All Stars SHOULD BE about more than the final but the stats suggest otherwise with 64% of the awards since 1971 going to the finalists. Differentiating between a good player and a good team is always difficult plus many of the pundits picking the All Stars do so based on the games they see (obviously) and how many games do they actually get to see. John Galvin of Limerick was one of the best players of his generation but never got enough visibility to get recognition for his skills. Year after year he was the toughest midfielder that Cork and Kerry All Stars encountered. "Trauma". Seriously, you're on a wind-up here. I'd say the only real trauma you experienced was Galway not winning with 2 extra players and a 40-mile-an-hour gale plus heavy squalls of rain behind their backs in the 2nd half. So the 1996 final outright scrap between multiple players following on multiple off-the ball and on-the-ball dirty deeds, which still only lead to two sendings off (of at least one wrongly identified player) doesn't compare? Fair enough, it must be something to do with the green, gold and red jersies, maybe televisions were different by then. 1983 had great games before the final. In the final, which was at least partly ruined by the worst weather of any final I can recall, 2 players behaved very badly/stupidly, and got sent-off and very severe suspensions. That doesn't explain why the rest of the players (15 from Galway, 13 from Dublin - the other 2 sendings off were minor discressions compared to some things that have happened in other finals) were punished in terms of not receiving All-Stars. Yes Galway were very poor in the final, and Cork deserved recognition for having beaten Kerry and taken part in a great semi. That only leaves one other conclusion about the attitude of the committee that year Dullys kick into the face on a prone Galway, Pat O'Neill, on the ground was as low a point as was ever reached in a final, enough said. Mullins, Hazley, Duff and Tierney all walked the plank that day, John Cough might have lost control of that final. One of the nastiest played.
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Post by Mickmack on Oct 13, 2014 18:27:43 GMT
I never said that only players that perform in semi finals of finals should be worthy of an all star. I said that these two games are the only games that players from Dublin, Kerry, Donegal and mayo should be evaluated on as these were the only evenly matches challenges they were involved in. I would have no issue with Shane Walsh of Galway getting an all star..... he delivered against better opponents consistently and was given little support.
Dublin footballers are in the same boat as Cork hurlers in 2014. Both bombed when their only challenge presented itself in the white heat of knockout championship game.
I wonder do Cork hurling followers expect 3 all stars for Cork hurlers. I would be surprised if they get even one. No Cork man in the running for hurler of the year either.
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Post by MrRasherstoyou on Oct 13, 2014 19:45:30 GMT
I never said that only players that perform in semi finals of finals should be worthy of an all star. I said that these two games are the only games that players from Dublin, Kerry, Donegal and mayo should be evaluated on as these were the only evenly matches challenges they were involved in. I would have no issue with Shane Walsh of Galway getting an all star..... he delivered against better opponents consistently and was given little support. Dublin footballers are in the same boat as Cork hurlers in 2014. Both bombed when their only challenge presented itself in the white heat of knockout championship game. I wonder do Cork hurling followers expect 3 all stars for Cork hurlers. I would be surprised if they get even one. No Cork man in the running for hurler of the year either. My dear Mick, it has been said that comparisons can be odious. Cork got hammered by Tipp and could easily have lost by 20 points. They never looked in the game. This was not the same as the football semi, not by a long shot. As for the year as a whole, Dublin's performances in the league semi and final, and yes, their performances in Leinster and the All-I quarter, regardless of opposition, could not have been better. That's all that anyone can ask of a team, regardless of opposition. I would not have said the same last year, they did not perform as well against very similar opposition at any stage up until the All-I semi. Not sure who you think is claiming we should get 3 All-Stars? And Mick, whatever happened to "walking softly when your pale is full"? How short memory can be.....
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Post by MrRasherstoyou on Oct 13, 2014 20:02:49 GMT
Not at all Mr. Daly sir. The Gentleman, scholar, and mere student of football that is Mr. Tierney, Esquire, in this prestigious school, is singularly delighted and honoured to have somethings once again worth discussing with my worthy teachers here. and you must always consider yourself most welcome in this venerable establishment Mr. Tierney. Indeed eat, drink and make merry but always consider your blood pressure and perhaps that of your compatriot from the skybluezone when the natives here, both long and short in the tooth, seek to incite one to anger. After all, you above perhaps most of the visiting delegates, realise that God has proven once again that he is certainly in his heaven and that all is right with the world for the 37th time in recent history. I'm sure you understand that when nobody stands in the gap between our dreams and reality, we must then turn to poking the caged animals in advance of their release next spring and a resumption of hostilities. It helps to while away the days and weeks, supping by the turf fire from the glorious canister..... Most articulately and scholarily put Mr. Daly. Not that I was aware of any honoured contributor here trying to incite any other member to vexatious thoughts or even to mild irritation. Other than one or two of the veterans, who speak the language that the students such as my humble self and the modest Mr. Zone. (Zone? I wonder is he of Jewish stock somewhere back down the line?) would understand well after many years in this learned establishment. Indeed I feel it only prudent as ever merely to point out a few alternative views to some of those which seek to denegrate our own family history, rather than to interfere with the justly earned rewards and celebrations of the achievements of your own family here. And with that, I beseech you good sir, most humbly, to carry on with the feasting and rejoicing as befits, etc etc. Good day to you sir, a dhuine uasail, agus slan, agus indeed, beannacht.
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Post by MrRasherstoyou on Oct 13, 2014 20:07:39 GMT
"Trauma". Seriously, you're on a wind-up here. I'd say the only real trauma you experienced was Galway not winning with 2 extra players and a 40-mile-an-hour gale plus heavy squalls of rain behind their backs in the 2nd half. So the 1996 final outright scrap between multiple players following on multiple off-the ball and on-the-ball dirty deeds, which still only lead to two sendings off (of at least one wrongly identified player) doesn't compare? Fair enough, it must be something to do with the green, gold and red jersies, maybe televisions were different by then. 1983 had great games before the final. In the final, which was at least partly ruined by the worst weather of any final I can recall, 2 players behaved very badly/stupidly, and got sent-off and very severe suspensions. That doesn't explain why the rest of the players (15 from Galway, 13 from Dublin - the other 2 sendings off were minor discressions compared to some things that have happened in other finals) were punished in terms of not receiving All-Stars. Yes Galway were very poor in the final, and Cork deserved recognition for having beaten Kerry and taken part in a great semi. That only leaves one other conclusion about the attitude of the committee that year Dullys kick into the face on a prone Galway, Pat O'Neill, on the ground was as low a point as was ever reached in a final, enough said. Mullins, Hazley, Duff and Tierney all walked the plank that day, John Cough might have lost control of that final. One of the nastiest played. I think you will find, in fact I know that you are well aware, that no actual 'kick to the face' occurred. To claim such a thing on a public forum, 31 years on, says more about your standards than those of a great and honoured servant of the games.
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Post by Mickmack on Oct 13, 2014 20:49:02 GMT
I never said that only players that perform in semi finals of finals should be worthy of an all star. I said that these two games are the only games that players from Dublin, Kerry, Donegal and mayo should be evaluated on as these were the only evenly matches challenges they were involved in. I would have no issue with Shane Walsh of Galway getting an all star..... he delivered against better opponents consistently and was given little support. Dublin footballers are in the same boat as Cork hurlers in 2014. Both bombed when their only challenge presented itself in the white heat of knockout championship game. I wonder do Cork hurling followers expect 3 all stars for Cork hurlers. I would be surprised if they get even one. No Cork man in the running for hurler of the year either. My dear Mick, it has been said that comparisons can be odious. Cork got hammered by Tipp and could easily have lost by 20 points. They never looked in the game. This was not the same as the football semi, not by a long shot. . I would not have said the same last year, they did not perform as well against very similar opposition at any stage up until the All-I semi.As for the year as a whole, Dublin's performances in the league semi and final, and yes, their performances in Leinster and the All-I quarter, regardless of opposition, could not have been better. That's all that anyone can ask of a team, regardless of opposition
Not sure who you think is claiming we should get 3 All-Stars? And Mick, whatever happened to "walking softly when your pale is full"? How short memory can be..... agreed but the big 4 are light years ahead of the peloton TO SUCH AN EXTENT that such games are irrelevant and of no value when judging a thing like all stars. Connolly should have got his all star in 2013.
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Post by onlykerry on Oct 13, 2014 20:58:22 GMT
Dullys kick into the face on a prone Galway, Pat O'Neill, on the ground was as low a point as was ever reached in a final, enough said. Mullins, Hazley, Duff and Tierney all walked the plank that day, John Cough might have lost control of that final. One of the nastiest played. I think you will find, in fact I know that you are well aware, that no actual 'kick to the face' occurred. To claim such a thing on a public forum, 31 years on, says more about your standards than those of a great and honoured servant of the games. Suggest you both look at the incident - "highlights" of the game and the main talking points are on utube. Have a look and tell us how you would describe the Duff incident - my memory was a kick but to be honest I could not remember to what part of the body, the utube clip will confirm whose recollection is correct.
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Jo90
Fanatical Member
Posts: 2,687
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Post by Jo90 on Oct 13, 2014 21:25:13 GMT
I'm not sure what's the big deal about the All-Stars. Apparently the Yazidis trapped on Sunjar mountain in subzero temperatures with barely any food or water and Isis chasing after them, read about the conditions at last years All-Stars and their reaction was "Wow, and we thought we had it bad!"
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Post by ballybunion on Oct 13, 2014 21:42:04 GMT
Just looked at that clip on youtube at 6.50 I had forgotten the incident.
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Post by MrRasherstoyou on Oct 13, 2014 21:55:24 GMT
He kicked the ground near his head. Intentionally kicked the ground. For although he had some bad misses in his career, that target would have been unmissable, if you get me
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Post by southward on Oct 13, 2014 22:07:31 GMT
He kicked the ground near his head. Intentionally kicked the ground. For although he had some bad misses in his career, that target would have been unmissable, if you get me Seriously, Rashers ??
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