kerryexile
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Post by kerryexile on Sept 2, 2014 12:02:36 GMT
A couple of things that are cropping up here and in papers.
Deciding whether Donaghy plays or not has nothing to do with Donegal. You start by picking your best team. That is the test he must pass - should he be in the first 15 and IMO he has proven he should be in the games against Mayo.
The papers are talking about Gouch making an appearance. It should not happen and ergo Eamon being an intelligent and discerning man will not allow it happen. It has been repeatedly shown that the initial recovery from an injury can happen quickly but the success of the player on return depends on very thorough and unrushed build up of strength and fitness. Gouch should not get involved at any level this season and return fresh in January.
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Post by ardfertnarrie on Sept 2, 2014 12:04:04 GMT
Yes the one he missed with his left peg should have been recycled. The other one wasn't far off in fairness. He won an important, if a little soft, free as well.
Just looking back on the 2012 semi final Kerry had chances to equalise at the end, when we had them on the ropes, but poor shot selection by Curtin cost us. I'm not blaming him, but lets hope we don't repeat the same mistakes the next day.
That little bollix Marty Duffy also denied us a very kickable free when Donnchadh Walsh was fouled about 40 yards out on the 70th minute.
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kaywhy
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Post by kaywhy on Sept 2, 2014 13:00:59 GMT
A couple of things that are cropping up here and in papers. Deciding whether Donaghy plays or not has nothing to do with Donegal. You start by picking your best team. That is the test he must pass - should he be in the first 15 and IMO he has proven he should be in the games against Mayo. The papers are talking about Gouch making an appearance. It should not happen and ergo Eamon being an intelligent and discerning man will not allow it happen. It has been repeatedly shown that the initial recovery from an injury can happen quickly but the success of the player on return depends on very thorough and unrushed build up of strength and fitness. Gouch should not get involved at any level this season and return fresh in January. I think we'll find that Eamon being an intelligent man will ensure that deciding whether Donaghy plays or not has everything to do with Donegal! "Best 15" no longer exists for Kerry. Best 15 to beat Donegal's plan A and also their plan B, in both first half and second half is what exists, and that is 3 or 4 different 15s.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2014 13:06:45 GMT
Looking forward to it i just hope donegal Dont play that defensive game again and ruin it .
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animal
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Post by animal on Sept 2, 2014 13:12:59 GMT
A couple of things that are cropping up here and in papers. Deciding whether Donaghy plays or not has nothing to do with Donegal. You start by picking your best team. That is the test he must pass - should he be in the first 15 and IMO he has proven he should be in the games against Mayo. The papers are talking about Gouch making an appearance. It should not happen and ergo Eamon being an intelligent and discerning man will not allow it happen. It has been repeatedly shown that the initial recovery from an injury can happen quickly but the success of the player on return depends on very thorough and unrushed build up of strength and fitness. Gouch should not get involved at any level this season and return fresh in January. I think we'll find that Eamon being an intelligent man will ensure that deciding whether Donaghy plays or not has everything to do with Donegal! "Best 15" no longer exists for Kerry. Best 15 to beat Donegal's plan A and also their plan B, in both first half and second half is what exists, and that is 3 or 4 different 15s. Yep -to use that cliche it's horses for courses. Eamonn will have to decide whether Donaghy fits into his game plan for the final and the opposition will determine the game plan. The days of purely concentrating on your own game and letting the opposition worry about you are long gone. What was it Tomás said the other night? "Hammer the hammer" - you target the oppositions strengths. It's been the modus operandi of the Munster rugby team for years and obviously forms part of Kerry's approach to big games too. So I guess what I'm saying is If Eamonn believes he has the best chance of hurting Donegal by playing Donaghy then he will play him. Personally I'm undecided. Donaghy was immense on Saturday but will get nothing like the same opportunities against Donegal. Over to you Eamonn.
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Jigz84
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Post by Jigz84 on Sept 2, 2014 13:13:23 GMT
Yes the one he missed with his left peg should have been recycled. The other one wasn't far off in fairness. He won an important, if a little soft, free as well. Just looking back on the 2012 semi final Kerry had chances to equalise at the end, when we had them on the ropes, but poor shot selection by Curtin cost us. I'm not blaming him, but lets hope we don't repeat the same mistakes the next day. That little bollix Marty Duffy also denied us a very kickable free when Donnchadh Walsh was fouled about 40 yards out on the 70th minute. I'm 99% sure that Coldrick was the ref that day.
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kerryexile
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Post by kerryexile on Sept 2, 2014 13:37:12 GMT
I think we'll find that Eamon being an intelligent man will ensure that deciding whether Donaghy plays or not has everything to do with Donegal! "Best 15" no longer exists for Kerry. Best 15 to beat Donegal's plan A and also their plan B, in both first half and second half is what exists, and that is 3 or 4 different 15s. Yep -to use that cliche it's horses for courses. Eamonn will have to decide whether Donaghy fits into his game plan for the final and the opposition will determine the game plan. The days of purely concentrating on your own game and letting the opposition worry about you are long gone. What was it Tomás said the other night? "Hammer the hammer" - you target the oppositions strengths. It's been the modus operandi of the Munster rugby team for years and obviously forms part of Kerry's approach to big games too. So I guess what I'm saying is If Eamonn believes he has the best chance of hurting Donegal by playing Donaghy then he will play him. Personally I'm undecided. Donaghy was immense on Saturday but will get nothing like the same opportunities against Donegal. Over to you Eamonn. .,............ and when exactly was it deemed approprite to leave a bang on form Paul O'Connell on the bench to achieve this .........
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Post by ardfertnarrie on Sept 2, 2014 15:15:39 GMT
Yes the one he missed with his left peg should have been recycled. The other one wasn't far off in fairness. He won an important, if a little soft, free as well. Just looking back on the 2012 semi final Kerry had chances to equalise at the end, when we had them on the ropes, but poor shot selection by Curtin cost us. I'm not blaming him, but lets hope we don't repeat the same mistakes the next day. That little bollix Marty Duffy also denied us a very kickable free when Donnchadh Walsh was fouled about 40 yards out on the 70th minute. I'm 99% sure that Coldrick was the ref that day. I'm 100% sure that you are incorrect.
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Jigz84
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Post by Jigz84 on Sept 2, 2014 15:18:37 GMT
I'm 99% sure that Coldrick was the ref that day. I'm 100% sure that you are incorrect. I just checked there, you are 100% correct Coldrick was on the line that day alright.
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Post by kerry4life on Sept 2, 2014 17:20:58 GMT
I'm hoping that Donegal's best game was against the Dubs, they could hardly beat a poor Armagh team a few weeks ago. They were out with a minute to go that day and then they are unbelievable against the Dubs. I'm thinking they may have peaked a little early. Its hard to keep a team in that form for another 3 weeks. Look what happened to both Mayo and Dublin after having crackers of Semi's last year they were both far off their best in that final. Obviously Donegal will be in great form but I wonder can they get back to the peaks of the Dublin game, if so we are in huge trouble unless we also find another gear which we may do due to the fact that the Mayo game will bring on that Kerry team for sure. It,s there for the taking and it would be the greatest achievement for a Kerry team if they pulled it off, in my life anyway.
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Post by kerry4life on Sept 2, 2014 17:28:02 GMT
Madness talk here lads real silly statements. You play your on form players. Donaghy is on form, his strong and physical and a great presence against a physical team, of course he will start, why would you play him off the bench when now his confidence is sky high and he has a great understanding with JOD who is cleaning up of Donaghy, sometimes people over think things and thats what many of ye are doing. There is no question Kieran Donaghy will start, that should be end of the discussion as Donegal lads looking in will be laughing at ye.
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Post by veteran on Sept 2, 2014 18:07:19 GMT
I was astonished to be told today that Killian was the only member of the 2009 team to start in Limerick. That is extraordinary attrition in the space of five years. It certainly highlights the progress Eamon has made.
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Post by kerrygold on Sept 2, 2014 18:16:05 GMT
I was astonished to be told today that Killian was the only member of the 2009 team to start in Limerick. That is extraordinary attrition in the space of five years. It certainly highlights the progress Eamon has made. The turn over of players is huge alright. Regarding Killian, I never prescribed to the notion that Killian should not be starting for kerry.
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Post by wayupnorth on Sept 2, 2014 18:37:20 GMT
Yep -to use that cliche it's horses for courses. Eamonn will have to decide whether Donaghy fits into his game plan for the final and the opposition will determine the game plan. The days of purely concentrating on your own game and letting the opposition worry about you are long gone. What was it Tomás said the other night? "Hammer the hammer" - you target the oppositions strengths. It's been the modus operandi of the Munster rugby team for years and obviously forms part of Kerry's approach to big games too. So I guess what I'm saying is If Eamonn believes he has the best chance of hurting Donegal by playing Donaghy then he will play him. Personally I'm undecided. Donaghy was immense on Saturday but will get nothing like the same opportunities against Donegal. Over to you Eamonn. .,............ and when exactly was it deemed approprite to leave a bang on form Paul O'Connell on the bench to achieve this ......... That "hammer the hammer" quote appeared in today's Irish News where Eamonn was given advice as to how he could beat Donegal in the final: 1 Read Dr Eamonn O'Sullivan's book (1953). 2 "Go west" and talk to Dara O'Cinneide and Tomas O'Se. Just where do they think he lives and works?!
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Post by seaniebo on Sept 2, 2014 18:43:41 GMT
.,............ and when exactly was it deemed approprite to leave a bang on form Paul O'Connell on the bench to achieve this ......... That "hammer the hammer" quote appeared in today's Irish News where Eamonn was given advice as to how he could beat Donegal in the final: 1 Read Dr Eamonn O'Sullivan's book (1953). 2 "Go west" and talk to Dara O'Cinneide and Tomas O'Se. Just where do they think he lives and works?! The poor nail hadn't a hope in the Ó Sé household
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Post by Mickmack on Sept 2, 2014 18:45:43 GMT
and when they had finished hammering the hammer, they threw the hammer after the hatchet
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Post by donegalman on Sept 2, 2014 18:49:05 GMT
I noticed Marty Duffy's name mentioned in this thread. I sincerely hope that he does not end up reffing the game. I think that he is one of the most selfish people going, it is not about the game, but about how he can be remembered in the game. We dont mind in donegal who refs the game, but I think there is universal dislike of this guys style of reffing. Anybody but him thank you very much.
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Post by stevieq on Sept 2, 2014 18:58:42 GMT
To be fair I can't see Donegal doing the same job on us as they did on Dublin. And it also can't see our lads folding the way some of the Dublin go to guys. Can't see how the bookies are making Donegal favourites for this one.
To be honest, before last weekend I had an awful fear/premonition that Dublin would beat us in the final. I couldn't cope with a another one and the fact that this possibility has been removed capped off an amazing weekend.
Can't wait.
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Post by Mickmack on Sept 2, 2014 19:20:28 GMT
Over the past 4 years the team that beats the All Ireland champs have NOT gone on to win it. I like my stats more than most like Kerry have played in 16 Semi finals in the 15 championships since 2000 but I put no mass sorry Mickmack in that stat, sample is too small. I said 4 years because I couldn't recall before that. On mature reflection I thinks it accurate to say that, SINCE 2004 only Tyrone (in 2005 and 2008) won the All Ireland and also beat the previous years winners. And in 2005 and 2008 Kerry were going for 2 in a row and 3 in a row respectively. So............................. maybe Dublin had a soft underbelly after all. They were not battle hardened and without Ger Brennan, Bastick and with McAuley off colour they lacked the hard men needed at this level. Beating the reigning champs aint as impressive as it seems. Mayo did beat Donegal by 16 points last year. and..... I thinks it clear too that Dublin need to score goals to kill off opponents and they didn't take the two chances that came their way. If they did then I don't think Donegal would have recovered. So................................. maybe Kerrys road to the final was a lot harder, Just thinking aloud.
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Post by Mickmack on Sept 2, 2014 19:21:59 GMT
I noticed Marty Duffy's name mentioned in this thread. I sincerely hope that he does not end up reffing the game. I think that he is one of the most selfish people going, it is not about the game, but about how he can be remembered in the game. We dont mind in donegal who refs the game, but I think there is universal dislike of this guys style of reffing. Anybody but him thank you very much. marty is consistent. That's as much as you can hope for.
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Post by augustafield on Sept 2, 2014 19:42:40 GMT
Be careful who you wish for to ref final. Remember when we beat Cork in final he allowed Darren hop the ball twice before an invaluable point was scored. He is not the worst we could get.
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Post by seaniebo on Sept 2, 2014 19:44:52 GMT
All refs have their thing! All you can hope for is that the analysis post game isn't about the performance of the ref.
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Post by Mickmack on Sept 2, 2014 20:00:32 GMT
by Keith Duggan in 2013
Have Kerry finally become the unknown quantity in an All-Ireland championship race?For they are mightily quiet and there is nothing more disconcerting in Irish life than the sound of Kerry people saying nothing.
Mayo’s play has been intoxicating and while all the talk is rightly about them, there has been much loose speculation about what a marvellous advertisement a Mayo-Dublin final would make for the modern game.
Meanwhile, the most prolific All-Ireland winners in GAA history are training away behind the padlocked gates of Fitzgerald Stadium. And you can’t help but think the fact they have almost become an afterthought makes them dangerous.
A few years ago, I went to visit a good friend from Kerry on the eve of an All-Ireland final. This was an All-Ireland final, it should be added, in which Kerry were starring. One of the surprising things about Kerry people is they do occasionally consent to live in places that aren’t Kerry, at least for part of their lives.
They are agreeable about it even if they will remark upon the lack of local amenities, such as Mount Brandon, say, or Banna Strand or not getting served pints from a bar owner who has played in 25 All-Ireland finals.
But they know that it is important to spread the love. It turned out that this quaint Kildare village where my friend lived was busy with Kerry folks that night.
Up For The Match was on the TV in all the bars. The Kerry crowed half watched as the parade of gods from the 1970s and 1980s trotted out to flirt with Gráinne and Des, all the time murmuring cautious promises about what would happen in the final, winking at the camera for effect.
Good barometer Up For The Match is a good barometer of how a county handles an All-Ireland weekend. For counties whose teams show up once on a blue moon, every bit of banter and exchange becomes weighted with significance and the populations of the interested counties keep fingers crossed, praying chosen guests won’t say anything to rouse the indignation of the fates and thereby scupper their chances.
But the show held no such fears for the Kerry crowd that night. They glanced towards the screen every so often, noting so and so was looking well and reminiscing about the October performance such-and-such gave in the ’88 county quarter-final one Sunday afternoon when he was 43 years old and badly hung over.
The overriding impression they gave on that All-Ireland weekend was they knew what to do with themselves.
They were texting and calling friends, organising pick-ups from the airport, tickets to be left with Ger in the Gresham or to be collected from Barry’s, and speculating who would pick up Colm Cooper when the match actually started.
It was as if the entire county was mobilising and embarking on an All-Ireland operation with Navy SEAL type efficiency. They just knew what they were at because they were used to this.
Around midnight, with all the logistical business finally taken care of, they settled down to singing ballads in turn bawdy and beautiful.
Most Kerry people are walking juke boxes when it comes to ballads about dead Kerry heroes. They sang brilliantly until dawn broke, decided they better call it a night and caught 90 minutes sleep before my friend, the host, awoke everyone with a gargantuan breakfast.
Everyone was on the road by noon and parked in the usual spot near the Clonliffe before meeting assorted friends and relatives in front of The Big Tree and strolling down to duly watch Kerry win the All-Ireland final.
Then they melted away from the capital, happy with another harvest. In the car on the way in, the 1980s finals came up fleetingly in conversation and then someone said, “These are great days too”.
And they have been. Now Kerry are one game away from another September. Have they ever made it this far with such stealth?
Clock is ticking The decision to leave Kieran Donaghy on the bench for tomorrow’s game is a vital reminder the clock is ticking for several of this Kerry team. As Eamonn Fitzmaurice remarked during the week, this season could represent a “last hurrah” for several senior squad members.
That is a sobering thought for Kingdom fans, who could be forgiving for believing several of this generation would go on forever. Take Tomás Ó Sé, for example.
When you consider this era of Kerry football players, when you look past the uncanny genius of Cooper or the aerial magnificence of the older Ó Sé brother or the all-round game of the younger, when you recall the effortless grace and power of Fitzgerald or the frightening dependability of Séamus Moynihan and after you name check Mike Frank and the O’Sullivans and Ó Cinnéide and the iconoclastic Mr Galvin, it could well be the essence of Kerry’s pomp and consistency is best personified by the middle Ó Sé, sparking off any number of wing forwards, winning awkward ball and always, it seems, producing one of those invaluable cantering points along the right wing whenever the county needed it.
Through Tomás Ó Sé, it is easy to trace Kerry’s modern period of dominance: he made his debut the year after late uncle Páidí guided Kerry back to the bright lights in 1997 and has owned that right wing spot since. Whenever he decides to bow out that Kerry people will know that the curtain has fallen on an entire era.
So there is a cause about Kerry this year. Yes, they are moving into a new phase under Fitzmaurice, but a gilded generation is fighting against time here and there is a do-not-go-gently mood about this game against their metropolitan rivals. Jim Gavin, the Dublin manager, wisely decided against romanticising the Kerry-Dublin rivalry: why have his young team get tangled up in myth and history?
No, it will be up to the Kerry men to ensure this most celebrated of GAA rivalries has another rich chapter by tomorrow night. The Kerry carnival is in town and it is as if nobody has noticed and now you can feel it in the air: Something wicked this way comes.
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Post by watchdebreakswillye on Sept 2, 2014 20:48:41 GMT
and when they had finished hammering the hammer, they threw the hammer after the hatchet I think the Kerrymen will go hammer & thongs at it from the word go & if they could get an early goal, 'twould set the cat among the pigeons & leave Donegal chasing their tails. 'Twould also upset the Donegal apple cart if Kerry can maintain a good lead throughout cos then the boys from Dun na nGall will have to come out of their shells & play ball, leaving them open & exposed like the broad Atlantic Ocean. Then, hopefully, their goose will be well & truly cooked by the green & gold.
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kboy
Junior Member
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Post by kboy on Sept 3, 2014 1:21:48 GMT
Haven't posted in years but always keep in touch! IMO Kerry have to do as Tomas said on the Sunday Game the other night and that is " hammer the hammer", to me that is go after Murphy, Gallagher and they're big lads… Keep shape at the back.. Absolutely delighted to be in an All-Ireland Final, who would've thought it in May!! Well done to all involved.. I'm sure EF and Co. will have a plan.. have Donegal peaked? Or us?
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Post by hurricane on Sept 3, 2014 2:03:05 GMT
It is a remarkable achievement by Fitzmaurice's Fledglings. Let's be honest here. Not one person on this forum would have predicted this before the Munster Final in early July. The experience gained in those two titanic battles with Mayo is priceless to this young team. However now that we are in the final we won't be happy unless Sam heads down the M7 with us. This Donegal team deserve enormous respect. They revolutionised their game to win in 2012 and have a master tactician and motivator behind them. At this stage I can't see much between the teams but what does strike fear into my heart is reading comments here that are bordering on complacency in the fact that their performance against Dublin cannot be repeated. Memories of sections of Kerry support in the Hill blasting out choruses of "easy, easy, easy" after Cinnéide's goal in the first half of '05 come flooding back. This is a very formidable opponent and nothing other than 21 Kerry men ready to die in 3 weeks time will suffice. Yup. I expect at least one black card
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Post by beantownfan on Sept 3, 2014 3:16:43 GMT
Just saw the Sunday game highlights.. I must say I feel a bit better after seeing them. For all of Donegal's goals the Dublin backs were at 6's and 7's.. I don't expect Kerry to leave themselves that open.. For a couple of the goals there were two free Donegal forwards.. Granted it might be a case of the highlights not showing everything (e.g. Donegal breaking at breakneck speed and not giving Dublin a chance to regroup), but I was very surprised to see so much space in the Dublin defense. I'd expect Kerry to set up like the first day against Mayo, with half backs dropping deep. Hard to know how Kerry will line out, it is great to have options again.. I was very impressed by Pa Kilkenny the last day when he came in, same too for Griffin.. Also Donaghy is back to his old self, couple that with a hopefully fit Stephen O'Brien and it certainly does give you a lot of options and different game plans that can be deployed.
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Post by colinsworth1 on Sept 3, 2014 4:23:55 GMT
Yep -to use that cliche it's horses for courses. Eamonn will have to decide whether Donaghy fits into his game plan for the final and the opposition will determine the game plan. The days of purely concentrating on your own game and letting the opposition worry about you are long gone. What was it Tomás said the other night? "Hammer the hammer" - you target the oppositions strengths. It's been the modus operandi of the Munster rugby team for years and obviously forms part of Kerry's approach to big games too. So I guess what I'm saying is If Eamonn believes he has the best chance of hurting Donegal by playing Donaghy then he will play him. Personally I'm undecided. Donaghy was immense on Saturday but will get nothing like the same opportunities against Donegal. Over to you Eamonn. .,............ and when exactly was it deemed approprite to leave a bang on form Paul O'Connell on the bench to achieve this ......... Will Donaghy Start or not is not the issue its how he will be deployed , orthodox full forward may not work this time around and Kieran may have to tweak his positioning and vary it also during the game. Bigger issue by far is not the full forward its the Full Back if you did not notice we have a crisis here its late now to resolve but never too late the godsend of the extra time on Saturday threw us a few more options here that we would never have found had we won the first day or the replay in Normal time . If AOM is Full back then why is he not deployed there A Warrior of a Player for Kerry playing great ball but Id rather he was minding the house . Also the lack of discipline in tackling is alarming we are giving away too many soft frees with Sloppy tackling We can be ferocious in the tackle and still be disciplined need to sort this especially in our back where each act of indiscipline is punished by a Score for the other team.
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Post by onlykerry on Sept 3, 2014 9:54:24 GMT
First time meeting Donegal in a Final so I checked back the records to see what other patterns are noteworthy. On a provincial basis our win/loss numbers are Leinster Opponents - won 18, Lost 11. Connaught Opponents - won 11, Lost 4. Munster (since back door) won 2, lost 0. London won 1, lost 0. Then we come to Ulster where we have 4 wins but 6 losses. 1986 is the last time we beat an Ulster team to lift Sam and since then three of our four losses have been to Ulster teams. As with all numbers we can take what we want from this - either we are due a victory over an Ulster team or Ulster teams are our hoodoo province!!! Dublin is the team we have played most often in Finals - 12 times with an 8-4 win-loss ratio. Next comes Galway who we have played 7 times with a 4-3 W-L ratio.
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kot
Fanatical Member
Posts: 1,122
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Post by kot on Sept 3, 2014 10:21:23 GMT
I was astonished to be told today that Killian was the only member of the 2009 team to start in Limerick. That is extraordinary attrition in the space of five years. It certainly highlights the progress Eamon has made. Jesus, that is some stat.
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