Munster Senior Football Championship 2014

[jackmurphy]

Cork beat an understrength Meath by 3-13 to 0-13 in Skyrene yesterday. Seems the game was over as a contest after 20 mins so it wasn't of much benefit. I think Cork have another challenge v Kildare next week-end. Any news of Kerry Challenge games ? Must be a few lined up.

Kerry and Cork begin their quest for Sam in a month or so - preparations will be getting into full flow - Cork have a slightly tougher tie v Tipp/Limerick but are at home. Kerry are away to Waterford/Clare. The non-seeded sides should be highly motivated after kicking up such a storm over the seedings but it's the players and not the CB's that are complaining. The CB's realise that a Cork V Kerry final is a big contibuter to Munster's coffers and they share the benefits too.

If they get bate out the gate then the talk of a boycott will sound a bit hollow.

[brigid]

From Jack Murphy
You would be very disappointed if you didn't get at least 2 senior players from every u21 side. The 2011 U21 side has produced an exceptional amount of senior players. I'm not suggesting that any of the U21's is good enough for senior right now but I'd like to see a few at training in the hope of fast-tracking their development at a crucial stage of their careers.

From Pat Spillane
“One management team had one game plan based around a defensive game; another crowd had a hand-passing game, depending on who was the coach. So we weren’t bringing through youngsters in the Kerry style of football. And the Kerry style of football is one where you can catch, kick and score. It’s still a winning formula. We lost that for a while so it could be five years.”


As you can seen from the above Kerry are now suffering for the poor coaching that has gone on for the last 2 to 3 years both at minor and senior level. Hand passing and intricate training movements did not and will not win Kerry an All Ireland at any grade. Great to see Jack O.C back again. Mayo will not win anything (Connacht champ excluded) as long as they have the former Kerry coach. So don’t criticise the County Board as I presume all contributors here are members of GAA clubs and so play a part in a direct or indirect way in the selection of managers/coaches. Will Kerry win an All Ireland Senior championship in the decade 2010 to 2019? With 6 years to go they just about might. Note Spillane says it could be 5 years!!! With good management they will win before the end of this decade..
The major difference between Dublin and Kerry is that Dublin players are faster (I don’t say fitter, as faster is more important over 10, 20 or 50 yards), better coached (Kerry were poorly coached for game V Dublin in the league) and Dublin have a better coach and manager who is not afraid to make tough decisions. Throughout 2013 Gavin continued to change the last few of his panel so that younger players could see at first-hand what is expected of them and were then released back to their clubs. At least 2 of these players benefited and are better players this year. I was disappointed to see that Kerry continued with the same panel last year although a number were not up to senior inter-county standard. There are at least 2 still on this year’s panel. If these are the best in Kerry, it will be NAMA again this year. The good news is that the minors look good and hopefully they have shaken off the coaching they had to endure last season. So what for the future? The selection of juvenile squads will only succeed if the selection of players is not left up to the local club management. The best players at U14 or U15 are often small as the bigger/taller players often lack co-ordination to impress selectors. I hear constant comments on Kerry Radio that the opposition are bigger/stronger than Kerry at minor/U21 level. What is needed in selecting players at juvenile level is commitment and this is easily judged by stating that ability to kick with both feet, hand pass with both hands and catch a ball in a proper manner is a requirement before joining any panel. I find it very disappointing to see adult players who have played for 10 year or more unable to do these basics.

On one hand it is great to see some of the smaller clubs represented on the Minor panel, but it is sad that bigger clubs are not there. Have they too taken their eyes of the ball?

[jackmurphy]

Well, the Munster Football C/ship kicks off this week-end with Limerick v Tipp.

The seeding row shows no sign of abating with Limerick Players/Management refusing a Munster Council offer of a double bill at Thurles (citing a refusal to cede home advantage) It would have been nice to see Tipp Footballers have decent home support after all the effort put in there, at underage.

Waterford CB are skint and really had to support the seeding - they need Munster Council Revenue. The 'weaker' county football players have boycotted the McGrath Cup, the c/ship official launch and now refuse to facilitate supporters wrt cost and travel. The vote was democratic and it's really a matter for the players/management to take up with their respective boards.

Will the sense of injustice inspire a shock result this season - or is the gap in class just too much ?

Clare might be the 'banana skin' - Colm Collins did a great job with Crathloe (Crokes beat 'em by a pt) and he's brought in an excellent strength and conditioning coach in Chris De Looze and Paudie Kissane will know a thing or two about how to beat Kerry.

I take Tipp to beat Limerick as the underage success has to be a factor.

[fitz]

May 21, 2014 11:25:21 GMT brigid said:

From Jack Murphy
You would be very disappointed if you didn't get at least 2 senior players from every u21 side. The 2011 U21 side has produced an exceptional amount of senior players. I'm not suggesting that any of the U21's is good enough for senior right now but I'd like to see a few at training in the hope of fast-tracking their development at a crucial stage of their careers.

From Pat Spillane
“One management team had one game plan based around a defensive game; another crowd had a hand-passing game, depending on who was the coach. So we weren’t bringing through youngsters in the Kerry style of football. And the Kerry style of football is one where you can catch, kick and score. It’s still a winning formula. We lost that for a while so it could be five years.”


As you can seen from the above Kerry are now suffering for the poor coaching that has gone on for the last 2 to 3 years both at minor and senior level. Hand passing and intricate training movements did not and will not win Kerry an All Ireland at any grade. Great to see Jack O.C back again. Mayo will not win anything (Connacht champ excluded) as long as they have the former Kerry coach. So don’t criticise the County Board as I presume all contributors here are members of GAA clubs and so play a part in a direct or indirect way in the selection of managers/coaches. Will Kerry win an All Ireland Senior championship in the decade 2010 to 2019? With 6 years to go they just about might. Note Spillane says it could be 5 years!!! With good management they will win before the end of this decade..
The major difference between Dublin and Kerry is that Dublin players are faster (I don’t say fitter, as faster is more important over 10, 20 or 50 yards), better coached (Kerry were poorly coached for game V Dublin in the league) and Dublin have a better coach and manager who is not afraid to make tough decisions. Throughout 2013 Gavin continued to change the last few of his panel so that younger players could see at first-hand what is expected of them and were then released back to their clubs. At least 2 of these players benefited and are better players this year. I was disappointed to see that Kerry continued with the same panel last year although a number were not up to senior inter-county standard. There are at least 2 still on this year’s panel. If these are the best in Kerry, it will be NAMA again this year. The good news is that the minors look good and hopefully they have shaken off the coaching they had to endure last season. So what for the future? The selection of juvenile squads will only succeed if the selection of players is not left up to the local club management. The best players at U14 or U15 are often small as the bigger/taller players often lack co-ordination to impress selectors. I hear constant comments on Kerry Radio that the opposition are bigger/stronger than Kerry at minor/U21 level. What is needed in selecting players at juvenile level is commitment and this is easily judged by stating that ability to kick with both feet, hand pass with both hands and catch a ball in a proper manner is a requirement before joining any panel. I find it very disappointing to see adult players who have played for 10 year or more unable to do these basics.

On one hand it is great to see some of the smaller clubs represented on the Minor panel, but it is sad that bigger clubs are not there. Have they too taken their eyes of the ball?

That's a fine post Brigid, good summarization and insight specifically on Gavin, on his belief and judgment that was vital in winning last year's semi. I totally agree with your breakdown on the skill sets too. Both feet kicking should be obligatory. I think strength and conditioning has its important place and should be a factor at underage but secondary to the skill sets. Underage needs to make enjoyment one of the main tenets. Cynicism can wait til the 21s. I brought up soloing as in running and soloing with your stronger kicking leg is the standard we see in all games before on a different thread and canvassed feedback unsuccessfully, so trying again Is coaching of switching soloing leg mid-run in any skills coaching known to anyone here in Kerry ? A brilliant mechanism for fending of a parallel tackling defender and also a brilliant piece of armoury for going by multiple defenders. To do this with accuracy requires excellent balance. In tandem with flexibility balance is the most important attribute to enable a players skills flourish, given a basic starting point of a living human organism with two arms and legs. Balance based exercises should be obligatory also IMO.

[Annascaultilidie]

...and agility training.

[fitz]

Correct and right you are Tom. A flexible fat fcuker steadily rooted to the spot isn't worth a sh*te.

[seamo]

...and the list which began with one, continues to grow...lol

[jackmurphy]

Tipp have finally got a Munster Championship win. Their first in 11 years - hard to beleive that. Obviously it's a totally new feeling for all of the management and squad.

Reading the match report in the Sindo - Tipp gave Limerick a right hammering - they won by 6 pts but missed a penalty and Limerick tacked on a goal and 2 pts, late on to put a bit of respectability on the scoreboard.

Tipp's underage success in Munster had to pay dividends and with the Div 4 league success against a very well prepared Clare side, this great win will give Tipp a massive boost going to Cork. Tipp have some very talented footballers in O Brien, Hannigan, O Riordan, Grogan, Sweeney and Quinlivan and if Cork are in any way complacent, they will be in for a rude awakening.

Clare v Wateford next week. Waterford have had some good performances including running Galway very close last year (in Galway) - Galway very nearly beat Cork after that. Clare are putting a huge effort and ran Tipp very close in the league final without the Collins Bros so they should be too strong.

[buck02]

Less than two weeks to go to Kerrys first game in the championship and I cant recall a time when it was so difficult to predict the starting 15 given the training behind closed doors, injury list and retirements since the last time we played in the championship.

[jackmurphy]

Jun 10, 2014 14:41:27 GMT buck02 said:

Less than two weeks to go to Kerrys first game in the championship and I cant recall a time when it was so difficult to predict the starting 15 given the training behind closed doors, injury list and retirements since the last time we played in the championship.

E Fitz likes to play his cards close. No reports on challenge games - Cork had 3 (Meath, Kildare, Monaghan)

Surprised that they released the injury list - what's the rationale there ?

There'll be no surprises in defence - Young will come in but not sure who'll drop out.

Moran will start if fit but who'll partner him ? Maher hasn't been great but maybe he's sharp again - hard to chosse between Maher and Sheehan.

JOD is out so we'll see the 2 O Sullivans, Walsh, O Brien, Geaney and 1 other. No idea who. Cox, Casey, O Leary ?

[mandad]

"Give me six hours to chop down a tree and I will spend the first four sharpening the axe". Abraham Lincoln.
Eamon is busy with the whetstone!

[Annascaultilidie]

Not sure how this is relevant but anyway...

Two bulls in a field and the young bull says to the old bull "I can't wait to get into that field and ride as many cows as I can!!".

To which the old bull replies "Era I'll take my time and ride 'em all!!"

[jackmurphy]

Today' Examiner:-

Kerry manager Eamonn Fitzmaurice expects the county’s recent injury crisis to have improved significantly in time for next Sunday week’s Munster SFC semi-final clash with either Clare or Waterford.

Marc Ó Sé, Daithí Casey, David Moran, Anthony Maher and Alan Fitzgerald all had knocks but Fitzmaurice is hopeful those problems will have cleared, with only Johnny Buckley (ankle) and James O’Donoghue (shoulder) ruled out along with captain Colm Cooper and Kieran Donaghy.

“The up-to-date position is that they’re all improving, but Sunday week will come too early for Johnny Buckley and James O’Donoghue, everyone else will be okay,” he said.

“Bar something unforeseen, we’re hopeful that all of the rest of the lads are available.

“Kieran Donaghy got a full session under his belt tonight too so he’s on the way back as well.”

Fitzmaurice is reluctant to set firm return dates for O’Donoghue or Buckley, though.

“We’re just focused on the first game first of all, we’ll see then,” he said.

“If we get over that and we’re in the Munster final, we’re hopeful that they might make that. We’ll have to wait and see, it’s only a maybe with both of them.”

Fitzmaurice must also plan without Brian McGuire, James Walsh, David Culhane and Conor Cox, all of whom are heading to the United States. The manager understands the position they find themselves in, even though it is not ideal in terms of strength in depth.

“Of course it’s a blow every time a fella leaves a squad,” he said.

“It weakens the squad in terms of what you’re trying to do and the internal matches that you have. It’s difficult for the lads too.

“Brian McGuire got a job offer, they came back to him three times, he just had to take it. For the younger lads, the job prospects for the summer in Kerry aren’t great and they were probably getting frustrated too at where they were at in the panel, where they saw themselves.

“You can’t put a gun to a fella’s head, if he’s going to go, he’s going to go. When fellas are leaving after a good bit of work has gone in, of course it’s going to weaken competition in terms of trying to get into the [match-day] 26.”

[lár na páirce]

Suprised Cox is gone for the Summer,Thought he could of made an impact.Good to see Star on the road back

[glengael]

Disappointing to be losing young players alright especially as we need all the players we can get this year. As the man said, you can't be putting a gun to anyone's head especially with things as they are in Kerry economically.

We have to press on with what we have and fervantly pray for no more injuries over the summer.

[buck02]

McGuire's situation is probably different to the others, didn't he get offered a full time job.

I'm also pretty sure that if the lads in question had told the management at the start of the year that they would be gone for the summer then they wouldn't have been on the panel to start with. The way it is at the moment, between injuries and withdrawals from the panel, Fitzy will have to start togging out for the training games himself.

[haryegsnbaken]

Nice to hear Star is training. His experience will be vital this year. No mention of Darren either so he must be OK? Good news for a change. I just hope management are more proactive than reactive this year. Plan A B and C will be needed

[Attacking Wing Back]

I suppose looking at things objectively you would have to place us among the 'also rans' for this years championship. We're missing our marquee player, the quality of player at our disposal isn't what it was even 5 years ago and the great players we do have are carrying too much mileage.

I think if we are to have any hope this year we are going to have to play some sort of defensive game. We just don't have the players to go toe to toe with teams anymore. I think we should look to hit teams on the break and use Daren and James pace to do this. It's the first time in about 15 years I couldn't name at least 12 of the starting 15 for Kerry and nearly all their positions.

Hopefully having jack in with the minors will help develop some players over the next few years as the u-21s were pitiful this year. We can't be giving jobs out to lads as the were good footballers. U21 can be a stepping stone to senior for both players and management alike. Minor less so, at least have lads with a track record in there. Pat O'Driscoll was poor as minor manager but he earned his shot after his work with ardfert

[jackmurphy]

Jun 13, 2014 13:14:18 GMT buck02 said:

McGuire's situation is probably different to the others, didn't he get offered a full time job.

I'm also pretty sure that if the lads in question had told the management at the start of the year that they would be gone for the summer then they wouldn't have been on the panel to start with. The way it is at the moment, between injuries and withdrawals from the panel, Fitzy will have to start togging out for the training games himself.

Reading between the lines, E Fitz understand's that McGuire had no choice and most people would have to accept a full time job.

With lads going away for the Summer, it's a bit different as you say. They joined the squad and some of them went away to Portugal and now are quitting a few weeks before the c/ship starts for Kerry. By joining the squad and not committing, they've denied other lads the chance. You can't be too critical of amateurs but E Fitz has to be fairly disappointed and I can't see them being invited back to the squad.

The other side of this is that these lads are going to 3rd level and there's only so mcuh they can expect from their parents. Maybe they have failed to get Summer work here and had no choice but to head for the States. It's not an easy one to be passing judgement from outside.

[givehimaball]

Jun 14, 2014 1:33:48 GMT jackmurphy said:

Reading between the lines, E Fitz understand's that McGuire had no choice and most people would have to accept a full time job.

With lads going away for the Summer, it's a bit different as you say. They joined the squad and some of them went away to Portugal and now are quitting a few weeks before the c/ship starts for Kerry. By joining the squad and not committing, they've denied other lads the chance. You can't be too critical of amateurs but E Fitz has to be fairly disappointed and I can't see them being invited back to the squad.

The other side of this is that these lads are going to 3rd level and there's only so mcuh they can expect from their parents. Maybe they have failed to get Summer work here and had no choice but to head for the States. It's not an easy one to be passing judgement from outside.

I think the fact that there was a message wishing Brian well on the official site and the fact that Eamonn mentions that the crowd came back to him 3 times, indicates that McGuire is in a very different boat to the other lads so to speak. Also its just possible that maybe in a year or two he might be back in Ireland? My worry is that as he's heading to Kentucky he's unlikely to be even playing any sort of football.

I wouldnt be too harsh on the lads but what's worrying for me is the underlying signal it sends. If the lads thought there was a good chance of a an All-Ireland medal (never mind a Munster medal) even if it was as only a panel member, would they be heading to the US? Cox got 3 appearances in the league, Culhane got 2 while Walsh got an appearance in last year's league and I think 2 of them lined out with the juniors previously so while they might be down the pecking order it's not as if they are miles down. Even compared to last season with Tomas, Paul and Eoin retired and Colm out, they have in a sense moved up that far in the pecking order. The thing is for these lads is that even if Kerry don't win the All-Ireland this year, they would at the least have had a summer of Championship level training to bring their game on further. In 2-3 years the panel could look very different and the lads could be a lot more central to things. Even still depending on how the season goes with injuries and who we might end up playing (especially in the qualifiers) it's not beyond the possibility that some of them might have got game time. Lads have always had to make sacrifices to play for Kerry sometimes with very little reward or in some cases with no reward. What does it mean if some of the most promising footballers in the county are not willing to make those sacrifices? Does anyone remember any other Kerry players ever doing the summer in the US thing? [Besides Paul and he didnt exactly have a whole pile of choice in the matter]

[givehimaball]

Was looking at the 20 who featured in the Dublin game and how we are for the first Championship game of this year.

Of those 3 are retired from the panel -Tomas O'Se, Paul Galvin, Eoin Brosnan

In terms of injuries Cooper is out for the season, Eamonn has said that Buckley, Donaghy and O'Donoghue arent in the reckoning for the next day.

That's 7 out of the 20 gone.

In terms of those likely to see action we have Darran who had a major operation in the interim and has had very little game time plus we have Marc, Maher and Moran who will be struggling for full fitness,and we have Declan O'Sullivan who got zero playing time in the league. That's another 5 who have major question marks over their fitness which takes it to 12 (not that far off a full-team) Some may say that Eamonn is probably engaged in some talking of things down, but if you know Eamonn you know that's not his way.

That's just in terms of physical fitness ; in terms of players in form things are almost as bleak especially when you look at the recent County Championship games.

Tomás Ó Sé - retired
Paul Galvin - retired
Eoin Brosnan - retired
Colm Cooper - injured
James O'Donoghue - injured
Kieran Donaghy - injured
Johnny Buckley - injured
Darran O’Sullivan - surgery
Marc Ó Sé - Not 100%
Anthony Maher - Not 100%
David Moran - Not 100%
Declan O’Sullivan - no league
Brendan Kealy
Fionn Fitzgerald
Mark Griffin
Shane Enright
Peter Crowley
Donnchadh Walsh
Jack Sherwood

This doesnt even mention the impact of the 4 lads gone to the US in terms of squad depth plus Curtin who seems to have retired as well?

[diego]

Both Waterford midfielders black carded in the 1st half in Dungarvan this evening, including key man Shane Aherne after just 2 minutes!

Apparently very harsh decisions as well.

Probably will be deciding factor in the game. Clare up 1-6 to 0-6 at half time.

[athletics]

Looks like Clare won handy enough in the end tonight. Any one like to take a chance of naming the starting 15 for Kerry against Clare next Sunday?

[donegalman]

I was interested to see how Clare won today after the draw in ennis, they were playing poor opposition for sure, but 8 points is impressive. Would there be respect for clare in kerry or is this a game that would be on the same level as our outing against antrim next week which we have some respect, but not that much either?

[Corner Back]

I would be very fearful of Clare. They have played for the last two weekends, Kerry have not played in 11 weeks. We never get it easy in Ennis. Minus Gooch, Galvin, Brosnan, O'Se and O'Donoghue from last year

[kerrygold]

Hard to look beyond a Kerry win next weekend in Ennis. No doubt N. Carew will band about, this week again, the lack of finance available to Waterford football as the reason why Waterford lost this tie last evening. Come to think of it, Clare football is probably in the same boat financially?

[glengael]

Well said givehimaball. The underlying message of all this isn't great.

As for Clare, KG, I don't know about their finances, other than it must be difficult to compete with the All Ireland Hurling champions in your parish. But they do have some excellent footballers, Gary Brennan at midfield to name just one and I wouldn't be taking anything for granted next weekend.

[buck02]

Jun 15, 2014 9:07:56 GMT Corner Back said:

I would be very fearful of Clare. They have played for the last two weekends, Kerry have not played in 11 weeks. We never get it easy in Ennis. Minus Gooch, Galvin, Brosnan, O'Se and O'Donoghue from last year

I can only recall one championship game in Ennis in recent times and that was 2004.

[playitfair]

I think in ways this is a very exciting year for us Kerry fans. Mainly because we haven't a clue how things will pan out given the level of change in the panel. You would anticipate that it will end before September, but given the excellent management that is in place, this Kerry team will achieve their potential (Whatever that is). That is all we can realistically expect and anticipate.

Looking forward to next Sunday already. It will be interesting, bring it on.

[brigid]

I think in ways this is a very exciting year for us Kerry fans. Mainly because we haven't a clue how things will pan out given the level of change in the panel. You would anticipate that it will end before September, but given the excellent management that is in place, this Kerry team will achieve their potential (Whatever that is). That is all we can realistically expect and anticipate.

Looking forward to next Sunday already. It will be interesting, bring it on.


Read more: kerrygaa.proboards.com/post/160231/edit#ixzz34pvn5akO


Sorry but I have very little confidence in this management team.